Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[Username1]

I bought two canisters Argon gas will it work. I've seen some info that says it might as argon is heavier than air. Do I just need to fill the bag full with argon. Also how long will it take for me to pass out. Please someone help

The optimal flow rate was determined assuming a constant presence of CO₂, using a gas with a similar weight to Nitrogen (Air), so it should work without assuming a disappearance of CO₂.

Several members have reported "fails" (aborted attempts due to feeling suffocation/panic) using Argon, like the @jodes2 guy who was posting that Argon failed him in almost all new ExitBag/Argon threads, claiming that he did everything correctly. Whether we believe them or not is up to us. I tend to think that they did something wrong in the process, but the truth is that we only have strong evidence of 15 LPM working well for Nitrogen and Helium. The supposed issues of Argon should be solved by increasing the flow rate.

None of this affects me, since I'm not gonna use the bag but top-notch SCBA gear.​

Argon is the worst inert gas to use with the ExitBag due to its weight (less eficient CO₂ purging), but there are people who have CTB'd with Argon+ExitBag like Deafsn0w and the PPeH says that Argon is viable for CTBing. imcadt99 also CTB'd with an Argon SCBA.

The best gas for the ExitBag is Helium (huge weight difference with CO₂) followed by Nitrogen. The most common CTB gas nowadays is Nitrogen, which has infinite supply (78.08% of the atmosphere is Nitrogen). Helium supply is dwindling since it cannot be manufactured, is more expensive and more difficult to find in pure form. The optimal flow rate of 15 LPM was determined by the EXIT International experiments using Air which has basically the same weight as Nitrogen.

There have been folks here reporting having to abort attempts due to feeling bad (suffocation/panic) with Argon+ExitBag (claiming that they did everything correctly). I tend to think that they did something wrong in the process, but the truth is that we only have strong evidence of 15 LPM working well for Nitrogen and Helium. The supposed issues of Argon should be solved by increasing the flow rate to have a faster CO₂ purging.​

I'm not sure, but I think I heard somewhere that the participants were going to use 20-25 LPM for argon

 

[danvii]

I'm not sure, but I think I heard somewhere that the participants were going to use 20-25 LPM for argon

Alright thanks. I'll give it a go. I've already invested a lot into getting the argon gas so I'm basically committed to that method and nowhere near me seems to have nitrogen. Honestly if this doesn't work I'm not sure what other peaceful method to try. Might just jump in front of a train. I really just need out of this life. But we will see come Sunday

Alright thanks. I'll give it a go. I've already invested a lot into getting the argon gas so I'm basically committed to that method and nowhere near me seems to have nitrogen. Honestly if this doesn't work I'm not sure what other peaceful method to try. Might just jump in front of a train. I really just need out of this life. But we will see come Sunday

Plus I really don't want to mess it up and be stuck here with a permanent disability

 

[ClownWorld2023]

Thoughts on this type of a mask? They come with or or without the bag attachment.

I don't think those types of masks were designed to provide a 100% seal, which is required to prevent oxygen from the outside flowing in.

 

[Ammended]

I don't think those types of masks were designed to provide a 100% seal, which is required to prevent oxygen from the outside flowing in.

My thoughts were this with an exit bag.

 

[ClownWorld2023]

My thoughts were this with an exit bag.

The plastic oven bags could work, but they seem fragile indeed.

A plastic bag that is made out of a thicker material and is also airtight would be better.

 

[DyingToDie123]

Help plz. The hose on my EEBD hood looks like a different material than those in other threads. Any idea how to get it connected to my regulator? There are not threads and there is a white filter near the top that I might need to cut off.

 

[Falling Slowly]

Help plz. The hose on my EEBD hood looks like a different material than those in other threads. Any idea how to get it connected to my regulator? There are not threads and there is a white filter near the top that I might need to cut off.

If there's no thread on the hose connection then it won't screw onto anything. It's probably best to cut the connector off and attach the hose directly to the regulator connection with a hose clamp.
Most regulators come with a barb connection like this:

 

[DyingToDie123]

It's probably best to cut the connector off and attach the hose directly to the regulator connection with a hose clamp.

On the EEBD hose or the regulator or both? EDIT: nevermind, re-reading it it seems like just the former.

Most regulators come with a barb connection like this:
View attachment 122784

thanks! I definitely have the narrow piece but I don't know if I lost the other or had to use it for something else? EDIT: I have both but they don't attach to the regulator.

If nothing fits immediately would it be a horrible idea to just use plumbers tape and/or duct tape? Surely that would be too easy but I'm desperate lol

 

[Falling Slowly]

On the EEBD hose or the regulator or both? EDIT: nevermind, re-reading it it seems like just the former.

thanks! I definitely have the narrow piece but I don't know if I lost the other or had to use it for something else? EDIT: I have both but they don't attach to the regulator.

If nothing fits immediately would it be a horrible idea to just use plumbers tape and/or duct tape? Surely that would be too easy but I'm desperate lol

You're saying that the top hose is connected to the regulator? Is it just a screw-on hose? If it is, unscrew it from the regulator, and screw in the hose barb, if you have one. A pic of your regulator and parts that came with it would be helpful.


As regards taping the two hoses together, you could but leaks are possible. If you're going down that road of attaching the two hoses together you're probably better off cutting off both connectors and attaching them together using a hose connector and hose clamps, as mentioned in previous pages on this thread. (E.g. the first post on this page).

 

[DyingToDie123]

You're saying that the top hose is connected to the regulator? Is it just a screw-on hose? If it is, unscrew it from the regulator, and screw in the hose barb, if you have one. A pic of your regulator and parts that came with it would be helpful.


As regards taping the two hoses together, you could but leaks are possible. If you're going down that road of attaching the two hoses together you're probably better off cutting off both connectors and attaching them together using a hose connector and hose clamps, as mentioned in previous pages on this thread. (E.g. the first post on this page).

This is my regulator. Thank you!

 

[Falling Slowly]

This is my regulator. Thank you!
View attachment 122793

The guage on that says carbon dioxide. I presume Carbon dioxide has a different density to argon, so the guage won't give you the correct reading for argon flow. Why didn't you get an argon regulator?
There's probably a way of converting carbon dioxide flow to argon flow, but I don't know what it is.
Also, your flow guage is in standard cubic feet per hour (SCFH). 15-25 litres per minute (LPM) of nitrogen is usually recommended on this thread to ctb, 15 LPM of argon is fine (= ~18 LPM nitrogen). To convert SCFH to LPM, you'll need to use a converter:

Cubic Feet Per Hour to Liters Per Minute | Kyle's Converter

Instantly Convert Cubic Feet Per Hour (cu ft/h) to Liters Per Minute (L/min) and Many More Flow Conversions Online. Cubic Feet Per Hour Conversion Charts. Many Other Conversions.

www.kylesconverter.com

.

If you decide to use the regulator in the pic, just unscrew the hose from the regulator. Then screw on the connector in its place, the one at the top of this pic below (unless it's already screwed onto the regulator):


Then slot the regulator barb down into the other connector (the one at the bottom of the above pic). It should then go from 1st pic below to 2nd pic:

>>>>>>>>>>>>


Then screw it up into the other connector that you already attached to the regulator.

Then you can cut the connection off your hood hose and then slide a hose clamp onto the hose end. Then attach the hose to the regulator barb and tighten the hose clamp.

 

[DyingToDie123]

The guage on that says carbon dioxide. I presume Carbon dioxide has a different density to argon, so the guage won't give you the correct reading for argon flow. Why didn't you get an argon regulator?
There's probably a way of converting carbon dioxide flow to argon flow, but I don't know what it is.

There is both CO2 and argon units, the argon is on the side.

Also, your flow guage is in standard cubic feet per hour (SCFH). 15-25 litres per minute (LPM) of nitrogen is usually recommended on this thread to ctb, 15 LPM of argon is fine (= ~18 LPM nitrogen). To convert SCFH to LPM, you'll need to use a converter:

Cubic Feet Per Hour to Liters Per Minute | Kyle's Converter

Instantly Convert Cubic Feet Per Hour (cu ft/h) to Liters Per Minute (L/min) and Many More Flow Conversions Online. Cubic Feet Per Hour Conversion Charts. Many Other Conversions.

www.kylesconverter.com

.

If you decide to use the regulator in the pic, just unscrew the hose from the rView attachment 122794egulator. Then screw on the connector in its place, the one at the top of this pic below (unless it's already screwed onto the regulator):

Then slot the regulator barb down into the other connector (the one at the bottom of the above pic). It should then go from 1st pic below to 2nd pic:

View attachment 122796View attachment 122795 >>>>>>>>>>>>


Then screw it up into the other connector that you already attached to the regulator.

Then you can cut the connection off your hood hose and then slide a hose clamp onto the hose end. Then attach the hose to the regulator barb and tighten the hose clamp.

Thank you so so much! I will try this!

 

[ClownWorld2023]

Help plz. The hose on my EEBD hood looks like a different material than those in other threads.

Btw, is this hard plastic-like material?
Or soft, similar to the regulator's rubber hose?

If it's hard plastic, it might be difficult to cut this hose.

 

[Hard decision]

Hello everyone

I have recently joined this forum although I have been reading this thread for a while. For CTB I have decided to use SCBA since I see it as a calm and reliable method, although a little confusing when it comes to acquiring the material. I have my 5l 200 bar nitrogen bottle and the g5/8 300 bar adapter to attach it to the bottle

I would like to purchase SCBA equipment. It is easy to see many for sale online but it gives me a certain distrust between those who sell second-hand equipment in who knows what condition and then those that you see at low prices and you do not know how reliable they will be, you can see a lot of difference in prices between one another. I prefer to buy a complete device instead of individual parts to avoid compatibility problems or a supplier failing. I would like to ask in general what problems or anecdotes those of you who have already purchased your equipment have had

Thank you so much

 

[MonsieurIsDead]

After seeing the video for the instructions for the helium method "Helium is better 6B" on www.veoh.com, and then after reading posts and replies to this thread, I've confused. The video, as the original information present in "The Final Exit" does not mention the need for a regulator with the helium method. It states to use to tanks of helium and to just open them and slide on the exit bag (yes there are more details to it but what I'm saying is this method seems to work fine without the regulator).

With the helium method, are we not supposed to lose consciousness within a few seconds and die within a few minutes? If so, then why would I need gas for 40 minutes? Why would my two helium tanks, properly set up, need a regulator to do the job in a few minutes.

I went online, looking for helium regulators... seriously, there are not as many options as with the other gases. Is it just that people have moved on from helium method and are trying to apply the information regarding the other gases to this helium? I certainly hope my 2 tanks of 100% helium are enough... 13.5 cubic feet each,

If I do need a regulator, please explain why. Please explain if it is true that I need a 40 minute supply. Please also help me know how to find a good regulator if I need one. I've read a lot of posts and replies and books and I am more confused than ever now.

 

[wanttosleep]

After seeing the video for the instructions for the helium method "Helium is better 6B" on www.veoh.com, and then after reading posts and replies to this thread, I've confused. The video, as the original information present in "The Final Exit" does not mention the need for a regulator with the helium method. It states to use to tanks of helium and to just open them and slide on the exit bag (yes there are more details to it but what I'm saying is this method seems to work fine without the regulator).

With the helium method, are we not supposed to lose consciousness within a few seconds and die within a few minutes? If so, then why would I need gas for 40 minutes? Why would my two helium tanks, properly set up, need a regulator to do the job in a few minutes.

I went online, looking for helium regulators... seriously, there are not as many options as with the other gases. Is it just that people have moved on from helium method and are trying to apply the information regarding the other gases to this helium? I certainly hope my 2 tanks of 100% helium are enough... 13.5 cubic feet each,

If I do need a regulator, please explain why. Please explain if it is true that I need a 40 minute supply. Please also help me know how to find a good regulator if I need one. I've read a lot of posts and replies and books and I am more confused than ever now.

In Australia easy helium tanks now contains 20% oxygen to prevent CTB. Not sure about the rest of the world I assume something similar. Most people are using nitrogen and argon because it is easier to make sure purity because the normal uses require purity.

The 40min is for safety buffer in case something isn't working correctly and to try ensure that you are deprived of oxygen for decent amount of to ensure CTB

 

[MonsieurIsDead]

In Australia easy helium tanks now contains 20% oxygen to prevent CTB. Not sure about the rest of the world I assume something similar. Most people are using nitrogen and argon because it is easier to make sure purity because the normal uses require purity.

The 40min is for safety buffer in case something isn't working correctly and to try ensure that you are deprived of oxygen for decent amount of to ensure CTB

I'm in Canada and my tanks say 100%. Am I to assume it is not 100%? Also... if it would only take a few minutes, I mean, you would not die more if it didn't work within a few minutes. You'd probably be brain dead, at least? Right? If, for example, the bag slips after you've been unconscious... either you are now in a coma and brain dead or getting there. I would hope? Even if you have more gas, if you miss, you miss. The extra gas would really finish the job?

 

[wanttosleep]

I'm in Canada and my tanks say 100%. Am I to assume it is not 100%? Also... if it would only take a few minutes, I mean, you would not die more if it didn't work within a few minutes. You'd probably be brain dead, at least? Right? If, for example, the bag slips after you've been unconscious... either you are now in a coma and brain dead or getting there. I would hope? Even if you have more gas, if you miss, you miss. The extra gas would really finish the job?

I would check if Canada has anything similar or test the purity of gas if uncertain.

Also time to CTB with gas seems to vary person to person but according to accounts seem to be 10+ mins. Also it less of one or the other but a spectrum of unconscious to brain damage to CTB. It depends of how long your brain has been deprived of oxygen. Hence why you want a buffer you don't want to not CTB because you didn't have enough gas and suffer severe brain damage. Also having extra gas to test purity, leak testing and trial runs to ensure everything is working correctly is useful and having more gas is better than having less

 

[Username1]

I want to bind my body for reliability. What can I write in a search engine to find what I need? I manage to find either belts for pants or ties for cargo

 

[Ammended]

I want to bind my body for reliability. What can I write in a search engine to find what I need? I manage to find either belts for pants or ties for cargo

Luggage straps.

 

[DyingToDie123]

So I finally got the guts to start doing it today, I turn on the gas and the regulator is leaking like mad, so much so that the little ball isn't even floating. It seems to be mostly or all from the point where the cylinder connects to the regulator. My best guess is that it's not screwing on tightly enough by hand (since there is some thread showing) so I've ordered a wrench that's coming in tomorrow morning to try that. My second best guess is that the regulator is crap so I've ordered a different one on Amazon just in case.

If anyone has other recommendations/solutions I should look into in the meantime, I would love to hear them. I know it's hard to diagnose without actually being able to feel/witness it though. I'm really frustrated, I really thought this was it, I'd finally figured it out, and yet another road block comes up.

 

[thewalkingdread]

My best guess is that it's not screwing on tightly enough by hand (since there is some thread showing) so I've ordered a wrench that's coming in tomorrow morning to try that

Probably it's this... You need a wrench to tight the Seal up... You could also try that white film they use on piping treads to help with the sealing too...

 

[ClownWorld2023]

I turn on the gas and the regulator is leaking like mad, so much so that the little ball isn't even floating. It seems to be mostly or all from the point where the cylinder connects to the regulator. My best guess is that it's not screwing on tightly enough by hand (since there is some thread showing) so I've ordered a wrench that's coming in tomorrow morning to try that.

Yes, you must tighten it using a wrench. It's a required step.

Did you order the correct size (and type) wrench?

My second best guess is that the regulator is crap so I've ordered a different one on Amazon just in case.

Regulator should be fine.

 

[bigfishlittlefish]

Exit Bag and Inert Gas Basics —A very, very long post, I know, but I feel like I've fielded a lot of questions about this, so I figured I'd spell out everything I know. Others on the forum should please add to this thread whatever reliable technical information they feel is appropriate for someone attempting this method to have.

The idea behind using an exit bag with inert gas is to create an atmosphere around your head that is both free of life-sustaining O2 and can carry away the exhaled CO2 that would activate your hypercapnic alarm.

The Gas:

You will need to keep the inert gas flowing at 15 liters per minute (Lpm) for 40 minutes to be confident of ending your life —in other words, you'll need a minimum of 600 liters of inert gas. In the past this would have been helium (He), but due to the uncertain availability of genuinely pure He, the best current options are nitrogen (N2) and argon (Ar). Both are reliably available in pure form (no air contamination) from stores that supply welders. N2 is also available from some brewery supply houses, but the purity of the gas should be confirmed to your satisfaction. Both N2 and Ar should work to ctb and are similar enough in their properties to be treated identically for use with an exit bag.

Pressurized gas cylinder sizes are not standardized across the industry, nor internationally, and it can be difficult, if not impossible, to tell how much gas they contain from a photograph on a website.

In the US, a 20 cubic foot (cf) cylinder is the smallest you should use for ctb; a 40cf will allow some margin for flinching, practicing, etc. "A 20cf" and "a 40cf", or "a 20" and "a 40" is nomenclature US welding supply houses will recognize, so asking for either should get you the desired product. A 20cf cylinder is quite small for industrial use; I've had clerks tell me, "well, we have a 40, but we'll need to special order a 20." It's up to you what you do in that situation. Personally, I have a 40cf cylinder. It has allowed me to flinch and abort my attempt three times now, and I don't need to worry about refilling it. I bought my N2 at AirGas, a national company here in the US. They do not demand any sort of professional certification for purchasing inert gas, and no more than the usual forms of ID depending on payment method.

I know nothing of gas cylinders outside the US, so if you are using other than US-typical cylinders, you'll need to call and ask to make sure whatever tank you're contemplating holds 600L of compressed gas. Hopefully knowledgeable forum members will add cylinder sizing information to this knowledge base.

Cover story: N2 and Ar are both used for welding. N2 is used in beer brewing. In my day job, I use both N2 and Ar to flood partial cans of expensive paint, to displace the O2 in the cans and prevent the paint from skinning over and going bad. It's a cost saving measure. The clerks I've bought gas from have never heard of that trick, which has meant they don't know enough to interrogate me on my motives or to try and quiz me on my welding knowledge. They have merely said, "huh! That's a new one!"

The store clerk may ask how you're carrying the pressurized cylinder "back to your shop," since pressurized cylinders can be very hazardous to transport (the valve is vulnerable to damage in an accident). I haven't had any trouble when I have told the clerk, "in the back footwell of my car, and very carefully padded!" What they really want to know is that you are aware that a pressurized cylinder is a missile waiting to explode if anything damages it, and that you know enough to not let that happen.

Thanks for all this.

PPH talks a little about someone removing the gear so it looks like you passed naturally.. I'm wondering how realistic this actually is though - won't a gas canister be found in the yeah, for instance? Plus, it means someone would have to be there to remove the hood...
I don't want to go alone, and may not have to. if I don't go alone I want to make damn sure I protect the person who is there immediately after...

 

[Mare Imbrium]

So I finally got the guts to start doing it today, I turn on the gas and the regulator is leaking like mad, so much so that the little ball isn't even floating. It seems to be mostly or all from the point where the cylinder connects to the regulator. My best guess is that it's not screwing on tightly enough by hand (since there is some thread showing) so I've ordered a wrench that's coming in tomorrow morning to try that. My second best guess is that the regulator is crap so I've ordered a different one on Amazon just in case.

If anyone has other recommendations/solutions I should look into in the meantime, I would love to hear them. I know it's hard to diagnose without actually being able to feel/witness it though. I'm really frustrated, I really thought this was it, I'd finally figured it out, and yet another road block comes up.

You cannot tighten a regulator by hand.

 

[DyingToDie123]

Probably it's this... You need a wrench to tight the Seal up... You could also try that white film they use on piping treads to help with the sealing too...

Yes, you must tighten it using a wrench. It's a required step.

Did you order the correct size (and type) wrench?



Regulator should be fine.

You cannot tighten a regulator by hand.

Thanks! Wrench came in (10" adjustable open-ended). It seems to fit but I can't get it screwed on any further than before. Can I attribute this to anything other than my lack of upper body strength?

Update: I think I figured it out somehow, air is coming through the hose now. The little ball blasts to the top whenever I turn it on the slightest, I'm not sure how to get it in the correct range, so that's my next mission.

Update #2: I figured out how to adjust the airflow! You all are wonderful tysm <333

 

[RazorWing]

Thanks for all this.

PPH talks a little about someone removing the gear so it looks like you passed naturally.. I'm wondering how realistic this actually is though - won't a gas canister be found in the yeah, for instance? Plus, it means someone would have to be there to remove the hood...
I don't want to go alone, and may not have to. if I don't go alone I want to make damn sure I protect the person who is there immediately after...

This is really difficult to do. Someone would have to be willing to remove the hood/mask and cylinder from the scene. Typically this action alone in most countries is unlawful as they will be tampering with evidence and so whoever you get to do it could end up going to prison if caught. In the absence of a reason for death, a postmortem would take place to determine cause of death. It's extremely difficult (not impossible) to detect that an insert gas was the cause of death. I would suggest if you strongly want to go down this road that the person you get to do it understands the consequences if caught.

 

[thewalkingdread]

@DyingToDie123 @reallysleepy

I've just stumbled, by chance, at an YouTube vídeo that gives us some basic information about gas cylinders and pressure... Not much, but it's worth to check It out.

It starts at 6:20



It's also fun to watch solely for the Elon Musk debunk.... God... I hate that duchebag

 

[thewalkingdread]

A decade ago, back in 2013, when i had my first major episode of active suicidal ideation, I started to research on topics like right-to-die and euthanasia... and I soon discovered the Final Exit book, and DVD, by Derek Humphry... That kind — empathetic! — man changed my life forever because he gave me all the reassurance that I craved, i. e, that I could end my torment, peacefully, at any point of my choosing, in a very simple way...

I have always wanted to CTB via Exit Bag and Helium ever since... It just stucked with me, in my mind, through all these years... this is the most accessible and peaceful method to euthanize myself.

I wouldn't need any fancy prescription drugs, lying to doctors, nor any other complicated stuff. At that time, you could just go to a "toy R us", get a couple of party hellium gas tanks, some PVC tubing, craft a plastic Exit Bag, and done!

Unfortunately, Helium party ballon tanks are not reliable anymore, only industrial Nitrogen tanks are... Which is a bummer, since I never really got the chance to play with Helium,as a kid, in order to make the notorious squeaky voice... and I was hoping to do it as one of the last things I would do before leaving this piece of shit world/reality...

Ironically, I always got some confort in the idea that dying with a last squeaky laughter would be a good last goodbye joke...

 

[Naitachal11]

People, it's not so complicated

Read the PPH

I tried to click the link for the pph and it said website not available. Do you have a current link? I'm not technically inclined so I don't have a VPN or use tor. Would love to learn how but not sure if that's possible.