Discussion What is supposed to bring meaning to my life now? :P

[Coconteppi]

I've always considered myself open minded. And I try to be open to others ideas. So I thought this would be a good place to ask/discuss this without fear of giving people survivors guilt n all.

Anyways, I wanted to ask. Life wasn't so bad when I was younger (<8yr old). But that was really only because I was still in the learning "honeymoon" phase with life. I was still learning about everything it had to offer and hadn't yet understood all that was possible. I also hadn't learned of the ability to ctb. So I really just was learning and exploring without an understanding that I could even leave. However, now that I know the possibilities life entails and offers. I don't really care to pursue any of it before death. I've grown content with what I have done so far and gain no more meaning from the things that I do relative to my death. There is nothing in life that I would see the point in doing before death anymore. I still have things I think would be cool to do, but I don't think any of it is something I need to do before death.

So, I am asking for others thoughts. I don't have anything I care to do, and am content with death having lived the life I've lived so far. Anything I do now is extra. So, if I were to live another >50yr, what would I be supposed to do to that would outweigh all the negative parts of life associated with living/doing that? What's supposed to be my meaning in life at this point?

This is not a call for help. It is an open discussion regarding a question I have had. I am looking answers to this question, and not opinions as to whether or not I should ctb.

I'd love to hear y'alls thoughts and proposed solutions to this! :)

(I did not proofread any of this, sorry for any grammatical errors.) :P

 

[SoulCage]

I feel the same way. I am so done with trying out things in life and there is literally 0 left to do, only surviving and suffering. Especially now that I am limited by my aged body.
I once thought it had a meaning which is: enjoying a variety of little pleasures (on a daily basis) and feeling appreciation by friends and family. And there was a hope that things get easier over time. But they actually only got harder. It was no longer worth pursuing my "meaning". It wasn't enough to cover for the pain.

Life was and always will be a shitty deal.

 

[Archness]

I believe the purpose is self-evident to oneself. Not that they decide it, or that it comes from thin-air. Just that you naturally know what it is given a life and situation.

When all that's left is nihil, that's that. Rather you're content or empty doesn't matter, what's left is just the wait for death.

Pixar's Soul touched on this a bit, might give you some insight, though it is very mid.

Personally, I'm just gonna vibe, listen to music, watch YT and consume other medias until I can't take it anymore then CTB.

 

[INTJme]

There is no inherent meaning to life. One creates meaning for themselves because, as a meta-cognitive species, we can't live in a vacuum. So if you've decided there's no worthwhile meaning or purpose left, it's natural to think in the direction of ctb.

I'm 31 and have tried most things they ask to do before voluntary ctb-ing like travelling solo to find oneself, adventure sports, facing a fear, falling in love, having sex etc. The only thing that could've been close to giving me enough meaning and purpose would've been starting a family with someone who loved me as much as I loved them, but that didn't happen.

Also, with my brain wired the way it is, I think it's best the above didn't happen because if I had started a family, I would never be able to bring myself to ctb. Saves me from so much more suffering.

 

[FuneralCry]

Your feelings really are understandable, I personally see existence as completely meaningless and pointless, in my case I simply don't wish to experience anything, all I wish for is for this existence to eternally disappear into nothingness. I see no point to suffering in this existence when there are no disadvantages to the peace of an eternal dreamless sleep, to me human existence is very undesirable especially as there is literally no limit as to how torturous it can get, the thought of suffering here for many more decades terrifies me.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I guess the answer is- no one knows because no one has a crystal ball. You could be on a train journey and start discussing a subject that interests you which makes you decide to pursue it further and it may make an enormous difference to your life. You might meet someone or discover a hobby or a cause that changes your life around.

I think the major stumbling block is not being fussed about it though. If we're not open to new opportunities. Not even looking for them. What's the chances they will land in our lap? And, even if they do, will we have the enthusiasm to pursue them?

I feel similarly to you by the way. There's not even that much I particularly want to do in life now. It's not even that i don't enjoy things. Although, maybe that I don't enjoy them enough. Everything takes effort. When you look back on your life (and I've had 44 years of it..) and think- was any of it really worth the effort and you come out with- rarely! It kind of makes you think- I can't be arsed anymore!

 

[Coconteppi]

I believe the purpose is self-evident to oneself. Not that they decide it, or that it comes from thin-air. Just that you naturally know what it is given a life and situation.

When all that's left is nihil, that's that. Rather you're content or empty doesn't matter, what's left is just the wait for death.

Pixar's Soul touched on this a bit, might give you some insight, though it is very mid.

Personally, I'm just gonna vibe, listen to music, watch YT and consume other medias until I can't take it anymore then CTB.

Agreed. I've been liiving that way for a while now and I've reached that point. I don't really care to stay around so hedonistically anymore. I don't see the point in living that way and don't care to just go through the motions of it anymore.

There is no inherent meaning to life. One creates meaning for themselves because, as a meta-cognitive species, we can't live in a vacuum. So if you've decided there's no worthwhile meaning or purpose left, it's natural to think in the direction of ctb.

I'm 31 and have tried most things they ask to do before voluntary ctb-ing like travelling solo to find oneself, adventure sports, facing a fear, falling in love, having sex etc. The only thing that could've been close to giving me enough meaning and purpose would've been starting a family with someone who loved me as much as I loved them, but that didn't happen.

Also, with my brain wired the way it is, I think it's best the above didn't happen because if I had started a family, I would never be able to bring myself to ctb. Saves me from so much more suffering.

Thank you. I unfortunately don't like the idea of having kids. And have trouble really seeing the point to a relationship. Friendships inherrently make more sense to my way of thinking. I could live for my partner but that isn't really something that would bring me fulfillment. It'd just be a continuation of me trying to be a good person. I would just want to be a house-partner so I could be free to help them at any time. But I don't think I'd feel I brought purpose back into my life.
If I were to raise a kid I'd adopt. And Idk if I really feel I am qualified to raise another person. I don't really like the idea of having that much power over someone elses life.

Your feelings really are understandable, I personally see existence as completely meaningless and pointless, in my case I simply don't wish to experience anything, all I wish for is for this existence to eternally disappear into nothingness. I see no point to suffering in this existence when there are no disadvantages to the peace of an eternal dreamless sleep, to me human existence is very undesirable especially as there is literally no limit as to how torturous it can get, the thought of suffering here for many more decades terrifies me.

I wanted to ask. Do you personally believe thay death is the abscence of everything or truw nothingness? I kinda just think death could be anything equally as much as nothing. I see it as a true unknown. It could be anything at all, worse/better/same/new/etc. I would love to hear more about your thoughts! :)

I guess the answer is- no one knows because no one has a crystal ball. You could be on a train journey and start discussing a subject that interests you which makes you decide to pursue it further and it may make an enormous difference to your life. You might meet someone or discover a hobby or a cause that changes your life around.

I think the major stumbling block is not being fussed about it though. If we're not open to new opportunities. Not even looking for them. What's the chances they will land in our lap? And, even if they do, will we have the enthusiasm to pursue them?

I feel similarly to you by the way. There's not even that much I particularly want to do in life now. It's not even that i don't enjoy things. Although, maybe that I don't enjoy them enough. Everything takes effort. When you look back on your life (and I've had 44 years of it..) and think- was any of it really worth the effort and you come out with- rarely! It kind of makes you think- I can't be arsed anymore!

So far, you sound like you're in the closest mental state to myself. I can still enjoy things. "Thats an absolutely beautiful sunset, I really liked that movie, that person is really fun to be around. Etc." And I would say my deppression is relatively mild compared to my own standards and compared to those around me. I am able to enjoy life for what it is... But this doesn't fix that I've grown content and see no real reason in pursuing those feelings as the thing that keeps me going. Although I have been suicidal for a while now. I still try to live an interesting/good/successful life. Similarly to what I said in the OP, I am completely open to the possibility of something bringing meaning to my life. I still live in a way that ensures my future self can hopefully pursue any desires in life. But I just don't see anything that could be. The most sensical way I've heard someone describe it is "Sometimes you'll just have to wait and see if it brought meaning (was worth it) to your future self." However, I really don't see the point in going through such an underwhelming life up until that point.

I'd love to hear more of your thoughts. It sounded like you were in a similar boat to me, and I hope to see if that stands true. :)

I guess the answer is- no one knows because no one has a crystal ball. You could be on a train journey and start discussing a subject that interests you which makes you decide to pursue it further and it may make an enormous difference to your life. You might meet someone or discover a hobby or a cause that changes your life around.

I think the major stumbling block is not being fussed about it though. If we're not open to new opportunities. Not even looking for them. What's the chances they will land in our lap? And, even if they do, will we have the enthusiasm to pursue them?

I feel similarly to you by the way. There's not even that much I particularly want to do in life now. It's not even that i don't enjoy things. Although, maybe that I don't enjoy them enough. Everything takes effort. When you look back on your life (and I've had 44 years of it..) and think- was any of it really worth the effort and you come out with- rarely! It kind of makes you think- I can't be arsed anymore!

So far, you sound like you're in the closest mental state to myself. I can still enjoy things. "Thats an absolutely beautiful sunset, I really liked that movie, that person is really fun to be around. Etc." And I would say my deppression is relatively mild compared to my own standards and compared to those around me. I am able to enjoy life for what it is... But this doesn't fix that I've grown content and see no real reason in pursuing those feelings as the thing that keeps me going. Although I have been suicidal for a while now. I still try to live an interesting/good/successful life. Similarly to what I said in the OP, I am completely open to the possibility of something bringing meaning to my life. I still live in a way that ensures my future self can hopefully pursue any desires in life. But I just don't see anything that could be. The most sensical way I've heard someone describe it is "Sometimes you'll just have to wait and see if it brought meaning (was worth it) to your future self." However, I really don't see the point in going through such an underwhelming life up until that point.

I'd love to hear more of your thoughts. It sounded like you were in a similar boat to me, and I hope to see if that stands true. :)

 

[FuneralCry]

I simply believe death to be eternal nothingness which is the absence of everything, I believe death to be nothing more than an dreamless, eternal sleep where all is finally forgotten about. This is why I find comfort in death, all I see as beautiful is the permanent absence of existence, I'd always see it as better that this existence disappears into nothingness.

 

[Coconteppi]

I simply believe death to be eternal nothingness which is the absence of everything, I believe death to be nothing more than an dreamless, eternal sleep where all is finally forgotten about. This is why I find comfort in death, all I see as beautiful is the permanent absence of existence, I'd always see it as better that this existence disappears into nothingness.

I think thats beautiful. I would be very greatful if this is true. The absence of all sounds like a great close to the life I've lived.

What lead you to believe this is what death holds in store? I'd love to hear more! :)

 

[FuneralCry]

Because I don't believe there to be any deeper meaning or purpose behind existence, it's all senseless, I believe consciousness to be stored in the brain and once we die that is it for us, we are gone. I see existence as nothing more than a futile process of waiting for death.

 

[4.I.2.Must.Die]

Because I don't believe there to be any deeper meaning or purpose behind existence, it's all senseless, I believe consciousness to be stored in the brain and once we die that is it for us, we are gone. I see existence as nothing more than a futile process of waiting for death.

Jeez x2 replies .....I almost CTB from a heart attack .....please keep it up
@FuneralCry​

 

[Coconteppi]

Because I don't believe there to be any deeper meaning or purpose behind existence, it's all senseless, I believe consciousness to be stored in the brain and once we die that is it for us, we are gone. I see existence as nothing more than a futile process of waiting for death.

That is really interesting! :D
In what way do you think life is "senseless"?

Why do you think existence is a futile process of waiting for death? Do you feel as though it is a disruption to your inexistance?

Jeez x2 replies .....I almost CTB from a heart attack .....please keep it up
@FuneralCry​

I've seen you quite a bit on SaSu. I didn't expect you to reply here. Welcome! :)

 

[FuneralCry]

Senseless as there is no deeper meaning or purpose behind existence, chance so cruelly determines everything after all, and existence truly is so useless as it never needed to exist, it just creates unnecessary problems and meaningless suffering.

And existence is just a futile process of waiting for death as that's what it is after all, we are all just waiting until somehow, someday this existence permanently disappears into nothingness whether it's on our own terms or not. I do see existence as a temporary, meaningless nightmare that so tragically disturbed the peace of nothingness and I believe that ceasing to exist is the return to that ideal state

 

[Coconteppi]

Senseless as there is no deeper meaning or purpose behind existence, chance so cruelly determines everything after all, and existence truly is so useless as it never needed to exist, it just creates unnecessary problems and meaningless suffering.

And existence is just a futile process of waiting for death as that's what it is after all, we are all just waiting until somehow, someday this existence permanently disappears into nothingness whether it's on our own terms or not. I do see existence as a temporary, meaningless nightmare that so tragically disturbed the peace of nothingness and I believe that ceasing to exist is the return to that ideal state

Is it possibly not pure chance though? Is the future not unchangable.

I don't know if "we all" are waiting for death. When I was a child I didn't wait for or hope to die someday. I enjoyed life for the experience of it. I think life is a bit more meaningful/enjoyable to some more so than others. I don't think most who want to live care to go to the nothingness of death.

Is life not neat simply because of the fact that its rare and there are other entities that are able to enjoy it to so you're not alone in it. I personally think that having gotten to experience life was more enjoyable for myself. However, I don't believe that this is the case for others.
Did you ever have a point in your life that you feel you would have rather experienced than the nothingness of "death".

 

[FuneralCry]

No, under no circumstances would I ever want to experience the abomination that is existence. Being conscious and aware is a curse to me, more than anything I wish I never existed at all. All that existence has ever caused me is suffering, I'd be glad to peacefully not exist.

 

[Coconteppi]

No, under no circumstances would I ever want to experience the abomination that is existence. Being conscious and aware is a curse to me, more than anything I wish I never existed at all. All that existence has ever caused me is suffering, I'd be glad to peacefully not exist.

I'm really sorry to hear that. What has kept you from ctb so far? Are hedonistic activities enjoyable for you?

 

[FuneralCry]

I'm only still here as there isn't the option to just reliably die in peace, what I'd also fear is trying to die going wrong and leading to way worse suffering, I despise how suicide is purposely made so inaccessible.
I see nothing enjoyable about something so hellish and unnecessary as human existence, all I wish for is the permanent release from it.

 

[Homo erectus]

If there are still 50 years of active life to think or worry about, maybe one can consider moving to a foreign place. Many problems in life, like suicide, cancer, are partly environmental. Some cancer disappears after moving to a new place and having a new diet. There are places where people have many children. There must be reasons that they like life very much.

 

[sserafim]

If there are still 50 years of active life to think or worry about, maybe one can consider moving to a foreign place. Many problems in life, like suicide, cancer, are partly environmental. Some cancer disappears after moving to a new place and having a new diet. There are places where people have many children. There must be reasons that they like life very much.

Maybe America is making me sick

 

[Homo erectus]

Maybe America is making me sick

Probably. Being a "foreigner" is a different mindset. Maybe people don't get boxed in mundane daily issues that often. They just blame their foreignness and move on.

 

[Blank_Slate]

I appreciate that your post is not a call for help.

I've experienced very similar to you in that as I get older (I'm now in my early 30s) fewer and fewer things are really engaging to me or can hold my focus - and I sometimes find myself just wanting to do nothing - I don't want to watch a TV show, I don't want to play a game, I don't want to read a book, I don't want to learn something new, I don't want to go for a walk - etc etc - I really have no "will" - not no will to live, just no will to do any of the things that usually comprise life.

These feelings are generally associated with depression - and certainly to me it seems rational to consider them a function of mental state rather than some kind of philosophical state of nihilism which actually philosophically ought to have nothing to do with whether or not we feel the desire to do things. Realizing the disconnect between our experience of the world and the world itself is probably one of the keys to answering your question technically speaking. When you were a child your psychology allowed you to become totally engrossed in new challenges, to learn, to explore, to feel wonder - that wasn't a function of how much knowledge or experience you had, but a function of the way the adolescent mind works.

Likewise we are not philosophical beings - we are animals that have the illusion of reason and function mostly off of something like "instinct" - we're just semi-self aware of it.

I'm going to point to one of my favourite "pessimist" philosophers Arthur Schopenhauer who wrote extensively on the concept of "the will".

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." -AS
"Desire is the most important feature of man's will; without it, will would be aimless and senseless." -AS

So from this we might see that if we don't have any desire or any will to do anything - the only thing left to ask is whether we preferred life when we had those feelings of desire and will - something pushing us to feel curious and to feel exhilarated at the thought of accomplishment, or to obsess over something and put all of ourselves into it.

If yes, then ask whether there's anything a person can do to regain those feelings. And as it turns out, generally there is something you can do, which is therapy/lifestyle change/in some instances treating an underlying physiological issue chemical/condition. A good place to start is to force yourself to exercise in my experience. So many problems in life connect back to and manifest in the body - that is why injury, disease, or addiction can have such a profound negative effect on psychology. I like to try to find a place that's comfortable that I can go back to go for a walk and get some fresh air - often just the physical act of strolling through a park can suddenly get your thoughts flowing in a more liminal way that feels more dynamic and full of possibility.

 

[Coconteppi]

If there are still 50 years of active life to think or worry about, maybe one can consider moving to a foreign place. Many problems in life, like suicide, cancer, are partly environmental. Some cancer disappears after moving to a new place and having a new diet. There are places where people have many children. There must be reasons that they like life very much.

Interesting! I've thought about this. Specifically Sweden as they seem to have very high happiness/friendlyness/quality-of-life index ratings. If I were to keep toughing life out I planned to move to Sweden. My thought process was if I wanted to be happy and hope to keep living. I should move to the "happiest" place in the world.

But I don't actually have terribly many problems living in Texas. And I don't see any real reasons that moving to another country would bring meaning back to my life. I don't have anything I desire to do in Sweden or any other country.

Thank you though! You seem to have came to similar possible options as I did when thinking about this. :)

Probably. Being a "foreigner" is a different mindset. Maybe people don't get boxed in mundane daily issues that often. They just blame their foreignness and move on.

This is an interesting take as well. Could be the case.

 

[Tears in Rain]

I still have things I think would be cool to do, but I don't think any of it is something I need to do before death.

If you still have things you think would be cool to do, then go ahead and do them. If you feel like you might still get some enjoyment out of life, then you might as well still try, there's no rush to ctb.

What's supposed to be my meaning in life at this point?

Life has whatever meaning you give it yourself, no more than that.

I've experienced very similar to you in that as I get older (I'm now in my early 30s) fewer and fewer things are really engaging to me or can hold my focus - and I sometimes find myself just wanting to do nothing - I don't want to watch a TV show, I don't want to play a game, I don't want to read a book, I don't want to learn something new, I don't want to go for a walk - etc etc - I really have no "will" - not no will to live, just no will to do any of the things that usually comprise life.

These feelings are generally associated with depression - and certainly to me it seems rational to consider them a function of mental state rather than some kind of philosophical state of nihilism which actually philosophically ought to have nothing to do with whether or not we feel the desire to do things.

While the mental state you're in can lead you to lose interest in things, like you describe in your situation, it could also just be a philosophical disillusionment with life. You may no longer enjoy the things you used to enjoy, they no longer bring any meaning to your life. This can obviously then lead to a lack of desire to do the things you used to enjoy.

So from this we might see that if we don't have any desire or any will to do anything - the only thing left to ask is whether we preferred life when we had those feelings of desire and will - something pushing us to feel curious and to feel exhilarated at the thought of accomplishment, or to obsess over something and put all of ourselves into it.

If yes, then ask whether there's anything a person can do to regain those feelings. And as it turns out, generally there is something you can do, which is therapy/lifestyle change/in some instances treating an underlying physiological issue chemical/condition.

Sometimes there's no going back to the way we were.

 

[Little_Suzy]

Your life, from the moment you are born until you reach the age of eighteen, is predetermined.

The life you lead from 18 to 30 is entirely of your own making.

Life after 30 involves personal growth, gaining wisdom from past experiences, healing from difficult times, and enjoying the fruits of one's efforts.

Conquer the Foe: Fear!
Fear of not meeting expectations, rejection, failure, or inadequacy.

You must not let fear control you. Finding the life you love requires taking part in everything that life has to offer and making the most of every opportunity that comes your way.

Being good at something tangible is the best way to boost your self-esteem, which is an important step toward overcoming fear! You don't have to be smart, rich, or even attractive; just be good at something with your hands!

 

[Blank_Slate]

While the mental state you're in can lead you to lose interest in things, like you describe in your situation, it could also just be a philosophical disillusionment with life. You may no longer enjoy the things you used to enjoy, they no longer bring any meaning to your life. This can obviously then lead to a lack of desire to do the things you used to enjoy.


Sometimes there's no going back to the way we were.

I respect your line of thinking, but I don't think it's technically possible to experience "philosophical disillusionment with life". I can read and agree with pessimist philosophy like Schopenhauer or Buddhist philosophy (I do) but it doesn't change my mental state or desire to experience and alter my world.

Disillusionment with life can only exist if the psychology that sustains a person's will is broken. And it seems like it's exclusively life events or physiological disorders that can cause that state - you can not reason with a person to place them in that state via philosophical proofs, nor can you pull them out of it by rebuttal.

I accept philosophical concepts such as the uncompensated suffering of life, or that pleasure cannot cancel out pain, yet here I am largely enjoying my life and happily willing it to go on for as long as possible. Am I suffering from delusion? Well certainly, we all are - none of us can see reality as it truly is, all of us can only experience the world subjectively.

As for "going back to the way we were" - no of course not but that's not what we are talking about. I can no more become the person who I was last year or last week than I can become you. But the person who inhabits your identity in the future does have the capacity to obtain that will and desire, so long as problems in living can be resolved, or any physiological damage or illness can be repaired or mitigated.

Of course there are exceptions - but those exceptions are basically terminal illness and conditions that cause indefinite and incurable abysmal quality of life. I don't say this to minimize the severity or reality of something like clinical depression, but just to expose the reality of it. Now I will regretfully concede that in practice there are many who are sadly lost because they are either neglected or unseen.

 

[Tears in Rain]

I respect your line of thinking, but I don't think it's technically possible to experience "philosophical disillusionment with life".

You can, it's called existential angst. Life no longer holds any meaning in any form for a person.

Disillusionment with life can only exist if the psychology that sustains a person's will is broken.

Life is ultimately meaningless. When someone can no longer find any meaning in anything, and it strikes to the core of their psyche, it can lead to a mental meltdown for some.
A.K.A. existential angst/dread.

I accept philosophical concepts such as the uncompensated suffering of life, or that pleasure cannot cancel out pain, yet here I am largely enjoying my life and happily willing it to go on for as long as possible.

If you are largely enjoying your life, and happily willing to go on as long as possible, what brings you to a suicide forum?

Am I suffering from delusion? Well certainly, we all are - none of us can see reality as it truly is, all of us can only experience the world subjectively.

True, life is a subjective experience.

As for "going back to the way we were" - no of course not but that's not what we are talking about. I can no longer become the person who I was last year or last week than I can become you. But the person who inhabits your identity in the future does have the capacity to obtain that will and desire, so long as problems in living can be resolved, or any physiological damage or illness can be repaired or mitigated.

"So long as problems in living can be resolved, or any physiological damage or illness can be repaired or mitigated".

Wow, you make it sound so easy!
I appreciate what you're saying, people should do everything they can to get out of the hole they find themselves in.
But a lot of people on here have obviously exhausted all options.

 

[Circles]

I always like the idea that life is just a tragic dance that's uncontrollable and impossible to make sense of. Trying to find meaning in a meaningless universe is always going to be a daunting challenge cause unlike most species us humans want to have it all make sense. But making sense of a senseless existence is pointless cause even if you found any meaning that could make all this senseless suffering and death the answers would probably be unsatisfactory and it might just as well feel hollow.

 

[Blank_Slate]

1. You can, it's called existential angst. Life no longer holds any meaning in any form for a person.


2. Life is ultimately meaningless. When someone can no longer find any meaning in anything, and it strikes to the core of their psyche, it can lead to a mental meltdown for some.
A.K.A. existential angst/dread.


3. If you are largely enjoying your life, and happily willing to go on as long as possible, what brings you to a suicide forum?


4. True, life is a subjective experience.


5. "So long as problems in living can be resolved, or any physiological damage or illness can be repaired or mitigated".

Wow, you make it sound so easy!
I appreciate what you're saying, people should do everything they can to get out of the hole they find themselves in.
But a lot of people on here have obviously exhausted all options.

Thank you for the response. Let me first say just to set the tone that I'm not approaching our exchange as an argument or debate, but rather as a conversation.

1. I think we are having some kind of semantic disagreement - my assertion is that these are feelings, not philosophical positions. You can use philosophy to justify or rationalize those feelings, but the feelings themself are not "philosophical" in nature. If a person can't find meaning in the world it isn't because of a philosophical question, anymore than you need philosophy to find "meaning" in the world. Feelings, such as the search for meaning, can be influenced or rationalized by philosophy, but the feelings themselves are not inherently philosophical.

2. Life is absurd in nature - to say that it is meaningless is again to fall victim to a kind of semantic trap - meaning is not a characteristic of life, and it never could be. Meaning comes from the will and our desires - when we feel ourselves being pulled by those inherent urges the world is coloured by them and we create meaning only in the context of our own will.

3. I've had personal experience with depression and suicidal thoughts, as well as with family members who have experienced illness that they expressed they wished to induce death to avoid experiencing. One of those family members also worked in the healthcare profession and witnessed first hand pain and suffering that evidently caused them to give these issues great consideration. They enjoyed their life, but deeply feared being unable to escape it while suffering from a debilitating pain and loss of their mind. Recovering from my own mental health issues as well as solidarity with my loved ones who deserved the right to death are the two converging issues that inform my desire to participate here. These experiences have caused me to think about these issues quite a bit, and I want to share and learn from others who are stakeholders in these issues.

4. Cheers

5. Yes it certainly is not easy - in fact depression can be one of the most difficult afflictions to overcome, especially when it's severe and/or accompanied by hard conditions in a person's life. It's a very complex issue but I was trying to boil it down to the simplest form of the idea.

Some people are depressed because of the material conditions of their life - this can be so difficult because the depression makes it harder to change those conditions, and often even without the depression the cards can be stacked against us. This is a kind of depression that you might call realist depression - they are depressed because the world they live in is depressing. Some people are depressed because the world they lived in was depressing, and now it's a bit better but their psychological state hasn't adjusted. And still some people really have a lot going for them in life, but they are afflicted with depression because of a physiological condition (this one I would argue is actually pretty rare - usually people are depressed for a reason).

In any case - even when the depression is a symptom of the depressed world that the person lives in - the depression itself is a subjective experience - it's a "mental disorder" and this is backed up by modern biology and advancing medical studies.

And I just want to make sure this clear because I think that while depression often causes people to report the world more accurately, I also believe that it clouds judgement in some equal and opposite ways. I think one of the issues is that we have medicalized mental health issues and created a system that tries to use drugs for example as a band-aid. In reality the vast majority of these problems are caused by "problems in living" - the actual lives of people (Thomas S. Szasz).

And yes I really feel for all of the people who have exhausted all of their options. There are many here who I have read from and they give accounts that paint exactly that picture. Even for those people, and for all the people who still have options remaining, I just want to try to provide something like a sober and honest account of the facts - not one characterized by the influence of depression or resignment, and equally not one characterized by societies irrational fear of allowing people autonomy over their own life or death.

 

[Coconteppi]

I appreciate that your post is not a call for help.

I've experienced very similar to you in that as I get older (I'm now in my early 30s) fewer and fewer things are really engaging to me or can hold my focus - and I sometimes find myself just wanting to do nothing - I don't want to watch a TV show, I don't want to play a game, I don't want to read a book, I don't want to learn something new, I don't want to go for a walk - etc etc - I really have no "will" - not no will to live, just no will to do any of the things that usually comprise life.

These feelings are generally associated with depression - and certainly to me it seems rational to consider them a function of mental state rather than some kind of philosophical state of nihilism which actually philosophically ought to have nothing to do with whether or not we feel the desire to do things. Realizing the disconnect between our experience of the world and the world itself is probably one of the keys to answering your question technically speaking. When you were a child your psychology allowed you to become totally engrossed in new challenges, to learn, to explore, to feel wonder - that wasn't a function of how much knowledge or experience you had, but a function of the way the adolescent mind works.

Likewise we are not philosophical beings - we are animals that have the illusion of reason and function mostly off of something like "instinct" - we're just semi-self aware of it.

I'm going to point to one of my favourite "pessimist" philosophers Arthur Schopenhauer who wrote extensively on the concept of "the will".

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." -AS
"Desire is the most important feature of man's will; without it, will would be aimless and senseless." -AS

So from this we might see that if we don't have any desire or any will to do anything - the only thing left to ask is whether we preferred life when we had those feelings of desire and will - something pushing us to feel curious and to feel exhilarated at the thought of accomplishment, or to obsess over something and put all of ourselves into it.

If yes, then ask whether there's anything a person can do to regain those feelings. And as it turns out, generally there is something you can do, which is therapy/lifestyle change/in some instances treating an underlying physiological issue chemical/condition. A good place to start is to force yourself to exercise in my experience. So many problems in life connect back to and manifest in the body - that is why injury, disease, or addiction can have such a profound negative effect on psychology. I like to try to find a place that's comfortable that I can go back to go for a walk and get some fresh air - often just the physical act of strolling through a park can suddenly get your thoughts flowing in a more liminal way that feels more dynamic and full of possibility.

Thank you this was a very in depth and thought out reply! I appreciate it! :)

I believe we differ a but in our desire to do things. As you might not want to do most things. I actually enjoy many of the things in a hedonistic. sense. I enjoy most things in life. However, I don't have any interest in doing the things I enjoy for so many more years. I feel life is kinda lived out. I don't care to continue doing things I enjoy because they're no longer interesting. I don't see anything that could fill the gap of something interesting out there. And having to work and deal with the pains of life is not worth doing things that I feel aren't enjoyable/interesting enough in exchange. I'd just rather go into whatever death is and call it early. Whether better/worse I am content with choosing it over life.

 

[AnyWonderBR]

So I am alive, forced alive, against the grit of teeth grinning at the sadism, of filth, of a tentacle disgusting hand, it's claws against the narroways causing a tempest, and claiming all life that would wish to escape. Yet there is no comfort in company. I hate this flesh! Yet there is an avarice for more flesh in this company. I can't stand the stench, of this rotting corpse, defiling my senses, leaving me dirty and disdained.

So I jump away from this filth of immensity, an end of reductionist absurdism, a stoic acceptance of filth and hatred, and a hedonistic desire to please the tentacle hand. I cannot stand this temporal dew, that will melt and fade away into that which is not dew! How can I be forced to live and endure, what is not profitable, and not my hall of the home? Where is my beloved cheese, or even, where is my beloved dog, whose name is Sisyphus? I can't hear my teeth without my beloved Sisyphus!

That this too would end, and the vapor, in the head, would disappear into a dead end. Fly you fools! Fly from nonlasting to everlasting! I will fly now, and escape this tentacle hand, it's fingers in all of the pots, where everything accepts the pots. If I die as I fly away, then I am free away from a false, creaturely, and delusional cycle, of psychotic acceptance, of an unacceptable tolerance, of an unimaginable horror! Oh God! GOD!

Why is the abandonment of the damned, loved ever so lovingly, like a child first taking its first step, towards a copycat copy of a path of its copies of narcissistic monopolistic claims of hegelian catastrophic catastrophe? I don't know! And I ain't, they say you can't say ain't, gonna stay to find out the why and the how to the why! I can't stay, I'm going now. Better to leave a path of freedom with the door open and lights off, then some inviting light to a door where it is locked from the inside. I am trapped, but no more. I will escape and dodge the tentacle hand, and go where home is home and not a prison for fear and love.

Then he lived ever after. The end.

That is as coherent as I can be describing why I can't live this life. I am ontologically incompatible with it. And I knew since I was three that I was.