Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[zardofan]

Right, it's just ticking things off the list. Really glad I switched to this instead of continuing to try to get meto and benzos. I got the SN easily but was stymied with the others. Plus for me this feels more peaceful.

 

[erski]

I am looking into leveraging on SCUBA setup with OceanReef full face diving mask - but based on the below comment I have some questions:

Yes, it can be multiple reasons. Different pressures or it wasn't full at the start. It's really annoying that this information is missing.

Yes, I guess so too. Maybe I will exchange it for a full one when my moment is there.
I think I learned a few things which I will do when I decide to ctb:

• Don't rush, take as much time as needed
• Do a pressure test and use a leak detector spray
• Put the mask on with the SAV (opening to the outside) open and wait until I'm relaxed and can breath normal (if not abort)
• Close the SAV and first exhale deeply as suggested in the dignitas study. I guess this will remove all the oxygen and carbondioxide which is still in the lungs.
• And breath pure nitrogen in, so this should have a faster effect then during my blackout test.

1) Does anyone has more less steps required for proper pressure test of the regulator and mask ?
2) Does anyone know how in this outline process the "pre-dive" configuration should be set ?

 

[martinso67]

I am searching for hours now for the 3M Scott ELSA hood.
Found only one seller that is though not active at the moment and will return back to operation mid 2025.

I think the reason seems to be, a warning and product recall of the 3M Scott due to a seam defect. This problem is in some batches of the product and causes a leakage in the hood. So I am not sure, if I buy the product and will get delivered the product from the affected production batch. It also makes me question the quality in general of the company 3M.

If I am already paying a 3 digits amount, then should I not get a really high quality and good product. Espcially for this endeavourthat cannot allow any failure.





Link to the product recall warning by 3M:

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/2431239O/3m-psd-scba-elsa-notification-july-2024.pdf

 

[Kbeau]

I am searching for hours now for the 3M Scott ELSA hood.
Found only one seller that is though not active at the moment and will return back to operation mid 2025.

I think the reason seems to be, a warning and product recall of the 3M Scott due to a seam defect. This problem is in some batches of the product and causes a leakage in the hood. So I am not sure, if I buy the product and will get delivered the product from the affected production batch. It also makes me question the quality in general of the company 3M.

If I am already paying a 3 digits amount, then should I not get a really high quality and good product. Espcially for this endeavourthat cannot allow any failure.

View attachment 160706

View attachment 160707

Link to the product recall warning by 3M:

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/2431239O/3m-psd-scba-elsa-notification-july-2024.pdf

Other good hoods you'd recommend or is that not an area of expertise?

 

[Athina_99]

View attachment 3848

The Final Exit book I have says construct Exit bag with large turkey bag and sweatband. I am having a hard time understanding how to attach the 6 inch sweatband properly to a 20" wide bag opening? When you roll it it bunches up. If anyone sees this can you let me know?

 

[restlesseyes]

Yes, you need to use elastic: the seal around your neck must be flexible to allow the inert gas to carry away the CO2.

If you don't allow the inert gas to carry away the CO2, the CO2 will trigger your hypercapnic alarm, your body will react beyond your conscious control and you will pull away the bag, and your attempt will fail.

You have been super useful to this community I hope if your still around of course not to sound selfish but if you ever get those thoughts like what am I here for , you can think of the hundreds of people you helped here :) i have another question for you if you wouldn't mind answering in the book the final exit they have alt method for exit bag they say you can just use a head band for the seal instead of making elastic draw string am I confusing this with the old way with out inert gases since the CO2 build up in that case would not matter or will something like a head band be able to release the C02
I was wondering if something like this could work instead of exit bag

 

[devils~advocate]

Exit Hood / Mask Combination

Here is a diagram of a hood / mask system combination.

Hood - either homemade or manufactured
Mask - this can be a non-rebreather type with the reservoir bag
Hose - vinyl type usually comes with the mask
Regulator - will need one that has cga-580 connection, since USA inert gas cylinders use this. Also will need one that has a barb end connection.

The only issue I can think of is the construction of the hood...which is highly variable. There are videos that go thru the steps to make one.

Then there is the hose from the mask...it is variable as well. One needs to coordinate with the barb connection of the regulator so the hose fits over it.
There are transition connectors that allow different size tubing to connect to one another. There are barb adapters.....push-in adapters...etc
Then use a hose clamp to tightly connect them together. Home centers & Amaz have all these items...hoses, connections, adapters, clamps, etc.

 

[restlesseyes]

Exit Hood / Mask Combination

Here is a diagram of a hood / mask system combination.

Hood - either homemade or manufactured
Mask - this can be a non-rebreather type with the reservoir bag
Hose - vinyl type usually comes with the mask
Regulator - will need one that has cga-580 connection, since USA inert gas cylinders use this. Also will need one that has a barb end connection.

The only issue I can think of is the construction of the hood...which is highly variable. There are videos that go thru the steps to make one.

Then there is the hose from the mask...it is variable as well. One needs to coordinate with the barb connection of the regulator so the hose fits over it.
There are transition connectors that allow different size tubing to connect to one another. There are barb adapters.....push-in adapters...etc
Then use a hose clamp to tightly connect them together. Home centers & Amaz have all these items...hoses, connections, adapters, clamps, etc.

Thank you for the information after a little more research I decided to go with EEBD since I was able to find one from the source A with a non expensive price seems like the only hard part is just making sure all the hoses fit properly so there are no leaks

 

[howtodisappearr]

Help!! I'm having an issue with my regulator and I can't go through with my method. I just made a post on the private suicide discussion if anyone at all can help or give any advice I would greatly appreciate it I really don't know what to do at all

 

[iamgood]

Help!! I'm having an issue with my regulator and I can't go through with my method. I just made a post on the private suicide discussion if anyone at all can help or give any advice I would greatly appreciate it I really don't know what to do at all

Hey, i don't have the answer, but please don't hurry.

 

[goldenbuddha]

I was wondering if something like this could work instead of exit bag

I plan to use a diving mask. I think its much better than a hood.
Its a cheap plastic diving mask with a valve. I have attached a plastic bag to the snorkel that will be filled with nitrogen.

 

[restlesseyes]

I plan to use a diving mask. I think its much better than a hood.
It's a cheap plastic diving mask with a valve. I have attached a plastic bag to the snorkel that will be filled with nitrogen.View attachment 161118

Interesting never heard of that

 

[goldenbuddha]

Interesting never heard of that

It was my idea and i have never told anyone about it.
I haven't tried so far but when i do i plan to succeed on the first try.
The good thing is you dont need a big overflow in comparison to your breathing capacity.
You just have to make sure that the mask sits tight.

 

[devils~advocate]

It was my idea and i have never told anyone about it.
I haven't tried so far but when i do i plan to succeed on the first try.
The good thing is you dont need a big overflow in comparison to your breathing capacity.
You just have to make sure that the mask sits tight.

Could theoretically work. You would need a large volume of gas.
15 l/m....at about 10 minutes or less.
I would propose attaching a compressed cylinder to the mask with a hose.
Assuming the mask has exhalation one-way valves.

 

[MsifuentesX22]

I'm considering this method

 

[goldenbuddha]

Could theoretically work. You would need a large volume of gas.
15 l/m....at about 10 minutes or less.
I would propose attaching a compressed cylinder to the mask with a hose.
Assuming the mask has exhalation one-way valves.

Thanks for your input. Yes the compressed cylinder is part the setup and the mask has exhalation one-way valves.

 

[devils~advocate]

Thanks for your input. Yes the compressed cylinder is part the setup and the mask has exhalation one-way valves.

This is one system that I came up with.
Constant flow to a full mask or half mask.

 

[devils~advocate]

Heres another system: Hood w/ mask tied to a delay timing release

 

[zardofan]

@devils~advocate and anyone else who knows stuff I've gotten myself terribly confused. Seeking guidance. I have my tank and regulator all set up and the hose barb fitting to connect to the vinyl tubing. That's a go.

I recently decided to use the allegro hood (9910-d). It came yesterday. I don't know how to connect it to my vinyl tubing. The specs say allegro uses rectus obac quick connect couplers (I believe typically this is connected to a breathing air hose which is attached to a compressor.)

My hose is 1/4 in, using the argon nut and nipple at the regulator. The hose is too small to fit on the end of the hood's low flow connector.

Ideas? Much appreciated!!! 2 photos, the first is regulator to hose using the argon nut and nipple. The second is the hose, the hood's hose and low flow quick connect coupler, and on the right is my spare argon nut/nipple and a hose clamp I didn't need so far.

 

[devils~advocate]

@devils~advocate and anyone else who knows stuff I've gotten myself terribly confused. Seeking guidance. I have my tank and regulator all set up and the hose barb fitting to connect to the vinyl tubing. That's a go.

I recently decided to use the allegro hood (9910-d). It came yesterday. I don't know how to connect it to my vinyl tubing. The specs say allegro uses rectus obac quick connect couplers (I believe typically this is connected to a breathing air hose which is attached to a compressor.)

My hose is 1/4 in, using the argon nut and nipple at the regulator. The hose is too small to fit on the end of the hood's low flow connector.

Ideas? Much appreciated!!! 2 photos, the first is regulator to hose using the argon nut and nipple. The second is the hose, the hood's hose and low flow quick connect coupler, and on the right is my spare argon nut/nipple and a hose clamp I didn't need so far.

No problems. The Allegro Hood barb connection appears to be a whats called a "High Flow" quick connect plug.

A Quick Guide to Air Line Couplers and Plugs

toolguyd.com

I can't determine the size without handling it personally. But find out what size it is.
What you need is a 'Coupler" that is made to accept this 'High Flow Plug'.
These high flow plugs/couplers are called 'V Style'. The webpage link describes in detail what these mean. Very interesting how they came up with these.
So when you search for them on amz, search for 'V Style'.

I think you need use something other than a vinyl hose from the regulator.
They make hoses that can connect to that regulator that in turn have a threaded end that allows a coupler to be attached to it.

The black hose in the image below is what I am talking about.
This particular hose has male connections on both ends.
One end goes connects to the regulator and the other end connects to a coupler.
The coupler shown below has a female connection end in order to connect to the hose.
I'd use sealant tape on all these connections. In the end, this would be an air tight configuration.

Then of course, the plug from the Hood hose would plug into the coupler.

When you get this system all together, please post a photo of it.
Its useful to see how all the parts look in a completed setup.

 

[devils~advocate]

Actually after thinking about it....you could use just the vinyl hose & the barb that comes with the regulator.

Instead you can get:
Barb fitting w/ male threads
Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female

This barb fitting would fit into the coupler. I'd say to use some hose clamps, sealant tape...should be air tight.

 

[zardofan]

Actually after thinking about it....you could use just the vinyl hose & the barb that comes with the regulator.

Instead you can get:
Barb fitting w/ male threads
Quick Connect Coupler 'V' style - Female

This barb fitting would fit into the coupler. I'd say to use some hose clamps, sealant tape...should be air tight.

Can't express how grateful I am! Of course I ordered an air hose (flexilla) along with the female v style (Milton, brass) right after I read your first post, before this one . But all things are returnable and hopefully this will get me in the right place. Ironically that link to the description of air hose fittings is the one I read that blew my mind causing me to post for help!! Hahaha you may have guessed I'm no engineer.

Again, many thanks. I will post once assembled.

 

[devils~advocate]

Can't express how grateful I am! Of course I ordered an air hose (flexilla) along with the female v style (Milton, brass) right after I read your first post, before this one . But all things are returnable and hopefully this will get me in the right place. Ironically that link to the description of air hose fittings is the one I read that blew my mind causing me to post for help!! Hahaha you may have guessed I'm no engineer.

Again, many thanks. I will post once assembled.

No problems, glad to help.
Yes you got the correct one..."V" style is the Milton. Its the high flow type of quick connections.
Its just getting the right size etc....which there aren't many to choose from anyhow.
I think other than that you should be good to go.

Yes please when you get there, a post of it assembled would be great.
I will add it to my visual guide of setups....that I will post here before I ctb myself.
cheers

 

[ocean2200reef]

Hello, I am going to ctb this Monday using the oceanreef scuba mask with nitrogen, my nitrogen is %100 pure, I was just wondering if anyone know how to test the connections for leaks when using ocean reef mask, I wanna do the soapy water and hiss test but idk if your supposed open the valve all the way or just a little and for how long? Also am in the usa and the adapter for it has to be to pieces that your screw together and my pieces won't screw all the way, there is still a few visible threads and I made sure I purchased the correct ones.

 

[devils~advocate]

For the threads on metal fittings... you can use PTFE thread seal tape. Its sold in all hardware stores.
There is also pneumatic thread sealant. Its in a liquid form that goes on the threads and seals them up air tight once the fittings are connected.

PTFE thread seal tape is a white stretchable tape that doesnt btw have an adhesive

Pneumatic thread sealant is a red bottle. Search on web, you'll see the brand.

 

[Argonus]

Hello,

This is my preferred method as well, however instead of exit bag I have EEBD hood with the hose. I have been wondering how big difference having single stage regulator vs dual stage regulator with 200 bar 10 liter argon gas cylinder is? Is it better to wait until dual stage regulator that I have ordered arrives to be sure the process is guaranteed to be successful?

Since the single stage regulator would fluctuate, while dual stage one as far as I have understood is guaranteed to keep steady flow?

 

[devils~advocate]

Hello,

This is my preferred method as well, however instead of exit bag I have EEBD hood with the hose. I have been wondering how big difference having single stage regulator vs dual stage regulator with 200 bar 10 liter argon gas cylinder is? Is it better to wait until dual stage regulator that I have ordered arrives to be sure the process is guaranteed to be successful?

Since the single stage regulator would fluctuate, while dual stage one as far as I have understood is guaranteed to keep steady flow?

Ive read that the dual stage ones can give finer control over the output, esp at low pressure settings. Which is hte kind of pressure a hood/bag system uses...low ones.
I'd probably say use a different gas, but argon is an inert gas & causes asphyxiation just like helium or nitrogen.
10 liters (water capacity of cylinder) ....probably about the same as 2.2 m3 or about 77 cubic feet of compressed gas argon.
This is more than enough.

 

[iamgood]

Ive read that the dual stage ones can give finer control over the output, esp at low pressure settings. Which is hte kind of pressure a hood/bag system uses...low ones.
I'd probably say use a different gas, but argon is an inert gas & causes asphyxiation just like helium or nitrogen.
10 liters (water capacity of cylinder) ....probably about the same as 2.2 m3 or about 77 cubic feet of compressed gas argon.
This is more than enough.

@devils~advocate you have a lot of knowledge regarding the inert gas method. I am planning to combine full suspension hanging with inert gas method. i plan to pass the rope through a hole at the bottom of the exit bag and tightly seal the hole. I have more than enough money needed to buy all the equipment. Could you please tell me if it's better to use exit bag or expensive scuba / other masks ? PPH says there should be some space left in the bottom so that Co2 escapes, but if we use scuba or other tight-fitting masks, we will be breathing in the exhaled co2 and 02. I think it only prolongs the suffering and cause co2 buildup in the blood, or ? I am new to inert gas method. Thanks :)

 

[devils~advocate]

@devils~advocate you have a lot of knowledge regarding the inert gas method. I am planning to combine full suspension hanging with inert gas method. i plan to pass the rope through a hole at the bottom of the exit bag and tightly seal the hole. I have more than enough money needed to buy all the equipment. Could you please tell me if it's better to use exit bag or expensive scuba / other masks ? PPH says there should be some space left in the bottom so that Co2 escapes, but if we use scuba or other tight-fitting masks, we will be breathing in the exhaled co2 and 02. I think it only prolongs the suffering and cause co2 buildup in the blood, or ? I am new to inert gas method. Thanks :)

Well I appreciate the accolades. But Im learning a lot from others as well. Gas Monkey mentioned a lot in his posts....its worth reading what he has to say about this topic.

If its better to use an exit bag or a scba system? In my opinion....Im going with the scba system.
The scba system is made for fire fighters in environments that aren't breathable or might even be toxic. There are exhalation one-way valves built into the masks that allow CO2 and O2 to be expelled with normal breathing.
This is not to say that than exit bag or hood system aren't effective. They certainly are. Its just that I didnt trust my ability to make a exit bag that was viable.

Think of the scba system this way.....they are made for fire fighters in extreme environments...toxic gases, smoke, etc
We're taking advantage of the way these systems work but using it in a reverse way.....
Same with the exit bag & hoods. They all work with the same goal in mind.

 

[iamgood]

Well I appreciate the accolades. But Im learning a lot from others as well. Gas Monkey mentioned a lot in his posts....its worth reading what he has to say about this topic.

If its better to use an exit bag or a scba system? In my opinion....Im going with the scba system.
The scba system is made for fire fighters in environments that aren't breathable or might even be toxic. There are exhalation one-way valves built into the masks that allow CO2 and O2 to be expelled with normal breathing.
This is not to say that than exit bag or hood system aren't effective. They certainly are. Its just that I didnt trust my ability to make a exit bag that was viable.

Think of the scba system this way.....they are made for fire fighters in extreme environments...toxic gases, smoke, etc
We're taking advantage of the way these systems work but using it in a reverse way.....
Same with the exit bag & hoods. They all work with the same goal in mind.

Thank you for the reply. I will send you a DM.