Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[color_me_gone]

Is the 40 mins unsurvivable even if somehow the oxygen level in the bag is somehow above 10%? Or Would it just take longer to die? What's you ur opinion on non-rebreather mask as an alternative?

Any O2 that you breathe in will add to the blood O2 that you are trying to deplete, so it WILL take longer to ctb.
Since after 10 minutes, your brain is severely damaged, you don't want anything to prolong the process.
I don't know anything about the non-rebreather mask.

 

[jolongone]

Ok, thank you. I have read the P

That's on the PPeH, it's not rocket science, you just need to tighten the connection with a wrench. xd


That's on the PPeH too, to check the position of the bag.

That's on the PPeH, it's not rocket science, you just need to tighten the connection with a wrench. xd


That's on the PPeH too, to check the position of the bag.

That's on the PPeH, it's not rocket science, you just need to tighten the connection with a wrench. xd


That's on the PPeH too, to check the position of the bag.

Thanks, l did read the PPeH twice and now only just saw about the mirror. Just getting too old

 

[MelodyCymbal]

@TiredHorse hasn't posted in 4 years, he's not gonna reply you, he's no longer around.


What post? I guess it's about NRB masks.


It is.

I know 4 cases of people who have CTB'd with SCBA/SCUBA (and I suspect from another 3 cases from users that vanished after finishing their setups). There are many more obviously, that's just what I know directly. Both the EM EEBD Hood and SCBA have gone out of stock several times, so go imagine.​

The EEBD hood is really good, I have tried it, it's like an hybrid between the ExitBag and a NRB mask with the best of both.

Any O2 that you breathe in will add to the blood O2 that you are trying to deplete, so it WILL take longer to ctb.
Since after 10 minutes, your brain is severely damaged, you don't want anything to prolong the process.
I don't know anything about the non-rebreather mask.

It'll take longer, but you'll die if your gas keeps running, right? What could prolong the process? Any successful attempts where a person combined EB/ IGA with an o.d.?

@TiredHorse hasn't posted in 4 years, he's not gonna reply you, he's no longer around.


What post? I guess it's about NRB masks.


It is.

I know 4 cases of people who have CTB'd with SCBA/SCUBA (and I suspect from another 3 cases from users that vanished after finishing their setups). There are many more obviously, that's just what I know directly. Both the EM EEBD Hood and SCBA have gone out of stock several times, so go imagine.​

The EEBD hood is really good, I have tried it, it's like an hybrid between the ExitBag and a NRB mask with the best of both.

Who were the successful ctb cases and the people who disappeared?

 

[GasMonkey]

Who were the successful ctb cases and the people who disappeared?

Successful: SlovakGuy, @LetzteAusfahrt's friend, @Wunderkind, EM former customer, @Bengal
Disappeared: @DOGMA67, @ertn, @Γyuk, @BrainBloodClots, @𝕊m̆̈i͜͡𝖑£😊

 

[steve_s5]

An adverse reaction to the gas could be due to some kind of contamination, maybe they gave you a N₂/CO₂ mixed cylinder.
@steve_s5 bought Nitrogen and when he went to the headquarters to pick it up they gave him an Oxygen cylinder LOL.

Yeah it was by mistake she understood me wrong.

 

[Γyuk]

Successful: SlovakGuy, @LetzteAusfahrt's friend, @Wunderkind, EM former customer, @Bengal
Disappeared: @DOGMA67, @ertn, @Γyuk, @BrainBloodClots, @𝕊m̆̈i͜͡𝖑£😊

I'm still here but n2 is still my way to go, have everything ready for some time now.

The amount of deadly incidents with n2 in the chemical industries for example shows just how effective this method is.

Once the time has come for me I know it will be quick and painless.

 

[lukas19]

I took some pictures of the equipment, but I don't know why I can't upload it here.

So if this is the case, nitrogen cannot be used with SCUBA because there is no large enough regulator?

this one

And this one.
I have both regulators.

And this SCUBA

DIY Exit Bag Instructions

Euthanasia, DIY Exit Bag Do practice this first, because you may be quite incapacitated when you try to do it, and the bag in particular should be prepared in advance. This is a self-use bag is des…

dasanarchist.wordpress.com

 

[imcadt99]

Will the body experience death throes or thrash about after losing consciousness using this method?

I'm considering tying down my limbs so that I don't bang the walls or fall off my bed, but I'm unsure if this is necessary.

 

[GasMonkey]

Only minor movements (if any at all) were observed in the studies with Helium, there are no studies documenting the process with Nitrogen tho.

SlovakGuy (Nitrogen SCUBA) wasn't strapped at all, had his cylinder right there next to him (not attached anywhere, just leaning against the bedstead) and an extremely short hose. He didn't rip anything. Wunderkind (Nitrogen SCBA) didn't use any straps either.

I will strap myself to this deck chair reclined, using this straps for ankles/wrists and this straps for the body. The chair will be blocked in every direction except the front by the wall and a heavy table.​

 

[bythefire12]

I have spent the past several hours reading this thread trying to get my head around it all. Let me see if I have this idea more or less correct for EEBD and SCBA options.

EEBD requires (mostly going off EM kit):
1. the hood with a hose coming out of it
2. a *flow* (not pressure?) regulator with male DISS part that allows the hose from the hood to connect to the regulator. not sure if hose coming from hood has a connector on the end or the hose attaches directly?
3. tubing/hose that attaches to OTHER part of flow regulator (again not sure if it has connectors)
4. an adapter for N2 cylinder that the tubing/hose coming out of the flow regulator goes into

For attaching the hose, is it easy for someone who is a complete idiot with this kind of stuff? I could easily see myself messing that up. Also, no additional regulator is needed that attaches to the cylinder?

SCBA requires:
1. scba mask
2. demand valve that "slots in" to the mask and has a hose with thing on the end coming out of it
3. a *pressure* reducer/regulator (not necessarily flow?) that the demand valve hose attaches to
4. some kind of hose with connectors that attach to the other end of the reducer/regulator (not sure what kind of connector or how to make sure hose will connect) and then to the N2 tank (presumably with some kind of adapter).

I'm in the US by the way.

As is clear, I get confused with the hoses and connectors. Do you need to generally buy a bunch of connectors or adapters with the hoses/tubes, connect the tubes/hoses to the connectors, then use that to hook everything up? Do the EM kits generally come with hoses with connectors pre attached?

Interested in both methods but would love to be spending less than like, 800-1000 bucks when all is said and done. This option seems better than SN but I have everything I need for SN besides actual SN.

Thank you for any help. I know a lot of this comes from my complete inexperience with handy/crafty kind of work, so I am definitely asking questions that probably seem obvious to many.

 

[GasMonkey]

After doing a bunch of tests I now think that the EM EEBD hood is better than the EM SCBA, due to its exhalation valve having zero exhalation resistance and being 50% cheaper.

 

[bennydiazapine]

Would a 580g Tank be enough? They seem to be much more available then the larger tanks.

I was looking at grabbing this;

SupremeWhipMax 580g N2O Canister | Tank - Cream Charger Warehouse

SupremeWhipMax 580g Gas Tank. Nitrous Oxide (N2O) Cream Charger Tanks. Select the quantity to show the price.

creamchargerwarehouse.com.au

 

[GasMonkey]

That's not inert gas buddy, N₂O (Nitrous Oxide) is not inert.

 

[coolintheshade]

After doing a bunch of tests I now think that the EM EEBD hood is better than the EM SCBA, due to its exhalation valve having zero exhalation resistance and being 50% cheaper.

Do you have links to online distributors of the EM EEBD???

I'm still here but n2 is still my way to go, have everything ready for some time now.

The amount of deadly incidents with n2 in the chemical industries for example shows just how effective this method is.

Once the time has come for me I know it will be quick and painless.

Care to share your online sources for "everything" that you have ready?

Only minor movements (if any at all) were observed in the studies with Helium, there are no studies documenting the process with Nitrogen tho.

SlovakGuy (Nitrogen SCUBA) wasn't strapped at all, had his cylinder right there next to him (not attached anywhere, just leaning against the bedstead) and an extremely short hose. He didn't rip anything. Wunderkind (Nitrogen SCBA) didn't use any straps either.

I will strap myself to this deck chair reclined, using this straps for ankles/wrists and this straps for the body. The chair will be blocked in every direction except the front by the wall and a heavy table.​

I have to ask why not just lay on the ground instead of the strapping to the chair?

 

[MelodyCymbal]

Do you have links to online distributors of the EM EEBD???

Care to share your online sources for "everything" that you have ready?

I have to ask why not just lay on the ground instead of the strapping to the chair?

Nitrogen does seem to cause severe convulsions. "Asphyxia due to oxygen deficiency by gaseous substances". https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9800365/

 

[GasMonkey]

EEBD requires (mostly going off EM kit):

The hood has an integrated hose that connects directly to the flow port of the regulator, no adapters.

SCBA requires:

If you mean the EM SCBA, the regulator connects to the cylinder, the demand valve to the regulator, and the mask to the demand valve.
For a standard non-EM SCBA, you would need an air-to-nitrogen adapter to connect the regulator to the N₂ cylinder, this adapter is not available in all regions.

For attaching the hose, is it easy for someone who is a complete idiot with this kind of stuff? I could easily see myself messing that up. Also, no additional regulator is needed that attaches to the cylinder?

You only need a wrench.

Do you need to generally buy a bunch of connectors or adapters with the hoses/tubes, connect the tubes/hoses to the connectors, then use that to hook everything up?

Nope.

Do the EM kits generally come with hoses with connectors pre attached?

Yep, they come ready to use, just to connect and run.

Interested in both methods but would love to be spending less than like, 800-1000 bucks when all is said and done.

My current recommendation is the EEBD hood.

I have to ask why not just lay on the ground instead of the strapping to the chair?

I have some sleep apnea so reclined is better for me.

Nitrogen does seem to cause severe convulsions. "Asphyxia due to oxygen deficiency by gaseous substances". https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9800365/

That study was done in rats, not sure how much of that extrapolates to humans.

 

[Dubito]

Anyone who bought an EEBD or scba in europe and has a link for me, plz pm me.

 

[Dubito]

Will you sit or lay down? And where you do sit. My greatest fear is that i collapse the construction does not work anymore.
Anyone heard from the new product ambuca (from the canadian company). What is it for?

I have a question regarding tubing.

There was this guy who was banned who criticized the description of J. Dübers german instruction guide.
He mentioned that the hose Düber recommends to be too thick (it has 6mm interior diameter). (see screenshot attached)
Moreover, he thought it is also too unflexible, and that the gap at the neck that would be created would be too large.

He recommended to use a 4mm plastic/oxygen tubing?

My question is. Is that really necessary, or is the thicker, less flexible tubing (screenshot) also appropriate?

I am asking as some of the critique of the guy that was banned seemed arbitrary.

Thanks so much for replies!!!

Any answers?

 

[GasMonkey]

Anyone heard from the new product ambuca

It's a debreather device. It uses recirculated air to produce a low O₂, low CO₂ enviroment to induce hypoxia.

The manufacturer says that is has been independently tested and validated, but I don't like it much. The medical mask they use is not explicity designed to protect you from the external gas and the system does not maintain a positive pressure inside the mask so it totally relies on the mask being airtight. Pressurized inert gas implementations are better.

That medical mask with the correct size for your face running with SCBA can work and there is a confirmed CTB with it. That's Greenberg's current setup.​

 

[EmptyVessel42]

Will this be enough gas? I don't understand how much gas in each tank; is it based on the litres (10l) or the volume (1.89m3)?

 

[GasMonkey]

is it based on the litres (10l) or the volume (1.89m3)?

10L is the compressed "water volume" (at 200bar), 1.89m³ is the total uncompressed volume (1890 L).

Will this be enough gas?

Yep, that's a lot of gas.

 

[EmptyVessel42]

10L is the compressed "water volume" (at 200bar), 1.89m³ is the total uncompressed volume (1890 L).


Yep, that's a lot of gas.

Thank you, can't tell you how much I appreciate the help. I'm trying to use this method to cbt asap, just wna make sure I do everything right the first time.

 

[EmptyVessel42]

10L is the compressed "water volume" (at 200bar), 1.89m³ is the total uncompressed volume (1890 L).


Yep, that's a lot of gas.

Could you possibly cla

Exit Bag and Inert Gas Basics —A very, very long post, I know, but I feel like I've fielded a lot of questions about this, so I figured I'd spell out everything I know. Others on the forum should please add to this thr technical information they feel is appropriate for someone attempting this method to have.

The idea behind using an exit bag with inert gas is to create an atmosphere around your head that is both free of life-sustaining O2 and can carry away the exhaled CO2 that would activate your hypercapnic alarm.

The Gas:

You will need to keep the inert gas flowing at 15 liters per minute (Lpm) for 40 minutes to be confident of ending your life —in other words, you'll need a minimum of 600 liters of inert gas. In the past this would have been helium (He), but due to the uncertain availability of genuinely pure He, the best current options are nitrogen (N2) and argon (Ar). Both are reliably available in pure form (no air contamination) from stores that supply welders. N2 is also available from some brewery supply houses, but the purity of the gas should be confirmed to your satisfaction. Both N2 and Ar should work to ctb and are similar enough in their properties to be treated identically for use with an exit bag.

Pressurized gas cylinder sizes are not standardized across the industry, nor internationally, and it can be difficult, if not impossible, to tell how much gas they contain from a photograph on a website.

In the US, a 20 cubic foot (cf) cylinder is the smallest you should use for ctb; a 40cf will allow some margin for flinching, practicing, etc. "A 20cf" and "a 40cf", or "a 20" and "a 40" is nomenclature US welding supply houses will recognize, so asking for either should get you the desired product. A 20cf cylinder is quite small for industrial use; I've had clerks tell me, "well, we have a 40, but we'll need to special order a 20." It's up to you what you do in that situation. Personally, I have a 40cf cylinder. It has allowed me to flinch and abort my attempt three times now, and I don't need to worry about refilling it. I bought my N2 at AirGas, a national company here in the US. They do not demand any sort of professional certification for purchasing inert gas, and no more than the usual forms of ID depending on payment method.

I know nothing of gas cylinders outside the US, so if you are using other than US-typical cylinders, you'll need to call and ask to make sure whatever tank you're contemplating holds 600L of compressed gas. Hopefully knowledgeable forum members will add cylinder sizing information to this knowledge base.

Cover story: N2 and Ar are both used for welding. N2 is used in beer brewing. In my day job, I use both N2 and Ar to flood partial cans of expensive paint, to displace the O2 in the cans and prevent the paint from skinning over and going bad. It's a cost saving measure. The clerks I've bought gas from have never heard of that trick, which has meant they don't know enough to interrogate me on my motives or to try and quiz me on my welding knowledge. They have merely said, "huh! That's a new one!"

The store clerk may ask how you're carrying the pressurized cylinder "back to your shop," since pressurized cylinders can be very hazardous to transport (the valve is vulnerable to damage in an accident). I haven't had any trouble when I have told the clerk, "in the back footwell of my car, and very carefully padded!" What they really want to know is that you are aware that a pressurized cylinder is a missile waiting to explode if anything damages it, and that you know enough to not let that happen.

The Regulator:

A regulator screws on to the cylinder and does two things: 1) it reduces the pressure in the cylinder to a useable level, otherwise the 2000psi tank pressure would just blow the exit bag off your head as soon as you opened the valve, and 2) it controls the rate of gas flow into the exit bag —specifically, it should release it at 15Lpm, which is the minimum adequate to carry away exhaled CO2 and fool your lungs into believing there's enough air.

The good news is that while gas cylinder sizes are not globally standardized, the cylinder valve threads are —and both N2 and Ar cylinders have the same threads (other gasses have different threads), so a regulator that fits on one cylinder will fit equally well on another.

You don't need to worry about being sure to choose a regulator that will reduce the pressure: they all do that. The flowmeter is the critical element of the regulator for our purposes.

Some regulators come with a "click adjust" flowmeter that is very simple, allowing you to dial in 15Lpm without needing to think about it. To the best of my knowledge, these are medical grade regulators; generally very good quality, but often a bit more expensive. Others here may know more about them, and where to acquire them, than I do.

A typical welding regulator will have two gauges: the tank pressure gauge (unimportant to us) and the flowmeter gauge.

A welding regulator's flowmeter gauge will be marked in either cubic feet per hour (Cfh), Lpm, or both. Some welding systems require a fairly low flow of inert gas, much lower than our necessary 15Lpm, and this low flow is most easily measured in Cfh. If you see a gauge marked only in Cfh, it probably will not work for our purpose. Look at the highest Cfh setting on the flowmeter and do the math, to be certain. If the gauge reads in Lpm, a glance should tell you whether the regulator provides the necessary 15Lpm flow.

Harbor Freight Tools offers a cheap CO2/Ar regulator (it also works for N2) with a flowmeter that shows flow in both Cfh and Lpm and goes high enough for our purposes. This is what I have.

The Hose:

The hose needs to be long enough to reach from the gas cylinder beside you, up into the exit bag on your head. I have found it easiest to lead the hose up my back and into the bag at the very back of my neck. It seems to disrupt the fit of the bag less right there.

Some regulators come with a hose that threads directly into the regulator body. Some regulators come with a hose-barb, onto which a length of soft tubing can be pressed. Some regulators come with neither.

For the first situation, just thread the hose into the regulator, tighten it with a wrench, and it's ready.

(Regardless of what type of threaded fitting is used, you do need to wrench-tighten this fitting: a lot of gas can leak out at this connection. If it is a brass fitting, you should not need teflon tape on the threads; the soft metal deforms enough when tightened to provide an adequately gas-tight connection.)

For the second situation, take the hose-barb to a hardware / home improvement store and purchase tubing that fits onto the barb. Once home from the hardware store, thread the barb into the regulator body, tighten with a wrench, and press the tube onto the barb. It should be a snug fit; if you're worried it's too loose, use a small hose clamp / jubilee clip to secure it in place. If it's a little too tight to get the hose into place, soak the end of the tube in very hot water to soften it and press it onto the barb. I used clear vinyl tubing. Aquarium tubing should work. Surgical tubing may not; I don't know for sure.

For the third situation, you'll need a hose-barb fitting (typically brass) that threads into the regulator body. Take the entire regulator to the hardware store and ask someone to help you fit it with a hose barb. Then proceed as for the second situation.

Cover story: as with purchasing the gas cylinder, you're using N2 for brewing, or Ar for filling partial paint cans. Why Ar? because it's heavier than air and settles down onto the paint surface inside the can. For extra confidence that they won't ask inconvenient questions, you're doing it for your father, or your brother, and you don't know why they want it for their paint locker, they just said to get a hose barb and six feet of tubing…

The Exit Bag:

There are several videos on YouTube detailing construction of exit bags. I strongly recommend watching them. That's how I learned.

The short version of what you want is a turkey roasting bag —available in the supermarket, in with the zip-locks and cling wrap— with an elastic drawcord worked into a turned hem, and a cord-lock to adjust the drawcord's tension.

I used 3/8" elastic cord. I purchased both it and the cord lock at a sewing and crafts store (JoAnn's).

To construct the turned hem you'll need micropore (surgical) tape, available at a pharmacy in the first aid section. It's the right tape to use because it will reliably stick to the material of the bag itself. Sometimes it isn't labeled as "micropore." Ask a clerk if you can't find it.

Cover story: you were asked to re-stock the family first aid kit with micropore tape and you don't recognize any of the brands available.

Using an elastic drawcord is important: it needs to fit snugly around your neck, but not seal tightly. It must still be flexible enough for the flow of inert gas, lightly pressurizing the exit bag, to push past the elastic and flush away the CO2 you're exhaling. Don't use a non-elastic drawcord or do something like duct tape the bag to your neck; you don't want to create a seal, just a restriction.

I feel like a dumbass reading the exit bag part; what is a 'turned hem'? Why do I need tape and what am I supposed to do with it? None of this part makes sense to me, and still have no idea how to create an ideal exit bag based on this explanation. I'd appreciate some help.

 

[jolongone]

DIY Exit Bag Instructions

Euthanasia, DIY Exit Bag Do practice this first, because you may be quite incapacitated when you try to do it, and the bag in particular should be prepared in advance. This is a self-use bag is des…

dasanarchist.wordpress.com

Could you please tell me where you got your regulators from. I am in Australia. Thank you

 

[GasMonkey]

what is a 'turned hem'?

The fold that holds the elastic cord inside.

still have no idea how to create an ideal exit bag based on this explanation

This is the manual in the PPeH.

 

[Adios Amigos]

Looking for N2 in Australia and have come across a company that ships it nation-wide.
I am wondering if these specifications are satisfactory to CTB. The cylinder is Type C.
I am planning to buy a regulator from Max dog Brewing to reduce pressure to 150 bar as per requirements in the PP handbook.

 

[GasMonkey]

I am planning to buy a regulator from Max dog Brewing to reduce pressure to 150 bar as per requirements in the PP handbook.

Don't do that, just get a 200bar regulator.

Looking for N2 in Australia and have come across a company that ships it nation-wide.

In Australia you can also get them on eBay.

I am wondering if these specifications are satisfactory to CTB.

Yep.
0.6m³ = 600L
600L / 15LPM = 40 minutes

 

[Adios Amigos]

Don't do that, just get a 200bar regulator.

From EM? Not sure where else to purchase a click type regulator.

 

[GasMonkey]

Yep.

 

[outrider567]

From EM? Not sure where else to purchase a click type regulator.

EM sells click regulators