Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[chester]

I wasn't planing on logging in anymore, but here I am. Tried twice today, decided to abort both times, because I felt something was off. I heard it's supposed to be peaceful and before you know it you're out. It wasn't like this. You know the feeling when you make a fool of yourself in public, and you feel yourself blush, you feel your ears and face getting red? Imagine this feeling in your face and ears, but much, much stronger and more uncomfortable. It felt like there was blood pressure building up. Both times, when I removed the bag, I felt very lightheaded, to put it mildly. I mean I was barely conscious, so I was definitely oxygen deprived. I also coughed up blood after the second attempt, but it passed quite quickly.

If I knew what I felt was to be expected, then I probably wouldn't have panicked and aborted. But it made me worry something isn't going as it was supposed to. Nowhere near as peaceful as I hoped. I definitely didn't last the 50 seconds supposedly required to pass out. But I need to be sure everything is in order before I let myself pass out.

Any thoughts, anyone?

 

[kudaphillips]

I wasn't planing on logging in anymore, but here I am. Tried twice today, decided to abort both times, because I felt something was off. I heard it's supposed to be peaceful and before you know it you're out. It wasn't like this. You know the feeling when you make a fool of yourself in public, and you feel yourself blush, you feel your ears and face getting red? Imagine this feeling in your face and ears, but much, much stronger and more uncomfortable. It felt like there was blood pressure building up. Both times, when I removed the bag, I felt very lightheaded, to put it mildly. I mean I was barely conscious, so I was definitely oxygen deprived. I also coughed up blood after the second attempt, but it passed quite quickly.

If I knew what I felt was to be expected, then I probably wouldn't have panicked and aborted. But it made me worry something isn't going as it was supposed to. Nowhere near as peaceful as I hoped. I definitely didn't last the 50 seconds supposedly required to pass out. But I need to be sure everything is in order before I let myself pass out.

Any thoughts, anyone?

I def haven't heard of anyone coughing up blood that's def a first , and I don't understand that .
However, many people including myself , report it definitely not being peaceful . For me, when I've tried , I had pounding heart and profoundly sweating . I'm not sure if it's a anxiet provoked or what, the brain is powerful , but discomfort is certainly common .

But if you were coughing up blood …I don't know . I think I heard of some people complaining about a cough after an attempt. So I guess ..I dunno, interested in other opinions in this .

All you can do is test your gas purity. Follow procedure and I guess just trust it . If your gas is 99% bag is made correctly with elastic, and adequate gas and your confident in it …it's gonna work . Sucks that you may have only had a few more seconds to go .
I'm a fucking pussy riddled with SI and have gone overkill with everything . Double tank, double regulator , an 80cf and a 40cf. I can't have any concerns of failure . Beef up your confidence in your rig maybe ,

 

[chester]

I def haven't heard of anyone coughing up blood that's def a first , and I don't understand that .

I don't think it came from the lungs. It's like something was sore somewhere between my lungs and my mouth. Hard to tell what and where exactly. Coughed up a few teaspoons of saliva mixed with mucus and blood, but it was mostly blood. After 15 minutes no more blood. Maybe I have a condition I don't know about. But it only happened to me after the attempt, while I was already hypoxic, never before.

 

[emma99]

 

[outrider567]

I wasn't planing on logging in anymore, but here I am. Tried twice today, decided to abort both times, because I felt something was off. I heard it's supposed to be peaceful and before you know it you're out. It wasn't like this. You know the feeling when you make a fool of yourself in public, and you feel yourself blush, you feel your ears and face getting red? Imagine this feeling in your face and ears, but much, much stronger and more uncomfortable. It felt like there was blood pressure building up. Both times, when I removed the bag, I felt very lightheaded, to put it mildly. I mean I was barely conscious, so I was definitely oxygen deprived. I also coughed up blood after the second attempt, but it passed quite quickly.

If I knew what I felt was to be expected, then I probably wouldn't have panicked and aborted. But it made me worry something isn't going as it was supposed to. Nowhere near as peaceful as I hoped. I definitely didn't last the 50 seconds supposedly required to pass out. But I need to be sure everything is in order before I let myself pass out.

Any thoughts, anyone?

I wasn't uncomfortable at all in my tests, but I use an EEBD Hood--Did you track your oxygen level with the oximeter? After I took off my Hood, it dropped all the way to 40

 

[chester]

I wasn't uncomfortable at all in my tests, but I use an EEBD Hood--Did you track your oxygen level with the oximeter? After I took off my Hood, it dropped all the way to 40

Did a final test run a few hours ago. I finally got an oximeter. Maybe I've done something differently, because there was no discomfort this time. Or maybe I didn't carry on long enough, I let my Sp02 drop to only around 60, which happened way quicker than I expected. Funny how it went right back up to 98 after just two normal breaths. I wasn't as lightheaded as previously, so I definitely didn't wait as long. No blood this time, but I have a dry cough, like something was itchy in my throat.

 

[exitingtothevoid]

I let my Sp02 drop to only around 60, which happened way quicker than I expected.

How long did that take? Good to hear you were comfortable this time.

 

[chester]

How long did that take? Good to hear you were comfortable this time.

Probably less than 20 seconds, I didn't time it. Still possible the discomfort would set on later. But i no longer care. It's not like I'll have to endure it for hours. Even if the pain was excruciating, it's only a minute or so, I can take it. As long as I have a decent chance of success, I'm good. I might end up a brain-damaged vegetable, but you know what? Even if that happened, I'd still consider it a successful attempt. My body would survive, but I wouldn't survive as a person. Good enough for me.

 

[DanielDanDean]

I found the Nitrogen bottle on the internet but I can't find any pressure regulator with the same valve connection (B24,32 x 1/14 inches ) I only find 21,8 x 1/14".

And finding pressure regulators with L/min showing is hard, I only find regulators displaying bars and psi

If I buy a regulator for argon with the good dimensions, which flow should I use on that regulator?
A retailer told me about a regulator (I didn't saw it) with a flow of 15L/min if you put it in maximum position, would it be good?

 

[chester]

A little update from me: don't underestimate the power of CO2. This was supposed to be the last time. Just like in my previous post, I thought to myself "screw the hyperventilating and bag inflating, I'm gonna be out in a matter of seconds anyway". Well, it was hell. I barely managed to go down to 80% SpO2. I think that's where my previous discomfort came from, that I didn't follow the instructions properly enough. Let it be a warning to others.

I found the Nitrogen bottle on the internet but I can't find any pressure regulator with the same valve connection (B24,32 x 1/14 inches )
And finding pressure regulators with L/min showing is hard, I only find regulators displaying bars and psi

Does anyone know if it's possible to convert bars in L/Minute?

I searched this forum (and other sources) for the same answer, no luck. It seems it only makes sense to use a flow regulator, not a pressure regulator. I bought one for Argon, because it was cheap and easily available. But then there's an issue if I'm converting the flow rate properly or not. I hope I am.

So yeah, unless you can find a Nitrogen flow regulator, you're risking it one way or another. Nobody will give you a definite answer, or at least it's unlikely you'll get this answer here. Unless some engineer specializing in fluid mechanics joins soon

 

[DanielDanDean]

A little update from me: don't underestimate the power of CO2. This was supposed to be the last time. Just like in my previous post, I thought to myself "screw the hyperventilating and bag inflating, I'm gonna be out in a matter of seconds anyway". Well, it was hell. I barely managed to go down to 80% SpO2. I think that's where my previous discomfort came from, that I didn't follow the instructions properly enough. Let it be a warning to others.


I searched this forum (and other sources) for the same answer, no luck. It seems it only makes sense to use a flow regulator, not a pressure regulator. I bought one for Argon, because it was cheap and easily available. But then there's an issue if I'm converting the flow rate properly or not. I hope I am.

So yeah, unless you can find a Nitrogen flow regulator, you're risking it one way or another. Nobody will give you a definite answer, or at least it's unlikely you'll get this answer here. Unless some engineer specializing in fluid mechanics joins soon

Thanks a lot
I read in previous pages that 15L/ min for Nitrogen is 23L/minutes with an argon regulator, is it true?

For example, is this article suitable for use with a nitrogen bottle?

Réducteur Argon / Gaz Mixte 24,32mm

Réducteur Argon / Gaz Mixte 24,32mm Le réducteur de pression à un étage est un régulateur avec contrôle variable de la pression de sortie. Ce réducteur de pression permet de réduire la pression des gaz extraits de la bouteille à la pression (de travail) requise et garantit que cette pression est...

www.weldingshop.nl

 

[chester]

I read in previous pages that 15L/ min for Nitrogen is 23L/minutes with an argon regulator, is it true?

For example, is this article suitable for use with a nitrogen bottle?

The answer to both is "I'm not sure, I'm far from an expert". All I can say is I hope the conversion rate is correct, otherwise I'm getting myself in trouble. And my flow regulator has a transparent cylinder with a floating ball in it. Does it mean the one you sent won't work? No idea.

 

[youareforgiven]

Hi!

Got my hood and flow regulator. I just received my Nitrogen, but it worries me a little bit. I ordered 200 bar 10L, but when I look on the cylinder itself it says 150 bar. When I connect to my flow regulator it says 2500 psi, while 2000 psi is FULL(it says on the regulator).

I am going to test purity, but for now is it a problem that this exceeds the 2000 psi? I know the regulator can max handle 200 bar.

 

[chester]

I am going to test purity, but for now is it a problem that this exceeds the 2000 psi? I know the regulator can max handle 200 bar.

2500psi is 172bar.

 

[youareforgiven]

2500psi is 172bar.

Thanks for the respons! Okay so even when my flow regulator says full at 2000 psi, that's no problem that it's 2500 psi?

Btw it is a little bit over 2500. But is it not weird that on the cilinder it says 150 bar?

 

[DanielDanDean]

This Nitrogen bottle is linked in the PPH

https://shop.gase-dopp.de/Stickstoff-28-2-Liter-200-bar-Flasche-neu-gefuellt-TUeV-min-bis-2031-Stand-2021

Is it good for the exit bag method? Some posts here say that there isn't enough gas..

 

[chester]

Thanks for the respons! Okay so even when my flow regulator says full at 2000 psi, that's no problem that it's 2500 psi?
Btw it is a little bit over 2500. But is it not weird that on the cilinder it says 150 bar?

Question 1 - I don't know.
Question 2 - I agree, it's weird.

This Nitrogen bottle is linked in the PPH

https://shop.gase-dopp.de/Stickstoff-28-2-Liter-200-bar-Flasche-neu-gefuellt-TUeV-min-bis-2031-Stand-2021

Is it good for the exit bag method? Some posts here say that there isn't enough gas..

This cylinder contains 400l of nitrogen. 400l at 15lpm gives about 26min. According to PPH (if you trust them) death should occur within 5-10min, 2 minutes for the bag inflation, leaves you 14 minute margin. I'm just stating the facts, I'll leave the conclusions to you.

 

[emma99]

I wasn't uncomfortable at all in my tests, but I use an EEBD Hood--Did you track your oxygen level with the oximeter? After I took off my Hood, it dropped all the way to 40

in your tests?
how can you run a test with a method that's supposed to be more or less instant unconsciousness
and fatal?

Did a final test run a few hours ago. I finally got an oximeter. Maybe I've done something differently, because there was no discomfort this time. Or maybe I didn't carry on long enough, I let my Sp02 drop to only around 60, which happened way quicker than I expected. Funny how it went right back up to 98 after just two normal breaths. I wasn't as lightheaded as previously, so I definitely didn't wait as long. No blood this time, but I have a dry cough, like something was itchy in my throat.

wait, how exactly did you run a test? the bag method is supposed to knock you out very quickly.

 

[chester]

wait, how exactly did you run a test? the bag method is supposed to knock you out very quickly.

I was quicker. According to Dignitas it can take up to 50 seconds to pass out in Nitrogen environment. I also didn't take deep breaths. Just wanted to see how quickly my saturation drops. And it did drop by at least 5% per second once I started breathing, it was kind of shocking how quick this was. I doubt I would last the 50 seconds, if I started breathing deeply from the start I think I might be out in 15.

So about being knocked out very quickly, you're right. But it's either not as quick as advertised, or maybe it's my fault, or both. With the amount of nitrogen I don't plan any more testing.

 

[emma99]

I was quicker. According to Dignitas it can take up to 50 seconds to pass out in Nitrogen environment. I also didn't take deep breaths. Just wanted to see how quickly my saturation drops. And it did drop by at least 5% per second once I started breathing, it was kind of shocking how quick this was. I doubt I would last the 50 seconds, if I started breathing deeply from the start I think I might be out in 15.

So about being knocked out very quickly, you're right. But it's either not as quick as advertised, or maybe it's my fault, or both. With the amount of nitrogen I don't plan any more testing.

thank you for sharing that. and did you find out what exactly caused the burning sensation

 

[chester]

thank you for sharing that. and did you find out what exactly caused the burning sensation

nope, still no idea. Hopefully I'll pass out before it becomes an issue.

 

[outrider567]

in your tests?
how can you run a test with a method that's supposed to be more or less instant unconsciousness
and fatal?

wait, how exactly did you run a test? the bag method is supposed to knock you out very quickly.

Its not instant, the Nitrogen takes some time to overwhelm the Oxygen in your body, less than a minute--As you watch your O2 level go down dramatically, I would take the Bag/Hood off when the oximeter says 70 or so, the delayed reaction in your fingertips belies the real number, which is actually 30 points lower, and at 25, you pass out, and you're finished

Did a final test run a few hours ago. I finally got an oximeter. Maybe I've done something differently, because there was no discomfort this time. Or maybe I didn't carry on long enough, I let my Sp02 drop to only around 60, which happened way quicker than I expected. Funny how it went right back up to 98 after just two normal breaths. I wasn't as lightheaded as previously, so I definitely didn't wait as long. No blood this time, but I have a dry cough, like something was itchy in my throat.

Yes, no need for another test, glad you had no discomfort--You let your Oxygen get down to 60, and then took the bag off? That's dangerous since Oximeters on fingers have a delayed O2 level reading

 

[SomewhereAlongThe]

Hi guys,

I am trying to find the accessories for my exit bag itself and I was wondering if you guys think this toggle will fit this elastic

Amazon.ca

Amazon.ca

I would use a smaller elastic but OP recommended using 3/8

 

[painofzed]

Does anyone know how to acquire N2 for this method?

 

[kudaphillips]

nope, still no idea. Hopefully I'll pass out before it becomes an issue.

Good luck . Care to share your bag and rig before you exit ?

 

[chester]

Good luck . Care to share your bag and rig before you exit ?

I've got an 8l cylinder, originally 200bar, now down to around 150bar, still should be plenty. An Argon flow regulator connected to a pvc tube and secured with a screw-tightened clamp on the tube. The other end of the tube is duct-taped to the inside of the bag. The bag itself is made from a large oven bag, with an elastic cord held by a cord lock. Nothing fancy, hopefully good enough.

 

[Tommen Baratheon]

Hi guys,

I am trying to find the accessories for my exit bag itself and I was wondering if you guys think this toggle will fit this elastic

Amazon.ca

Amazon.ca

I would use a smaller elastic but OP recommended using 3/8

I don't think it matters. If you look at the 'Doing it with Betty' (or 'Doing it with Chi') video you'll see the elastic cord that she's using is smaller.

 

[youareforgiven]

Hi!

Question 1 - I don't know.
Question 2 - I agree, it's weird.


This cylinder contains 400l of nitrogen. 400l at 15lpm gives about 26min. According to PPH (if you trust them) death should occur within 5-10min, 2 minutes for the bag inflation, leaves you 14 minute margin. I'm just stating the facts, I'll leave the conclusions to you.

hmm I did some research myself and it does not seem to be a problem. 200 bar = 3000 psi and my regulator can max handle 200 bar.

Got my EEBD hood and regulator and nitrogen. Tested the regulator for leaks and no leaks. I am going to test the purity of the N one of these days so hope that it is good.

The supplier said that 15 LPM should do the work if hood is prefilled. Should take half a minute to prefill it at 15LPM.
See a lot of comments that people do 25LPM with the EEBD hood. Any evidence that 25LPM is better? One worry I have with putting it on a higher LPM (like 25) is that hood comes off after couple of minutes.

Does also anybody know how you can test if your regulator is indeed a nitrogen and not a argon one? Got mine from the company who's owner is now is prison, so too speak.

 

[kudaphillips]

Hi!



hmm I did some research myself and it does not seem to be a problem. 200 bar = 3000 psi and my regulator can max handle 200 bar.

Got my EEBD hood and regulator and nitrogen. Tested the regulator for leaks and no leaks. I am going to test the purity of the N one of these days so hope that it is good.

The supplier said that 15 LPM should do the work if hood is prefilled. Should take half a minute to prefill it at 15LPM.
See a lot of comments that people do 25LPM with the EEBD hood. Any evidence that 25LPM is better? One worry I have with putting it on a higher LPM (like 25) is that hood comes off after couple of minutes.

Does also anybody know how you can test if your regulator is indeed a nitrogen and not a argon one? Got mine from the company who's owner is now is prison, so too speak.

When an exit bag or hood fills up, the gas will fill until the positive pressure inside is great enough to purge the gas through the bottom. In my opinion ( definitely open to being corrected ), the force of pressure isn't necessarily any drastically different at the higher lpm . So it's not like 25-30-40 lpm will have more force to blow of the hood or anything , you'll just fill up quicker and reach that necessary bottom purging force alot quicker just get faster purging of gas .
Hope that makes sense .

On my tests at 15 lpm and 30 lpm , the bag fills up like a ballon pretty much the same, just at higher lpm it purges way more air out the bottom, quicker, and fills up quicker .

The advantages for this in my opinion , is that higher lpm purges cO2 quicker , making air hunger possibilities and hippocampus alarm less likely . The disadvantages are obvious, if you are limited supply on gas . This is why they generally say 15 lpm is sufficient , especially when alot of people exiting are older and weaker and can't lift 60-100 cf tanks .

So final exit recommends 15 lpm with a 20 cf tank which is pretty small ( about 20-27 minutes of flow at that lpm )

For people like me that are having trouble getting this over with and have SI issues , I sm a candidate for higher flow and fancier rigs .

15 lpm is totally fine , I currently am in the school of thought that higher can only be better , with no disadvantage other then more gas loss

 

[youareforgiven]

When an exit bag or hood fills up, the gas will fill until the positive pressure inside is great enough to purge the gas through the bottom. In my opinion ( definitely open to being corrected ), the force of pressure isn't necessarily any drastically different at the higher lpm . So it's not like 25-30-40 lpm will have more force to blow of the hood or anything , you'll just fill up quicker and reach that necessary bottom purging force alot quicker just get faster purging of gas .
Hope that makes sense .

On my tests at 15 lpm and 30 lpm , the bag fills up like a ballon pretty much the same, just at higher lpm it purges way more air out the bottom, quicker, and fills up quicker .

The advantages for this in my opinion , is that higher lpm purges cO2 quicker , making air hunger possibilities and hippocampus alarm less likely . The disadvantages are obvious, if you are limited supply on gas . This is why they generally say 15 lpm is sufficient , especially when alot of people exiting are older and weaker and can't lift 60-100 cf tanks .

So final exit recommends 15 lpm with a 20 cf tank which is pretty small ( about 20-27 minutes of flow at that lpm )

For people like me that are having trouble getting this over with and have SI issues , I sm a candidate for higher flow and fancier rigs .

15 lpm is totally fine , I currently am in the school of thought that higher can only be better , with no disadvantage other then more gas loss

Thanks! Does anybody know btw what the exact science is behind this being a peacefull death? Brainscans during this process or measurement of fear or something?

If the only evidence is that we loose consciousness before physical death then i hate to say it but this is a belief, not a fact. Consciousness has never been found in the brain. It could very well be that we are a brain in consciousness. I use this analogy:

Consciousness is everywhere and we are whirlpools / localizations in that consciousness. Our brain is what the localizing process looks like from the outside, but there is no actual consciousness IN the brain. We are like fish in the water that does not directly know they are in water. Brains are in consciousness but don't directly know they are in consciousness.

That would mean at best that we loose the egoic loop of consciousness during passing out and that the more the brain dies the more conscious we actually become. It think this is backed up by science that if certain drugs are used it actually DECREASES brain activity instead of increase while reporting very alive experiences. Is that not weird that when we have very alive experiences the brainscan shows almost no activity?
This sounds horrible for this "peacefully" method, but I don't think it's horrible. People who had NDE's report a feeling of coming home / deep peace / love. So whenever the brain is dying (delocalizing) it is going towards this place. So I don't think there is any reason to suggest that going towards home/deep peace/ love is going to be painful. What I do think is that it is going to be absolutely shocking that you still exist, but in another form.

I am not saying this is true, I am just proposing another view of consciousness and I think it's fair to you that you are aware of this theory proposed by philosophers.