Discussion What do we get for holding on?

[Meteora]

Is it just cowardice or do I really expect something better to come?
Who said it is improtant to live long?
Why does everybody seem to aim a long healthy life?
Are there any benefits if we make it to a natural death?

 

[LaVieEnRose]

For me tenacity has never been rewarded. Only with new traumas.

I don't know why they think age will make things better for people like me. Becoming even uglier, feebler, more alienated, and more socially irrelevant isn't likely to improve suicidal thoughts.

 

[Iris Blue]

I think some people think just living out their life and idk "living" makes it all worth it but I don't see it personally.

 

[Nikitatos]

I prefer a natural death because SI is so hard to overcome, but my life is becoming unbearable, Every time I could have CTB and didn't, I regretted it. Nothing ever does seem to get better.

 

[Meteora]

I don't know why they think age will make things better for people like me. Becoming even uglier, feebler, more alienated, and more socially irrelevant isn't likely to improve suicidal thoughts.

I don't think you re ugly.... but I know what you mean. aging can be scary.
I rarely see ugly people tbh.

idk "living" makes it all worth

I don't understand that either.

I prefer a natural death because SI is so hard to overcome, but my life is becoming unbearable, Every time I could have CTB and didn't, I regretted it. Nothing ever does seem to get better.

That's tough and brave...

 

[TotallyTerrible]

Is it just cowardice or do I really expect something better to come?
Who said it is improtant to live long?
Why does everybody seem to aim a long healthy life?
Are there any benefits if we make it to a natural death?

To be honest I see no point. Most of us are doomed to a life of work and taxes, and at the end you will most likely pass away confused, in pain, or both...

 

[ryba]

the "live a long and happy life" thing is such nonsense. honestly, how many 90-year-olds look like they're still enjoying life? ultimately, choosing to live is a gamble where you bet on things eventually getting better. a lot of people will try to sell you on that chance, but being promised a chance at happiness if you continue to suffer doesn't seem all that persuasive.

 

[Meteora]

honestly, how many 90-year-olds look like they're still enjoying life?

Hm but that's a interesting point. I think there are people who still are ok with being alive at this age. How much suffering do we have to bear`? It is obvious that life isn't always easy and happy...

 

[Render]

Prolonged depression is not uncommon in the general population, but it is far from the norm. Most people will never experience a major depressive disorder episode in their lifetime. This is true even among the elderly. The best data I could find indicates that around 1/3rd of hospitalized elderly patients experience symptoms of depression. But that still leaves 2/3rds that are at least appearing to enjoy life in one way or another.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMcp1402180

It is important to remember the selection bias at play in communities such as this and to keep in mind that we are in a relative minority.

 

[Meteora]

Prolonged depression is not uncommon in the general population, but it is far from the norm. Most people will never experience a major depressive disorder episode in their lifetime. This is true even among the elderly. The best data I could find indicates that around 1/3rd of hospitalized elderly patients experience symptoms of depression. But that still lives 2/3rds that are at least appearing to enjoy life in one way or another.

In my (fucking) country they start to say, every human being experiences depression in life. Ha! Sure. What assholes they are. They call it a depression if they are overworked, you know! I really hate my country.
I once per week volunteer in a nursing home and meet an old lady who will turn 93 in August. Last time she told me that she has never experienced times of extreme stress or desperation. Might be she doesn't remember it. Might also be true since she seems to have a very loving relationship with her family still.

 

[Render]

In my (fucking) country they start to say, every human being experiences depression in life. Ha! Sure. What assholes they are. They call it a depression if they are overworked, you know! I really hate my country.
I once per week volunteer in a nursing home and meet an old lady who will turn 93 in August. Last time she told me that she has never experienced times of extreme stress or desperation. Might be she doesn't remember it. Might also be true since she seems to have a very loving relationship with her family still.

It's kind of you to volunteer there. I have spent a decent amount of time in nursing homes and never plan on going back. They are dens of misery.

To be completely honest, what I have seen in nursing homes, in hospitals, and among the similarly defective and lame honestly make me a little less empathetic to people that have fully functioning bodies. That being said, there are plenty of people that have horrible lives with relatively robust vessels. More power to them.

Just out of curiosity, why do you want to die?

 

[Forever Sleep]

Depends on your circumstances. My 30's were better than my 20's and childhood but, that's because I had put in lots of effort and risk to change my life around and it paid off to some extent. Was it really worth it though? Not for me personally. I still wouldn't have missed out on much if I'd gone earlier. Plus, that's comparitively speaking. My 30's weren't exactly good. They were just less bad than previous years!

Probably depends on how much motivation a person has to try and change. I don't think much in life lands in our laps. It all takes effort and even then, you can still ultimately fail. Depends how much staying power you have left, if anything in life still appeals or brings you joy and- if you think it's state of mind that's the problem- depression or whatever else- how willing you are to work on that. Ultimately- I think the main thing for any of us is: How much effort are we willing to put in to improve our situations? How long can we cope with the bad things in our lives? No one actually knows whether things will improve. They could just as easily stay the same or get worse!

Me personally- age has brought some benefits. I probably care/worry a little less. Although- that's ideation too. What really is worth worrying about when you intend to kill yourself?!! Age can mean independence from a toxic home environment- if you're able to move out. But- it brings lots of negatives too. Health and energy levels decline while responsibilities increase.

 

[Meteora]

It's kind of you to volunteer there. I have spent a decent amount of time in nursing homes and never plan on going back. They are dens of misery.

To be completely honest, what I have seen in nursing homes, in hospitals, and among the similarly defective and lame honestly make me a little less empathetic to people that have fully functioning bodies. That being said, there are plenty of people that have horrible lives with relatively robust vessels. More power to them.

Just out of curiosity, why do you want to die?

Hm ok, the nursing home I visit is ok-ish. Just that most young ppl who work there don't seem to be the smartest.... and sometimes treat the old ppl strangely.

I suffer from complexe trauma. My body is relatively ok.
What about you?

Me personally- age has brought some benefits. I probably care/worry a little less. Although- that's ideation too. What really is worth worrying about when you intend to kill yourself?!! Age can mean independence from a toxic home environment- if you're able to move out. But- it brings lots of negatives too. Health and energy levels decline while responsibilities increase.

Age helped me, too, to a certain point, then it got almost worse than before. Or let's say, bad in a different way. I struggle with extreme inner tension, day and night, it' s trauma sequelae and not a single doctor so far could help me (I ve seen around 30 in the last three, four years only).
I guess, since my life was always shit from early on, I bear much more than others. I simply don't know what an easy life is from a mental point of view. Physically, I m blessed.
But now, in my 40ies, the unsolved emotional pain starts to affect the body and that is so unbearable and I m just nothing else but dumb to carry on.

 

[Render]

Hm ok the nursing home I visit is ok-ish. Just that most young ppl who work there don't seem to be the smartest....

Lmao. Maybe the nursing homes are just especially bad in my neck of the woods.

I suffer from complexe trauma. My body is relatively ok.

I'm sorry to hear about that. I've known a few people with complex trauma and it's obviously not easy. Good to hear your body is alright.

What about you?

Multi-morbidity. Don't want to dox myself.

But I really just come here to spread joy and good cheer. I'm like Santa.

 

[Blue Elephant]

Is it just cowardice or do I really expect something better to come?
Who said it is improtant to live long?
Why does everybody seem to aim a long healthy life?
Are there any benefits if we make it to a natural death?

I will speak for myself: there is some cowardice there, there is also the fact that I'm afraid that if I attempt in an easily accessible place I will be found and I will not be allowed to die. The zombies are very well indoctrinated to prevent anyone who tries to escape.

The length of one's life should not matter. I think, optimally we should live as long as conditions allow. I think we should live in nature, eat organic food and consume organic, natural medicine when needed. When time comes we should be allowed to go as to not put pressure on the ecosystem. Humans are a disease that affects other humans, animals and plants alike.

Everybody is conditioned to aim for a long life so as to slave and consume and slave and consume for as long as possible.

For me tenacity has never been rewarded. Only with new traumas.

I don't know why they think age will make things better for people like me. Becoming even uglier, feebler, more alienated, and more socially irrelevant isn't likely to improve suicidal thoughts.

Uglier? Darling, you women put too much stock into thinking that graphics are everything, some men actually find intelligence sexy. Sadly intelligence is also extremely difficult to find. As you grow you do get wiser though, if you try.

You do get more feeble, there's no arguing that, but you can mitigate that by choosing a healthier lifestyle. I know one person who is 65 but looks 45 and acts like he's 35. It can be done.

Alienated how?

Socially irrelevant how?

 

[Ambivalent1]

Suffering is the reward. Suffering builds resilience and character, which don't matter

 

[rozeske]

It depends on whether you are mentally and emotionally healthy or not, whether you enjoy your life or not. I my case the only thing I got from holding on is additional age, additional suffering and coming to terms with the idea of suicide.

 

[Meteora]

Lmao. Maybe the nursing homes are just especially bad where I've lived.

Haha no I think there are really bad ones, here too. But I m fortunate the one I visit seems ok.

I'm sorry to hear about that. I've known a few people with complex trauma and it's obviously not easy. Good to hear your body is alright.

Yeah it is a living hell. Not for a period but forever as it seems. There is no healing. No good solution.

Multi-morbidity. Don't want to dox myself.

But I really just come here to spread joy and good cheer. I'm like Santa.

Hi Santa :D, not what means multi-morbidity? Many different diseases? Are you young or old?

 

[ijustwishtodie]

Depends on the individual. In my case, all I get from living on is more suffering, that's it. Though I'm not really voluntarily holding on either as I'm only here because I don't have access to a peaceful, painless method.

I prefer a natural death because SI is so hard to overcome, but my life is becoming unbearable, Every time I could have CTB and didn't, I regretted it. Nothing ever does seem to get better.

I relate. As much as I hate to admit it, I think I may have to die from a natural death as I don't really have access to peaceful, painless methods. The pro lifers checkmated me and won.

I rarely see ugly people tbh.

If you somehow get to see my appearance, I'll be the first

 

[Meteora]

The length of one's life should not matter. I think, optimally we should live as long as conditions allow. I think we should live in nature, eat organic food and consume organic, natural medicine when needed. When time comes we should be allowed to go as to not put pressure on the ecosystem. Humans are a disease that affects other humans, animals and plants alike.

Thank you, I like this approach! It is so true.

Everybody is conditioned to aim for a long life so as to slave and consume and slave and consume for as long as possible.

True also. I never saw the connection between living long and being a slave to economy/society.

Uglier? Darling, you women put too much stock into thinking that graphics are everything, some men actually find intelligence sexy. Sadly intelligence is also extremely difficult to find. As you grow you do get wiser though, if you try.

I think, La vie en rose is a boy. What is intelligence for you?

 

[Blue Elephant]

I think, La vie en rose is a boy. What is intelligence for you?

Oh, I'm sorry, I did not know. However, regardless if one is a girl or if one is a boy my point still stands, I think people should concern themselves less with how they look and more with how they think. I think the world would be a very very different place if they would do so. Why do we even have mirrors!? Vanity! I mean, they even used to call them that.

There was one time when I lived in nature (on the road) (mostly), I did not look upon myself for months. It was a very good time!

Beauty comes from within, ugliness cannot be hidden no matter how many layers of plaster one applies to their face.

For me intelligence is seeing things for what they are, making thoughtful decisions based on that, making good decisions. This is what I love, there is a certain .. shine to an intelligent person.

Of course there is also the element of goodness or badness, a good character can be intelligent and also a bad character can be intelligent. I will revise my .. preferences, I like intelligent and GOOD people. : )

 

[Ash]

I think the best majority of people do enjoy their lives and the people around them and the things they do and the homes they've created and if they live a long time, are able to look back through their memories as a source of comfort. What we feel is not the norm, otherwise the human race would have died out long ago.

We're not supposed to feel like this.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

Uglier? Darling, you women put too much stock into thinking that graphics are everything, some men actually find intelligence sexy. Sadly intelligence is also extremely difficult to find. As you grow you do get wiser though, if you try.

Not a woman, darling, but that smacks of misogyny and you can miss me with it. If you didn't know, you shouldn't assume before spouting crap.

I have plenty wisdom. Wisdom is acquired through experience, not age.

The looks thing (and FYI, gay men take the cake when it comes to who prioritizes lokks) is just one aspect. When you have a lot of problems, they all blend together and compound each other. There isn't enough to compensate for all the deterioration, especially as someone who won't have a family.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

Is it just cowardice or do I really expect something better to come?
Who said it is improtant to live long?
Why does everybody seem to aim a long healthy life?
Are there any benefits if we make it to a natural death?

It's a pretty much subjective experience with some objective parts. It doesn't apply to each and everyone.

In my case:

I can anticipate that in the long run my life quality would increase even if I do nothing but sitting it out but it won't be the life I expected to have but still better than it is now.

I can expect a long and healthy life for myself bc ik that my family and ancestors had good genetics in general - many of them reached an old age without any severe health issues and I myself have no health issues, although I already reached 50% of an avg life time.

Potential benefits are subjective - I wouldn't mind reaching 100+ if I had no materialistic problems and have good health I wouldn't even mind reaching and age of 200 years.

 

[Endisclose]

For me tenacity has never been rewarded. Only with new traumas.

I think I am eventually coming around to this. Even if things had worked out, existence would always have been miserable. As Van Gogh is purported to have said "The sadness never ends".

 

[untothedepths]

I think we get to generate income for the elite first and foremost. Secondly, we get an congratulatory pat on the back, where it is no longer about the quality of the life, just how long you have lived. It's just some noise, some nonsense to make sense with how uncomfortable life can really be. In all honesty, there is no god, person, or friend who can help me or save me. I understand this. I understand I am a loser/lost cause in this life. I want to have hope, but I logically cannot have hope when I know how things have been for me. And how they will be. Society hates suicide because it is the very reminder that this is how life could be for them. It is a statement that if you are happy, you have it lucky. If not everything can be saved, then let me stop the inevitable, prolonged suffering.

 

[Blue Elephant]

Not a woman, darling, but that smacks of misogyny and you can miss me with it. If you didn't know, you shouldn't assume before spouting crap.

I have plenty wisdom. Wisdom is acquired through experience, not age.

The looks thing (and FYI, gay men take the cake when it comes to who prioritizes lokks) is just one aspect. When you have a lot of problems, they all blend together and compound each other. There isn't enough to compensate for all the deterioration, especially as someone who won't have a family.

misogyny n: hatred of women [syn: misogyny, misogynism] [ant: philogyny]

Assuming that you were a woman was a mistake, I'm sorry about that. But now you're assuming I hate them. Wtf!? Why? Who do you think I hate women? What is the "crap" that you say I'm spouting?

About acquiring wisdom: First: Age does play a part in acquiring wisdom, a one-year-old baby cannot possibly be as wise as a 100 years-old-person assuming (yes, we're assuming here, for the sake of the explanation) that both have similar mindsets and both are going or will go through the same life events. Second: Wisdom is acuired through experience if you're paying attention, if you're open-minded, smart enough to understand and learn from it and brave enough to accept it.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

Regarding OP title: What do we get for holding on?

It's also pretty much subjective but in the best case a finally fulfilled life.

 

[Blue Elephant]

Society hates suicide because it is the very reminder that this is how life could be for them.

What if it's a reminder that there is rot underneath it all, we're the ones who see it and they hate us because our deaths remind them of how rotten they become? : )

 

[doneforlife]

There are various viewpoints to this question. From a religious and spiritual context , you get more time as a human being. It is said that human birth is like a "tool" to be utilised to get Nirvana, Moksha , enlightenment.

From a practical viewpoint, one gets time to work on themselves and try to make a good living. Mc Donald's owner became successful at age 60+.

But I believe the ultimate outcome of every life is death. And if one has truly become detached from this world and doesn't have an iota of attachment to what this world has to offer , they should have the option to exit in a painless way.