Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
604
@Rhizomorph1 what do you think about @Proper Overdoser's suggestions? He created two threads on drug overdoses and suggested various combinations in two postings, some including opioids (here and here).
That's a lot of different combinations, most of which the statistics in this post will probably apply to. That being that drug poisonings tend to be between only 2-6% effective.

Milage will vary considerably between those combinations. The combinations appear somewhat arbitrary/anecdotal to me, which makes me skeptical.

Opioids are probably a bit more reliable but certainly not very reliable overall. A lot of this user's posts appear to be basing the reliability on speculation rather than evidence-based reasoning. As I said, I'm fairly skeptical.

They do rightfully point out that the major benefit to opioid and other drug poisonings (e.g., GBL) is peacefulness.

I'm not sure this benefit outweighs the cons or risks though given a higher likelihood of failure or permanent injury which itself would be painful.

I think some of their claims require further corroboration regarding their reliability and risks.

I would stick to the drugs mentioned in the PPH as they are corroborated by medical research and reports of users who have successfully performed the methods.

I especially wouldn't use research chemicals; as the user mentions, many are caustic (likely painful) and a lot is not known about them.
 
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Antoine_Roquentin

Member
Dec 17, 2023
76
That's a lot of different combinations, most of which the statistics in this post will probably apply to. That being that drug poisonings tend to be between only 2-6% effective.

Milage will vary considerably between those combinations. The combinations appear somewhat arbitrary/anecdotal to me, which makes me skeptical.

Opioids are probably a bit more reliable but certainly not very reliable overall. A lot of this user's posts appear to be basing the reliability on speculation rather than evidence-based reasoning. As I said, I'm fairly skeptical.

They do rightfully point out that the major benefit to opioid and other drug poisonings (e.g., GBL) is peacefulness.

I'm not sure this benefit outweighs the cons or risks though given a higher likelihood of failure or permanent injury which itself would be painful.

I think some of their claims require further corroboration regarding their reliability and risks.

I would stick to the drugs mentioned in the PPH as they are corroborated by medical research and reports of users who have successfully performed the methods.

I especially wouldn't use research chemicals; as the user mentions, many are caustic (likely painful) and a lot is not known about them.

Thank you for your reply, you criticism unfortunately completely reflect my thoughts about it, the more I am researching and reflecting on it. For anyone interested in @Proper Overdoser's methods, I suggest to research the proposed materials. Especially on reddit you can find a lot of informations and experiences (f. i. researchchemicals, RcBenzodiazepine, Opioid_RCs) but also on sites like psychonaut wiki. A lot of what they wrote is right concerning the dangers of the materials (f. i. a lot of users caution against the use of -zenes), but a lot of the drugs have some very bad effects, f. i. the research benzos can cause days of blackout.

It's a pity, because like you said, what @Proper Overdoser wrote really sounds like a simple and peaceful way - you just fall asleep and die. This would be my favourite way out. But his directions are to vague in my opinion (whats a "megadose" of benzos f. i. or the correct timeline of taking the different drugs so that one can ctb quickly)
 
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Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
604
Thank you for your reply, you criticism unfortunately completely reflect my thoughts about it, the more I am researching and reflecting on it. For anyone interested in @Proper Overdoser's methods, I suggest to research the proposed materials. Especially on reddit you can find a lot of informations and experiences (f. i. researchchemicals, RcBenzodiazepine, Opioid_RCs) but also on sites like psychonaut wiki. A lot of what they wrote is right concerning the dangers of the materials (f. i. a lot of users caution against the use of -zenes), but a lot of the drugs have some very bad effects, f. i. the research benzos can cause days of blackout.

It's a pity, because like you said, what @Proper Overdoser wrote really sounds like a simple and peaceful way - you just fall asleep and die. This would be my favourite way out. But his directions are to vague in my opinion (whats a "megadose" of benzos f. i. or the correct timeline of taking the different drugs so that one can ctb quickly)
Reddit will probably have varying results for research purposes as it is so subjective and anecdotal. You have to take it upon yourself to differentiate fact from nonsense.

Both psychonautwiki and Erowid are great and reliable resources for psychotropic drug-related information.
 
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hea54

Member
Dec 20, 2023
12
Both psychonautwiki and Erowid are great and reliable resources for psychotropic drug-related information.
These references are useful. My search needs were narrow, so I finished looking at Erowid quickly. Visitors to Erowid will want to search for content using that site's Search function. I'll go back to the psychonautwiki website when I have more time.

Has anyone else looked at current links to PPH that appear in the thread titled Suicide Resource Compilation? In late December, I tried 3 of those links. but none of the links was working! Can someone please point me to links that work? This is a recurring problem (see Suicide Resource Compilation Links not active").
 
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DeadPilot

DeadPilot

hopeless
Jan 18, 2024
15
How quick is the effect after snorting?
What are the chances of failing the CTB naturally, I mean w/o the use of Naloxone or any help at all, is it possible to stay alive somehow?

I'm thinking about using 1 gram of China White, half in each nostril, but I don't know where to find a kit for concentration testing to be sure.
 
AngelTears

AngelTears

Far Away
Jun 10, 2023
54
Preamble

I wanted to write something similar to Stan's guide to SN but I hesitate to call this a guide because I can't in good conscience make a guide for something so unreliable in terms of access, lethality, and risk of permanent injury. I.e., traumatic brain injury from hypoxia. SN is a far more reliable and lower-risk alternative in this regard.

Indeed, the PPH strongly recommends against opioids for these reasons.

However, many will still seek to ctb using opioids due to reasons of accessibility, their notoriety for taking lives in the current overdose epidemic, and/or their well-known status as euphoriants and painkillers. The PPH does not go into details about how to ctb with opioids and overlooks different routes of administration and available drug checking services that can inform people on what is in their drugs.

The major benefit of opioids is that if successfully performed, death will be guaranteed to be peaceful, and perhaps even enjoyable for some. At face-value opioids would seem like an attractive method for this reason alone. But, I encourage spending some time forming an unbiased/neutral assessment of both the risks and benefits of this method, before making a decision.

The goal of this thread is twofold:
  1. Help some to reconsider this method due to its poor reliability and risks of permanent injury/disability.
  2. Provide information to improve reliability and minimize risk for permanent injury/disability for those who choose this method anyways.
    1. **Even following the methods in this thread, opioid poisoning remains very unreliable due to variability in personal tolerance and uncontrollable factors related to drug quality.

Introduction

This thread is dedicated to compiling and discussing information on the method of opioid poisoning. Please feel free to comment with any additional information or recommended edits/criticisms to this post.

What are Opioids?

Opioids are analgesic (pain-relieving) drugs that, in high enough doses, result in death via respiratory depression. Examples include morphine, heroin, fentanyl, oxycodone (AKA Percocet or Oxycontin), hydrocodone, hydromorphone (AKA Dilaudid), codeine (AKA T3s), tramadol, and many others.

Pros and Cons

Pros
  • Nearly guaranteed to be peaceful, if successful
  • Accessible for people with pre-existing sources/dealers
  • Non-violent
  • Can easily be portrayed as "accidental", especially if one already uses drugs
Cons
  • Low to moderate reliability
  • Risk of permanent damage; traumatic injury, organ failure, etc.
  • Non-accessible for people without pre-existing sources/dealers or access to dark net
  • Reduced reliability for people with tolerance to opioids (e.g., from pre-existing opioid use)
  • Unpredictable: significant variance in effects from person to person (genetic/etc.-related tolerance & sensitivity)

How Do Opioids Work to Induce Death? What Does it Feel Like?

Opioid drugs bind to the opioid receptors in the brain which are the brain's primary pain-killing receptors. At high enough doses, this causes the nervous system to become depressed to a point where the brain stops sending signals to the lungs to breathe. This results in hypoxic death from lack of oxygenated blood to the brain and body. By the time of fatal respiratory depression, the person's brain will have been flooded with pain-killing signals and will also be completely unconscious (likened to a state of general anaesthesia); they will not experience any suffering.

Prior to losing consciousness, opioids can cause feelings of contentment, relaxation, euphoria, a warm and pleasurable feeling in the body, and has generally been described as being cozied up in a blanket beside a fire. Many people experience a cold flush and/or nausea and vomiting, especially their first time using opioids. Vomiting is not an issue for the effectiveness of ctb if the opioids were not consumed orally, but may be uncomfortable for some. Notably, the pleasurable opioid effects often make people indifferent to nausea. In some cases, intravenous injection may result in such rapid onset of effects that blackout occurs almost immediately, bypassing the pleasurable effects.

Which Opioids are Considered Best For CTB?

In short, heroin or fentanyl are ideal.

Stronger opioids such as heroin, fentanyl, or oxycodone are generally preferable as other types of opioids require much larger doses and thus have higher risk of failure. For example, heroin is about 10x as strong as morphine.

Pharmaceutical-grade opioids might be considered preferable by some given that their dosages are accurately labelled and they are not potentially contaminated or sold as different drugs entirely like with illegal markets. However, many pharmaceutical opioids also contain high concentrations of anti-inflammatory drugs such as paracetamol, acetaminophen, or ibuprofen (e.g., Percocet) that are likely to cause significant stomach pain and damage organs in the doses required to ctb. They also often contain fillers (e.g., Oxycontin) that make them unsuitable for injection or other routes of administration. Eating these medications is also not recommended as it is very likely to fail due to vomiting and oral bioavailability is low.

I highly recommend against using weak opioids like codeine, tramadol, or hydromorphone (dilaudid) as they are far too weak to reliably ctb.

I also recommend against research chemical opioids as too little is known about them to reliably ctb and the risk for pain, adverse effects, etc. is high.

Where Can I Get Opioids?

As mentioned above, some people get them by prescription, but most people will opt for heroin or fentanyl which are rarely prescribed. Illicit opioids can be found by contacting a dealer on the street or sourcing them via the dark net. See: How to Access Dark Net Markets for Ctb Resources or download tor browser and look up the Dark Net Market Buyer's Bible which you can find a .onion link for on the https://tor.taxi/ directory (.onion links in this directory can only be accessed using the tor browser).

Street drugs may be more accessible for some, but tend to be much more contaminated with other drugs and have significant variability in concentrations. Fentanyl, for example, tends to vary from around 5-25% concentration in a given sample. It is often cut with caffeine, benzodiazepines, cocaine, heroin, paint thinners, even concrete, and a range of other drugs. This webpage shows data on common cuts and buffs in the opioid supply, demonstrating how unreliable quality sourcing is off the street.

Dark net markets tend to have higher quality drugs due to their review system which adds some (but far from perfect) level of accountability. The gold star method would involve sourcing from a vendor with a long track record of positive reviews combined with utilizing drug-checking services (see below). China white #4 heroin is advisable.

The Importance of Checking Your Drugs

Because the drug supply on the street and dark net markets are heavily contaminated and inconsistently dosed, it is important to get your drugs checked using harm reduction services such as Energy Control (EU; possibly worldwide) or Get Your Drugs Tested (Canada) to determine approximate concentrations, to confirm the presence of your expected opioid, and to rule out the presence of other drugs. Some jurisdictions have local services where you can get your drugs checked legally, anonymously, and confidentially in-person.

*Energy Control has confirmatory chromatography testing meaning they can tell you more precise information without the limitations below. They should be able to tell you the exact concentration. Try to figure out if the service you use utilizes confirmatory/chromatography testing or an FTIR machine.

*Important: The FTIR spectroscopy technology used by Get Your Drugs Tested and many similar organizations has some limitations:
  1. It can only detect concentrations within a margin of error that is around 10%. I.e., Results will usually say, for example "between 40-50% heroin". Some organizations prefer not to share concentrations unless explicitly asked.
  2. It can only detect the presence of drugs that are above 5% concentration within the sample. There could be multiple other drugs present in a given sample below the 5% detection limit.
  3. The "chocolate chip cookie effect": it can only detect what is in the portion of the sample you send them; just like in a cookie if you break off a chunk, there may or may not be chocolate chips in the chunk. Some drugs tend to clump together and won't be present in the "chunk" you send for testing. Grinding your sample to ensure it is a homogeneous mixture before mailing a portion may reduce this risk.
Fentanyl test strips can also be accessed online and via many pharmacies. However, they will only detect the presence of fentanyl and provide no information on concentrations. Plenty of fentanyl samples are massively under-dosed so fentanyl test strips alone are insufficient.

The Method

Now that you have sourced your opioid of choice, determined its relative concentration and ruled out the presence of other drugs, you need to ensure the right amount enters your body the right way.

Dose

A lethal dose of heroin for a person without any tolerance is technically 30mg. For fentanyl, it is considered 3mg. However, it is unlikely your sample will be 100% pure or even close to it. These doses are also on the lower end of the spectrum and will only be lethal in a proportion of people. A more conservative/reliable aim is at least 150mg for heroin and 15mg for fentanyl.

You will need to do some math based on the relative concentrations provided by the drug checking services you accessed previously. If you have a gram (1,000mg) of powder with a concentration/purity of 10-20% fentanyl, this means there is between 100-200mg of fentanyl in the gram of powder.

Here's an example of the math for a 500mg sample that has a concentration of 30-40% heroin:

500mg x 0.3 (30%) = 150
500mg x 0.4 (40%) = 200

Therefore, 500mg of 30-40% heroin will contain between 150-200mg of heroin. It is recommended to dose conservatively to ensure that the lower end of the range includes the lethal dose.

If you have any tolerance to opioids, this will also reduce the method's reliability further as you will have to do some guesswork to increase your dose accordingly. Erring on the side of caution by taking a larger dose will improve reliability.

Regarding Polydrug Poisoning & Potentiation

Some may wish to combine their opioid with other depressants which can potentiate the effects of opioids, making them more lethal. This is not necessary if you have a large enough dose of opioids but doesn't hurt to improve reliability or if the dose of opioids itself is too small to ctb on its own. The drugs below potentiate the effects of opioids meaning each individual drug has its own effect, but there is an additional effect due to the interaction between these drugs (almost like a 3rd effect on top of the individual effects of the 2 drugs). Potentiation will make the opioid more lethal by causing respitatory failure with a lower dose.

*Important: Although potentiating small doses of opioids with depressants will increase its reliability, it is still very unreliable compared to just using a high dose of opioids. Ideally one would use a sufficiently large dose of opioids in the first place and the addition of sedatives will only be included as a fail-safe.

Potentiating drugs that can be included are below:

- Benzodiazepines (e.g., Xanax (alprazolam), Klonopin (clonazepam), etizolam, Ativan (lorazepam), Valium (diazepam), etc. Benzodiazepines are drugs that reduce anxiety and cause sedation and relaxation. The combination has become increasingly associated with overdose deaths as dealers are cutting the fentanyl supply with benzodiazepines to make them feel stronger. The current supply of fentanyl in Canada witnesses around half of samples containing benzodiazepines. Check your drugs with the services above so you know whether yours contains benzodiazepines.

- Alcohol

- Z-drugs such as zolpidem (ambien) or zopiclone. Z-drugs are commonly prescribed for insomnia/as sleeping pills.

Route of administration (ROA)

The two ideal ROAs are intravenous injection and rectal administration. Other options are less ideal for the reasons described below.

Injections are preferable for anyone who has experience using needles or those willing to learn. Just make sure you draw visible blood into the syringe before pushing the plunger down, and don't hit an artery. Use sterile needles. 30-31 gauge syringes are provided no-questions-asked at most pharmacies or can be obtained online. More detailed instructions on preparing your shot can be found with a quick google search. I recommend following all harm reduction protocols (except "start low, go slow - for obvious reasons) such as sanitary procedure, in case of ctb failure or abort. I know the risk may seem trivial, but you don't want to fail ctb only to be hospitalized and in pain due to a serious blood infection.

Rectal administration is the second most effective method as it has high bioavailability and is suitable for those who wish to skip the stress (or potential phobia) of needles. All you need is a small oral syringe, some water, and some lube for your bum hole. It is marginally less reliable as absorption will be slightly slower. This guide is great for detailing how to do it.

*Note: regarding the homophobia/stigma of men penetrating their butts with a syringe, it does make you gay. That's the best part! Jokes aside, straight men all over the world insert things in their butts to consume drugs (recreational, suppositories, to die), and sexual pleasure. There would be a lot less of us on this forum if not for homophobiaā€¦ Show your support for us queer folk by dying with heroin up your arse <3

Oral administration is not suitable as it has a low bioavailability and vomiting is incredibly likely. Anti-emetics can be used, but this ROA is still inadvisable due to slow absorption/poor bioavailability. Snorting is also not recommended as absorption can be slow and is effected by the amount of powder in your nostrils; the more powder, the slower the absorption. It is also less bioavailable than injection or rectal administration.

Regarding Naloxone/Suicide Reversal

I feel compelled to advise people on how naloxone works in case anyone should want it by their side. Although most of us aim to ctb without potential for hesitation or reversal, cases where people will consume their lethal dose by whatever means and regret it or contact help are not out of the question.

Should you wish to have a means of reversal (up until the point where you cannot move your body or notify others for help; this will occur very quickly in most cases), naloxone is an effective reversal agent. Naloxone kits usually come with 3 vials and 3 syringes. You may wish to prepare the naloxone by drawing it into the syringes in advance in case you change your mind last minute. There is nothing wrong with changing your mind.

*Injection use of opioids will provide less/potentially no opportunity for reversal as the onset is so quick one may blackout immediately. Rectal administration will take place in approximately 5 minutes after adminstration.

You should dose yourself with at least 2 or more doses as you will have taken a dose that is likely considerably larger than what most people overdose on. If comfortable, contact emergency services after dosing the naloxone as it has a short half-life and when it wears off the opioid effects can cause you to collapse and die later on. If you aren't comfortable contacting emergency services, consider getting 2 or more naloxone kits so you can dose yourself repeatedly until certain the opioid effects have worn off.

Naloxone works by kicking the opioid off your brain's opioid receptor. You can access naloxone kits legally and confidentially at most local pharmacies. It is relatively intuitive to use and will not harm you in any way; it has virtually no interactions with other drugs. You will feel sober afterwards and that is about it.

Final words

I figured I would write this post while I wait my SN to be delivered. I hope this post serves as a way of giving back to this community for what it has provided for me. Thank you to those operating this site, the mods, and contributing members. I'll stick around for a bit to edit this post as needed.

Thanks to @zel for inspiring me to write this.

With love in finding peace in living or dying,
Rhizo :heart:
Gosh, such a well articulated post!!! Love seeing educated people sharing knowledge <3
 
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Bobert_Beniro

Bobert_Beniro

Life sucks and then you die.
Mar 14, 2023
346
I would like the OP to edit his post as it is incomplete and incorrect:
1) OP forgot to mention the intramuscular ROA method. From this follows point 2
2) Opiate method is reliable and not low/average chance for ctb. It all depends on the dose, and if you inject 1g of heroin/methadone/oxycodone intramuscularly, it is 100% death, even if you vomit
3) The rectal method is also not ideal, since the solution can simply leak out of the ass, consider that you have given yourself the most expensive enema of your life
4) It is better to inject into a muscle rather than into a vein, because if you inject into a vein you will instantly lose consciousness from opiates and may not have time to fully inject the capacity of the syringe. And it's also very difficult to get into a vein yourself for the first time
5) 15 mg of fentanyl absurdly high if 2 mg is considered lethal and the tablets are made with a dosage of 100 or 200 micrograms (that is, even less than one milligram, so as not to cause an overdose)
 
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rotciv

rotciv

Something In The Way
Mar 25, 2023
566
I would like the OP to edit his post as it is incomplete and incorrect:
1) OP forgot to mention the intramuscular ROA method. From this follows point 2
2) Opiate method is reliable and not low/average chance for ctb. It all depends on the dose, and if you inject 1g of heroin/methadone/oxycodone intramuscularly, it is 100% death, even if you vomit
3) The rectal method is also not ideal, since the solution can simply leak out of the ass, consider that you have given yourself the most expensive enema of your life
4) It is better to inject into a muscle rather than into a vein, because if you inject into a vein you will instantly lose consciousness from opiates and may not have time to fully inject the capacity of the syringe. And it's also very difficult to get into a vein yourself for the first time
5) 15 mg of fentanyl absurdly high if 2 mg is considered lethal and the tablets are made with a dosage of 100 or 200 micrograms (that is, even less than one milligram, so as not to cause an overdose)

Intramuscular applications are not talked about much here or on drug forums, nor have I seen any mention of related deaths, so it is a little difficult to know the right dose for CTB.

I would anyway go for the rectal/boof/plug, which has more evidence behind and much more bioavailability than orally.

Before coming up with assumptions, please provide information about this if any.
 
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Bobert_Beniro

Bobert_Beniro

Life sucks and then you die.
Mar 14, 2023
346
Intramuscular applications are not talked about much here or on drug forums, nor have I seen any mention of related deaths, so it is a little difficult to know the right dose for CTB.

I would anyway go for the rectal/boof/plug, which has more evidence behind and much more bioavailability than orally.

Before coming up with assumptions, please provide information about this if any.
It's strange that you ask me to provide sources of information, but do not ask the OP to do so. For example, where did he get the figure of 30-40% purity of street heroin? The intramuscular route of administration is quite popular for opiates, I don't know why this is so, but drug addicts inject into the muscle. I find information about dosages and methods of roa in rc thematic forums, but they are Russian, I can send it to you if you want to read it. You can also look up roa dosage and methods on the psychonaut wiki
 
rotciv

rotciv

Something In The Way
Mar 25, 2023
566
It's strange that you ask me to provide sources of information, but do not ask the OP to do so. For example, where did he get the figure of 30-40% purity of street heroin? The intramuscular route of administration is quite popular for opiates, I don't know why this is so, but drug addicts inject into the muscle. I find information about dosages and methods of roa in rc thematic forums, but they are Russian, I can send it to you if you want to read it. You can also look up roa dosage and methods on the psychonaut wiki

Why use heroin when you can buy pure nitazenes legally :)

Never heard about about intramuscular opioids but I'll search about. But you still can send it to me.
 
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JezebelDuLioncourt

JezebelDuLioncourt

Member
Feb 23, 2024
81
Thank you very much for this excellently written article. It makes me wish I could CTB with you, someone who knows exactly what needs to be done to ensure one does not miss the bus.

In your article, "Final words" section, you indicated that you'd be using SN to CTB. This makes me reconsider my method of choice, which would be F. I mean, since you are obviously so much more knowledgeable than I am on this topic, I am inclined--nay, it behooves me--to simply take after you.

I hope you are still around. If not, then I'd just have to console myself with reading and re-reading the written knowledge you have so generously gifted us with.
 
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L

losing hope

Arcanist
Apr 27, 2022
447
Why use heroin when you can buy pure nitazenes legally :)
Are they a DW job, or can you find them on the clear net?

"Experts are warning that nitazenes ā€” a type of synthetic opioid ā€” could lead to an increase in drug-related deaths as they flood the UK market."

Could these be the new SN?
 
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rotciv

rotciv

Something In The Way
Mar 25, 2023
566
Are they a DW job, or can you find them on the clear net?

"Experts are warning that nitazenes ā€” a type of synthetic opioid ā€” could lead to an increase in drug-related deaths as they flood the UK market."

Could these be the new SN?

Metonitazene, Metonitazepyne, N-Desetilisotonitazenol, Pronitazepyne and Ethomethazene still available in Europe.
 
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L

losing hope

Arcanist
Apr 27, 2022
447
Metonitazene, Metonitazepyne, N-Desetilisotonitazenol, Pronitazepyne and Ethomethazene still available in Europe.
Where would you get them though? Street dealer? DW? Clearnet research pills website? Elsewhere?
 
darkSea

darkSea

Member
Mar 7, 2024
42
Is it possible to inject a gram of heroin? Does anyone with knowledge of injecting opiates know of that's just too much stuff to get into a vein? Like, even the time it takes to push the plunger thing, will I pass out with half of it in my vein, half in the needle, and hanging out of my arm? I know it depends how fast I do that, but I feel like I can't just push a full gram into a vein in 2 seconds.
 
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darkSea

darkSea

Member
Mar 7, 2024
42
Is it possible to inject a gram of heroin? Does anyone with knowledge of injecting opiates know of that's just too much stuff to get into a vein? Like, even the time it takes to push the plunger thing, will I pass out with half of it in my vein, half in the needle, and hanging out of my arm? I know it depends how fast I do that, but I feel like I can't just push a full gram into a vein in 2 seconds.
I answered my own question, and am adding it here to help anyone who has the same question 1710331744554
 
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T

this_fckn_guy

New Member
Apr 27, 2022
3
Something I don't ever see mentioned in opioid threads that I have questions about is the viability of methadone. And I realize it's because it's hard to get in significant enough quantities, but say I were to stockpile take homes or something. What would a lethal dose be compared to my daily dose? It has a high oral bioavailability. I could much easier drink 700 mg of methadone than a big fuck off glass of SN. It also has a very long half life, so I'm inclined to think that would make it very effective in terms of getting the job done. I've done lots of research, but it's hard to find information online because there's just not that much of it.
 
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strangelife

strangelife

Specialist
Feb 16, 2024
357
How much milliliters of substance contains 1g of heroin?
 
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samicitchka

samicitchka

It Hurts Until it Doesn't.
Apr 14, 2024
26
This is a really informative post. I appreciate how well written it is. And it answered every question i had.
 
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uncat_

uncat_

aspiring corpse
Nov 3, 2023
126
I'm able to get oxycodone or oxycontin pills. I'm not sure how pure they are, are there testing kits? i'm also not sure how much i'll need for a lethal dose.
 
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lifesprisoner

Member
Apr 23, 2024
48
What are the risk envolved with opiod overdose other than death am i risking brain damage or something?
 
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Spectre

Spectre

I am serious about not taking things seriously
Nov 27, 2023
234
Instant death button discovered!!

 
I

innerentropy

"Non placet? Licet eo reverti unde venisti"
Jul 8, 2023
46
@Rhizomorph1 What about methadone?
It's strong, potentially lethal and could be taken orally. Have you information about it?
 
Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
604
Protonitazepyne is certainly much weaker than fentanyl in causing respiratory depression...
Agreed. Avoid research chemicals. Too little is known about their potency, adverse effects, contraindications, etc.
@Rhizomorph1 What about methadone?
It's strong, potentially lethal and could be taken orally. Have you information about it?
The potency of methadone is quite low and the platykurtic (flat) absorption-excretion curve of the drug means it will be challenging to reach peak blood concentrations needed to die, even at high doses.

I wouldn't recommend it as opioids already come with a range of factors that reduce reliability. Using low-potency opioids will only compound the risk of failure, adverse events, or injury from non-fatal respiratory depression.

This method is really only suitable for lab-tested (see above for options) heroin, fentanyl, or oxycodone (without buffs such as pill binders). Finding these drugs is really the challenge which is why alternative methods are better suited for most people.

I can't stress enough how unreliable this method is. Even following the procedure to a T, it is still only moderately reliable due to the reasons I mentioned in the OP.
What are the risk envolved with opiod overdose other than death am i risking brain damage or something?
Yes there is a risk of hypoxia-induced brain damage.

If the dose is not high enough, breathing can become depressed to a point where breaths are interspersed irregularly, resulting in enough oxygen for the brain to survive, but too little for it to avoid neuronal death.

Especially over a period of hours, the brain will preserve oxygen in the essential areas of the brain stem. This means your cognition, memory, problem solving, decision making, mood, intellect, motor function, etc. areas will be the first to experience brain damage.

This is why I recommend other methods as more reliable alternatives with generally lower risk (e.g., SN)
 
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rotciv

rotciv

Something In The Way
Mar 25, 2023
566
Agreed. Avoid research chemicals. Too little is known about their potency, adverse effects, contraindications, etc.

The potency of methadone is quite low and the platykurtic (flat) absorption-excretion curve of the drug means it will be challenging to reach peak blood concentrations needed to die, even at high doses.

I wouldn't recommend it as opioids already come with a range of factors that reduce reliability. Using low-potency opioids will only compound the risk of failure, adverse events, or injury from non-fatal respiratory depression.

This method is really only suitable for lab-tested (see above for options) heroin, fentanyl, or oxycodone (without buffs such as pill binders). Finding these drugs is really the challenge which is why alternative methods are better suited for most people.

I can't stress enough how unreliable this method is. Even following the procedure to a T, it is still only moderately reliable due to the reasons I mentioned in the OP.

Yes there is a risk of hypoxia-induced brain damage.

If the dose is not high enough, breathing can become depressed to a point where breaths are interspersed irregularly, resulting in enough oxygen for the brain to survive, but too little for it to avoid neuronal death.

Especially over a period of hours, the brain will preserve oxygen in the essential areas of the brain stem. This means your cognition, memory, problem solving, decision making, mood, intellect, motor function, etc. areas will be the first to experience brain damage.

This is why I recommend other methods as more reliable alternatives with generally lower risk (e.g., SN)

I agree with everything you said except the part about methadone being low in potency, the oral LD50s in mice and rats show it to be much more potent than oxycodone and heroin. And even twice the potency of heroin when used intravenously.
 
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Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
604
I agree with everything you said except the part about methadone being low in potency, the oral LD50s in mice and rats show it to be much more potent than oxycodone and heroin. And even twice the potency of heroin when used intravenously.
It has a much broader opioid receptor affinity, which I suppose could influence the LD50 in mice. Still, it's inferential at best.

Methadone is less potent across most metrics; single-receptor binding affinity; especially the Mu receptor, response curve, subjective effects. I'm fairly certain I've read somewhere that the Mu receptor is the most predictive receptor of respiratory and hindbrain depression, at least in humans; but don't quote me on this as I can't remember where I read it.

Indeed, 5mg of methadone is considered equivalent to morphine 7.5mg. Morphine is well known to be about 10x less potent than heroin amongst medical and pharmacology communities of practice.

How the LD50 of mice translates to humans considering the varying binding affinity and the different comparative neurobiology, I would gather a lot of guesswork and infering would take place, blurring what one could expect in terms of fatality and overall effects. I don't know many reports of successful case reports too, but I'd be interested to hear of them.

I personally can't recommend it, but I'm not saying it's impossible; I'm open to new information. I always er on the side of caution in this thread for obvious reasons ā¤ļø

-----

Edit: I did some more reading. Accordingly, methadone's relative potency is higher than that of heroin or oxy (but not fentanyl) because of its broader binding affinity and longer half-life. However, acute & peak concentrations at single-receptor sites are greater for heroin & oxycodone. Considering that fatal effects usually occur as a result of threshold peaks in concentration, I wouldn't rely on methadone. It's a drop in the bucket as to how the more widespread, longer acting, but attenuated effects will impact lethality in my opinion. It's questionable whether animal studies translate to humans.

Hope this is informative :) I agree that calling methadone less potent can be misleading, but I hope this clarifies! It boils down to relative vs. acute potency.

-R
 
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rotciv

rotciv

Something In The Way
Mar 25, 2023
566
It has a much broader opioid receptor affinity, which I suppose could influence the LD50 in mice. Still, it's inferential at best.

Methadone is less potent across most metrics; single-receptor binding affinity; especially the Mu receptor, response curve, subjective effects. I'm fairly certain I've read somewhere that the Mu receptor is the most predictive receptor of respiratory and hindbrain depression, at least in humans; but don't quote me on this as I can't remember where I read it.

Indeed, 5mg of methadone is considered equivalent to morphine 7.5mg. Morphine is well known to be about 10x less potent than heroin amongst medical and pharmacology communities of practice.

How the LD50 of mice translates to humans considering the varying binding affinity and the different comparative neurobiology, I would gather a lot of guesswork and infering would take place, blurring what one could expect in terms of fatality and overall effects. I don't know many reports of successful case reports too, but I'd be interested to hear of them.

I personally can't recommend it, but I'm not saying it's impossible; I'm open to new information. I always er on the side of caution in this thread for obvious reasons ā¤ļø

-----

Edit: I did some more reading. Accordingly, methadone's relative potency is higher than that of heroin or oxy (but not fentanyl) because of its broader binding affinity and longer half-life. However, acute & peak concentrations at single-receptor sites are greater for heroin & oxycodone. Considering that fatal effects usually occur as a result of threshold peaks in concentration, I wouldn't rely on methadone. It's a drop in the bucket as to how the more widespread, longer acting, but attenuated effects will impact lethality in my opinion. It's questionable whether animal studies translate to humans.

Hope this is informative :) I agree that calling methadone less potent can be misleading, but I hope this clarifies! It boils down to relative vs. acute potency.

-R
Switching from morphine to oral methadone in treating cancer pain: what is the equianalgesic dose ratio?

"Dose ratios ranged from 2.5:1 to 14.3:1 (median, 7.75:1), which indicated that, in most cases, the dose ratio was much higher than that suggested by the published equianalgesic tables. A strong linear positive relationship between morphine and methadone equianalgesic doses was obtained (Pearson's correlation coefficient, 0.91). The dose ratio increased with the increase of the previous morphine dose with a much higher increase at low morphine doses.

Conclusion: The results of our study confirm that methadone is a potent opioid, more potent than believed. Caution is recommended when switching from any opioid to methadone, especially in patients who are tolerant to high doses of opioids."


Opioid from Methadone: Fraught with Difficulties

'Published equianalgesic dose ratios between morphine and methadone range widely, anywhere from 2.5:1 to 15:1 (equivalent dose of oral morphine to oral methadone)"
 
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Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
604
Switching from morphine to oral methadone in treating cancer pain: what is the equianalgesic dose ratio?

"Dose ratios ranged from 2.5:1 to 14.3:1 (median, 7.75:1), which indicated that, in most cases, the dose ratio was much higher than that suggested by the published equianalgesic tables. A strong linear positive relationship between morphine and methadone equianalgesic doses was obtained (Pearson's correlation coefficient, 0.91). The dose ratio increased with the increase of the previous morphine dose with a much higher increase at low morphine doses.

Conclusion: The results of our study confirm that methadone is a potent opioid, more potent than believed. Caution is recommended when switching from any opioid to methadone, especially in patients who are tolerant to high doses of opioids."


Opioid from Methadone: Fraught with Difficulties

'Published equianalgesic dose ratios between morphine and methadone range widely, anywhere from 2.5:1 to 15:1 (equivalent dose of oral morphine to oral methadone)"
Makes sense. As I said, relative vs acute potency. There's multiple metrics to measure potency by; subjective, binding affinities (pharmacodynamics), blood plasma conentrations, absorption-excretion curves (pharmacokinetics).

It's not cut and dry. Which is important to remember for all opioids. So many variables can reduce the likelihood of successfully ctb.

Thank you for sharing. It's very insightful :hug:
 
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nottinghams

nottinghams

Official Written Apology for Being a Buzzkill
Apr 15, 2024
270
Hi

How much time do I ACTUALLY need alone to die of a fentanyl overdose? I am injecting via intramuscular.
people have given me so many different answers. some have said 1 hour or 2 hours. one person said 7-9 is a perfect window. others have said 7-9 is more than enough.

I can only do 9 max 10. I would never be looking for an exact but 9 hours is a wide margin of time to say how many needed alone. it escapes me why it would take 9 hours to die unconscious.
Please only answer me if you have knowledge and know what you're talking about šŸ™ opinions are appreciated but not now please. Thank you :)
 

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