Venting Humans just create suffering

[FuneralCry]

Humans truly are such a repulsive species, they just create so much suffering, no matter what the human species will always be an abomination and I find it beyond tragic how it hasn't gone voluntarily extinct yet. The fact that humans so harmfully procreate yet make suicide pretty much illegal is really evil and disgusting, I'm tired of this hellish world and I'd always prefer to die no matter what. Existence truly does cause nothing but pain, harm and cruelty, all of which was unnecessary in the first place and could had been prevented if humans had the awareness and compassion not to procreate.

It truly is like a virus how they procreate even know existing really is only suffering, how could they procreate when we truly do exist in hell, to be conscious with the ability to suffer will always be a terrible curse. The fact that many humans just cause others to suffer more with their cruelty and insensitivity just makes me wish to not exist even more, even this site is no different, it's not a safe space for those who really want to die anymore, I'm tired of the insensitivity of humans and how they love to make others feel worse.

 

[sserafim]

The fact that humans so harmfully procreate yet make suicide pretty much illegal is really evil and disgusting

True. Why are people allowed to bring new life here without any restrictions, but those who don't want to exist aren't allowed to die? Dying is made risky and difficult; peaceful, guaranteed methods are intentionally restricted. Why? No one chose to be born, so we should all have the right to die. I've never understood this. The only reason I can think of is that society needs us alive to be slaves to the system. @DarkRange55 @Pluto @SexyIncél Any thoughts or ideas on this strange dichotomy?

 

[DarkRange55]

True. Why are people allowed to bring new life here without any restrictions, but those who don't want to exist aren't allowed to die? Dying is made risky and difficult; peaceful, guaranteed methods are intentionally restricted. Why? No one chose to be born, so we should all have the right to die. I've never understood this. The only reason I can think of is that society needs us alive to be slaves to the system. @DarkRange55 @Pluto @SexyIncél Any thoughts or ideas on this strange dichotomy?

Suicide still treated as a crime in at least 20 countries, report finds

One in every 100 deaths is a suicide: campaigners say criminalisation deters people seeking the help they need

www.theguardian.com

Suicide Act 1961 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4462779/

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0160252715001429

True. Why are people allowed to bring new life here without any restrictions, but those who don't want to exist aren't allowed to die? Dying is made risky and difficult; peaceful, guaranteed methods are intentionally restricted. Why? No one chose to be born, so we should all have the right to die. I've never understood this. The only reason I can think of is that society needs us alive to be slaves to the system. @DarkRange55 @Pluto @SexyIncél Any thoughts or ideas on this strange dichotomy?

@sserafim

 

[DarkRange55]

True. Why are people allowed to bring new life here without any restrictions, but those who don't want to exist aren't allowed to die? Dying is made risky and difficult; peaceful, guaranteed methods are intentionally restricted. Why? No one chose to be born, so we should all have the right to die. I've never understood this. The only reason I can think of is that society needs us alive to be slaves to the system. @DarkRange55 @Pluto @SexyIncél Any thoughts or ideas on this strange dichotomy?

I mean there is inheritance ("death") tax and stuff. Plus if you don't have any beneficiaries then the state can take your estate. Social security and medicare benefits can stop but sometimes the window/widower can continue receiving social security.
My hunch is it's really more about cultural, ethical and religious views. I honestly haven't looked into this topic very much though.

 

[sserafim]

I mean there is inheritance ("death") tax and stuff. Plus if you don't have any beneficiaries then the state can take your estate. Social security and medicare benefits can stop but sometimes the window/widower can continue receiving social security.
My hunch is it's really more about cultural, ethical and religious views. I honestly haven't looked into this topic very much though.

Why do you think that religion is such a big part of society?

 

[malevolentdiety]

Most people aren't depressed, anxious, and suicidal so they have relationships and normal lives and procreate and happily live their stupid lives. I think procreation is the most immoral thing a human can do.

 

[sserafim]

I think procreation is the most immoral thing a human can do.

Literally. I also believe that procreation is the most immoral thing a human can do. It's selfish. The thing I hate the most about it is that the person being born can't consent to it, they're brought into this life of wageslavery without their input or choice.

 

[Labyrinth]

I understand everything you said. Only those affected by pain will feel the weight of your words. But I can't say it's "completely" correct.

 

[DreamEnd]

This is such a broad simplistic statement. I understand you are in pain. But all human life is bad is such a generalisation it isn't even worth considering seriously. Having children isn't immoral or selfish provided you are a good parent and can provide for them.

 

[sserafim]

This is such a broad simplistic statement. I understand you are in pain. But all human life is bad is such a generalisation it isn't even worth considering seriously. Having children isn't immoral or selfish provided you are a good parent and can provide for them.

There's no reason to have children that isn't selfish. It's about the parents' desires, never the child's well-being. Some parents even have children as retirement plans and trophies to show off

 

[malevolentdiety]

There's no reason to have children that isn't selfish lol. It's about the parents' desires, never the child's well-being. Some parents even have children as retirement plans and trophies to show off

There is a branch of philosophy that argues this it is called anti-natalism

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I agree. Humans truly are so awful. We aren't really as good as people act like we are. We really are just a bunch of primitive apes in the end who act like we are the most superior species ever, so much so to where people believe that an almighty god cares about humans so much to where they would bother with their time making arbitrary rules for humanity

 

[sserafim]

There is a branch of philosophy that argues this it is called anti-natalism

I know lol, I am one

 

[betternever2havbeen]

Literally. I also believe that procreation is the most immoral thing a human can do. It's selfish. The thing I hate the most about it is that the person being born can't consent to it, they're brought into this life of wageslavery without their input or choice.

Parents put little thought into bringing new life here and society supports that. You want a pet and people will grill you about if you can afford it and if you've thought through every single scenario because if you don't you shouldn't get a pet and you'd be a bad owner. You want a kid however all the responses will be "go for it, you won't regret it, there's never a good time to have a baby, if we thought it through no one would ever have kids (like that's a bad thing!) and you'll figure it out when the babies here and manage" it just boggles my mind how parents can treat the literal creation of human life like this and be supported for it.

 

[sserafim]

Parents put little thought into bringing new life here and society supports that. You want a pet and people will grill you about if you can afford it and if you've thought through every single scenario because if you don't you shouldn't get a pet and you'd be a bad owner. You want a kid however all the responses will be "go for it, you won't regret it, there's never a good time to have a baby, if we thought it through no one would ever have kids (like that's a bad thing!) and you'll figure it out when the babies here and manage" it just boggles my mind how parents can treat the literal creation of human life like this and be supported for it.

This always seemed so strange to me. Why do you think this is?

 

[LevUwU]

Pretty bleak outlook, like yeah life and humans suck but it's not ALL bad

 

[davidtorez]

I know lol, I am one

I am also an antinatalist. I think it's already been mentioned here but religious, societal and being a slave to authorities for tax purposes have all made it taboo/ hard to end ones life. It's absurd really. To me the biggest reason it is immoral to procreate besides bringing new life into this world who will definitely suffer for our own selfish entertainment and happiness , is the fact one can always adopt a child . When someone says I want MY own child (to pass on genes, see what their child will look like etc) when there are other countless mouths to feed in orphanages, this is the epitome of selfishness in my view.

 

[DEATH IS FREEDOM]

Humans will go extinct but the process will take time. An industrial civilization is time limited and can´t live forever. All civilizations will be destroyed. In a few hundreds of years, our civilization will collapse due to overpopulation and pollution.

 

[betternever2havbeen]

This always seemed so strange to me. Why do you think this is?

Probably because there really is no good reason to create new life and once you've done it you can't undo it so society is just like "ok well the kids are here now so we just have to support the parents as best we can else the children will suffer" and obviously everyone wants what's best for the kids. I think a lot of people see kids as a necessity whereas pets are not (tho I know which one I'd rather have) and a human "right" and 8 billion people later here we all are...

 

[sserafim]

Probably because there really is no good reason to create new life and once you've done it you can't undo it so society is just like "ok well the kids are here now so we just have to support the parents as best we can else the children will suffer" and obviously everyone wants what's best for the kids. I think a lot of people see kids as a necessity whereas pets are not (tho I know which one I'd rather have) and a human "right" and 8 billion people later here we all are...

Why do they see kids as a necessity?

 

[theboy]

so dark

 

[betternever2havbeen]

Why do they see kids as a necessity?

Beats me! Maybe because it's instant "purpose"-if you're a bit lost in life and lacking meaning, pop out a kid and society tells you you've just done something incredibly meaningful without really having to do anything

 

[malevolentdiety]

Humans will go extinct but the process will take time. An industrial civilization is time limited and can´t live forever. All civilizations will be destroyed. In a few hundreds of years, our civilization will collapse due to overpopulation and pollution.

I heard it will be all renewable energy as in wind and sun in ten years. The future is actually going to be awesome for humans. If there was ever a time to be alive in human history this is it. Because it will be a combination of quantum computers and ai.

I'm still a suicidal loser so it doesn't change anything for me but I just thought I'd mentioned that.

 

[davidtorez]

Why do they see kids as a necessity?

Evolution. Keep the species going. Pointless really

 

[sserafim]

I heard it will be all renewable energy as in wind and sun in ten years. The future is actually going to be awesome for humans. If there was ever a time to be alive in human history this is it. Because it will be a combination of quantum computers and ai.

I'm still a suicidal loser so it doesn't change anything for me but I just thought I'd mentioned that.

Should I stay alive for the future? I'm interested in how AI will impact society and the world

 

[LastFlowers]

This is such a broad simplistic statement. I understand you are in pain. But all human life is bad is such a generalisation it isn't even worth considering seriously. Having children isn't immoral or selfish provided you are a good parent and can provide for them.

How do you define a "good parent"?
Because I've seen the bar many parents set for themselves and it's shockingly low to the ground.

Provide what exactly?
Food and shelter for a time?
A guaranteed avenue to happiness?
(Surely not the latter..)

It's still rolling the dice on a human life, no matter how a parent compensates after the fact..if they even bother.
(Until inevitable abandonment follows.)
Then you've got a million ways to Sunday..to suffer, if life deals you a shitty hand.
What is the mere act of decent parenting going to do then?

Some generalizations are appropriate when what's being asserted is generally true..
Can we really deny that life itself gives birth to suffering?
Can we, in good faith, claim that humanity isn't uniquely adept at creating novel, cruel and unusual ways to suffer..not just for ourselves and one another, but for other life on the planet, all whilst we 'know better'…?

Nature overall is unforgiving but humans are a particularly nasty scourge.
Some individual ones more than others, but still..

 

[DarkRange55]

Why do you think that religion is such a big part of society?

Sociologists, psychologists and anthropologists have been studying that for so long but I would say it's multi-variant.

1. Cultural Identity: Religion often forms the foundation of cultural identity for many communities, providing a sense of belonging and shared values.
2. Morality and Ethics: It provides moral and ethical frameworks that guide individuals' behavior and interactions within society.
3. Community and Support: Religious communities offer social support networks, fostering relationships and providing assistance during times of need. Religion gatherings act as a facet of community.
4. Meaning and Purpose: Religion addresses existential questions about life, death, and the purpose of existence, offering answers and comfort to believers.
5. Tradition and Ritual: Religious rituals and traditions are deeply ingrained in societal customs, shaping rituals around birth, marriage, and death.
6. Power and Influence: Throughout history, religious institutions have often held significant power and influence over politics, governance, and social structures.
7. Explanation: I like the fast-food theology analogy. It's easier and more convenient to go to church and hear some stuff about Jesus or go to a temple and hear some stuff about reincarnation then it is to read a textbook on cognitive neuroscience or evolutionary biology. People don't like not knowing sometimes.
8. Fear/Comfort: I'm sure fear also plays a factor. Especially fear of death and the unknown. As I've said before, religion and conspiracy theories are attractive to people because it makes this random, chaotic, cold universe seem in control. Whether it's illuminati or God. Everything is planned and controlled. Remember the paraphrasing of Freud I told you about? Is a god just an existential manifestation of our collective cultural yearning for a sense of parental power over a chaotic universe?
Plus not going to hell, not being a bad person, speaking validation and forgiveness.

I'm sure there are other factors but thats just off the top of my head.

Should I stay alive for the future? I'm interested in how AI will impact society and the world

Warning controversial statement, just MY opinion for MYSELF: I think one of the saddest things about dying is really just not seeing where humanity progresses to. My great-grandmother was born at the right time that she experienced men riding horses to literally landing on the goddamn moon. In less than 80 years. She witnessed the invention of the automobile, the Great Depression, Spanish Flu, World War I & II, cell phones, the splitting of the atom and the advent of nuclear weapons, the curing of polio, the creation and rise of the internet, the moon landing, the Civil Rights movement — when she was born, she met Civil War veterans. Thats ONE human lifetime. Even if you think it's all bullshit and meaningless and we're all going to hell anyone… you can just bat an eye at that and say, how boring, pff who cares? I think that is INCREDIBLE. Wouldn't you want to see what happens next? Again, this is just my personal opinion.

 

[sserafim]

8. Fear/Comfort: I'm sure fear also plays a factor. Especially fear of death and the unknown. As I've said before, religion and conspiracy theories are attractive to people because it makes this random, chaotic, cold universe seem in control. Whether it's illuminati or God. Everything is planned and controlled. Remember the paraphrasing of Freud I told you about? Is a god just an existential manifestation of our collective cultural yearning for a sense of parental power over a chaotic universe?

Personally, I think that God was created by humanity to explain what they couldn't at the time. They would just call it divine power and will. Nietzsche said that God is dead and we killed him. I think that this has to do with the collective unconscious becoming less religious over time.

The universe is so chaotic, and people want to believe that it was specially designed and that we were all brought here with a purpose. The strange thing is that physicists seem to believe in God though, the more they research the mysteries of the universe, the more they believe in the divine. Why is this the case?

 

[DarkRange55]

Personally, I think that God was created by humanity to explain what they couldn't at the time. They would just call it divine power and will. Nietzsche said that God is dead and we killed him.

Nietzsche's prediction was wrong in that religion didn't end yet.
I like Eric Weinstein's quote, "We are now gods but for the wisdom." We have split the atom and manipulated the cell.

Personally, I think that God was created by humanity to explain what they couldn't at the time. They would just call it divine power and will. Nietzsche said that God is dead and we killed him. I think that this has to do with the collective unconscious being less religious over the times.

The universe is so chaotic, and people want to believe that it was specially designed and that we were all brought here with a purpose. The strange thing is that physicists seem to believe in God though, as they research the mysteries of the universe, the more they believe in the divine.

The strange thing is that physicists seem to believe in God though, as they research the mysteries of the universe, the more they believe in the divine.
I need more context…

 

[sserafim]

Nietzsche's prediction was wrong in that religion didn't end yet.
I like Eric Weinstein's quote, "We are now gods but for the wisdom." We have split the atom and manipulated the cell.

The strange thing is that physicists seem to believe in God though, as they research the mysteries of the universe, the more they believe in the divine.
I need more context…

"The first gulp from the glass of natural sciences will turn you into an atheist, but at the bottom of the glass God is waiting for you."
~ Werner Heisenberg

"The more I learn of physics, the more i am drawn to metaphysics."
~ Albert Einstein

"Our separation from each other is an optical illusion."
~ Albert Einstein

"One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike. We still do not know one thousandth of one percent of what nature has revealed to us. It is entirely possible that behind the perception of our senses, worlds are hidden of which we are unaware."
~ Albert Einstein

"The ancients knew something, which we seem to have forgotten."
~ Albert Einstein

"I am not an Atheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds…

We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books…

The common idea that I am an atheist is based on a big mistake. Anyone who interprets my scientific theories this way, did not understand them…

Everything is determined, for the insect, as well as for the star. Human beings, vegetables, or cosmic dust, we all dance to a mysterious tune, intoned in the distance by an invisible piper. The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion."
~ Albert Einstein

"Energy cannot be created or destroyed; it can only be changed from one form to another."
~ Albert Einstein

"The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion that stands at the cradle of true art and true science. Whoever does not know it and can no longer wonder, no longer marvel, is as good as dead, and their eyes are dimmed. Few are those who see with their own eyes and feel with their own hearts."
~ Albert Einstein

"I believe in intuitions and inspirations. I sometimes feel that I am right. I do not know that I am."
~ Albert Einstein

"We cannot solve our problems with the same thinking we used when we created them."
~ Albert Einstein

"Religion and science go together. As l've said before, science without religion is lame and religion without science is blind, they are interdependent and have a common goal: the search for truth."
~ Albert Einstein

"All religions Arts and Sciences are branches of the same tree."
~ Albert Einstein

"Everyone who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that some spirit is manifest in the laws of the universe, one that is vastly superior to that of humans. In this way the pursuit of science leads to a religious feeling of a special sort."
~ Albert Einstein

"Study and, in general, the pursuit of Truth and beauty is a sphere of activity in which we are permitted to remain children all our lives."
~ Albert Einstein