Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[pipapo]

It would be better to use the regulator with the gas that it is designed/calibrated to work with, that's for sure.

You guys like to do weird combinations.

I think you're totally right, would def. be better to use the designated gas.

However I did research on the serious seller website and it is stated that the regulator works fine for any inert gas (mixes).
Helium is specifically mentioned to be compatible.

Leaves me a bit unsure still tbh.

 

[Wunderkind]

I think you're totally right, would def. be better to use the designated gas.

However I did research on the serious seller website and it is stated that the regulator works fine for any inert gas (mixes).
Helium is specifically mentioned to be compatible.

Leaves me a bit unsure still tbh.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/exit-bag-and-inert-gas-megathread.8393/post-1810734

This has already been discussed. The consumption of inert gas cannot be the same due to the different molecular composition of each gas.

 

[Wunderkind]

Hello everyone again. As I wrote earlier, thanks to you, I was able to assemble SCBA and that's it required for method N2. I did not have a large budget, so all the components diligently searched on Ebay (you can use any site with ads). It was difficult, but the result exceeded all my expectations. I was able to find a seller who sold me fully serviceable Drager (Dräger) kit which is fully assembled by the factory. My kit turns on the reducer (breathing apparatus, I don't know how it's called correctly, on the pulmonary machine it supplies a pressure of 7.5 bar), a lung machine with positive pressure (this important, Drager with a blue button works on negative pressure), a pressure gauge with warning whistle that goes off at 50 bars. The Drager mask is new. Want pay attention, I was surprised at how comfortable it sits on the face. The mask is very comfortable. Tank 5 liters 150 bar, which is more than enough for this implementation. Adapter G 5/8 (mom) for my tank (it was also not easy to find). The cost of all my accessories does not exceed $250. I have almost all the components, except for the G 5/8 adapter and masks are not new, but in good condition and, what is important, from reliable and high-quality manufacturers.
Tank 5 liter 150 bar 50$ + nitrogen filling 10$
New mask 80$ (I also bought on Ebay probably cheaper than from the official representative)
Drager reducer, pressure gauge, lung machine 100$
Adapter from G 5/8 Drager to my tank $10

The length of the hose from the lung machine to the reducer is approximately 1.5 meters.

The main thing is to choose the kit that maintains positive pressure in mask is very important. With a negative breath, it is harder to do.
Sorry for my English, I use google translate.
@GasMonkey special thanks to you for your help! Thank you for pointing me in the right direction.

Spoiler: Photo

View attachment 102428
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View attachment 102431

A small tweak to the Dräger Panorama Nova mask in my setup.
I had a problem (subjective, personal) with heavy exhalation.
It turned out that the exhalation valve spring can be easily adjusted. In which case it will not be difficult to return everything back.
All you need to do is remove the mesh cover and you will have access to the spring.
Just make a couple of turns around the plastic ring.

 

[pipapo]

I found the information that only "double-stage" regulators can really ensure that the flow is held constant given the changing pressure/volume of the cylinder.

Is this true?

Why then, most here use "single-stage" regulators?

How big can the deviation from the set flow be? Is it even relevant?

 

[steve_s5]

A small tweak to the Dräger Panorama Nova mask in my setup.
I had a problem (subjective, personal) with heavy exhalation.
It turned out that the exhalation valve spring can be easily adjusted. In which case it will not be difficult to return everything back.
All you need to do is remove the mesh cover and you will have access to the spring.
Just make a couple of turns around the plastic ring.
View attachment 102614View attachment 102615View attachment 102616

@Wunderkind I have the same Mask, but i need a Regulator + Valve. Could you send me your setup?

 

[CerberusReapers]

It looks amazing!!! Well done!

Hey everyone, I'm looking for some clarification on what WunderKind said about their chosen ctb method. As far as I understand it through my own research and notes made from the previous post, I require the following equipment:
1). An 8-litre tank of nitrogen gas (100% / 150 bar).
2). A nitrogen pressure regulator (compatible with 150 bar). (Object description ↓)
> 30L/min.
> Outlet: 0.5 - 10 bar.
> Threaded nut on outlet: G 1/4.
> Inlet thread: W24, 32x1 / 14.
3). A Draeger EEBD hood.
Can you confirm if I am missing anything? Is there anything else I will need to commit to this method? Do I need an adaptor of sorts to connect the EEBD hood to the N2 tank? What is the appropriate amount of Nitrogen that assures a successful ctb?

↓ Below is the N2 tank I'm looking at, however, I am not sure how I would connect the EEBD hood hose to this. ↓

 

[Wunderkind]

Hey everyone, I'm looking for some clarification on what WunderKind said about their chosen ctb method. As far as I understand it through my own research and notes made from the previous post, I require the following equipment:
1). An 8-litre tank of nitrogen gas (100% / 150 bar).
2). A nitrogen pressure regulator (compatible with 150 bar). (Object description ↓)
> 30L/min.
> Outlet: 0.5 - 10 bar.
> Threaded nut on outlet: G 1/4.
> Inlet thread: W24, 32x1 / 14.
3). A Draeger EEBD hood.
Can you confirm if I am missing anything? Is there anything else I will need to commit to this method? Do I need an adaptor of sorts to connect the EEBD hood to the N2 tank? What is the appropriate amount of Nitrogen that assures a successful ctb?

↓ Below is the N2 tank I'm looking at, however, I am not sure how I would connect the EEBD hood hose to this. ↓
View attachment 102696

Do you already have something in stock? Have you purchased any accessories?
8 liters 150 bar in theory will be enough in any implementation, be it EEBD, Exit Bag, SCBA

 

[CerberusReapers]

Do you already have something in stock? Have you purchased any accessories?
8 liters 150 bar in theory will be enough in any implementation, be it EEBD, Exit Bag, SCBA

I haven't bought anything yet, just trying to make sure I have the right tools in my kit first. Plus I need to earn the money first. How are you doing WunderKind? Did you make your attempt yet?

 

[GasMonkey]

1). An 8-litre tank of nitrogen gas (100% / 150 bar).

You goal is to get a 200 bar cylinder between 5 and 10 Liters. If you only have access to a 150 bar one then it's ok, but your priority must be a 200 bar one.

what WunderKind said about their chosen ctb method
3). A Draeger EEBD hood.

I think you are confusing concepts, WunderKind's setup is SCBA, not EEBD hood.

 

[CerberusReapers]

You goal is to get a 200 bar cylinder between 5 and 10 Liters. If you only have access to a 150 bar one then it's ok, but your priority must be a 200 bar one.


I think you are confusing concepts, WunderKind's setup is SCBA, not EEBD hood.

Ah, do you have any other advice for my chosen concept in that case?

 

[GasMonkey]

If your method is EEBD hood, it depends on the connector on the hose of that EEBD hood.

 

[Wunderkind]

Ah, do you have any other advice for my chosen concept in that case?

I started by buying a tank of nitrogen, filling it up, filling a big bag with nitrogen, and trying to inhale the nitrogen to get a feel for what it was like.
So I realized whether this method suits me or not and proceeded to purchase related components.

 

[pipapo]

I found the information that only "double-stage" regulators can really ensure that the flow is held constant given the changing pressure/volume of the cylinder.

Is this true?

Why then, most here use "single-stage" regulators?

How big can the deviation from the set flow be? Is it even relevant?

Someone has info?
Thanks so much.

 

[CerberusReapers]

I started by buying a tank of nitrogen, filling it up, filling a big bag with nitrogen, and trying to inhale the nitrogen to get a feel for what it was like.
So I realized whether this method suits me or not and proceeded to purchase related components.

I understand. I am certain this method is for me since I've been searching for the most suitable ctb method for years now. I just need to confirm all the correct components so I can purchase everything and proceed.

 

[Wunderkind]

An interesting observation. Physics of elementary grades. A tank temperature difference of ~30 degrees will add or subtract 25% of your tank's capacity. And if write more correctly, the volume of your gas will be more or less.

 

[pipapo]

I found the information that only "double-stage" regulators can really ensure that the flow is held constant given the changing pressure/volume of the cylinder.

Is this true?

Why then, most here use "single-stage" regulators?

How big can the deviation from the set flow be? Is it even relevant?

The primary pressure dependency for single-stage cylinder pressure regulators is *approx. 1.5%*, so that the bottle has to be readjusted from time to time when it is emptied. Bottle connection on the left.

Two-stage cylinder pressure regulators only have a *dependence on the admission pressure of 0.05%*, so that readjustment in the event of fluctuations in the admission pressure (emptying the cylinder with compressed gases) is not necessary.

I searched that by myself.
Can someone confirm ?

 

[henikova]

How does one prevent an exit bag bursting due to the growing pressure (continuous flow of gas)? Isn't an exit bag just a plastic bag sealed tightly around the neck?

 

[GasMonkey]

The bag must never be sealed around the neck, a gap is needed for CO₂ purging.

 

[henikova]

What volume of pure inert gas does one need to avoid the problem of CO2 accumulation? You know what I mean. In a sealed room filled with pure inert gas one would not have enough time to exhale enough CO2 to trigger survival instinct. Likely less than a room would be enough. How about 200 liters? 500 liters? Is it enough to sit in a 2m3 (2000 liters) space filled with pure inert gas?

 

[GasMonkey]

Filling spaces is unviable, you need too much gas volume and output rate.
The proved methods are SCBA, SCUBA, Hood and ExitBag; the rest is dangerous guesswork.

 

[GasMonkey]

I just need to confirm all the correct components so I can purchase everything and proceed.

For the hood method, you need a cylinder, regulator, hose and hood. The tricky part is the connection of the hose to the regulator, which depends on what hose your hood has.

Or you can just buy the EEBD hood kit from the Canadian source ready to use.

 

[pipapo]

The primary pressure dependency for single-stage cylinder pressure regulators is *approx. 1.5%*, so that the bottle has to be readjusted from time to time when it is emptied. Bottle connection on the left.

Two-stage cylinder pressure regulators only have a *dependence on the admission pressure of 0.05%*, so that readjustment in the event of fluctuations in the admission pressure (emptying the cylinder with compressed gases) is not necessary.

I searched that by myself.
Can someone confirm ?

Can someone confirm?
Maybe one of the experts? @GasMonkey

Thanks so much!

 

[Lostinspace]

Is there a good EB tutorial? I'm having a hard time getting behind the individual steps (especially what hose/connecting the hose) without pictures

 

[softline]

I found this item at my local welding supply shop.

It seems too take most of the work and guess work out exit bag construction.
The item is generally available on places like Amazon. Sometimes it comes in at kit that pretty much has everything (hoses, connectors,etc.) but the gas. Seems simple to operate: Connect the gas, put on the hood, turn on the gas, your done.

The official name of this if your searching for info is "Continuous Flow Supplied Air Respirator".

Interested in opinions of others

 

[GasMonkey]

Can someone confirm?
Maybe one of the experts? @GasMonkey

CTBing with inert gas is too fast for that small variations to matter, it's only a few minutes for the bus to arrive to its destination.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/attachments/welding-hood-png.102976/

Perfectly viable if you manage to connect it to a N₂ flow regulator. You can even use the same flow rate as the air pump designed to work with the hood.

Is there a good EB tutorial? I'm having a hard time getting behind the individual steps (especially what hose/connecting the hose) without pictures

Do you mean the Hood? I have only seen 2 implementations: the one in the PPeH and the Canadian source.

 

[Emmanuel108]

Hello guys,

I have tried this method to ctb but it didn't work. I waited for 3 minutes and I didn't even pass out. Can somebody tell me what I'm doing wrong. Thank you

 

[LifeIsAChore11]

I found this item at my local welding supply shop.
View attachment 102976
It seems too take most of the work and guess work out exit bag construction.
The item is generally available on places like Amazon. Sometimes it comes in at kit that pretty much has everything (hoses, connectors,etc.) but the gas. Seems simple to operate: Connect the gas, put on the hood, turn on the gas, your done.

The official name of this if your searching for info is "Continuous Flow Supplied Air Respirator".

Interested in opinions of others

What is the purpose of this hood? To keep out fumes? Do the welders hook up oxygen to it while working?

Hello guys,

I have tried this method to ctb but it didn't work. I waited for 3 minutes and I didn't even pass out. Can somebody tell me what I'm doing wrong. Thank you

This kind of feedback is why I haven't even attempted this method. I've heard more problems than successes. Everyone must be setting stuff up with leaks, or else it would be more commonplace like the SN has been.

 

[Emmanuel108]

There were no leaks. I checked with soppy water. It didn't hurt I just didn't pass out

 

[LifeIsAChore11]

There were no leaks. I checked with soppy water. It didn't hurt I just didn't pass out

The f*ckers at the gas store must not be doing it right then. Either that or faulty regulator.

 

[Emmanuel108]

Maybe it's the gas.I don't know if there is a test for nitrogen. My regulator seems fine though I got it for 300 pound brand new.