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Does this forum benefit you in some way?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 781 96.2%
  • No.

    Votes: 31 3.8%

  • Total voters
    812
RainAndSadness

RainAndSadness

Administrator
Jun 12, 2018
2,075
The idea that this site could benefit people or the idea it could harm people are not mutually exclusive concepts. This simple distinction should be obvious. Denial of this fact seems at best uncritcal and at worst disingenuous.

I think this unnuanced poll being so laughably one sided undermines any point trying to be made here. It is not suprising people on the outside don't take this place seriously. I'm not saying it's fair, but definitely not suprising. Saying there is no potential benefit to this forum is as untrue as saying there is no potential harm.

You should read my opening post again before you post anything, tbh. This thread is a response to someone saying that this forum doesn't benefit anyone, which is very obviously a demonstrably false statement and since the media doesn't do it's job and fact-check these claims because claims like these fit perfectly into the narrative that this is a useless, horrible and toxic forum, I took it upon me to do the job for the media, to prove this forum does actually benefit people. It's not the poll that's bad faith, it's the people portraying this forum in a very one-sided manner, like even if you disagree with this forum on principle, there is no reason to pretend that there aren't people out there - and according to this poll it's a vast majority of members - who appreciate this forum. And look, I even made the poll anonymous to encourage no-votes, okay. So don't come at me with "uncritical and at worst distingenous" because that's your post. You didn't even understand why I made this thread but thanks for spouting your ignorant opinion here, great. But hey, since you're so smart, maybe you tell me how I'm supposed to counter obviously false claims in these articles if not with a poll. Educate me, odradek. Tell me how I'm supposed to debunk these bad-faith arguments.

If the media did their job, I wouldn't have to run these polls myself. And it's funny because these journalists have accounts here. I know it, okay. And the problem is, they're not using these accounts to try to understand why this forum exists and why there is a demand for a place like this one. And that's a problem.
 
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odradek

odradek

Mage
Sep 16, 2021
548
You should read my opening post again before you post anything, tbh. This thread is a response to someone saying that this forum doesn't benefit anyone, which is very obviously a demonstrably false statement and since the media doesn't do it's job and fact-check these claims because claims like these fit perfectly into the narrative that this is a useless, horrible and toxic forum, I took it upon me to do the job for the media, to prove this forum does actually benefit people. It's not the poll that's bad faith, it's the people portraying this forum in a very one-sided manner, like even if you disagree with this forum on principle, there is no reason to pretend that there aren't people out there - and according to this poll it's a vast majority of members - who appreciate this forum. And look, I even made the poll anonymous to encourage no-votes, okay. So don't come at me with "uncritical and at worst distingenous" because that's your post. You didn't even understand why I made this thread but thanks for spouting your ignorant opinion here, great. But hey, since you're so smart, maybe you tell me how I'm supposed to counter obviously false claims in these articles if not with a poll. Educate me, odradek. Tell me how I'm supposed to debunk these bad-faith arguments.

If the media did their job, I wouldn't have to run these polls myself. And it's funny because these journalists have accounts here. I know it, okay. And the problem is, they're not using these accounts to try to understand why this forum exists and why there is a demand for a place like this one. And that's a problem.

I felt the poll was too binary and it undermined what I thought was the purpose of this thread: to contrast the benefits of the forum against the bleak mental health reality paired with uncaring governments and media. Our late stage capitalist reality. I misunderstood this thread.

The purpose of the poll and thread was actually to debunk this medical official and counter with the benefits of the forum because of the media attention. I didn't mean to come off like I was attacking this site or its community and totally miss the point. But I did, and that's my fault, I'll admit it. I'm sorry. I used aggressive language and unempathetically communicated my wrong point also.

I'd like to think I'm a part of this community. I don't know where the constructive discussion can be had here tbh. That's a failing on me. I just get frustrated at how black and white discussion can be at times here and I guess I don't help on that front much either.

I feel like trying to debunk our most bad faith or ignorant critics undermines our argument and makes us look more extreme than we are. Maybe I'm wrong about that, I definitely haven't thought about it enough, so maybe I should do that. This wasn't the place for this opinion, I see that now.

We have the better argument, I agree. There's a lot of nuance in that opinion for me, which includes criticisms. I guess I don't know how to properly express this yet. I don't know, I'm not trying to be an activist or anything so my opinion should be taken with a massive grave of salt. I have been uncritical. I'll think more, talk less.
 
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Valky

Valky

Petulant Child
Apr 4, 2023
1,302
It really helps knowing that I am not alone with my problems and that others feel the same. As someone always trying to 'fix' people/situations (due to family background) it is very uplifting being able to do so and getting the feeling of bringing others comfort and a clearer point of view on their situations.
The site also is some kind of safety net for me, knowing that I can still always come back and vent, without being judged, if I need to. :)
 
C

Catcrazygirl

Want the calm
Jan 31, 2024
12
Hi everyone. Just out of curiousity, a while ago there was a report about this forum where the CEO of the Canadian Mental Health Association said that "[...]there is no value to this site, it doesn't benefit anyone - in fact it does quite the opposite[...]", defending the position that this forum shouldn't exist and it made me curious, is that true? Like, that person is obviously talking down to us, over us, pretending they know what we want, when they claim this forum doesn't benefit anyone despite there being clearly a demand for website like this one, right. And it seems to me people are making an account and participating here voluntarily, so I'd assume there must be some value to this website for the people who are using it. It's also important to fact-check these claims given this person seems to speak for the CMHA and it would be interesting to know if these people even remotely understand what goes on in the minds of suicidal people, if they understand what our needs and desires are and how we want society to treat us.

It seems to me these people think want to be treated like children and have other people decide what we're allowed to see and research online and what decisions we're allowed to make while I do think that people who use this forum want some degree of autonomy and a right to make their decisions regarding their own welfare and decide for themselves how they want to live this life and when they want to leave. That's how I want society to treat me, I found this forum in 2018 when I was in need for information to make my own decisions and a supportive community and I didn't agree with these experts that other people should have a right to tell me, as an autonomous adult, what I'm supposed to see online and which decisions I make for my own life, concerning my own welfare, are valid and appropiate and which aren't. I think these are deeply personal decisions and essentially nobody's business but mine. And I have a feeling that's echoed by a majority of people in this community.

So let's solve this dilemma. What do you think? I'd be curious to hear your opinion, feel free to explain your position in the comments below.
Yes it definitely does help! I understand for some it can bring up mixed thoughts and emotions - but ig that's a natural part of life.

This site is a symbol of unfiltered self expression and compassion for those who the world has treated so incredibly badly. I have found the people in here are pleading for autonomy and anything better than the pain that their lives entail.

For me, a big issue I have in life is organising my thoughts, yet on this site I truly feel free to say as I wish, without big prefaces and explanations, people just "get it". I can talk openly, ask questions and help others directly, without societal veils and etiquettes.
 
S

scottyy

Member
Feb 17, 2024
48
It's hypocritical for the Canadian government to criticize this website after all the hysteria the news created about the government considering allowing the mentally ill access to maid.
 
thereisthemist

thereisthemist

drops common loot when defeated
Nov 5, 2021
155
Mirror question:
Does the Internet / uncensored information / real-time communication benefit you in any way?
 
S

skittkles.s

Member
Feb 19, 2024
8
Yes, it does, often the methods listed on this website helps me with my current education, and this site is also helpful for me to find a sort of comfort.
 
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사람이 없어

사람이 없어

그냥 재미없는 사람인데
Oct 11, 2020
7
I value free freaking speech and being able to talk about what you want, not censoring everything behind some "safety wall".
It's nice to see you're not alone, or see the available options out there, knowing there's a way out without suffering for decades on end, hopefully at least.
 
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terra.nuvo

terra.nuvo

Member
Feb 15, 2024
61
I feel like this site comforts me and in a way offers me hope that i can control my own fate. I find reading through the forums helps me stay calm and feel reassured. Reading so many posts of people who feel similarly to me has honestly been so freeing because it made me realize that i'm not completely alone and that there are people out there who understand what i'm going through.
 
D

Duality

Harmony in Duality
May 27, 2023
164
Yes it absolutely benefits me and many others. It is truly the only safe space where people can freely talk about their suicidal thoughts without blowback. It's not only for discussing methods either - in my opinion, the most important thing about this forum is that it brings comfort and, as counterintuitive as it sounds, it does make people delay their suicide or abandon it altogether. For those that are determined and ready, the forum has a lot of good research on methods that will hopefully bring about a peaceful death.

Personally I've decided to live a bit longer and enjoy life knowing that I can choose to die at any time, using a specific method.
 
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Blurry_Buildings

Blurry_Buildings

Just Existing
Sep 27, 2023
280
The site in certain ways can act like a non- judgemental support group.

Around my area every support group I could find after looking for hours online caters to very specific demographics, none of which I qualified as. There are many support groups for teens, many for very specific disabilties, many for very particular ethnic groups, a lot for middle aged women, a ton for retirees, but none for young adults in my demographic.

I understand why irl support groups get extremely specific with their membership requirements and the benefits it can bring when people in the group can relate to each other with common struggles, but if there's no group that wants you, it doesn't leave a whole lot of options in real life.

Similarly as other people/ organizations have talked about, there is no real "third place" in towns and cities anymore that people can go to alone outside of work and home to meet people, which the very oldest people alive today apparently once had. If are going someplace, you need to have people already going with you if you expect to have anyone to talk to. If you don't have anyone readily available nearby and/or are flat broke, you are stuck alone.

Most members of the government buerocracy (or the large government contractors) similar to this person here say nice things and probably have nice intentions but run into politics and ultimately get nothing done. There is no sense of community for people who struggle with long term depression or suicidality and in the void Sanctioned Suicide has risen to fulfill the need. Moral grandstanding about a makeshift community that isn't made in this official's ideal image (like what we are seeing here) is great but the inaction of the government and the wider society as a whole on the underlying cause(s) speaks louder.

The government and society at large can't solve every problem, and there is a seperate debate about the role of government in anything or everything. I don't want to claim to know the perfect solution either when I am the splitting image of a failure. That being said, it is hard for me, and I'm sure many other nihilistic people here, to care.

If you care, maybe do something about the causes instead of attempting to conceal the unpleasant reality.

None of us got here out of nowhere.
 
Skallagrim

Skallagrim

Member
Apr 14, 2022
11
Yes. This place benefits me.

1. I have a lot of pain, a lot of regret, a lot of thoughts about how I shouldn't even be present in this world. Everywhere else I go, whether online or offline, I kind of feel I shouldn't be there. Like I'm a complete waste of time and energy and other's should spend it on me. I'm always an outsider. This place, alone in all the world, is somewhere I don't feel out of place and apologetic about being part of.

2. I'm safe from toxic positivity here. There is nothing, nothing at all, that makes me want to hurt myself more than total strangers pretending to care with platitudinous tripe like "You are valued" and "You are cared about" when I know they'll forget I even exist 10 seconds after turning the next page.

3. I can express pain here, really let it out, without fear that some well-meaning but completely ignorant busy-body will contact some authority or other and try to get ambulances to come cart me off against my wishes.
 
U

unfixable

Member
Oct 1, 2023
17
The CMHA is apparently unaware that the Canadian healthcare system is in a state of total meltdown, and believe that EVERYONE can be saved, if only "mental health", that same mental health mind you that wouldn't be and isn't accessible anyways not to mention it won't magically fix everyone's problems. Remember, you don't need a doctor, you don't need housing, you don't need to be able to afford food, you don't need to have enough health to be able to care for your basic needs, all you need is "mental health" and it will all be better, just like a warm cozy delusional dream. They are nothing more than that dog in the burning house "everything is fine" meme.

Reality exists, those suffering can't just ignore it like the outside delusional observers can. Silencing those who suffer doesn't make their pain go away, it doesn't make suicidal thoughts go away. This is the one of the last places on earth where you can speak your pain and not be censored. Everywhere else to completely utter such words is a thought crime and they direct you to your "mental health professionals" which is nothing more than a trip to a jail cell where you learn about your mistake of reaching out for help, and when you are fed up with enduring your punishment in the abysmal jail cell like conditions, you eventually break and you tell them what they want to hear even though its not the truth so that they can send you on your way. They get to tell the media that they "saved a life" and the suicidal person knows not to reach out and to deal with it themselves next time whether that involves death or not. Help doesn't exist, it is a myth, a lie and a delusion.
 
BlockHammer

BlockHammer

Confused loser
Oct 25, 2023
177
I cant say for anyone else but me personally, i do feel that this place had something to offer one of them is a place to share my thought about suicide and also sometimes we debated about a certain scenario or philosophy that's rare to encountered in any social media or forum.

Well i should said that this site isn't the only one who do this kind of thing, in fact there's another place where you can share ur thought about suicidal or ur stand about that topic, i know a subreddit who do this that subreddit in my experience were well organized, so you rarely gonna found any toxic people in there

But regardless of how non toxic that subreddit was, i can't say things that sounds pro suicide or even pro choice cause the nature of the sub
reddit it self was pro life. So even if u managed to construct a valid opinion about suicide, they still gonna denied that saying either you not working hard enough or theres still a lot of option, and that's just make the discussion exhausting cause we can't go to the point to understand each other

But in this website maybe because the nature of SaSu being a pro choice, we can have a healty discussion about choose to stal alive or leave it all behind, note that there's people that still agree with their original mindset but at least in here, they willing to admit that sometimes/most of the times, death is the solution unlike this subreddit i mention that's so pro-life to the point that they think if they agree with people like me, their worldview will change in a instance

Last thing about the media, i thing either they just wanna be seen as a hero so they demonized this website cause ironicly, being a "hero" will gave them a lot of profit. Or they just dont wanna be canceled by other media or society if they seems to support this website ideology

So this's my whole speech, in summary this website allowed me to rant and share my thought about sensitive topic etc without seeing someone else to be so defensive/combative, i hope this can help you get what you needed
 
T

TiredBuddhist

Member
Sep 3, 2021
12
CEO of the Canadian Mental Health Association said that "[...]there is no value to this site, it doesn't benefit anyone - in fact it does quite the opposite[...]", defending the position that this forum shouldn't exist and it made me curious, is that true?


Views like this one from the Canadian CEO tend to come from a few different perspectives,

1, Capitalist mentality and the desire to forever grow the economy and have workers/consumers to fuel that.

2, The belief that they know better than the individual in regards to what is good for the individual

3, That there is no rational reason to want to die.

4, Religious beliefs

5, Disrespect for individual autonomy and freedoms.

That's not an exhaustive list, but it does covers a broad spectrum of views.

They fail to account for the fact that many people are mentally sound and able to make rational decisions but still would prefer to choose their own fate and die at some point. For example, I have chronic kidney disease and cannot afford dialysis or a transplant. I definitely do intend to die by my own actions before my health reaches a point where I wish I could die. As such a "site like this" is a useful resource. I've asked questions around how to handle loved ones, researched methods etc. I'm also trans, which in and of itself is a reason to die in the transphobic society I live in....
 
4.I.2.Must.Die

4.I.2.Must.Die

Up with life I cannot put 🙅 ✋
Nov 8, 2023
1,741
Whoa!! 10 users at this time saying this site doesn't benefit them 🙄😱
I previously called them pro-lifers but I'm now thinking that this is actually the pro-extinction crew ( @FuneralCry and her followers basically). Duh 🤦 makes sense.
 
K

KitIsAHotMess

Member
Mar 14, 2023
5
For me it does. What a lot of people don't get is that sometimes we need to be able to talk about the stuff we go through without being told the usual "oh don't do it" bs. Yes, people who use this site have died, that's what happens when suicidal people are suicidal. This site isn't making anyone kill themselves, it's giving them a space where they won't be bombarded by worried family and friends, or have police knocking on their door, or get paramedics called on them. It lets us be open without being afraid, and for a lot of people, that's what they need. There are times where sites like this have actually helped save my life, not encourage me to end it
 
P

Peerless_Cucumber

The one and only king of cucumbers
Feb 22, 2023
113
I'm currently writing a thesis on one of Dazais Books in which he states that everyone should have the right to die. All the literature on the book is tainted by life loving prejudices. It's awful. There's not one thesis out there who didn't call him surviving a suicide attempt a fortune outcome.

People in my life are just like that. They don't get my point of view. It's awful being treated like a child just because you're suicidal. I have trauma from being locked up after an attempt. However people still believe that it was for the better because I'm still here. It's horrible. The only reason I haven't attempted to ctb again is because I'm deadly afraid of being locked in. Last time had I needed to stay even one day longer I'd have banged my head against the wall because I couldn't take it anymore.

I'm so glad this place exists. It's the only place where I can share my experience without being called a liar. People in the psychiatry didn't believe me when I told them I was scared. They screamed at me that I was lying because I wanted to get out so I can ctb when that was not the case. I was so afraid that I'd have tried to ctb because of the fear alone had they not let me go. The worst thing about it was that they told me I'd be locked up for at least two weeks the next time I failed an attempt. I didn't commit a crime. Why am I threatened to be locked up? This is so sick but no one in my life sees it that way which is even more fucked up.
 
Malaria

Malaria

If I can't be my own, I'd feel better dead
Feb 24, 2024
1,010
I learned about this website because of that Tantacrul video, and I can tell you genuinely that what he said about this website was very wrong. I have been lurking this website ever since that video. Sometimes this website is the only source of comfort I have, because I feel judged over my suicidal ideation by many people in my personal life. Either they say insensitive things, or they mean well but still don't "get it".

People who are suffering from suicidal ideation don't want to be judged or be given cliche platitudes or be made to feel guilty for the way they feel. They want compassion, empathy, and understanding. Hell, the way people here can be so compassionate and understanding towards the suffering of others sometimes helps prevent me from suicide. I feel less alone, and that's all I can ask for.

Thank you for all the work you do @RainAndSadness :heart:
 
I

inmyhead

Student
May 21, 2023
168
I've been coming here on and off since May 2023 when I was going through a particularly bad depressive episode and experiencing a lot of suicidal ideation. Just getting to speak to people about how I felt in a non judgemental way, without scaring anyone in my real life actually helped save me in an ironic way.

I actually brought up the website during an appointment with my CPN (without naming it obviously) and he agreed that it was a positive therapeutic outlet. I didn't go into too many details about it but said how it had helped me.
 
hailspark

hailspark

hail
Jan 23, 2024
11
Yes! This site is a community of people who won't judge ctb and are in the same place as me mentally. Also, I only found this site about a month ago but its actually helped me a lot with sh - I've found I scroll through here until instead of doing other things (not sure how it helps though lol)
 

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