What SN does (symptoms)

[James777]

So I get that it turns haemoglobin to methemoglobin, essentially killing you from lack if oxygen. The general impression I get is that this method is peaceful and you get knocked out before any pain.

Look I ordered SN now I'm a bit freaked:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/emp2.12702

That's a case with 10g ingested, even then he woke up in diarrhoea and vomiting after passing out.

Look at this https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/24734306.2021.1972691
Mortality is 41% why is this the primary method pushed in this sight it seems really inconsistent and can lead to a large amount of suffering.

 

[jimmy7754]

people are desperate and want something humane.. which doesn't exist unless you have assisted dying.

 

[Cali101]

Does it say how much the person in the first case took? A small dose to test or a large dose?

It looks like the people in the second link received the antidote which has been shown to work.

 

[wljourney]

Mortality is assessed based on all cases, including attempts that were interrupted, found by family members, who called 911 themselves, received the antidote and other stabilizing care, people who throw up most of the solution ingested, people who don't take the recommended dose, people who "want to try how it feels" and up in the ER…

All those are counted as part of the statistic.

They also included nitrate poisoning (which we know doesn't work) and in the end it's a VERY small sample size. Only 17 in total. Not representative IMO.

If you read the PPeH the method is explained and also what needs to be considered.

Re the first link: he didn't take more than 10g (2 teaspoons), he also had IBS (which could be responsible for some of his uncomfortable side effects/symptoms) and he quickly received the antidote.

 

[Shu]

So I get that it turns haemoglobin to methemoglobin, essentially killing you from lack if oxygen. The general impression I get is that this method is peaceful and you get knocked out before any pain.

Look I ordered SN now I'm a bit freaked:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/emp2.12702

That's a case with 10g ingested, even then he woke up in diarrhoea and vomiting after passing out.

Look at this https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/24734306.2021.1972691
Mortality is 41% why is this the primary method pushed in this sight it seems really inconsistent and can lead to a large amount of suffering.

This same article keeps being brought up... he did it a few days after Matthew mindler... coincidence? I think not... he probably saw the article and decided that he would try the same method.... he probably did not follow any guide or regime at all....

 

[SofterSoftest]

I do think there are risks of taking SN that are regularly overlooked on this site, including the fact that SN is highly carcinogenic and has been shown to trigger kidney failure in mice across many studies. In other words, while it's true that we don't have much evidence about SN causing brain damage, it still might damage the body in other significant ways if not done right (or if done for the purpose of self-harm, which I think is never a good idea since it can easily cause death or very serious medical complications).

All of that being said, the fatality rate of SN is much higher than 41%. In the paper that you linked, 14 of the 17 individuals included in the researchers' sample were given methylene blue, which is the only antidote to SN. The fact that 41% of the sample died, in spite of such a large proportion accessing methylene blue, tells you that it is actually quite effective. That being said, nothing is a guarantee, sadly. In the first article you linked, the person ingested two teaspoons of SN, which is roughly equivalent to 8-12 grams (depending where one is). That is lower than the recommended dose, but still technically considered a fatal amount - it is possible that they didn't take an AE and vomited the SN too early (i.e., before it had a chance to get absorbed). I don't think there is ever a guarantee with any method that is not medically supervised, but some are more effective than others.

 

[Viafactorum]

I read the PubMed article on the case you mentioned and yes it is true that the person survived. He had taken 10g(although the article mentioned by you says that he took two teaspoons which is closer to 8g) and used a cannabinoid as an antiemetic(unreliable as far as I can tell compared to other prescription meds). We have no data on his weight(at least I do not) not his BMI which leads me to believe that he had not taken the appropriate dose. In fact according to detailed studies done on this forum about the dosages he had severely underdosed which might explain why he survived.

It is also said that he bought the SN from Walmart which usually sells SN for curing meat, i.e. consumer grade SN of low purity which might also explain how it turned out for him. As for the rest he vomited and defecated which can happen. The diffuse abdominal pain of intensity 8/10 is probably caused by low oxygenated blood supply to his bowels. Tachycardia is a known symptom of SN poisoning for which there are ways to prevent it.

All in all from all the signs described in the report the man clearly did went through with his ctb on impulse which is never good for this method.

As for the second part of your discussion the mortality is 41% because of the range of the study. The study was conducted across a span of 11 years and they openly admit within the the study that most of the fatal cases of SN poisoning emerged within the last few years(2019ish during which time SaSu was promoting the method). Rest of the cases included in the study was mostly from accidental poisoning which is why the mortality rate is 41%(I mean even with accidental poisonings included the mortality is 41%).

As I say in almost all of my replies no ctb method is a guaranteed peaceful exit(maybe N is but I haven't read into too much). We do not have technology that is sophisticated enough to gauge the perception of pain or sensations during the time of unconsciousness(we do have brain wave monitoring devices but there is no way to completely understand what a person experiences in the unconscious state). I do not promote ctb. Life keeps giving you second chances, it is upto you to utilize it.

 

[BornBrief]

So I get that it turns haemoglobin to methemoglobin, essentially killing you from lack if oxygen. The general impression I get is that this method is peaceful and you get knocked out before any pain.

Look I ordered SN now I'm a bit freaked:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/emp2.12702

That's a case with 10g ingested, even then he woke up in diarrhoea and vomiting after passing out.

Look at this https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/24734306.2021.1972691
Mortality is 41% why is this the primary method pushed in this sight it seems really inconsistent and can lead to a large amount of suffering.

The mean age was 23.2 years old. Visible cyanosis was present in 13/17 patients with a mean oxygen saturation of 85%. Methylene blue was administered in 14/17 cases with 8/17 requiring advanced cardiac life support. The overall mortality rate was 41% (7/17). All patients presented in the final two years of the study period. Intentionally ingesting sodium nitrite represents a novel, growing trend and carries a high mortality rate among young adults.

So they attempted to save 14 of the people who ingested SN. We have already established, if you are found, you may be rescued if it's in a timely manner.

And even though MB was administered more than half of those receiving it required advanced cardiac life support.

This isn't a study of people who took SN and were left to their own devices

 

[Shu]

I read the PubMed article on the case you mentioned and yes it is true that the person survived. He had taken 10g(although the article mentioned by you says that he took two teaspoons which is closer to 8g) and used a cannabinoid as an antiemetic(unreliable as far as I can tell compared to other prescription meds). We have no data on his weight(at least I do not) not his BMI which leads me to believe that he had not taken the appropriate dose. In fact according to detailed studies done on this forum about the dosages he had severely underdosed which might explain why he survived.

It is also said that he bought the SN from Walmart which usually sells SN for curing meat, i.e. consumer grade SN of low purity which might also explain how it turned out for him. As for the rest he vomited and defecated which can happen. The diffuse abdominal pain of intensity 8/10 is probably caused by low oxygenated blood supply to his bowels. Tachycardia is a known symptom of SN poisoning for which there are ways to prevent it.

All in all from all the signs described in the report the man clearly did went through with his ctb on impulse which is never good for this method.

As for the second part of your discussion the mortality is 41% because of the range of the study. The study was conducted across a span of 11 years and they openly admit within the the study that most of the fatal cases of SN poisoning emerged within the last few years(2019ish during which time SaSu was promoting the method). Rest of the cases included in the study was mostly from accidental poisoning which is why the mortality rate is 41%(I mean even with accidental poisonings included the mortality is 41%).

As I say in almost all of my replies no ctb method is a guaranteed peaceful exit(maybe N is but I haven't read into too much). We do not have technology that is sophisticated enough to gauge the perception of pain or sensations during the time of unconsciousness(we do have brain wave monitoring devices but there is no way to completely understand what a person experiences in the unconscious state). I do not promote ctb. Life keeps giving you second chances, it is upto you to utilize it.

No. The SN he used is the same exact one I have and is 99%.. the guy literally did this a few days after the Matthew Mendler article was released to the public he probably didn't know what he was doing and followed after what he was reading without following any kind of plan

 

[James777]

Again, this case does not appear isolated though people still seam to be conscious while cyanosis and dyspnoea are taking place

Two cases of fatal methemoglobinemia caused by... : Medicine

oxication in suicidal attempts. Patients concerns: A 26-year-old man and 20-year-old woman attempted suicide by taking sodium nitrite, and were brought to the emergency department. Diagnosis: The male patient collapsed at the scene. He ingested approximately 18 g of sodium nitrate, and his...

journals.lww.com

 

[wljourney]

Again, this case does not appear isolated though people still seam to be conscious while cyanosis and dyspnoea are taking place

Two cases of fatal methemoglobinemia caused by... : Medicine

oxication in suicidal attempts. Patients concerns: A 26-year-old man and 20-year-old woman attempted suicide by taking sodium nitrite, and were brought to the emergency department. Diagnosis: The male patient collapsed at the scene. He ingested approximately 18 g of sodium nitrate, and his...

journals.lww.com

Yes they are still conscious for a while.
We have several reports here in the forum of people starting to feel cold (peripheral cyanosis as in hands and feet) and their lips going blue.

And yes at some point they start feeling out of breath. That doesn't last long though. Most black out within a few minutes after that.

 

[Shu]

Again, this case does not appear isolated though people still seam to be conscious while cyanosis and dyspnoea are taking place

Two cases of fatal methemoglobinemia caused by... : Medicine

oxication in suicidal attempts. Patients concerns: A 26-year-old man and 20-year-old woman attempted suicide by taking sodium nitrite, and were brought to the emergency department. Diagnosis: The male patient collapsed at the scene. He ingested approximately 18 g of sodium nitrate, and his...

journals.lww.com

What is your reason behindal of this? are you trying to scare people away from the method? Would you rather them do something even more riskier?

 

[James777]

What is your reason behindal of this? are you trying to scare people away from the method? Would you rather them do something even more riskier?

No I ordered this and now I feel conflicted, this method is not as clear cut as I thought it would be. I looked at Belgium where doctors gave patients barbiturates to sleep then pentobarbital to give a heart attack. The point being it seems for this method to actually be the way people describe you have to be unconscious and SN does not do that.

 

[LifeHasNoOptIn]

Not sure where the idea that SN is on par with N for peacefulness has ever been suggested here and everything I read here made it pretty clear it was the crappier, riskier alternative for those of us for whom N is not on the table. It was never suggested that SN would induce loss of consciousness nearly immediately such as N, and it was pretty well understood that you would be looking at 15-30 minutes(possibly longer) of consciousness involving various possible negative physical effects such as nausea, headache, tachycardia, and bowel pain. It does however, have a pretty good track record for effectiveness if the regimen is followed properly and you are not found.

Quite simply, its not the most peaceful method, but is a solid choice for availability and reliability. If you want to sip and quickly pass out, N is your only alternative.

 

[James777]

Not sure where the idea that SN is on par with N for peacefulness has ever been suggested here and everything I read here made it pretty clear it was the crappier, riskier alternative for those of us for whom N is not on the table. It was never suggested that SN would induce loss of consciousness nearly immediately such as N, and it was pretty well understood that you would be looking at 15-30 minutes(possibly longer) of consciousness involving various possible negative physical effects such as nausea, headache, tachycardia, and bowel pain. It does however, have a pretty good track record for effectiveness if the regimen is followed properly and you are not found.

Quite simply, its not the most peaceful method, but is a solid choice for availability and reliability. If you want to sip and quickly pass out, N is your only alternative.

I get that maybe I got too excited, but if your at the point of suicide my willpower is gone I'm a shell of myself. If I quit while ingesting its a lifetime of dealing with the repricussions and parents and therapy. And these last 2 years have shown me that I'm a slave to pleasure... I dont know if I just wasted money back to the drawing board

 

[BornBrief]

No I ordered this and now I feel conflicted, this method is not as clear cut as I thought it would be. I looked at Belgium where doctors gave patients barbiturates to sleep then pentobarbital to give a heart attack. The point being it seems for this method to actually be the way people describe you have to be unconscious and SN does not do that.

You're only going to see what you want to see I guess, when you ignore all the other factors in these articles surrounding someone who lives after ingesting SN. It's like you're deliberately avoiding acknowledging them. There are so many variables here. You don't have to do it but this is just fear mongering. Time and time again people have used this method and the ones who fail have always done it incorrectly/impulsively or had bad product.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Look I ordered SN now I'm a bit freaked:

Then don't use it. Throw it away after you get it. This forum isn't here to persuade people to commit suicide. Use a different method or don't commit suicide at all. It's as easy as that.

 

[PrisonBreak]

The point being it seems for this method to actually be the way people describe you have to be unconscious and SN does not do that.

So what you're saying is SN does not make one go unconscious? But I went unconscious after my attempt with SN without any sedatives or barbiturates. What made me go unconscious then, if that is the case?

I'm also curious what method of choice you're leaning towards since SN is so "inconsistent" and causing "suffering"?

 

[James777]

OK so lots of people replying. I'm not trying to start an Internet fight here. The point here is SN is not peacfull and can be a rather painful way to die. I don't have all the answers here in regards to me not looking at extenuating factors read the articles everyone is going to be slightly different and will react accordingly I know you will lose conscious with SN but the amount of suffering you have to go through will vary but it won't be pretty .

Look here Is a case with 99.5% pure SN. DEPICTS Distressing image: http://www.ricardinis.pt/wp-content...ng-sodium-nitrite-ordered-on-the-internet.pdf

I don't know your individual circumstances and yeah you could say every method of suicide has some suffering unless lucky like in hanging the hangman's fracture is only ≈ 8.8% the time. I don't want to be blind and run from the truth

Me I don't know where I am at I don't want to live like this anymore. The most painless appears to be the barbiturates and nepubartinal but that requires the aid of a doctor in a place like Belgium or Switzerland. My only point is not that I'm blind to people going the right way but SN is a lot more risky than I think people are willing to admit (not saying you guys here).

 

[Shu]

OK so lots of people replying. I'm not trying to start an Internet fight here. The point here is SN is not peacfull and can be a rather painful way to die. I don't have all the answers here in regards to me not looking at extenuating factors read the articles everyone is going to be slightly different and will react accordingly I know you will lose conscious with SN but the amount of suffering you have to go through will vary but it won't be pretty .

Look here Is a case with 99.5% pure SN. DEPICTS Distressing image: http://www.ricardinis.pt/wp-content...ng-sodium-nitrite-ordered-on-the-internet.pdf

I don't know your individual circumstances and yeah you could say every method of suicide has some suffering unless lucky like in hanging the hangman's fracture is only ≈ 8.8% the time.

Me I don't know where I am at I don't want to live like this anymore. The most painless appears to be the barbiturates and nepubartinal but that requires the aid of a doctor in a place like Belgium or Switzerland. My only point is not that I'm blind to people going the right way but SN is a lot more risky than I think people are willing to admit (not saying you guys here).

I'm still going to use it. I've read hundreds and hundreds of threads and I've also spoken to numerous people who have survived the attempts. Nobody has mentioned suffering the way that you are making it out to seem. I understand that you are skeptical but just don't use it if you feel this way.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Look here Is a case with 99.5% pure SN. DEPICTS Distressing image: http://www.ricardinis.pt/wp-content...ng-sodium-nitrite-ordered-on-the-internet.pdf

Exactly what do you think is in that article that indicates that this person suffered unduly? The picture depicts livor mortis, which is something that happened to the guy's body after he died.

Livor mortis - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I'm curious to know how old you are, by the way?

 

[ge0rge]

that dead person looks like a normal dead person that's not been discovered immediately. it's nowhere near the smurf blue people have been fearing. it's actually a decent looking body if I do say so myself

 

[James777]

Exactly what do you think is in that article that indicates that this person suffered unduly? The picture depicts livor mortis, which is something that happened to the guy's body after he died.

Livor mortis - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I'm curious to know how old you are, by the way?

18 fail to see how it's relevant but that cyanosis which is blue skin pigmentation due to lack of blood O2. Yeah some of it was due to death but largely due to SN at particular points like your 'extremities' which is where all your nerves are hurting the most.

 

[Cathy Ames]

18 fail to see how it's relevant but that cyanosis which is blue skin pigmentation due to lack of blood O2. Yeah some of it was due to death but largely due to SN at particular points like your 'extremities' which is where all your nerves are hurting the most.

That's funny that you fail to see how it's relevant. I fail to see how any of the things you have shared are relevant to the points you apparently are attempting to make. The sentence above about "SN at particular points like your 'extremities'..." is nonsensical.

Again. How old are you?

 

[Shu]

That's funny that you fail to see how it's relevant. I fail to see how any of the things you have shared are relevant to the points you apparently are attempting to make. The sentence above about "SN at particular points like your 'extremities'..." is nonsensical.

Again. How old are you?

They said "18"

18 fail to see how it's relevant but that cyanosis which is blue skin pigmentation due to lack of blood O2. Yeah some of it was due to death but largely due to SN at particular points like your 'extremities' which is where all your nerves are hurting the most.

I've seen other SN autopsy especially ones that were fresh and they didn't look like that. That picture is the worse one I've seen of all of them.
Y

That's funny that you fail to see how it's relevant. I fail to see how any of the things you have shared are relevant to the points you apparently are attempting to make. The sentence above about "SN at particular points like your 'extremities'..." is nonsensical.

Again. How old are you?

Yeah I'm still trying to understand the point trying to be made.

 

[wljourney]

18 fail to see how it's relevant but that cyanosis which is blue skin pigmentation due to lack of blood O2. Yeah some of it was due to death but largely due to SN at particular points like your 'extremities' which is where all your nerves are hurting the most.

Ok, so age plays a role because you never stop learning. Don't be offended. It's simply about life, learning and experience.

Now.
Cyanosis is more like a light blue tinge in the beginning. Happens when not enough blood rich with oxygen gets to the peripheral arteries in hands and feet. Usually comes with cold hand and feet, blue lips (where skin is thin and unpigmented). Tingling sensation. Not painful.

Then, very soon after (15-30 min) you go unconscious. That's not painful either, unless you fall and hit your head. But once you are out, you won't be in pain.

What you are seeing in those pictures (dark blue blotches) happens well after going unconscious and after your heart stops pumping blood. Once the engine stops, blood pools at the underside of the body. That's simply physics.

All this being said, don't use your SN if this doesn't feel right.
It's ok to change your mind.
Take a step back and reassess.
If SN isn't your thing, then please dispose of it responsibly ( it's a poison and should be disposed as toxic waste, not in your household garbage)

Best wishes

 

[BornBrief]

OK so lots of people replying. I'm not trying to start an Internet fight here. The point here is SN is not peacfull and can be a rather painful way to die. I don't have all the answers here in regards to me not looking at extenuating factors read the articles everyone is going to be slightly different and will react accordingly I know you will lose conscious with SN but the amount of suffering you have to go through will vary but it won't be pretty .

Look here Is a case with 99.5% pure SN. DEPICTS Distressing image: http://www.ricardinis.pt/wp-content...ng-sodium-nitrite-ordered-on-the-internet.pdf

I don't know your individual circumstances and yeah you could say every method of suicide has some suffering unless lucky like in hanging the hangman's fracture is only ≈ 8.8% the time. I don't want to be blind and run from the truth

Me I don't know where I am at I don't want to live like this anymore. The most painless appears to be the barbiturates and nepubartinal but that requires the aid of a doctor in a place like Belgium or Switzerland. My only point is not that I'm blind to people going the right way but SN is a lot more risky than I think people are willing to admit (not saying you guys here).

Lol wow shocking looking at very dead bodies is distressing!! Must mean despite all the monitoring Exit has done on people with notes taken it must be extremely painful because looking bad after death means it hurted badge >:(

 

[Cathy Ames]

They said "18"

Does that seem credible?

I've seen other SN autopsy especially ones that were fresh and they didn't look like that. That picture is the worse one I've seen of all of them.
Y

It probably took longer for this person to be found (more time for the blood pooling to occur).

Yeah I'm still trying to understand the point trying to be made.

Maybe the assumption was that the cyanotic body parts would be painful? They don't understand the difference between the cyanosis and the livor mortis maybe? It seems like they're making things up kind of randomly. If I had to guess where "all the nerves are hurting the most," I would say it is probably the headache. I'll shut up now.

Ok, so age plays a role because you never stop learning.

Age also plays a role in that people are supposed to be at least 18 years old to be here. I was feeling dubious as to whether that was the case here.

All this being said, don't use your SN if this doesn't feel right.
It's ok to change your mind.
Take a step back and reassess.
If SN isn't your thing, then please dispose of it responsibly ( it's a poison and should be disposed as toxic waste, not in your household garbage)

Best wishes

This is good advice.

 

[James777]

I'm ending this hear cause its not worth senseless argument, you can look at the cases yourself and define the level of pain through research and talking to people who can be unbias like certain doctors, I just wanted to show what I found being that it is not as peaceful as people make it out to be, there are reasons it's not used as a death penalty method. Anyway thanks for hearing me out.
I'm ending this hear cause its not worth senseless argument im 18 believ waht you will, you can look at the cases yourself and define the level of pain through research and talking to people, I just wanted to show what I found being that it is not as peaceful as people make it out to be, there are reasons it's not used as a death penalty method. Anyway thanks for hearing me out

 

[Alex6216]

Me I don't know where I am at I don't want to live like this anymore. The most painless appears to be the barbiturates and nepubartinal but that requires the aid of a doctor in a place like Belgium or Switzerland. My only point is not that I'm blind to people going the right way but SN is a lot more risky than I think people are willing to admit (not saying you guys here).

Thanks genius, barbiturate overdose is painless... Too bad they're illegal, hard to get and super expensive, which is why people use SN in the first place; LifeHasNoOptIn said it best, it's a poor mans N and is never meant to be super amazing just good enough.
You should also mention that 2 or more grams of xanax followed by 10 grams of GHB mixed with 400ml of alcohol is painless too, tastes awful but it kills the same way as N, problem is it's also super illegal and expensive (even worth now with this crypto crash)