Discussion Vexatious posts have become a thing round here ...

[bluem00n]

Seriously, it's pathetic to troll a suicide forum in such a weird way. Grow up. It disturbs me how some people on here see the suffering of others as being a joke, like it may be amusing to you but many of us actually want to die yet struggle to leave this world, but no, who cares about that, as long as bored people are enjoying themselves on a suicide forum, as that's totally the important thing!

Yes, I find the levels of combativeness and adversarial activity being expressed here lately to be quite extraordinary, all the more so given this is supposedly a Support Forum! FuneralCry's most recent thread is just the latest of several that have fallen victim to such activity in just the last few days alone.

I've noticed too that those who frequently post adversarial remarks don't like to start threads themselves, they instead prefer to restrict their activities to criticising, undermining, and derailing threads started by others, especially targeting those towards whom they've cultivated a hostile demeanour due to differing values and points-of-view. And because of their intolerance for views that vary from their own, they won't simply walk away like other readers might - no, they'd rather stick around and start an argument. This is on a Support Forum mind!

It seems that anyone expressing a point-of-view that varies from that of a disrupter is sufficient grounds for them to inject an adversarial tone to a thread (yes, even on a Support Forum!). And their goal always seems to be to 'win the argument', rather than get to the truth of a matter. So they'll just go on and on (and on) posting what are typically brief offhand remarks requiring little thought and no substance, but nevertheless using every disruptive trick in the book, until they have in their own mind 'won the argument'.

That 'achievement' is affirmed for a disruptor when they (else a member of their group) get to have 'the last word' - the lack of a response to their latest post is a sign that the thread starter has been worn down fending off multiple attacks on their thread, and has given up, has in effect been 'vanquished' from their own thread. This is a 'bullying into submission' strategy plain and simple.

The likely outcome of such activities is that a Forum steadily degrades, to a point where it becomes just another victim of online toxicity. And the only way to avoid that depends on whether the individuals causing the damage see it in their longterm interests to refrain. Unfortunately, that seems less likely on a forum where dopamine levels are already deficient, as forfeiting the instant gratification of having 'the last word' might prove too problematic for disruptors at SS.

As I proposed on another thread that was likewise being derailed recently ...​

Posts that set out to undermine threads started in good faith are becoming a thing round here. Perhaps try and remember this is a Support Forum, and posts should lean towards being empathic, rather than cynical or confrontational.

So if a post can't offer support to the OP of a thread, maybe start another thread and submit alternative viewpoints there instead - adversarial posts in the original thread just come across as vexatious - creating mischief for its own sake. What's more, they're being posted despite the author knowing the OP is suicidal (that seems the most extraordinary aspect really). This is after all supposed to be a SUPPORT forum for suicidal people ...​

 

[Chinaski]

Sounds very much like you are drawing a line between who you consider to be suicidal (people who like the same output as you) and people who are nasty troll bullies (people who are less keen on said output). You seem very enthusiastic about policing what content should be driven off this forum and are a bit disingenuous about how you are going about it.

 

[WhiteRabbit]

This is after all supposed to be a SUPPORT forum for suicidal people ...

I thought this was a suicide discussion forum.

especially targeting those towards whom they've cultivated a hostile demeanour due to differing values and points-of-view.

This is funny.

When a poster makes a shit-ton of posts calling people delusional and just plain wrong if they don't agree with her point of view, that poster is bound to get some push back. Like I mentioned above, this is a suicide discussion forum.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

When a poster makes a shit-ton of posts calling people delusional and just plain wrong if they don't agree with her point of view, that poster is bound to get some push back. Like I mentioned above, this is a suicide discussion forum.

This ^
And I very much like FC. I truly do. I read all of her postings and I feel really bad for her that she is in so much pain. But, the non-stop extreme form of nihilism that she puts out in every single post is just too much sometimes. But, the one thing I will agree about is that if we have nothing good to say about somebody, we should just say nothing at all. Those are good words to try and live by.

 

[freedompass]

Sounds very much like you are drawing a line between who you consider to be suicidal (people who like the same output as you) and people who are nasty troll bullies (people who are less keen on said output). You seem very enthusiastic about policing what content should be driven off this forum and are a bit disingenuous about how you are going about it.

I agree. Where in any of FC's posts does she ask for support? She is propounding her core beliefs, none of which I have a problem with. It is the constant unfounded accusations, slurs, gatekeeping, and invalidating of others here that I take issue with. I note she never names names or argues with anyone individually. Not sure if she is trying to start a nihilist cult or what. But @Bluemoon you seem to be ignoring all of this and accusing other members of being 'vexatious' and 'bullies' when the most vexatious person here is probably FC herself. She derails her own posts by constantly attacking others! Oh and thanks for inventing a new slur by the way! 'Disruptor'. Good one.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

I don't know about any of you, but I have this strange and disturbing (to me) image of FC that has embedded itself in my mind. For some reason I can't explain, I picture her laying in a hospital-type bed, in her home, unable to move or speak, and only managing to type messages through her computer using one of those "blow-into"- type devices, or similar, like Stephen Hawking used to use. I don't know where that came from, as I have no information on her situation. If that were the case, I could definitely understand the origin of her fatalistic views. If I were in that situation, I'd probably have those same views. I know having those per-conceived images of her are just stupid and not based in any reality.

 

[FuneralCry]

It's so great to see that there is even more malicious gossip here, I'm just so amazed at the level of quality of some of the posts on here. People seriously should be ashamed of the fact that they go around trying to make suffering people feel worse, no wonder so many wish to die when people behave like this. It's ironic how the user who says that they are happy, no wait happier actually sounds so bitter and spiteful. Some people here are just being honest and saying things for how they are and others should just get over that fact.

And yes, people can imagine me how they like, diagnose me with whatever condition or disease they want, like people on here have done that in the past, but it's seriously insane to believe that in order for someone to have realistic views of this world, they must be severely disabled. No, my views towards life make sense and the fact that life itself is horrific is the reality. Anyone who has awareness and an ability to take in information should know that. I bet users like that enjoy picturing others in extreme suffering, which is the disturbing thing. Maybe it makes them feel better about themselves or something. I mean why would they write a post about it otherwise. This is all very odd and suspicious to me. I can move around perfectly fine by the way.

But yes, I do see the internet as being a toxic place in general. Nowhere is free from the cruelty of humans, and I think the unfortunate reality is that some people get so desperate for attention and they seek it in less than genuine ways which can often harm others in the process and the truth is that many people would do anything just to make themselves feel better even if it means acting in a malicious way.

The subject of suicide really shouldn't be so stigmatised and it's tragic how we lack a peaceful right to die, and instead all that there is, is this website for suicidal people which is sadly used as a clique-ish social media site by many for their own amusement. Of course this can be harmful because of the amount of genuine suffering people that come on here either looking for methods or just somewhere to vent, and the thought of them coming on here and being surrounded with what would make them feel even more suicidal really is sad. Suicide should never have to be discussed on the internet in the first place, and in a more ideal pro choice society there would never be any need for suicide forums at all.

 

[freedompass]

FC. Venting posts are not a problem. Name calling and invalidating other members is. You are absolutely entitled to your views. As is anyone to respectfully disagree but the issue here is your constant sniping and lashing out in those posts.

I can see that I'm probably talking to the deaf at this point but hope that at least some here may begin to understand why this 'flame war' is happening and stop the misguided attempts to 'defend' FC and effectively break the forum into 2 camps. All you are doing is enabling her. Not good for either her or the forum. Please just stop.

 

[Forever Sleep]

And their goal always seems to be to 'win the argument', rather than get to the truth of a matter.

To begin with, I want to say that I have a lot of respect and deep sympathy for FC. She is clearly suffering immensely but she is always supportive to people while they are suffering too- no matter the reason.

That said- I don't necessairily hold all the same viewpoints she does. (Funnily enough- I do more for me but I don't think they should necessarily apply to everyone else.)

While I agree with you that this SHOULD be a support forum, it is also a place to discuss issues surrounding suicide- the very name for this section is 'Suicide Discussion' after all. I take from that- that I don't necessarily have to agree with everything the OP has put forward. (IF the thread is in that vein initially- ie. putting forward an idea to the community.) Neither would I expect everyone to agree with me if I put forward my ideas.

Of course- it is important that we ALL respect one another in HOW we go about expressing our opinions.

I suppose the part from your OP about getting to 'the truth of the matter' (I think) is the core problem though... What truth? That EVERYONE ought to find life a meaningless and appalling experience because bad things CAN happen? Is that objective truth or does it rely on a person's subjective experience? I'd say that while life certainly can objectively be seen as cruel (although again- perceiving cruelty is surely subjective- being dependant on our own feelings. Surely even morals are subjective,) I think an individuals personal experience very much comes into play when it comes to how they perceive life.

Therefore, I'm not so convinced we can find a 'truth' that relates to EVERYONE. I'm actually more inclined to think it's something we may never agree on.

I kind of realise that these aren't always discussion topics now though as I feel for the OP, quite often their thoughts ARE the objective truth and they probably don't want to discuss it- so I think I avoided the thread in question this time. Like FC herself said- these are sometimes venting posts rather than invitations to discuss, so I'm trying to be a bit more mindful and respectful now. We're all entitled to our own viewpoints after all.

 

[freedompass]

To begin with, I want to say that I have a lot of respect and deep sympathy for FC. She is clearly suffering immensely but she is always supportive to people while they are suffering too- no matter the reason.

That said- I don't necessairily hold all the same viewpoints she does. (Funnily enough- I do more for me but I don't think they should necessarily apply to everyone else.)

While I agree with you that this SHOULD be a support forum, it is also a place to discuss issues surrounding suicide- the very name for this section is 'Suicide Discussion' after all. I take from that- that I don't necessarily have to agree with everything the OP has put forward. (IF the thread is in that vein initially- ie. putting forward an idea to the community.) Neither would I expect everyone to agree with me if I put forward my ideas.

Of course- it is important that we ALL respect one another in HOW we go about expressing our opinions.

I suppose the part from your OP about getting to 'the truth of the matter' (I think) is the core problem though... What truth? That EVERYONE ought to find life a meaningless and appalling experience because bad things CAN happen? Is that objective truth or does it rely on a person's subjective experience? I'd say that while life certainly can objectively be seen as cruel (although again- perceiving cruelty is surely subjective- being dependant on our own feelings. Surely even morals are subjective,) I think an individuals personal experience very much comes into play when it comes to how they perceive life.

Therefore, I'm not so convinced we can find a 'truth' that relates to EVERYONE. I'm actually more inclined to think it's something we may never agree on.

I kind of realise that these aren't always discussion topics now though as I feel for the OP, quite often their thoughts ARE the objective truth and they probably don't want to discuss it- so I think I avoided the thread in question this time. Like FC herself said- these are sometimes venting posts rather than invitations to discuss, so I'm trying to be a bit more mindful and respectful now. We're all entitled to our own viewpoints after all.

You kinda missed the point. FC is more than entitled to her views. The issue is her attacking and invalidating other members who (frankly) fail to kiss her ass.

Her right to speak her truth is not in question but what about my right not to be called a prolife troll who has no right to be here and makes others feel more suicidal than they do already?

 

[Forever Sleep]

You kinda missed the point. FC is more than entitled to her views. The issue is her attacking and invalidating other members who (frankly) fail to kiss her ass

This wasn't the impression I got from the OP. Sounds like they were trying to defend FC. I don't like it when anyone attacks anyone else on here. We're all in the same (sinking) ship after all.

Still, I think it's also a good thing to know when to walk away. I think what I was trying to say was- some people aren't actually inviting a discussion when they post stuff. They are just venting. I have tried to offer counter arguments to posts like these in the past. (As I mentioned- while MY views are more on the nihilistic side, I don't think they can or should be applied to everyone.) If there isn't a response, I get the impression that this wasn't something they wanted to debate- they just wanted to vent.

I don't think it is always helpful to severely question a person who is devout (ironically, I think there definitely are people who are devout to their anti-beliefs and anti-life.) I didn't read the thread in full I confess but of what I did- mud looked to be flying in both directions...

 

[freedompass]

This wasn't the impression I got from the OP. Sounds like they were trying to defend FC. I don't like it when anyone attacks anyone else on here. We're all in the same (sinking) ship after all.

Still, I think it's also a good thing to know when to walk away. I think what I was trying to say was- some people aren't actually inviting a discussion when they post stuff. They are just venting. I have tried to offer counter arguments to posts like these in the past. (As I mentioned- while MY views are more on the nihilistic side, I don't think they can or should be applied to everyone.) If there isn't a response, I get the impression that this wasn't something they wanted to debate- they just wanted to vent.

I don't think it is always helpful to severely question a person who is devout (ironically, I think there definitely are people who are devout to their anti-beliefs and anti-life.) I didn't read the thread in full I confess but of what I did- mud looked to be flying in both directions...

I'm starting to wonder if anyone reads her threads before jumping to conclusions about who is attacking who! She is the thread starter and the OP and she intersperses every post with sly jibes at other members who she doesn't name but it's clear who she means. She seemingly cannot tolerate other people's views as we tolerate hers! It's slinging mud to politely request that she stop calling other members prolife trolls, delusional and so forth is it?

Having a zillion posts on here, being 'popular' or having a cult following does not exempt you from basic decency, civility and respect that we should all strive and hope for no matter what we are going through.

Whoever still wants to argue with me can you name me one prolife troll on here? Just one? Genuinely interested.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

Of course- it is important that we ALL respect one another in HOW we go about expressing our opinions.

I don't wish to engage with this thread right now but this is some of what I was thinking.

To begin with, I want to say that I have a lot of respect and deep sympathy for FC. She is clearly suffering immensely but she is always supportive to people while they are suffering too- no matter the reason.

That said- I don't necessairily hold all the same viewpoints she does.

All of this too. And I can respect FC feels a certain way and has good reason to feel that way.

Honestly, I'm feeling really uncomfortable where this is going, and by this I mean any sort of open discussion about another user on the forum. Can you imagine how awkward that is for FC? I feel bad being here even though I want to give them support. None of this sits right with me. There's an unspoken code of conduct, minimum social respect (a modicum of respect) & credit that's being broken here. Just putting myself in their shoes.

I would say just let FC have her vent thread, and don't respond to them if you don't like them. Most of her posts are in support of other people, on their threads, which is probably an understatement, I never saw her make vent threads before so things must be getting worse. She's more than entitled to make her own, and be treated with the same guarded caution as any other potential vent thread by anyone else imo. Which is to say, just let someone vent even if you disagree. I don't think her original post was villifying anyone, it was just full of anguish, because she wants to ctb but nothing is ever that easy and is probably fed up with the same pro-tripe many of us experience IRL or online. It's sad that someone that gives a lot of support to others can't get it in their own vent thread really.


edit: as said, I'm not willing to engage with the rest of the thread, because I personally don't think it will be productive to do that . Also I've got a lot of tumultuous things to deal with going on in my life to follow up threads even if I wanted to . People are entitled to take my words & actions any way they want. I just wanted to say what was on my mind.

 

[freedompass]

I don't wish to engage with this thread right now but this is some of what I was thinking.

All of this too. And I can respect FC feels a certain way and has good reason to feel that way.

Honestly, I'm feeling really uncomfortable where this is going, and by this I mean any sort of open discussion about another user on the forum. Can you imagine how awkward that is for FC? I feel bad being here even though I want to give them support. None of this sits right with me. There's an unspoken code of conduct, minimum social respect (a modicum of respect) & credit that's being broken here. Just putting myself in their shoes.

I would say just let FC have her vent thread, and don't respond to them if you don't like them. Most of her posts are in support of other people, on their threads, which is probably an understatement, I never saw her make vent threads before so things must be getting worse. She's more than entitled to make her own, and be treated with the same guarded caution as any other potential vent thread by anyone else imo. Which is to say, just let someone vent even if you disagree. I don't think her original post was villifying anyone, it was just full of anguish, because she wants to ctb but nothing is ever that easy and is probably fed up with the same pro-tripe many of us experience IRL or online. It's sad that someone that gives a lot of support to others can't get it in their own vent thread really.

Right. So it is ok for her to keep insulting other members. Just so I know.

It's great that so many people here empathise with her so much. To the point where you write long posts defending her from a perceived attack.

She is clearly popular here. Look at all the 'likes'.

How is that working for her? Is all the support, empathy, popularity, likes, hearts, accolades and praise making her happy or even giving her a reason to live?

Clearly not. It is however enabling her to act like a spoiled entitled brat who gets to throw tantrums and invalidate and degrade other members whenever she likes with impunity.

Sorry if I can't feel terrible for her being the current subject of discussion. I don't know what would help her but honestly it is the members supporting, babying and making special allowances for her that concern me the most. If there is a flame war? Don't look to FC but to her 'supporters'.

 

[Chinaski]

I don't wish to engage with this thread right now but this is some of what I was thinking.

All of this too. And I can respect FC feels a certain way and has good reason to feel that way.

Honestly, I'm feeling really uncomfortable where this is going, and by this I mean any sort of open discussion about another user on the forum. Can you imagine how awkward that is for FC? I feel bad being here even though I want to give them support. None of this sits right with me. There's an unspoken code of conduct, minimum social respect (a modicum of respect) & credit that's being broken here. Just putting myself in their shoes.

I would say just let FC have her vent thread, and don't respond to them if you don't like them. Most of her posts are in support of other people, on their threads, which is probably an understatement, I never saw her make vent threads before so things must be getting worse. She's more than entitled to make her own, and be treated with the same guarded caution as any other potential vent thread by anyone else imo. Which is to say, just let someone vent even if you disagree. I don't think her original post was villifying anyone, it was just full of anguish, because she wants to ctb but nothing is ever that easy and is probably fed up with the same pro-tripe many of us experience IRL or online. It's sad that someone that gives a lot of support to others can't get it in their own vent thread really.

Worth pointing out at this point that this thread was begun by someone using cry-bully crap relating to one user to whip up a storm, and not by people seeking to actually bully one user. I think the OP is entirely off-colour tbh and it's legitimate for folk to counter it.

 

[TimetoGo!]

Y'all need to chill……should be a peaceful place this forum

 

[FuneralCry]

Just to make it clear, everything that I've wrote on here is completely reasonable and the 'insults', are simply just making valid points. What I write makes a lot of sense. It's sad how people cannot see that, but I guess you cannot please everyone after all.
Maybe those who are the 'happiest they've ever been' should be out enjoying life instead rather than furiously ranting on a suicide forum about suffering people. It's really not a good look doing that but that's just my opinion.

 

[Papilio_polyxenes]

I have no issues with the user in question, and all of my interactions with everyone here have been positive.

I will say that my own views on the matter are sharply distinct from FC's. I am not anti-natalist or nihilistic, regardless of my appreciation for writers like Thomas Ligotti.

I take a "moderate" pro-choice stance and view this forum as a harm reduction space. People should consider recovery as a possibility and the risks of various methods. 18 or 19 is too young to make such a consequential decision.

All of that is controversial. But I'm for bodily autonomy and freedom of choice, not an advocate of death in all (or most) circumstances. We do a disservice if we become dogmatically pro-death like "suicide is never the answer" pro-lifers.

 

[msci4499]

Just to make it clear, everything that I've wrote on here is completely reasonable and the 'insults', are simply just making valid points. What I write makes a lot of sense. It's sad how people cannot see that, but I guess you cannot please everyone after all.
Maybe those who are the 'happiest they've ever been' should be out enjoying life instead rather than furiously ranting on a suicide forum about suffering people. It's really not a good look doing that but that's just my opinion.

if death is as good as you say
Maybe you should leave this world earlier
instead of staying here

 

[freedompass]

Just to make it clear, everything that I've wrote on here is completely reasonable and the 'insults', are simply just making valid points. What I write makes a lot of sense. It's sad how people cannot see that, but I guess you cannot please everyone after all.
Maybe those who are the 'happiest they've ever been' should be out enjoying life instead rather than furiously ranting on a suicide forum about suffering people. It's really not a good look doing that but that's just my opinion.

*sigh* here we go again. I do not have to defend what I said to anyone! You know nothing about my life! Please do not presume to tell me what I should be doing, I am nearly 3 times your age! Ranting furiously? No I am calling you out on your nonsense and have no intention of stooping to your level. Talk to me one on one for once instead of sly jibes! Like I care what you think is a good look.

Where is your evidence for calling me a prolife troll or any of your other slurs? Or is this just 'malice', 'spite', 'bitterness', exactly what you accuse me of?

You don't argue directly with me because you have nothing…zero evidence, zero knowledge or understanding, no insight into yourself to even see what you are doing, zero boundaries and, thanks to your devoted following, no checks and balances for your behaviour.

You can PM me anytime if you want a listener for your troubles or even advice, I told you that when I came back on this forum in 2020. We live in the same country. But you prefer to stay as you are. That's absolutely your prerogative. I'm not going to lie and say I understand.

All of this toxicity you're giving out is unnecessary. For the fiftieth time I have no problem with your negative take on life. If you keep taunting, jibing and sniping at people in a personal manner is it surprising if they object?

By the way. I'm still waiting for the list of prolife troll usernames. Anyone?

 

[Mthom2]

I don't know about everyone else, but I've noticed a huge shift in the posts here lately. As a matter of fact, I've just recently began to use the thread ignore feature here, for the first time since joining, if that tells you anything. There is a real lack of support, compared to how the forum used to be. Now, it seems to be degrading severely, unfortunately.

 

[freedompass]

I don't know about everyone else, but I've noticed a huge shift in the posts here lately. As a matter of fact, I've just recently began to use the thread ignore feature here, for the first time since joining, if that tells you anything. There is a real lack of support, compared to how the forum used to be. Now, it seems to be degrading severely, unfortunately.

From what I saw today I kind of agree. Not sure why it might be…almost no thread titles that looked interesting. Just same old methods shit. Hopefully it picks up again soon.

 

[Seiko]

bruh the hell is this drama

 

[SamTam33]

...I suppose the part from your OP about getting to 'the truth of the matter' (I think) is the core problem though... What truth? That EVERYONE ought to find life a meaningless and appalling experience because bad things CAN happen? Is that objective truth or does it rely on a person's subjective experience? I'd say that while life certainly can objectively be seen as cruel (although again- perceiving cruelty is surely subjective- being dependant on our own feelings. Surely even morals are subjective,) I think an individuals personal experience very much comes into play when it comes to how they perceive life...

I think about this a lot. And I genuinely believe that if we could remove our personal experience and beliefs from the equation - most everyone should be able to objectively say that life is pointless and the scale is severely tilted towards the suffering side of things.

Just look at the work week in the US: five days working vs two for the weekend.

Look at the number of holidays compared to the number of regular days.

Think of your friends who experience severe hardship, yet they aren't remotely suicidal.

Just because they aren't suicidal doesn't mean their life is worth living.

Doctors and nurses are overworked and overwhelmed because of all the sick people.

Police departments are stretched thin because of all the people in some form of distress who call them.

What's my point?

People don't have to actively subscribe to the notion that life is shit for it to be true.

They can say life is beautiful or the pain is worth it (or whatever they say). But if we could step back and observe their life from an objective, completely neutral POV - their words would not line up with their experience.

Their job is stressing them out. Their kids are zapping all their energy. Their bills are never-ending. They can't regulate their blood pressure. Their car keeps breaking down. Their spouse can't get employment.

How many people call us with good news vs the ones who call with problems?

That's how I've always interpreted FC's posts. She's posting observations about life at a macro level. Those observations are indisputable.

We get old. We develop health problems. We work to give all our money away to other people. Loved ones betray us. Wildfires, hurricanes, tornadoes, famine, rape, incest, abuse, lies, blackmail, politicians, AIDS, poverty, war, adultery. Homelessness, racism, misogyny, torture, cancer, crack babies.

Like... anyone trying to make a case that a world filled with those things is a world worth living in... That it's generally beautiful... They're batshit crazy.

 

[ge0rge]

if death is as good as you say
Maybe you should leave this world earlier
instead of staying here

absolute icon

 

[WhiteRabbit]

We get old. We develop health problems. We work to give all our money away to other people. Loved ones betray us. Wildfires, hurricanes, tornadoes, famine, rape, incest, abuse, lies, blackmail, politicians, AIDS, poverty, war, adultery. Homelessness, racism, misogyny, torture, cancer, crack babies.

Like... anyone trying to make a case that a world filled with those things is a world worth living in... That it's generally beautiful... They're batshit crazy.

But lovers of life can also make long lists of all the good things about the world. It's all just opinions and perspectives.

 

[SamTam33]

But lovers of life can also make long lists of all the good things about the world. It's all just opinions and perspectives.

I've wanted to do this for awhile (have someone make a list of good things compared to bad things).

If anyone wants to take me up on that, I'd be down. I'll supply the bad if they supply the good.

I'd bet everything that the bad will outweigh the good.

Edit: I've tried to do it myself but I can't. If I list "flowers" then I'm just going to offset it with "bee stings" LMAO
---
One more thing (as you can probably tell, I'm obsessed with this line of thinking).

But whatever positive things people list, the negative things will occur more frequently.

So if someone says "a baby's laugh." Babies cry more often than they laugh.

If someone says "a sunset." You're going to be in exponentially more traffic jams than you are going to witness sunsets.

If you say "winning on a lottery scratch off ticket," the amount you pay in sales taxes on everything else is going to obliterate your scratch off winnings.

There's no objective way to argue in favor of life as we know it. It's nice to fantasize about. But when you get down to the nitty gritty - life is a grind. Existing is a chore.

 

[WhiteRabbit]

I've wanted to do this for awhile (have someone make a list of good things compared to bad things).

If anyone wants to take me up on that, I'd be down. I'll supply the bad if they supply the good.

I'd bet everything that the bad will outweigh the good.

Edit: I've tried to do it myself but I can't. If I list "flowers" then I'm just going to offset it with "bee stings" LMAO

Even if there are more bad things about life (which is debatable), some people put more weight onto the good things. Everyone has their own values and experiences. Suicidal people generally don't like being called crazy or delusional, so I don't really understand doing it to others.

 

[SamTam33]

Even if there are more bad things about life (which is debatable), some people put more weight onto the good things. Everyone has their own values and experiences. Suicidal people generally don't like being called crazy or delusional, so I don't really understand doing it to others.

But that's my point - REMOVE your own values and experiences and objectively observe life.

Saying that life is beautiful while babies are being molested is crazy.

Those kids are not experiencing a beautiful life.

In other words, I've never been sexually abused or assaulted, but how can I, in good conscience, proclaim that life is grand when I know that there are millions of people who this has happened to?

It would be like a billionaire proclaiming that dropping 100k on a car is affordable. That's unequivocally false.

 

[WhiteRabbit]

But that's my point - REMOVE your own values and experiences and objectively observe life.

Saying that life is beautiful while babies are being molested is crazy.

Those kids are not experiencing a beautiful life.

Does the bad cancel all the good? Does the good cancel all the bad? IDK. It's just opinions.