Resource The Right To No Longer Exist - Street Outreach Video

[TAW122]

After a long time, the founder of TRTNLE has released the footage of Street Outreach.



Besides the

Spoiler: first encounter

A pro-life, preventionist

and

Spoiler: another encounter later in the video

Some religious pro-lifer nutjob

most of the interactions are pretty cool and respectful. I really enjoy their work and I hope their grassroots influence continue to spread across the country and overtime change the social and societal landscape as well as legislation surrounding the right to die. They (TRTNLE) made really good points about the consequences of preventionists and prohibitionists when it comes to suicide. Feel free to give your thoughts and responses to this video.

 

[OceanBlue]

These people don't realize that they are the circus, not the activists. Nice tribute at the end.

Thank you for standing there, talking to the public - the most important, but thankless activity.

 

[Vizzy]

After a long time, the founder of TRTNLE has released the footage of Street Outreach.



Besides the

Spoiler: first encounter

A pro-life, preventionist

and

Spoiler: another encounter later in the video

Some religious pro-lifer nutjob

most of the interactions are pretty cool and respectful. I really enjoy their work and I hope their grassroots influence continue to spread across the country and overtime change the social and societal landscape as well as legislation surrounding the right to die. They (TRTNLE) made really good points about the consequences of preventionists and prohibitionists when it comes to suicide. Feel free to give your thoughts and responses to this video.

This is a good initiative

I think they should stop comparing this with abortion, as a whole just stop mentioning abortion when someone asking what this movement is about, abortion is totally different from legalize suicide because we are talking about grown adults here

 

[OceanBlue]

abortion is totally different from legalize suicide

It's a question of bodily autonomy. Everything that pro-choice abortion activists already know about this can be applied to RtD, it's a good way to explain the issue. This is applicable to RtD even more, as abortion topic has a victim of birth to consider. But as it is unlikely that in reality we can advocate for forced abortions, these two topics go parallel, meaning in both cases people have a right to decide what happens to their bodies.

 

[Vizzy]

It's a question of bodily autonomy. Everything that pro-choice abortion activists already know about this can be applied to RtD, it's a good way to explain the issue. This is applicable to RtD even more, as abortion topic has a victim of birth to consider. But as it is unlikely that in reality we can advocate for forced abortions, these two topics go parallel, meaning in both cases people have a right to decide what happens to their bodies.

In my opinion both the cause don't go parallel and legalize suicide is totally different from abortion, as abortion have a lot of different scenarios and case by case basis but legal euthanasia is like saying everyone above 18 (I personally think it should be 21+) should have the right to die no matter what but I can't say this for abortion as it is more complicated

 

[TAW122]

These people don't realize that they are the circus, not the activists. Nice tribute at the end.

Thank you for standing there, talking to the public - the most important, but thankless activity.

Oh it's not me, and I have never partook in any activism myself. I simply just linked the video on SaSu.

It's a question of bodily autonomy. Everything that pro-choice abortion activists already know about this can be applied to RtD, it's a good way to explain the issue. This is applicable to RtD even more, as abortion topic has a victim of birth to consider. But as it is unlikely that in reality we can advocate for forced abortions, these two topics go parallel, meaning in both cases people have a right to decide what happens to their bodies.

I agree, and while abortion is a separate topic, it does indeed share many similarities and overlap when it comes to "bodily autonomy".

In my opinion both the cause don't go parallel and legalize suicide is totally different from abortion, as abortion have a lot of different scenarios and case by case basis but legal euthanasia is like saying everyone above 18 (I personally think it should be 21+) should have the right to die no matter what but I can't say this for abortion as it is more complicated

While both topics are complex and there are multiple scenarios (with each being different and nuanced), there could be a general benchmark on how one will implement them. Also, I know that some people will choose an age higher than 18 (21, or even 25 or 26) due to the reason of "fully-developed brain", but I'm a bit more lenient with age just drawing the legal line at the age of majority. I chose the age of majority (18 in most countries, including the US) since that is the age in which an individual receives full rights as an legal adult, thus it makes most sense for one to receive the right to die when they are the age of majority. Of course this isn't to say that minors don't get the right to die, they would in certain circumstances (terminal illnesses and severe illnesses, but would require parental/guardian decision as well, because they are legally not considered an adult).

 

[Vizzy]

Oh it's not me, and I have never partook in any activism myself. I simply just linked the video on SaSu.


I agree, and while abortion is a separate topic, it does indeed share many similarities and overlap when it comes to "bodily autonomy".


While both topics are complex and there are multiple scenarios (with each being different and nuanced), there could be a general benchmark on how one will implement them. Also, I know that some people will choose an age higher than 18 (21, or even 25 or 26) due to the reason of "fully-developed brain", but I'm a bit more lenient with age just drawing the legal line at the age of majority. I chose the age of majority (18 in most countries, including the US) since that is the age in which an individual receives full rights as an legal adult, thus it makes most sense for one to receive the right to die when they are the age of majority. Of course this isn't to say that minors don't get the right to die, they would in certain circumstances (terminal illnesses and severe illnesses, but would require parental/guardian decision as well, because they are legally not considered an adult).

Unlike abortion, legal euthanasia don't have complex or multiple scenarios as we are just fighting to allow anyone to do ctb after 18 (I personally think it should be 21+) peacefully and painless with the help of government, it doesn't matter whether the person is healthy or not

 

[heavyeyes]

I'm surprised by the positive interactions and feedback. I really hope this becomes a reality in the future. It would benefit so many people. It would literally save lives.

 

[Forever Sleep]

It's a question of bodily autonomy. Everything that pro-choice abortion activists already know about this can be applied to RtD, it's a good way to explain the issue. This is applicable to RtD even more, as abortion topic has a victim of birth to consider. But as it is unlikely that in reality we can advocate for forced abortions, these two topics go parallel, meaning in both cases people have a right to decide what happens to their bodies.

But in abortion- the child doesn't get to choose. The child doesn't have autonomy- the mother/ parents do. Abortion in that way isn't a form of suicide- it's the euthanizing of an unwanted life- without giving that life the choice.

I am actually in favour of abortion but I think that it is very different to the right to die. I guess there are parallels with bodily autonomy- but that supposes that the baby's life while it is inside the mother BELONGS to the mother- is actually the mother's life in a way- when, I'm not so sure it is.

As an argument- I don't think they align personally. As a right though- I am in favour. I believe the chances of an unwanted child having a good life are even lower than one that is loved.

 

[NoLoveNoHope]

Love the video, they all seem super nice. I'm surprised about the positive interactions but it's great they happened.

 

[TAW122]

I'm surprised by the positive interactions and feedback. I really hope this becomes a reality in the future. It would benefit so many people. It would literally save lives.

Same here, I hope it becomes more accessible, or at the minimum like Canada's current MAiD program at the very least. The difference in Canada and US now is that Canada not only allows those who are terminally ill and whose death is reasonably foreseeable, but also those whose condition is intolerable to the individual in circumstances of his or her condition. That alone, is a BIG STEP up from the US's existing death with dignity (US's equivalent of MAID) laws in the states that have it.

But in abortion- the child doesn't get to choose. The child doesn't have autonomy- the mother/ parents do. Abortion in that way isn't a form of suicide- it's the euthanizing of an unwanted life- without giving that life the choice.

I am actually in favour of abortion but I think that it is very different to the right to die. I guess there are parallels with bodily autonomy- but that supposes that the baby's life while it is inside the mother BELONGS to the mother- is actually the mother's life in a way- when, I'm not so sure it is.

As an argument- I don't think they align personally. As a right though- I am in favour. I believe the chances of an unwanted child having a good life are even lower than one that is loved.

I'm also in favor of abortion, a woman's right to choose whether to conceive a child or not.

Love the video, they all seem super nice. I'm surprised about the positive interactions but it's great they happened.

Yeah I was thinking that there could have been more negative interactions, but besides the two or three (if you count the person who didn't even bother to interact), most others are pretty reasonable and willing to listen (even if they don't agree).

 

[squirley]

Same here, I hope it becomes more accessible, or at the minimum like Canada's current MAiD program at the very least. The difference in Canada and US now is that Canada not only allows those who are terminally ill and whose death is reasonably foreseeable, but also those whose condition is intolerable to the individual in circumstances of his or her condition. That alone, is a BIG STEP up from the US's existing death with dignity (US's equivalent of MAID) laws in the states that have it.

Thanks for bringing this is up. I didn't realize all the updates and new bills either passed or in the works in regards to MAiD in Canada.
( 2021-2023)
The new bill C-39 is delaying the persons with solely mental illness suffering. (2024)
But then it also says:
"You do not need to have a fatal or terminal condition to be eligible for medical assistance in dying."
But than also have a 90 day assessment period.
I understand the need for safe guards but it almost contradicts itself at the same.time.
I have a lot of reading to do.

For some odd reason I always thought you had to be like 60...70...80 years old or with a illness or physical disability of sorts.

Anyway thanks for bringing it up.
I didn't realize Canada was going in this direction. It will be very interesting to see what happens in the near future.

 

[Rob1984]

I read through their entire website. It'd be nice if they detailed or expressed what the ideal procedure would entail (waiting period, tests, consultations, etc). There's a big difference between having suicide booths (like in Futurama), where someone can just ctb at any moment, and having to go through an entire process that includes a waiting period/consultation/etc.

Also, they say they "strive for a society guided by facts and reason, not faith and superstition", yet that contradicts the foundation of their beliefs (which I'll explain). First, they are anti-natalist and sentiocentric, so they believe existence is the root of our problems and that humans should stop procreating. They go on to say "only in death will our problems be fixed." But that's the contradiction. Their foundation does not rely on "facts and reason." They are no different than the religious people who rely on "faith and superstition" that they themselves oppose. Why? Because nobody knows what the fuck happens when we die. There is no evidence or facts to tell us. So somebody who thinks they will meet God after death and somebody who thinks they will disappear after death are both relying on belief and assumptions, not facts. To claim death fixes all of our problems (when you have zero proof of what happens when we die) is a weak claim, but more importantly, is self-contradicting when you strive to rely on facts about the world and existence.

They are also assuming we did not exist before taking the form of a human. They don't believe in anything non-physical about existence. But again, there is no proof either way of this. They are relying on the opposition to prove their beliefs, which the opposition cannot prove, but that does not suddenly make their own beliefs true. It just brings everyone to an impasse where nobody can prove jack shit about the grand scheme of existence.

I consider myself pro-choice, but as you can tell, I have problems with these people's philosophy on life. To me, it's no different than religious people going around preaching about the afterlife. The reality is, none of us truly know, so stop acting like you know better than others just because you give them the burden of proof.

 

[BlindsClosed]

I read through their entire website. It'd be nice if they detailed or expressed what the ideal procedure would entail (waiting period, tests, consultations, etc). There's a big difference between having suicide booths (like in Futurama), where someone can just ctb at any moment, and having to go through an entire process that includes a waiting period/consultation/etc.

Also, they say they "strive for a society guided by facts and reason, not faith and superstition", yet that contradicts the foundation of their beliefs (which I'll explain). First, they are anti-natalist and sentiocentric, so they believe existence is the root of our problems and that humans should stop procreating. They go on to say "only in death will our problems be fixed." But that's the contradiction. Their foundation does not rely on "facts and reason." They are no different than the religious people who rely on "faith and superstition" that they themselves oppose. Why? Because nobody knows what the fuck happens when we die. There is no evidence or facts to tell us. So somebody who thinks they will meet God after death and somebody who thinks they will disappear after death are both relying on belief and assumptions, not facts. To claim death fixes all of our problems (when you have zero proof of what happens when we die) is a weak claim, but more importantly, is self-contradicting when you strive to rely on facts about the world and existence.

They are also assuming we did not exist before taking the form of a human. They don't believe in anything non-physical about existence. But again, there is no proof either way of this. They are relying on the opposition to prove their beliefs, which the opposition cannot prove, but that does not suddenly make their own beliefs true. It just brings everyone to an impasse where nobody can prove jack shit about the grand scheme of existence.

I consider myself pro-choice, but as you can tell, I have problems with these people's philosophy on life. To me, it's no different than religious people going around preaching about the afterlife. The reality is, none of us truly know, so stop acting like you know better than others just because you give them the burden of proof.

Keep being a weak fence-sitter about death while they are actually doing something that fights for our rights. You're the one with the incorrect logic. Just because someone says they don't believe in god, doesn't mean they have some massive burden of proof. They are fighting against the claims theists are making, which is the backbone to almost every problem, especially the right to die. ...You also talk about how can they know they didn't exist prior to life? Are you kidding? You might as well say they can't prove the tooth fairy doesn't exist so they are contradictive. Death literally solves 100% of that person's problems when they die. If you can't get that simple 2+2 logic then you'll get nowhere. Go on believing in Karma, reincarnation, Reiki healing crystals, and whatever bullshit you have in your silly mind, while they are doing SOMETHING to help the situation, unlike 99.99% of everyone on this site or planet earth.

These people don't realize that they are the circus, not the activists. Nice tribute at the end.

Thank you for standing there, talking to the public - the most important, but thankless activity.

Better than nobody doing anything at all, imo. It puts ideas in people's heads. That's all that matters.

 

[Rob1984]

Death literally solves 100% of that person's problems when they die.

You can't say that when you don't know what happens when we die. You're making an assumption that when we die, we cease to exist entirely. But there is zero proof of that, the same way there is zero proof of an afterlife. If you believe we disappear when we die, you are no different than a religious person who claims there is an afterlife. One cannot say death solves 100% of our problems when one doesn't know what death truly and entirely entails.

 

[Vizzy]

You can't say that when you don't know what happens when we die. You're making an assumption that when we die, we cease to exist entirely. But there is zero proof of that, the same way there is zero proof of an afterlife. If you believe we disappear when we die, you are no different than a religious person who claims there is an afterlife. One cannot say death solves 100% of our problems when one doesn't know what death truly and entirely entails.

So what you trying to say people should not do ctb?

 

[Rob1984]

So what you trying to say people should not do ctb?

?

 

[Vizzy]

You can't say that when you don't know what happens when we die. You're making an assumption that when we die, we cease to exist entirely. But there is zero proof of that, the same way there is zero proof of an afterlife. If you believe we disappear when we die, you are no different than a religious person who claims there is an afterlife. One cannot say death solves 100% of our problems when one doesn't know what death truly and entirely entails.

You just made this statement so what's your conclusion?

People can do ctb or not ? If they want

 

[Rob1984]

You just made this statement so what's your conclusion?

People can do ctb or not ? If they want

I'm confused why you are conflating the mystery of death with one's right to ctb? They are separate topics

 

[Vizzy]

I'm confused why you are conflating the mystery of death with one's right to ctb? They are separate topics

Humans made up everything even your term mystery of death is a made up one, humans are so good in creating something which doesn't exist and good in spreading that stupidity to others

We all see what happens when someone die still we make up things with no proof, you and me are just in a cycle of life, we born, we die and nature does the process after we die!

 

[BlindsClosed]

You can't say that when you don't know what happens when we die. You're making an assumption that when we die, we cease to exist entirely. But there is zero proof of that, the same way there is zero proof of an afterlife. If you believe we disappear when we die, you are no different than a religious person who claims there is an afterlife. One cannot say death solves 100% of our problems when one doesn't know what death truly and entirely entails.

I think you're misunderstanding the idea here... Say a person has 100k in debt, major back pain, depression, bad divorce, child support, etc... Death fixes every single one of those "earthy" things. I think that's the point being made and those types of fixed problems are irrelevant to an afterlife or not.