Russia has become dystopian for queer people.

[RainAndSadness]

So a while ago I covered the Supreme Court in the US overturning Roe v. Wade and I pointed to the extremely problematic implications of that decision for women's rights and a possible dystopian future for many minorities in the US if they started to overturn other Supreme Court decisions such as same-sex marriage.

The US is moving backwards.

It looks like it has happened. The Supreme Court in the US decided to overturn Roe v. Wade and essentially ban abortion in approximately every red state instantly, thanks to implemented triggers laws in these states. There was a leaked document that confirmed the decision of the court months ago...

sanctioned-suicide.net

Well it turns out Russia has outpaced the US, let's take a look at the timeline of 2023.

Back in July earlier this year, Putin signed a law making legal gender change, gender-reassingment procedures and hormone replacement therapy illegal.

Vladimir Putin signs law banning gender changes in Russia

Legislation outlaws medical interventions ‘aimed at changing the sex of a person’ and altering gender details in public records

www.theguardian.com

Putin Signs Law Banning Gender-Reassignment Surgery, Hormonal Therapy

Russian President Vladimir Putin on July 24 signed into law a ban on gender-reassignment surgery and hormone therapy done as part of the gender-transition process.

www.rferl.org

In November, just a few days ago, the Supreme Court of Russia declared the "LGBT movement" an extremist organisation and banned "all activities associated with it" in the country.

Russia's Supreme Court bans "LGBT movement" as "extremist"

Russia's Supreme Court ruled on Thursday that LGBT activists should be designated as "extremists", in a move that representatives of gay and transgender people fear will lead to arrests and prosecutions.

www.reuters.com

And in December, the police has already raided the first gay bars in Moscow as a result of the Supreme Court's decision.

Police raid Moscow gay bars after a Supreme Court ruling labeled LGBTQ+ movement 'extremist'

Russian security forces raided gay clubs and bars across Moscow after the Supreme Court banned what it called the “global LGBTQ+ movement."

apnews.com

These decisions are mind-baffling. I'm not quite sure how you can even label the "LGBT movement" as an extremist organisation, how does that even work and where does it end? Sadly the vague definition of that ruling gives the state full reign to crack down on any kind of activism and it makes advocating for your rights nearly impossible

So we have finally reached a stage in where gay bars are being raided by the police, in 2023. This is uttely concerning, Russia has outpaced the US in it's trajectory for regression. We already got a glimpse into this dystopian future when Russia passed an anti-gay law back in 2013, making "homosexual propaganda" in the presence of minors illegal, which is very similiar to Florida's "don't say gay" law, which has been signed into effect one year ago. So Russia already set a precedent and inspired future law makers to implement similiarly regressive laws over nine years ago. And in 2020, Russia legally banned same-sex marriage for good, which has been ruled a human rights violation by the ECHR.

I feel sorry for everyone who is queer and lives in Russia today. These are extremely concerning developments and it's disheartening to see that we have reached a stage again, where gay bars are being raided, talking about queer relationships is being considered propaganda and trans people are literally being erased from society again. This gives us insight into a mindset that should never have been ressurected again and what could happen in other countries if we're not careful. And I've already pointed out in my thread about the overturning of Roe v. Wade one year ago that the US isn't immune to this kind of development. And we can see with Russia, it's totally possible for countries to do a 180 and regress back into the past again.

It's important to remain vigilant and fight back against this kind of oppressive law making. No matter how comfortable you are right now with your rights, we should never take them for granted. The people who oppose autonomy and freedom don't rest, ever - until they have achieved their goals. We shouldn't either.

 

[Tesha]

This was unfortunately always on the cards. Putin apparently annexed parts of Ukraine to uphold his conservative views and to protect traditional Russian values from Western influence. LGBT didn't fit his irrational narrative.

It's very backward thinking, and he's doing a real disservice to the younger Russian generation, but he won't live much longer and will be replaced by someone who probably has more than two brain cells. I just hope the LGBT community isn't damaged too much before then.

As for the US, the political landscape only involves two parties - as long as the voters keep flitting between the two, I think there will be slow positive progress.

I personally think Putin is just a little frustrated that he hasn't met the right man yet. He'd make a good Chub.

 

[Terranova]

its fucked up to me that my father idolizes Russia and Putin for their cruelty towards queer people, he says "atleast they know who they are", it annoys me specially because he's not even a politically aware person he's just a narcissistic asshole

 

[BarnabasCollins]

It's sad. Just so sad, irrational, and pathetic that this happens in the 21st Century. My heart breaks.

 

[Ε. Η. R.]

These decisions are mind-baffling. I'm not quite sure how you can even label the "LGBT movement" as an extremist organisation, how does that even work and where does it end?

It will end (has already begun) worse than it was before.
Earlier, even before the law that was adopted this summer: in any court in russia, a transwoman could be freely misgendered. The same applied to any government institutions and hospitals. The situation with the "police" in russia, and transgenders, queers - is even worse. "people" could attack and there would be nothing for it. I went through all this a long time ago, and for 12 years.

russians, like all the peoples of the commonwealth of independent states - extremely transphobic, homophobic by they nature. The russian government skillfully manipulates their citizens, knowing this fact.

I think that lgbt people of the USA and European countries have nothing to worry about. First of all, the mentality of russians and the mentality of peoples of the United States and European countries are too different. And it's not just about mentality.
Secondly, russia will never approach the USA level of development.
Thirdly, in russia all movements take ugly forms. Unfortunately, this also applies to lgbt social groups in russia.
People in the States will not allow what happened in russia to happen.

RainAndSadness, even if my words seem racist to you - the facts speak for themselves.
In the russian duma there are at least 5 percent gays, bisexuals, and lesbians. But nevertheless, in 2023, they all unanimously supported three anti-lgbt bills.

 

[リンさん]

Russian queer woman here.

Yet another great reason as to why I'm on this forum in the first place. This country is hell on Earth.

 

[BarnabasCollins]

Russian queer woman here.

Yet another great reason as to why I'm on this forum in the first place. This country is hell on Earth.

I can't imagine your strength and courage. I have so much respect for you. Keep being you. I'm sorry Russia is so horrible to you just for being born different, but you're so much better than backwards viewpoints and laws.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

It will end (has already begun) worse than it was before.
Earlier, even before the law that was adopted this summer: in any court in russia, a transwoman could be freely misgendered. The same applied to any government institutions and hospitals. The situation with the "police" in russia, and transgenders, queers - is even worse. "people" could attack and there would be nothing for it. I went through all this a long time ago, and for 12 years.

russians, like all the peoples of the commonwealth of independent states - extremely transphobic, homophobic by they nature. The russian government skillfully manipulates their citizens, knowing this fact.

I think that lgbt people of the USA and European countries have nothing to worry about. First of all, the mentality of russians and the mentality of peoples of the United States and European countries are too different. And it's not just about mentality.
Secondly, russia will never approach the USA level of development.
Thirdly, in russia all movements take ugly forms. Unfortunately, this also applies to lgbt social groups in russia.
People in the States will not allow what happened in russia to happen.

RainAndSadness, even if my words seem racist to you - the facts speak for themselves.
In the russian duma there are at least 5 percent gays, bisexuals, and lesbians. But nevertheless, in 2023, they all unanimously supported three anti-lgbt bills.

I'm sorry, but no. RainandSadness is completely in the right in worrying about the potential future of lgbtq+ people in the US. Acts of anti-lgbtq+ violence, propaganda, and demonstrations have been on the rise recently and I've actually seen a lot of Americans online supporting Russia and it's anti-lgbtq+ policies. In reality, the mentality of a lot of Americans and even Europeans aren't actually that different from Russians. As RainandSadness pointed out, we are already seeing this bigotry reaching government and it's likely only going to get worse if no action is taken.

Year-to-Date Snapshot: 2023 Anti-LGBTQ+ State Legislative Activity

• Over 520 anti-LGBTQ+ bills have been introduced in state legislatures, a record;
• Over 220 bills specifically target transgender and non-binary people, also a record; and
• A record 70 anti-LGBTQ laws have been enacted so far this year, including:
  • Laws banning gender affirming care for transgender youth: 15
  • Laws requiring or allowing misgendering of transgender students: 7
  • Laws targeting drag performances: 2
  • Laws creating a license to discriminate: 3
  • Laws censoring school curriculum, including books: 4

Notable 2023 Trends & Topline Analysis

• There have been more anti-LGBTQ+ bills introduced in state houses this year than in each of the previous five years; with the increase in LGBTQ Erasure bills, bills that strip away dozens of legal protections and rights for LGBTQ+ people, coming as the newest form of attacks on the community
• More than 125 bills would prevent trans youth from being able to access age-appropriate, medically-necessary, best-practice health care, in addition to more than 45 bills banning transgender students from playing school sports and more than 30 "bathroom bills," a figure that exceeds the number bathroom bills filed in any previous year.
• Some states that have been the most aggressive in advancing anti-LGBTQ+ laws include Florida, North Dakota, Tennessee, and Texas

Notable Bills Advanced in the Past Week (updated as of May 22, 2023)

• More than 145 anti-LGBTQ+ bills have passed at least one chamber this calendar year. Some notable bills that advanced this past week or may advance this week include:
• Arizona:
  • SB 1040: would ban trans students and school personnel from using school restrooms that match their gender identity and allows people to sue schools if they share a restroom or similar school facility with a trans person.
• Louisiana:
  • HB 648: would ban gender affirming care for transgender youth
• Ohio:
  • HB 6: would prohibit transgender students from participating in school sports
  • SB 83: would restrict diversity, equity, and inclusion programs or trainings
• South Carolina:
  • H. 3728: would censor curriculum and prohibit schools from requiring gender or sexual diversity counseling or training for students and staff.
• Texas:
  • SB 17: would prohibit diversity, equity, and inclusion offices at state colleges and universities
  • SB 12: would criminalize drag performances
• The following bills have additionally been enacted into law.
• Florida:
  • HB 1069: silences educators by prohibiting any instruction on sexual orientation or gender identity from Pre-K through 8th grade, expanding the "Don't Say LGBTQ+ Law" passed last year
  • SB 254: penalizes providers by inflicting criminal penalties (including felony penalties) on providers who give gender-affirming care; takes licenses away from those providers; and it prohibits Medicare from covering gender-affirming care for transgender youth or adults. It also forbids public funds, including those of a public university, public hospital, city, or county, and Medicare, from being used to provide benefits that include gender-affirming care – for transgender people of all ages. And – uniquely – it allows the state to use gender-affirming care or the "risk" of such care for a child as a reason to give Florida family courts exceptional jurisdiction to set aside another state's custody determination
  • HB 1521: would criminalize transgender people for using the restroom that matches their gender identity
• Montana:
  • SB 518: allows schools to misgender and forcibly out transgender and non-binary students
  • SB 458: LGBTQ+ Erasure bill, adopts an anti-LGBTQ definition of "sex" that now impacts the entirety of Montana law
  • HB 676: allows parents to withdraw students from public school if they disagree with the lesson plan of the day
• Nebraska:
  • LB 574: prohibits transgender youth from receiving age-appropriate, best practice gender affirming healthcare and will also prohibit abortions after 12 weeks of pregnancy
• Tennessee:
  • HB 239: LGBTQ+ Erasure bill, establishes an anti-LGBTQ definition of "sex" in state statute
  • HB 158: prohibits public education institutions from requiring implicit bias trainings
  • HB 1269: allows for the intentional misgendering and deadnaming of transgender and non-binary students by their teachers
• Additional bills that are in the final stages in the legislature or are awaiting signature from the state's governor:
• Florida:
  • SB 170: would discourage cities from passing non-discrimination ordinances by raising the barriers to proposing ordinances and making it easier to challenge ordinances in court
• Iowa:
  • SF 496: would ban classroom discussions that touch on LGBTQ+ topics in grades K-6, and would also require schools to forcibly out transgender students
  • SF 391/HF 327: would censor info about HIV and AIDS from required curriculum standards
• Louisiana:
  • HB 648: would ban gender affirming care for transgender youth
  • HB 466: would impose a "Don't Say LGBTQ+" style curriculum censorship law
• Missouri:
  • SB 39: would ban transgender students from participating in school sports
  • SB 49: would ban gender affirming care for transgender youth
• Texas:
  • SB 14: would ban gender affirming care for transgender youth
  • SB 15: would prohibit transgender students from participating in sports at public universities
  • SB 763: would allow for chaplains to serve as public school counselors

Roundup of Anti-LGBTQ+ Legislation Advancing In States Across the Country

The Human Rights Campaign — the nation’s largest lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and queer (LGBTQ+) civil rights organization — is providing the a snapshot (updated weekly) to illustrate the hostile legislative climate facing LGBTQ+ people, and the scale and scope with which the ongoing...

www.hrc.org

Key Trends

• Anti-LGBT+ mobilization — including demonstrations, political violence, and offline propaganda activity — has risen to its highest levels since ACLED started collecting data for the United States in 2020
• Nearly 200 anti-LGBT+ incidents have been reported so far this year, marking an increase of three times compared to 2021 and 12 times compared to 20201​
  • Acts of political violence targeting the LGBT+ community have more than tripled compared to 2021
  • Anti-LGBT+ demonstrations have more than doubled relative to 2021
• Far-right militias and militant social movements like the Proud Boys have ramped up their engagement in anti-LGBT+ demonstrations by over three times this year compared to 2021

UPDATE | Fact Sheet: Anti-LGBT+ Mobilization on the Rise in the United States

Anti-LGBT+ mobilization has risen to its highest levels since ACLED started collecting data for the United States in 2020.

acleddata.com

Also, all major movements take ugly forms. If you ever looked into the history of any big movement there is nearly always some sort of ugly aspect to it. When talking about movements advocating for the rights of oppressed demographics in particular, violence and "ugliness" only really arises when nothing else works. These groups usually start off protesting peacefully before eventually getting violent as a result of not being listened to, defending themselves from oppressors trying to harm and silence them, and due to the situation they are in becoming dire.

With that in mind, most lgbtq+ movements in Russia are likely peaceful anyway and it's clear that they are only being labelled as "extremists" due to discrimination. The same thing has happened to plenty of other movements advocating for the rights of others in the past.

 

[DazaiKinnie]

My country is going backwards on rights too. Mine is a post-soviet country that still sadly has a conservative influence from Russia. HRT is legal but same-sex marriage is illegal under the constitution. There are some news articles where queer people got attacked as part of an attack motivated by hatred and bigotry. My country has very old people in it since most young people leave to live abroad. There is a new party that appeared a few years ago AUR, it's not that different from Putin's party in Russia, now in 2023 they seem to be winning and they are being voted by old stupid people. I am sure that if they win in the next or so years Romania will become hell for queer people for sure, it already was bad for us here, it will be even more so if that party wins.

 

[Meditation guide]

Putin need cannon fodder for his war in Ukraine so I suspect it's for purely practical reasons somehow.
The military needs to be very conforming for him. People to him are merely to wage war and get killed.

 

[Justnotme]

In this world, mentally ill living organisms want to control us, who somehow have power over us.
I hate this world.
I am sincerely sorry that a person can be beaten and punished for loving a person who is of the same sex as himself. A person can be beaten and punished for wanting to be of a different gender.
But we release rapists and murderers from prison, who then kill and rape people again anyway!! And knackers are not punished at all!
It's just a planet of death, where people and animals are tormented by the cruel mind of other human beings!
I have long believed that life is not what happens on this planet, but what happens after death. Even if there is "nothing" after death

 

[justcallmeJ]

Putin really wants to speedrun being one of the worst people alive. I feel so sorry for all the queer people in Russia. They alreayd had it hard. I hope things there will change for the better.

 

[Ε. Η. R.]

Acts of anti-lgbtq+ violence, propaganda, and demonstrations have been on the rise recently and I've actually seen a lot of Americans online supporting Russia and it's anti-lgbtq+ policies.

It is, of course, terrible - the laws that have been passed in some States. However, some States, as some European countries, are the best places for lgbt people in this world. And russia is the bottom in terms of lgbt rights, in terms of human rights and freedoms. The gap between the bottom (rus) and the best countries is huge. This is what I meant.

In reality, the mentality of a lot of Americans and even Europeans aren't actually that different from Russians.

Have you lived in russia to say this? Did you spend your childhood in russia being a European, or American?

These groups usually start off protesting peacefully before eventually getting violent as a result of not being listened to, defending themselves from oppressors trying to harm and silence them, and due to the situation they are in becoming dire.

First, a show of force towards those who infringe on the rights of your social group - this is not ugly forms. On the contrary, this is good.
By ugly forms I meant: when members of the same social group, of the same kind - torture, hounding and cruelly betray their own. This is what I meant by that phrase.

 

[GriffonGuard]

I'm sorry, but no. RainandSadness is completely in the right in worrying about the potential future of lgbtq+ people in the US. Acts of anti-lgbtq+ violence, propaganda, and demonstrations have been on the rise recently and I've actually seen a lot of Americans online supporting Russia and it's anti-lgbtq+ policies. In reality, the mentality of a lot of Americans and even Europeans aren't actually that different from Russians. As RainandSadness pointed out, we are already seeing this bigotry reaching government and it's likely only going to get worse if no action is taken.

Roundup of Anti-LGBTQ+ Legislation Advancing In States Across the Country

The Human Rights Campaign — the nation’s largest lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and queer (LGBTQ+) civil rights organization — is providing the a snapshot (updated weekly) to illustrate the hostile legislative climate facing LGBTQ+ people, and the scale and scope with which the ongoing...

www.hrc.org

UPDATE | Fact Sheet: Anti-LGBT+ Mobilization on the Rise in the United States

Anti-LGBT+ mobilization has risen to its highest levels since ACLED started collecting data for the United States in 2020.

acleddata.com

Also, all major movements take ugly forms. If you ever looked into the history of any big movement there is nearly always some sort of ugly aspect to it. When talking about movements advocating for the rights of oppressed demographics in particular, violence and "ugliness" only really arises when nothing else works. These groups usually start off protesting peacefully before eventually getting violent as a result of not being listened to, defending themselves from oppressors trying to harm and silence them, and due to the situation they are in becoming dire.

With that in mind, most lgbtq+ movements in Russia are likely peaceful anyway and it's clear that they are only being labelled as "extremists" due to discrimination. The same thing has happened to plenty of other movements advocating for the rights of others in the past.

I think you are partially right. People like to pretend they are fundamentally different from their "enemies". In reality, there are definitely people in the West who think similarly to those in power and Russia.

Though he is certainly homophobic, I don't think Putin really thinks the LGBT movement is as destructive as he says it is. He is just using "traditional values" as a tool to promote his illiberal, anti-Western ideology. Putin loves to prop himself up as a savior of marginalized/oppressed people: ethnic minorities in Russia are some of his strongest supporters. But his actions show that he doesn't give a shit about anyone who isn't useful to him, and that he will gladly cause harm to marginalized groups if it promotes his own worldview. It's sad that so many peoples' lives are being harmed for the sake of this pathetic propaganda.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

I think you are partially right. People like to pretend they are fundamentally different from their "enemies". In reality, there are definitely people in the West who think similarly to those in power and Russia.

Though he is certainly homophobic, I don't think Putin really thinks the LGBT movement is as destructive as he says it is. He is just using "traditional values" as a tool to promote his illiberal, anti-Western ideology. Putin loves to prop himself up as a savior of marginalized/oppressed people: ethnic minorities in Russia are some of his strongest supporters. But his actions show that he doesn't give a shit about anyone who isn't useful to him, and that he will gladly cause harm to marginalized groups if it promotes his own worldview. It's sad that so many peoples' lives are being harmed for the sake of this pathetic propaganda.

Yeah, I agree. He's definitely mislabelling them for his own traditional values. It's awful.

It is, of course, terrible - the laws that have been passed in some States. However, some States, as some European countries, are the best places for lgbt people in this world. And russia is the bottom in terms of lgbt rights, in terms of human rights and freedoms. The gap between the bottom (rus) and the best countries is huge. This is what I meant.

Even the best places in the US for lgbtq+ people still harbour a lot of people who are discriminatory towards them. In Europe, the treatment of lgbtq+ people can vary wildly depending on which country you are in. You're probably going to face less discrimination in Iceland than in Poland. Discriminaton against queer people might be more subtle in certain parts of the US and Europe, but it's there and it's only getting less subtle over time.

It's important that we recognize this and start trying to deal with it now, instead of gloating about how great these places are for lgbtq+ people. The bar for "best place for lgbtq+" is on the floor and with the recent uptick in violence against them, we should be more focused on trying to stop this violence and discrimination from continuing.

Have you lived in russia to say this? Did you spend your childhood in russia being a European, or American?

I've met people from Russia before and I've met people from the US and Europe. The differences in their mentalities isn't as big as you seem to think they are. I've seen plenty from both sides who whole-heartedly support the lgbtq+ community and plenty who do not. I've seen Europeans and Americans who have gone out of their to support the Russian government's policies and laws against queer people and claim that they wished their country would follow suit.

First, a show of force towards those who infringe on the rights of your social group - this is not ugly forms. On the contrary, this is good.
By ugly forms I meant: when members of the same social group, of the same kind - torture, hounding and cruelly betray their own. This is what I meant by that phrase.

Yeah, how do I break it to you that what you've described happens in plenty of movements still. Fighting for rights can be incredibly ugly at times, especially as the situation for those who are oppressed worsens. Also, as I've mentioned before, most of the people fighting for lgbtq+ rights in Russia are likely doing so peacefully. The "extremsist" label is due to discrimination against them. It's to make them look bad.

 

[Raindancer]

What is happening around the world is terrifying. Don't feel bad as in the US many Christians are now labeled as terrorist groups. This labeling of people and quelling free speech needs to stop. Governments are gaining way too much power. We are totally in dystopian times.

 

[ADeadBunny]

I don't have much of anything constructive to offer, but that's what people do. People want to feel like god and hurting others is the best way to get a taste of it.

Whether you're a dictator, terrorist, pastor, politician, parent or redneck racist. Everyone wants to know what it feels like to get their way and be able to punish those who oppose it. Right now the people that everyone wants to punish are queer people.

It pains me to know that others born just like me will suffer just as I have, for no reason other than ego. I cannot stop it, how I would do anything to make the suffering stop. It's a deep pain to feel this helpless. I hope others stronger than me can stop these attrocities, but I know it's only going to get worse. Those in power will only want more, they won't stop until they own the world. They'll stand on our necks just for the view.

I know that isn't comforting, but it's what it feels like to me. I can only pray for the wellbeing of the children of the future. I pray for the future of others like me because I won't be around to know what it's like.

 

[lament.]

This is just disgusting.

 

[hellispink]

We should all be allowed to be who we want to be and love who we want to love. Russia is such a big country. I cant imagine living there being oppressed every second and minute for being me. It has to be hell honestly. This world is fucked everywhere there is no salvation anymore

 

[Ε. Η. R.]

I've met people from Russia before and I've met people from the US and Europe. The differences in their mentalities isn't as big as you seem to think they are. I've seen plenty from both sides who whole-heartedly support the lgbtq+ community and plenty who do not. I've seen Europeans and Americans who have gone out of their to support the Russian government's policies and laws against queer people and claim that they wished their country would follow suit.

But the fact is that you did not live in russia, being European by blood. I'm German. I live in russia, unfortunately. I know what the russians core is like (If you understand this wording). And knowing their core (nature) they could very well be lying to you. Moreover, russians will never behave in the USA and European countries the way they do in the сommonwealth of independent states countries.

You're probably going to face less discrimination in Iceland than in Poland.

Yes. Poland in this regard differs from other European countries. But, nevertheless, the situation in Poland for lgbt+ people is better than in russia, mind you.

I've met people from Russia before and I've met people from the US and Europe. The differences in their mentalities isn't as big as you seem to think they are. I've seen plenty from both sides who whole-heartedly support the lgbtq+ community and plenty who do not. I've seen Europeans and Americans who have gone out of their to support the Russian government's policies and laws against queer people and claim that they wished their country would follow suit.

people who support government policies (how wrong they think - thinking they understand the situation), but they don't attack lgbt+ people, don't insult - that's one thing.
When you are openly attacked on the street, when you are discriminated against in court and your rights are violated, when you are forcibly locked into a nuthouse in the men's ward (if you a transwoman) - this is completely different. they did all this to me. Have you been through this?
And after this you will teach me? you will talk about your experience of communicating with russians?
I wish I could tell you where to go...

It's important that we recognize this and start trying to deal with it now, instead of gloating about how great these places are for lgbtq+ people.

There was not a drop of gloating in my words on this matter.

Yeah, how do I break it to you that what you've described happens in plenty of movements still. Fighting for rights can be incredibly ugly at times, especially as the situation for those who are oppressed worsens. Also, as I've mentioned before, most of the people fighting for lgbtq+ rights in Russia are likely doing so peacefully.

Again you don't understand what I'm talking about.
First of all, you are used to the fact that the USA and European countries are full of organizations, as well as lgbt+ members themselves, that support each other. When in russia, in commonwealth of independent states countries only a handful of people were doing this all the time. And they were "engaged in protection" - this is loudly said. I remember how it was.
Secondly, it is much worse when within social groups of lgbt cruel betrayals and hounding occur. This is the worst. Get a knife in the back from your own kind. Much worse than what I mentioned above.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

But the fact is that you did not live in russia, being European by blood. I'm German. I live in russia, unfortunately. I know what the russians core is like (If you understand this wording). And knowing their core (nature) they could very well be lying to you. Moreover, russians will never behave in the USA and European countries the way they do in the сommonwealth of independent states countries.

One, generalizing Russians? Really? Are they all apart of some sort of hivemind or something? Do all of them think the same to you? It seems as though you hold a lot of predujices towards them and it's quite frankly, pathetic.

Yes. Poland in this regard differs from other European countries. But, nevertheless, the situation in Poland for lgbt+ people is better than in russia, mind you.

Not by a lot.

people who support government policies (how wrong they think - thinking they understand the situation), but they don't attack lgbt+ people, don't insult - that's one thing.
When you are openly attacked on the street, when you are discriminated against in court and your rights are violated, when you are forcibly locked into a nuthouse in the men's ward (if you a transwoman) - this is completely different. they did all this to me. Have you been through this?
And after this you will teach me? you will talk about your experience of communicating with russians?
I wish I could tell you where to go...

Again, you can find plenty of Americans and Eurpoeans who do the same thing. As I've hightlighted before, there has been an increase in acts of political violence against lgtbq+ people in recently and many queer people, especially trans people, have spoken up about the fact that they've been attacked before because of them being lgbtq+. Did you also just forget about shit, like the Orlando nightclub shooting or the Colorado Springs nightclub shooting?

Do you not realize that trans people are still sent to units that are for the gender they don't identify as?

NBC News was able to confirm only 15 cases in which these prisoners were housed according to their lived gender​

Few transgender prisoners are housed according to their identity — putting many in danger

Out of 4,890 transgender state prisoners, NBC News was able to confirm only 15 cases in which a prisoner was housed according to their lived gender.

www.nbcnews.com

Did you foget about Tory Minister Keni Badenoch wanting to change the legal definition of sex in order to strip tans people of their rights and protections?

I'm starting to doubt that you even give a shit about lgbtq+ people. Your only using that community to help further your weird xenophobic views towards Russians.

Again you don't understand what I'm talking about.
First of all, you are used to the fact that the USA and European countries are full of organizations, as well as lgbt+ members themselves, that support each other. When in russia, in commonwealth of independent states countries only a handful of people were doing this all the time. And they were "engaged in protection" - this is loudly said. I remember how it was.
Secondly, it is much worse when within social groups of lgbt cruel betrayals and hounding occur. This is the worst. Get a knife in the back from your own kind. Much worse than what I mentioned above.

So, we're just going to pretend like lgbtq+ people who go out of ther way to betray their own community don't exist in the West? Blair White, Kelly Cardigan, Christian Walker, Caityln Jenner, and all the other queer right-wing grifters who have gone out of their way to throw their own community under the bus for fame/clout, money, and acceptance from the right just don't exists? Organizations, like Gays Against Groomers, the far-right American orgainzation that is against things, such as against gender-affirming care for minors and school curriculums that teach young people lgbtq+ content, just don't exist? Betrayals and back stabbings happen everywhere. Do you know how many times I've come across queer people from the US and Europe who've gone out of their way to discriminate against other queer people and throw them under the bus? Do you know how rampant acephobia is within the lgbtq+ community? How common it is for white queer people to discriminate against and throw queer poc under the bus? How common it is for gay people to discriminate against lesbians and bi/pan people? For trans people to try and exclude nonbinary people from the community? For bi people and pan people to continually bash each other?

Backstabbing is rampant in most communities and movements, and the lgbtq+ movements in Europe and the US are no exception. Acting as though this is something that only happens amongst Russians is idiotic and only goes to show off your biases against them.

 

[Ε. Η. R.]

Again, you can find plenty of Americans and Eurpoeans who do the same thing. As I've hightlighted before, there has been an increase in acts of political violence against lgtbq+ people in recently and many queer people, especially trans people, have spoken up about the fact that they've been attacked before because of them being lgbtq+. Did you also just forget about shit, like the Orlando nightclub shooting or the Colorado Springs nightclub shooting?

That is, you did not live in russia, being a transgender, but you claim that the terrible attitude towards lgbt+ people, the situations, is not much different from those in the USA and European countries. This is exactly your words that look pathetic, deceitful, hypocritical.

First of all, I described to you the situations that happened in russia before 2018. After 2020, public (among citizens) and political attitudes towards lgbt+ people began to deteriorate even worse.
Secondly, you will never prove to me that even in the courts of the most republican states, the attitude towards transgender people is just as terrible, inhumane, as in russia, сommonwealth of independent states countries.
It's the same with nuthouses. you gave an example of an exception, which is sought out in the USA and European countries. And they are doing the right thing by looking for and publishing such cases. While in russia you will be forced to be placed in a department that is contrary to your gender. With no exceptions. Without the right to choose. It was like that before. Now, I wouldn't be surprised if they inject and force into a nuthouse for a very long time (half a year or more).

Did you also just forget about shit, like the Orlando nightclub shooting or the Colorado Springs nightclub shooting?

I remember these cases.
Only the situation is such that if an lgbt person is killed in russia, in сommonwealth of independent states countries, her\ his orientation or transgenderism will not be written about in the newspaper. It was like that before. And now it is officially prohibited to mention being lgbt. Also remember that in russia it is extremely difficult to obtain permission to own firearms.

How common it is for white queer people to discriminate against and throw queer poc under the bus?

White queer people specifically? Now you're the one who sounds like a racist.

It is your devaluing words that show that you don't care about lgbt+ people at all.

So, we're just going to pretend like lgbtq+ people who go out of ther way to betray their own community don't exist in the West?

There are, unfortunately. But obviously not on such a scale as in russia, сommonwealth of independent states countries.
So that you know, for me, transgenderism comes above race, above blood. And yet this does not cancel all the terrible things what happens within lgbt social groups in russia.

Organizations, like Gays Against Groomers

I've heard a little about this. It's disgusting.

Betrayals and back stabbings happen everywhere.

Unfortunately. Only the scales are different.

Do you know how many times I've come across queer people from the US and Europe who've gone out of their way to discriminate against other queer people and throw them under the bus?

No. Just like you don't know my story, situation, my experience of communication.

Do you know how rampant acephobia is within the lgbtq+ community?

I could say a lot about this. When I met my ex she very well played the role of a shy girl who is not interested in sex. she also said that she was most likely assexual. It was she who threw me into the abyss of hell. A lot of terrible things happened. she turned out to be whore. she did a lot of dirty things that gave me c-ptsd and major depressive disorder. Many terrible things that contradicted her words. Now when someone talks about her asexuality - I just don't believe it inside. That asexuality is possible without the traumas that other nonhumans have inflicted. Although, before, as you understand, I was fine with asexuals.
And you lie when you say that the lgbt+ community treat asexuals badly. Too many people in the lgbt community classify asexuals as lgbt+ members. Which is not true.

All your words are just devaluation of pain.
You will never prove to a thinking person that the situation in russia, in сommonwealth of independent states regarding lgbt+ equal to what is happening in the USA and in civilized countries of Europe. Not even a little equal.

 

[jbear824]

Don't worry, the US will catch up once republicans, conservatives and christo fascists take over the government. Hopefully when they start shipping us off to the gay death camps, it"I'll be quick.

 

[UltraRareSlinky]

My country is going backwards on rights too. Mine is a post-soviet country that still sadly has a conservative influence from Russia. HRT is legal but same-sex marriage is illegal under the constitution. There are some news articles where queer people got attacked as part of an attack motivated by hatred and bigotry. My country has very old people in it since most young people leave to live abroad. There is a new party that appeared a few years ago AUR, it's not that different from Putin's party in Russia, now in 2023 they seem to be winning and they are being voted by old stupid people. I am sure that if they win in the next or so years Romania will become hell for queer people for sure, it already was bad for us here, it will be even more so if that party wins.

yesterday there was an AUR march throught the city and i got a bit scared. im scared for the future of our country

 

[DazaiKinnie]

yesterday there was an AUR march throught the city and i got a bit scared. im scared for the future of our country

Same here. Inflation and rising prices are hard enough to deal with as they are right now. Somehow Romania is the country where no matter the party they manage to fuck up the whole country in one way or another.

 

[BarnabasCollins]

Don't worry, the US will catch up once republicans, conservatives and christo fascists take over the government. Hopefully when they start shipping us off to the gay death camps, it"I'll be quick.

Sadly, this. The rise in anti-LGBT+ laws and sentiment is a reason I want to ctb, and I'm a straight cys male. It hurts my heart so badly.

 

[restless.dreams]

It breaks my heart to see this happening to the LGBTQ community. We're not an extremist group, we are just people who want to live, to love, and to be ourselves. I wish I could do something to help ... it all feels so hopeless.

Hate is a contagion.

 

[BarnabasCollins]

It breaks my heart to see this happening to the LGBTQ community. We're not an extremist group, we are just people who want to live, to love, and to be ourselves. I wish I could do something to help ... it all feels so hopeless.

Hate is a contagion.

Beautifully said. Hate is indeed a contagion, and one that I fear dooms us all.