Story Kenneth Law (SN Provider) investigated by UK News provider

[LastFlowers]

I thought that was a rather unfortunate way of writing the article. Sort of paints an inaccurate picture I think.

Yea. If they painted a completely accurate picture, then there would be no article.
Journalism has become a mouthpiece for the status quo, instead of what it should be: a voice for those crushed by it.

Honestly even if he (or someone else) was knowingly selling this to people who wanted a viable way to end their suffering..that doesn't makes this man any more deserving of this atrocious diatribe against him.
He, along with the suicidal themselves, will continue to be a scapegoat while the real perpetrators pat themselves on the back for "preventing suicide" whilst perpetuating pain and suffering among those most vulnerable to it.
"Vulnerable", not to a man selling SN, but to their shitty circumstances, the way of the world, and the disturbing apathy and total disregard offered by those in power trying to stop the tormented from ending their torment..even if that means leaving them with less and less options and more and more desperation (dangerous).
These asshats destroy a chef's livelihood and reputation while their impotence of thought & emotionally amateur mentalities negligently serve up a recipe for disaster.
The irony.

 

[Unending]

Journalism has become a mouthpiece for the status quo, instead of what it should be: a voice for those crushed by it.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

 

[LastFlowers]

not worried if they do mate, i would tell them to get fucked too, lol, we have the inherent right to die, i mean some countries even have this in legislation already, i dunno i need to get off of here so angry man, as if there isnt enough to be angry about, now this, i highly doubt police in the uk would visit anybody over this, there as incompetent as other places, i dunno mate i wish you well and everybody here, what a shocking turn of events tho, just wow, i guess the only positive is some already purchased theres in time, i am glad i did now, and had the werewithal to, god i hate pro lifers, they fuck it for the rest of us.

They want to leave us with options that have a high rate of failure and consequences.
So when we do inevitably survive, on top of the reasons why we attempted to begin with..we will be left in a dependent state…a medical patient for life. Either locked in the ward or a vegetable in a hospital bed, becoming a paycheck or puppet for those doing better in this society.

They will not let us go, they will make slaves of us to make a dime, even when our brain activity is zapped…drones are preferable to humans they can't quite control.
Gagging the unpleasant sound of our voices, all while playing hero to selfish family members/partners/friends and strangers alike, who would rather keep a 'loved one' around in pieces, to suffer, than permit them access to what should be an inalienable right.

In short, they are not opposed to removing all opportunities we might have to do or say our piece, including so much as telling them to get fucked.
It's terrifying.


(I was planning on buying a backup SN because the product I obtained quite some time ago, has begun to clump badly and may be beyond expiry.
Especially with my storage methods not being the greatest and the conflicting information about how to keep SN usable for a longer period of time, etc.
For those of us who weren't able to make use of our method in time, due to aggravating circumstances, seeing other possible options evaporate before our eyes is only going to break our minds and push us over the edge..with only jagged cliffsides to fall over.
I'm glad you brought up 'wherewithal', because that's exactly what these people are consistently whittling away at.)

 

[unnormal9]

Once again, it is all about the children, not much about the adults. Yet its ripple affects it as well.

 

[LastFlowers]

Sad to have lost not only access to SN, but also the equipment on EM site. These can all be acquired elsewhere but the site was good for getting everything needed for other methods.

I see why prolifers do these things, reality is it's awful to lose someone to suicide and prevention is only natural. The sad reality is this just forces people into more violent ways of ending their lives. It can do more harm than good.

I think it is actually preternatural to want to keep someone alive when they're already the walking dead.
(In this way, modern medicine has gone too far if you ask me..specifically when it's implemented involuntarily.)
Prevention of the inevitable, for all the wrong reasons…wanting to prolong the existence of suffering in another person, just to keep them around as an accoutrement to the living.
If this is natural, then it is only natural in the sense that human beings are naturally diabolical and self-serving creatures.

The only time I begin to understand wanting to prevent someone's necessary death is when it's a child (even an adult child) clinging to a parental figure (who they will be fucked without)…or perhaps seeing your abuser and/or tormentors meet the mercy of death while you, the victim, are left holding the bag…never getting the chance for closure, true retribution or justice.

There are also instances of impulse and thoughtless suicides where the deceased acted too quickly, without the time to reflect or really pick apart their odds in this world.
Unfortunately these cases end up becoming the face of suicide and they obfuscate the rest of us who have no chance in hell at thriving or even being content in our predicaments.
And the incorrect narrative that we are all irrational "youngsters" is heading every single article out there.
(Even getting to the point where you are making an effort to purchase a method, requires premeditation.
To go a step further, if we were to take these types of sensationalistic headlines at face value- people of an age we consider to be "minors" can be prosecuted and held responsible for the murder of another human being, so why are they not held responsible for the taking of their own life as well?
Why is that decision always presented as the work of another party…commonly not even the one arguably making that person's life difficult..)

With all that said, in most cases of prevention, it's simply those who have never been pushed to the brink who don't want to deal with (nor respect) the wishes of those who have.
It's an inconvenience.
Practically, maybe even emotionally, what have you..it's a headache and they will opt for putting their needs above the suicidal..usually in the form of expecting excess while forcing the suicidal to subsist on meager means and torturous deficiencies.
It's an asymmetry of human self-preservation where each side is not equal to the other, not in the slightest.


So yes, as you said, it does do more harm than good..and yes, the further they go with prevention tactics, the more we will be forced to take up violent methods or lose our wits trying.

i can only speak for myself when i say i dont care about whether he is truly nice or not, if i want out i want out, hence why i bought it, i can only go by my own experiences, i wanted it, he sold me it, with questions and plenty of em, if they restrict this method people will discover another, it will solve nothing in the grand scheme of things, suicide ever evolves, restricting methods never does work, he did seem nice btw, he was prompt with delivery and packaging, what more can you ask for ?, i say nice as in he asked why would i be needing it, packaging was discreet, look i got the item i wanted, as have many others, i dont know him on a personal level only the brief interactions on the emails forwarded, even if he did know i am thankful he offered me a way out, which is what i asked for, and i am guessing many of us here, the gray area is whether they can prove he knew about what people were intending to use it for, can they prove that ? i highly doubt it man

That's my thinking as well.
Firstly I don't think providing someone with an exit method is inherently the opposite of "nice", like these pro-life people do.
Secondly, even if he had malignant reasoning or selfish reasoning…how does that make him different from the people stopping him?
He is still one step above them simply for offering people an evidently/comparatively safe or less unpleasant method to end their suffering.

If a mystery man/woman had a magical pill that cured someone's ills or made a person's life worth living/solved all their problems, I don't think anyone would hesitate to grab that panacea out of their hands and swallow it.
Including the pro-lifers.
They wouldn't even bother asking questions, would not care what or who this provider was..so long as the product got the job done.
Even if they simultaneously thought poorly of the provider, that wouldn't make the product any less worthwhile or necessary to provide.
(Although I bet you that there would be people who would only try to stop the provider after they got what they needed, everyone else be damned. We have already seen this play out.
Hypocrisy.)

If a preventionist's time came to suffer indefinitely and SN was the best available option to end said suffering, these same people lambasting this man would be quick to run into his arms and beg for this substance, trampling everyone else in line in the process.

 

[betternever2havbeen]

I think it's a slippery slope with these people trying to hold this guy responsible. One of the parents saying "I think he's the man that effectively handed a loaded gun to my son. I believe my son would still be alive if it wasn't for this man and this substance." What if his son took that hypothetical gun and murdered someone instead? Who's fault would that be? Does no one have personal responsibility anymore? Total victim mentality, everyone else is to blame, parents are blameless, their grown ass kids are "vulnerable" and hold no responsibility for their own decisions, it's crazy. These parents gonna stay in the denial and anger phases of grief forever then? I pity them, there doesn't even need to be any blame or anger directed at anyone.

 

[LastFlowers]

I think it's a slippery slope with these people trying to hold this guy responsible. One of the parents saying "I think he's the man that effectively handed a loaded gun to my son. I believe my son would still be alive if it wasn't for this man and this substance." What if his son took that hypothetical gun and murdered someone instead? Who's fault would that be? Does no one have personal responsibility anymore? Total victim mentality, everyone else is to blame, parents are blameless, their grown ass kids are "vulnerable" and hold no responsibility for their own decisions, it's crazy. These parents gonna stay in the denial and anger phases of grief forever then? I pity them, there doesn't even need to be any blame or anger directed at anyone.

Yea, I agree with your analogy/extension of that scenario and also found that quote to be ridiculous and shortsighted.
Like you alluded to and I also mentioned in my other comment…we hold "youngsters" responsible for murder..unless that murder is done unto themselves.
(Choose one, I say. The mindset on display in these articles/backlash is far too contradictory.)

And even if we were to admit that the ending of human life..one way or another, can be the result of external forces or situations (which I do believe, even with things like school shootings..we are quick to demonize the shooter even if they're a minor, rarely regarding the outside circumstances/other people that probably broke their brain to the point they resorted to something of that scale), we would still need to point the finger at the appropriate parties or factors..which never seems to actually happen. (So good change never happens either. History repeats itself.)
In other words, even where/when blame should be attributed to someone/something, it is almost never placed where it actually belongs..or it is not properly dispersed among a multitude of contributors, in proportional degrees that make reasonable sense.


So although of course it's natural for genuine victims to have the mentality of victimhood, it's different when that narrative is coming from the wrong direction, from people who are perhaps more responsible than the ones they're implicating: their damaging implications creating even more victims, not less.

 

[CentreMid]

That's very unfortunate, this is only going to make people resort to more violent methods. If there's anyone who has a sick and perverted pleasure in making others suffer, it's the people who try to shut folks like Kenneth Law down. Forcing people to live is so cruel and unjust, and taking away their only source of relief is essentially torture.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

I thought that was a rather unfortunate way of writing the article. Sort of paints an inaccurate picture I think.

It's sheer manipulation lol.

 

[betternever2havbeen]

That's very unfortunate, this is only going to make people resort to more violent methods. If there's anyone who has a sick and perverted pleasure in making others suffer, it's the people who try to shut folks like Kenneth Law down. Forcing people to live is so cruel and unjust, and taking away their only source of relief is essentially torture.

Definitely. How dare that guy say "I think he's playing God. He is knowingly supplying a substance for people to take their own life and gaining some kind of perverse pleasure from the knowledge that they are doing it." These people think they know everyone's motivations. I'm so done with this world and fucking moron humans.

I can just imagine the reactions these parents had if their kids actually came to them for help, they are SO closed minded and ignorant. Sorry your kid made a choice you don't agree with and you can't accept that.

 

[umjammertranner]

I didn't read this yet but ,,suicidal youngsters''. They really don't give a shit about us, do they. All for views

Reminder that if your'e over the age of 25 that suddenly your suicide means less in the eyes of the parasitic British public and press

 

[Rocket]

The reporter is totally over the top, the melodramatic music on the clip with KL speaking is classic clickbait. And The Times is a subscription site, you can't read the article unless you subscribe. That's how much they care.

However, it's terrible that KL said so much. There's a good reason it's strictly enforced here not to reveal supplier names and details. It wasn't like the reporter had to coerce it out of him, the posted phone call made it clear KL knew exactly what was going on and even gave advice on how to use the product. That puts every one of his customers at risk. Just like buyers, suppliers have a duty (maybe even more than buyers) to shut up and keep their business confidential. Inviting somebody in his car (even if he didn't know it was a reporter) and explaining things is a fatal error.

KL's recklessness did just as much damage as the reporter, who is hearing terrible things from parents and loved ones of people who used his products. I'm adamantly pro choice and respect adult decisions, but places like Exit do some screening and evaluation first. It's why they've been able to offer compassion. Having guys going to PO Boxes with armfuls of boxes and stopping to talk to people about it may be helping people in the short term, but now that it's a major investigation and a 17-year-old was involved, it adds a lot of risk to all suppliers. However, it's not a difficult substance to obtain for commercial purposes, so I don't think there should be panic; other suppliers will enter the picture. Supply will meet demand.

I hope everybody continues our efforts to keep sources private and to be careful with the people we're doing business with. Confidentiality is a must. This is a tragedy all around.

 

[betternever2havbeen]

@Rocket I am surprised he was so open but I guess he figured he wasn't doing anything wrong-I mean in our eyes he isn't he's just selling a product but you can't go up against the outrage and emotion of pro-lifers who can't use logic. They see everyone's motives as sinister and of course the parents get free reign to throw accusations as much as they like without anyone questioning them because they are "victims".

 

[Unending]

It's sheer manipulation lol.

Indeed. Not sure how my comment came off because I forget that there is no detectable tone when typing lol.

 

[JC96178235]

Do you think the police in the UK will check up on people who have purchased from Kenneth?

 

[glitterypearls]

I mean might as well ban alcohol since it can kill you too or cars. they won't ever ban anything that will kill you in the worst way possible, but something that will give you a relatively peaceful death? NOPE let's ban it!!!!


if they really GIVE A SHIT about us, they would put that energy into resources that will help our mental health and make it free, but they don't care. they want us alive to be slaves and work.

logically shouldn't they take down videos that teach you how to tie a knot for hanging? or actually ban guns and be serious about it? but those two methods are painful for us so its fine if they stay but SN??? NOPE ITS A HUGE DEAL

 

[LastFlowers]

The reporter is totally over the top, the melodramatic music on the clip with KL speaking is classic clickbait. And The Times is a subscription site, you can't read the article unless you subscribe. That's how much they care.

However, it's terrible that KL said so much. There's a good reason it's strictly enforced here not to reveal supplier names and details. It wasn't like the reporter had to coerce it out of him, the posted phone call made it clear KL knew exactly what was going on and even gave advice on how to use the product. That puts every one of his customers at risk. Just like buyers, suppliers have a duty (maybe even more than buyers) to shut up and keep their business confidential. Inviting somebody in his car (even if he didn't know it was a reporter) and explaining things is a fatal error.

KL's recklessness did just as much damage as the reporter, who is hearing terrible things from parents and loved ones of people who used his products. I'm adamantly pro choice and respect adult decisions, but places like Exit do some screening and evaluation first. It's why they've been able to offer compassion. Having guys going to PO Boxes with armfuls of boxes and stopping to talk to people about it may be helping people in the short term, but now that it's a major investigation and a 17-year-old was involved, it adds a lot of risk to all suppliers. However, it's not a difficult substance to obtain for commercial purposes, so I don't think there should be panic; other suppliers will enter the picture. Supply will meet demand.

I hope everybody continues our efforts to keep sources private and to be careful with the people we're doing business with. Confidentiality is a must. This is a tragedy all around.

Good points, that was my only real issue with his behavior once I read the full article as well.
I'm not quite sure what he was thinking in opening up to that degree.
Did he think they would act appropriately or respectfully to him being candid and telling it like it is?
These reporters never do any such thing.
Still their fault at the end of the day, for blowing it up the way they did and twisting it to bits, but I wish he had used more discretion and just told them to fuck off, play dumb (in this case, it's warranted).

 

[Challu]

He spoke too much. Even gave that story about his mother... now, what would've lead to an investigation with no rigid response, seems much more damnable.

 

[unnormal9]

"We are also investing £2.3 billion extra a year into mental health services, which will help an additional two million people to access NHS-funded mental health support by 2024." - LOL

Does this by chance include a weekly stipend?

 

[Archness]

They're gonna RUIN his life. Then if he decides to ctb they'll silently pat themselves on the back with a huge smile.

They'd rather ban shit or dump taxpayer $$$ into programs instead of making life interesting and worth living. Fuck em', SN > COPIUM!


US has more gun control then ever before but still a plague of school shootings. When will they learn kids aren't garbing guns and blazing the school just because they can? Same thing with suicide supplies.

Since it's the UK, in time, I expect all suicidal people to basically get bound and enslaved "For their own safety"; as if they're on suicide watch on death row.

 

[umjammertranner]

Do you think the police in the UK will check up on people who have purchased from Kenneth?

Nah they're too busy trying to make it illegal to strike

 

[Salvation_]

US has more gun control then ever before but still a plague of school shootings. When will they learn kids aren't garbing guns and blazing the school just because they can? Same thing with suicide supplies.

Um... seems like a rather distasteful and unfair comparison. Let's not put suicidal people and school shooters in the same boat...

 

[Superdeterminist]

This makes me so angry. Fuck these people for trying to deny the right to die. Bless Kenneth Law.

 

[lukas19]

I s this anything to do with a few sites being down lately or was he not part of those ones ?

I really chose the wrong time to find this forum, especially as I live in England. Am I likely to be able to source SN anytime soon or do I find another method ?

Sorry I'm pretty sure that KL was behind IC, it was based in Canada and the timing, more than likely was him. Seems like SN is impossible to access in GB at the moment.

 

[Yahwa]

He was doing people a favor. Was he overpricing his product? Absolutely. But he was providing us with an easy way out, and I feel like he should be compensated for that. After all, he took risks for us. I hope he'll be okay

 

[ThisIsLife]

As a result of this witch hunt not only the responsibles for people's nightmarish life will never be held accountable but those who already suffer enough to end their life will either suffer even more not being able to escape from it or find much more violent methods to do so !

David Parfett, from Maidenhead, Berkshire, whose 22-year-old son Tom took his own life after buying the chemical from Law's company, said: "I think he's the man that effectively handed a loaded gun to my son. I believe my son would still be alive if it wasn't for this man and this substance."

How delusional. How does he know had he not bought SN he wouldn't have jumped from a building or under a train ? I don't think he would have said "I believe my son would still be alive if it wasn't for this company and their bloody ropes" if his son had choosen to hang himself.
Blame the post office or the mail man while you're there !

Another customer was Anthony Jones, 17, an American who took it and then ran to his mother shouting: "I want to live", but who died shortly afterwards.

B.U.L.L.S.H.I.T

Perhaps you may want to stop people buying knives and guns.

KL is right. If you want to stop people from killing themselves then ban trains, tall buildings, prescription drugs, ropes, knives, insecticide, paracetamol, nitrogen, or electricity while they're at it ! They don't want people to not die, they want people to not die peacefully. They don't want people not scared anymore.

I believe it's not a coincidence if the articles focus on IC and SN and never mention EM and the Nitrogen/helium stuff.
I'm 100% sure authorities are a lot more worried by the Nitrogen/helium method than SN, because it's impossible to detect if people are assisted. Since KL owns both businesses it's easier to make people focus on SN and outrage everyone on the fact that some customers were young to bring both sites down in one shot.

 

[tams]

I was actually just emailing back and forth with this guy over the past few days. Haven't heard back since yesterday morning. Really wonder what is going on.

 

[ever so lonely]

I wish you the best bro whatever your decision is , i hope we were born in a better world but that's not the case. SI is the most powerful thing , we wouldn't be here without it and it would be fine.

thank you my man, i appreciate it, faith in the police in the uk is at an ever time low anyways, who can blame anybody, we probably live in the most nanny state daddy government nation in the globe, if you ask me i am tired of them telling us how to live our lives and just what we should strive for, and what to do with it, tossers the lot, they have there hands dipped into too many pies in peoples lives if you ask me bro, i just call a spade a spade, best way to be, i mean the metropolitan police is a shambles in particular, if there officers arent abducting, raping, and murdering our innocent female citizens, there likely now going to curb people offing themselves, probably under the guise of wellness checks, fuck em, they will also likely now be trying to deprive many of the only release they have available, wish you well mate, i cant comment on this post further, i dunno why , dont care, i hope you stay well bro, many will be angry over this, just the tip of the iceberg tho aint it, stay safe matey

 

[LastFlowers]

Um... seems like a rather distasteful and unfair comparison. Let's not put suicidal people and school shooters in the same boat...

Not necessarily in the same boat, but what they said also isn't necessarily a direct comparison.
They're making a point. A fair one.
People don't usually go to such great lengths "just cuz" certain means or tools are within their grasp.

Violence can be a reaction to extreme duress and desperation..of which there are many possible causes.
Gun control isn't addressing these causes.

Suicide can be a reaction to extreme duress and desperation..of which there are many possible causes.
Suicide prevention is not addressing these causes.

There also is something to be said about possibly being in the same boat.
The problem is people get too bent out of shape with trying to distance themselves from the blind rage and demonization that gets directed at violent criminal behavior like school shootings.
And in a sense, I get it, we already have a target on our backs and we don't want to give the naysayers any further ammuntion to twist against us…we don't want to blur the line to the point that pro-lifers start acting like we're all latent criminals in the making.
But quite frankly I am sick and tired of the hypocrisy and the utter lack of nuance in discussing that type of topic (school shooters, law breaking, etc).
The "at least we're not them, they're the real scum" talking point.
It was rife in the thread here about the Nashville shooting (when barely any details were available) and I planned on saying something much more thorough and thought out about it then, but never got the chance.
Yes there are other victims to consider when it comes to these incidents, but thinking critically about a situation and what may have led to it is not the same as being insensitive.
Nor is it a jab at the suicidal.
(It's also strange to me how crazed people get over school shootings in particular when there are arguably even more despicable and violent actions being committed all the time, but with no sensationalism that draws the eye or ear.
Horrible cases where nobody is making any type of fuss or attempt at posturing.)

In short, if we are a group of people that supposedly know what it's like to suffer dearly and what that does to our minds, our bodies, our worth..how it affects our interactions with others, our mobility in society, our ability to navigate the world in what's deemed an acceptable way..how many of us have breakdowns with our sanity barely hanging on by a thread- in large part thanks to the people who push and prod and taunt and oppress us…is it that far of a leap in thinking to understand how someone in similar circumstances might snap outward instead of inward?
Because personally, the more I suffer and the more negative or apathetic reactions I receive in response to my suffering..the more these supposed "bad people" make sense to me.
They don't surprise me at all, they are not some mystery to me, and most are not monsters either.
I can imagine what they may have experienced over the course of their life, I can imagine what they may have been thinking, I can imagine how the domino pieces fell in just the right way where it opened up the possibility of violent behavior, even on a mass scale.
They're human beings at the end of the day, and surely it's not as simple as "bad person" or "bad brain" does bad thing.
I'm not saying every one of them has the same reasons or that every reason is as easy to comprehend as the next, but I don't think it's "unfair or distasteful" to bring up the obvious parallels, the elephant in the room…uncomfortable? Sure.
It's uncomfortable knowing that there are plenty of homicides (not just school shootings) which were first intended to be suicides (or vice versa), that a person with no reason to live and every reason to die, might extend their suffering to others, with motivations & rationale that may only be fathomable if you had lived their life from start to finish, if you had truly been them in that moment.
A moment they might even regret, a moment that may involve impulse, or mind altering drugs or excess stressors on the day it all came to fruition.

When it comes to the action of ending your own life versus ending someone else's..you could have just as much room for similarities as you do differences..in the circumstances, detriments and entire chain of events that lead up to either action
(or even both).
It may be unpleasant to realize, but it's just the fact of the matter.
And it doesn't suddenly mean suicidal people are somehow evil or irrational or any other unsavory adjective that could be thrown around by those who are quick to judge or conflate without deeper thought.

(Sorry for the rambling and getting somewhat off topic, but I think this is worth saying.)

 

[ge0rge]

He spoke too much. Even gave that story about his mother...

i doubt thats true. multiple fake stories make for good self defence

i hope he gets back in the game asap, his services are desperately needed by many