Discussion i’m skeptical of the “why ODs fail miserably” post

[twinfantasylover]

i feel like it's really misleading tbh, it's based on the LD50 values for the toxicity of the drug in animals, which 1) obviously can't be extrapolated to humans, and 2) toxicity isn't the thing that kills in the majority of overdoses. the majority of overdose deaths happen because of either respiratory depression or vomit asphyxiation, and this would happen WAYYYY before the toxicity of the drug would kill you. also, they only show values for the drugs on their own, which is stupid because taking multiple different depressants almost always causes them to potentiate eachother and make the depressant effects so much stronger, therefore lowering how much is needed to kill you. idk man maybe this is just the dunning-kruger effect but it really annoys me when people just immediately reply to every OD post with links to the same 2 posts without even thinking about it.

 

[Hime]

I agree. There's a reason why OD deaths (especially on opioids) are known to just happen without any thought. It's deceptively easy to take too much especially when you combine it with other depressants. One moment the effects are kicking in, the next you are nodding out and then... Bam! Respiratory depression. And if you're not in the recovery position, it will make it even more unlikely to live.

Now, I still think the SN protocol is better suited for ctb. But this path could also work for some, it just requires to be studied thoroughly similar to every other method.

 

[Hystearical]

It's about probability and risk awareness.

 

[d4isy]

i knew someone who committed by od'ing on meds. it very much is possible. i don't know which exact meds they used, though.

i could've died last year after getting blackout drunk on effexor. i vomited in my sleep. if i had been laying on my back, i would've 100% choked on it and died.

 

[Forveleth]

... 2) toxicity isn't the thing that kills in the majority of overdoses. the majority of overdose deaths happen because of either respiratory depression or vomit asphyxiation,

Citation?

... because taking multiple different depressants almost always causes them to potentiate eachother and make the depressant effects so much stronger,

Citation?

There's a reason why OD deaths (especially on opioids) are known to just happen without any thought. It's deceptively easy to take too much especially when you combine it with other depressants.

Most people on this forum are not looking to OD on strong opioids and another depressant. They are trying to OD with whatever they have in their medicine cabinet, which most of the time is not going to do the job.

Most people come to this forum asking for methods that have a very high chance of killing them with very little pain and suffering. ODs have been shown to be highly unpredictable and usually involve at least some mild to moderate discomfort. Therefore, they do not fit what most people are looking for when they come here for information on how to kill themselves.

Even anecdotally on this site, there are many threads of people attempting or have attempted to kill themselves with a pill OD that all report failure and, occasionally, some pretty significant suffering. I always try to mention when posting to the OD failure thread that yes you can die from OD's but it is difficult to do so predictably.

 

[Hime]

Citation?

Citation?

Most people on this forum are not looking to OD on strong opioids and another depressant. They are trying to OD with whatever they have in their medicine cabinet, which most of the time is not going to do the job.

Most people come to this forum asking for methods that have a very high chance of killing them with very little pain and suffering. ODs have been shown to be highly unpredictable and usually involve at least some mild to moderate discomfort. Therefore, they do not fit what most people are looking for when they come here for information on how to kill themselves.

Even anecdotally on this site, there are many threads of people attempting or have attempted to kill themselves with a pill OD that all report failure and, occasionally, some pretty significant suffering. I always try to mention when posting to the OD failure thread that yes you can die from OD's but it is difficult to do so predictably.

Ahh yeah you're right. My brain defaulted to strong opioids and forgot to consider people trying to OD on e.g. antidepressants. It is really unreliable/sketchy to OD on any other "medication".

 

[twinfantasylover]

Citation?

Citation?

Most people on this forum are not looking to OD on strong opioids and another depressant. They are trying to OD with whatever they have in their medicine cabinet, which most of the time is not going to do the job.

Most people come to this forum asking for methods that have a very high chance of killing them with very little pain and suffering. ODs have been shown to be highly unpredictable and usually involve at least some mild to moderate discomfort. Therefore, they do not fit what most people are looking for when they come here for information on how to kill themselves.

Even anecdotally on this site, there are many threads of people attempting or have attempted to kill themselves with a pill OD that all report failure and, occasionally, some pretty significant suffering. I always try to mention when posting to the OD failure thread that yes you can die from OD's but it is difficult to do so predictably.

'citation' i'm a pharmacist lmfao

 

[JonCody]

i feel like it's really misleading tbh, it's based on the LD50 values for the toxicity of the drug in animals, which 1) obviously can't be extrapolated to humans, and 2) toxicity isn't the thing that kills in the majority of overdoses. the majority of overdose deaths happen because of either respiratory depression or vomit asphyxiation, and this would happen WAYYYY before the toxicity of the drug would kill you. also, they only show values for the drugs on their own, which is stupid because taking multiple different depressants almost always causes them to potentiate eachother and make the depressant effects so much stronger, therefore lowering how much is needed to kill you. idk man maybe this is just the dunning-kruger effect but it really annoys me when people just immediately reply to every OD post with links to the same 2 posts without even thinking about it.

In checking multiple Ai bot sources about hydrocodone specifically it takes nothing close to the thousands of tablets shown in the table to be fatal. Of equal importance is the impact of even modest amounts of alcohol. You may want to query something like chatgpt and approach the issue like you have just been prescribed hydrocodone, say I 10 mg tablet per day, and you just want to check how many mg's are required for it to be dangerous or life threatening, Then ask how one or 2 50 ml grins of 80 proof alcohol would exacerbate the effect

 

[Forveleth]

In checking multiple Ai bot sources about hydrocodone specifically it takes nothing close to the thousands of tablets shown in the table to be fatal. Of equal importance is the impact of even modest amounts of alcohol. You may want to query something like chatgpt and approach the issue like you have just been prescribed hydrocodone, say I 10 mg tablet per day, and you just want to check how many mg's are required for it to be dangerous or life threatening, Then ask how one or 2 50 ml grins of 80 proof alcohol would exacerbate the effect

Then ask ChatGPT to cite its sources and see if they even exist. AI lies. Do not trust yiye life to something an LLM tells you.

 

[Bishop]

'citation' i'm a pharmacist lmfao

Lol

 

[JonCody]

Then ask ChatGPT to cite its sources and see if they even exist. AI lies. Do not trust yiye life to something an LLM tells you.

Death by hydrocodone overdose typically occurs due to respiratory depression, where the body's ability to breathe slows down or stops entirely. This is the most dangerous effect of opioid overdose. The process can be frightening, both for the person overdosing and for those around them, although it's important to remember that experiences can vary.
Here's a general idea of what may happen during an overdose:

1. Early Symptoms:
   • Drowsiness, confusion, or dizziness
   • Slowed breathing or shallow breathing
   • Slurred speech and loss of coordination
   • Nausea or vomiting
2. Progression of Symptoms:
   • Severe respiratory depression: Breathing slows dramatically, or may stop altogether. The person may appear to be in a deep, unconscious sleep.
   • Bluish tint to lips or nails due to lack of oxygen.
   • Unresponsiveness: The person may be unable to be awakened or respond to stimuli.
3. Death:
   • If the overdose is not treated, a person may stop breathing entirely, leading to brain damage due to lack of oxygen, followed by organ failure and death.

The experience can be a slow and frightening one, especially if help is not immediately available. If someone is suspected of overdosing on hydrocodone (or any opioid), it's critical to call emergency services right away. Naloxone (Narcan) is a medication that can reverse opioid overdoses and can save lives if administered in time.
If you or someone you know is struggling with substance abuse, it's important to seek professional help.



Do you have any statistics available that summarize the fatalities each year die to prescribed sunstances like Hydrocodone and OxyContin. I would also like to see fentenayl related numbers.


Yes. The statistics are unfortunately very well tracked now because the numbers became so large during the opioid epidemic.
The important distinction is this:

• Prescription opioids = drugs like Hydrocodone, OxyContin, Vicodin, Percocet, morphine, etc.
• Synthetic opioids = overwhelmingly illicitly manufactured Fentanyl and related compounds coming from the street drug supply.

The numbers today are dominated by fentanyl, not by people taking stable prescribed pain medication as directed.
Here is the broad CDC picture for the United States:

Year	Total U.S. overdose deaths	Opioid-related deaths	Fentanyl / synthetic opioid deaths	Prescription opioid deaths*
2010	~38,000	~21,000	~3,000	~16,000
2015	~52,000	~33,000	~10,000	~15,000
2020	~92,000	~69,000	~57,000	~17,000
2021 peak	~107,000	~81,000	~71,000	~14,000
2023	~105,000	~83,000	~73,000	~10,000
2024 (preliminary)	~79,000–80,000	~54,000	~48,000	~8,000

*"Prescription opioid deaths" includes natural and semi-synthetic opioids such as hydrocodone and oxycodone, but many cases also involve multiple drugs.
A few important observations:

• Around 2010–2012, deaths from prescribed opioids were the dominant opioid problem.
• Beginning around 2014–2015, illicit fentanyl exploded into the drug supply.
• Today, fentanyl is involved in the overwhelming majority of opioid overdose deaths.
• The CDC now reports that synthetic opioids (mostly fentanyl) account for roughly 85–90% of opioid deaths.

Another point that often surprises chronic pain patients:
People taking stable prescribed opioids under medical supervision are statistically a very different population from illicit fentanyl users. Many overdose deaths labeled "prescription opioid" also involve:

• alcohol,
• benzodiazepines (Xanax, Valium, etc.),
• multiple opioids,
• counterfeit pills,
• or nonmedical use.

For perspective:

• The annual U.S. death toll from fentanyl recently exceeded deaths from car accidents and firearms in some age groups.
• Meanwhile, legal opioid prescribing rates have fallen dramatically over the last decade.

If you want, I can also break this down further into:

• hydrocodone vs oxycodone specifically,
• how many deaths involve only prescribed medication,
• age-group statistics,
• Texas/Houston data,
• or how overdose risk changes with dosage (MME levels).

Can you please tell me your sources.


Most of the figures I gave came from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), particularly their overdose surveillance and mortality databases.
Main sources:

• CDC — Understanding the Opioid Overdose Epidemic
  General overview of prescription opioids vs synthetic opioids (fentanyl), trends over time, and categories of deaths.
• CDC SUDORS Dashboard (State Unintentional Drug Overdose Reporting System)
  Detailed fatal overdose data including fentanyl involvement, co-ingestion patterns, demographics, and state-level information.
• CDC National Center for Health Statistics — Drug Overdose Deaths
  Official national overdose mortality statistics and provisional annual updates.
• CDC Opioid Dispensing Rate Maps
  Shows how prescription opioid dispensing has declined over the last decade.
• NIH / National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA) — Overdose Death Rates
  Good summary charts separating:
  • prescription opioids,
  • heroin,
  • methamphetamine,
  • fentanyl/synthetic opioids.

A couple of important caveats about the numbers:

• "Prescription opioid deaths" in CDC statistics do not necessarily mean the drug was legally prescribed to the deceased.
• Many deaths involve multiple substances simultaneously.
• Fentanyl numbers are now so dominant that they can visually swamp the prescription-opioid trend lines.

One statistic that often surprises people:
The CDC has reported that prescription opioid dispensing has fallen dramatically since about 2012, while fentanyl deaths exploded afterward. That is one reason the modern epidemic is often described as primarily an illicit fentanyl crisis rather than a traditional prescription-pill crisis.

 

[Lost Wife]

You aren't wrong, but the reason people don't recommend OD is because most stuff in the cabinet won't do the job, and just results in a bad experience. Combining opiods and other depressants is more reliable, but still not a guarantee. In 2023 I attempted with a 90 count bottle of 10mg vicodin, and another bottle of Flexeril. I got found, and the hospital couldn't figure out why the narcan wasn't working. Got put in a coma for 3 days while my body cleaned itself out. None of the bloodwork showed the flexeril... I kept it to myself. I don't recommend anyone try that, it sucked. When they woke me up I was still intubated but they turned it off, to see if I would breathe on my own, I couldn't breathe or talk with the tube in obviously so for two minutes I was just freaking out because I couldn't breathe or talk. Cussed out the doctor (and all the other dudes standing there watching) after they pulled the tube out. Part of me was glad to still be here, and then two years later my husband CTB... now I don't know how to feel anymore. What's the point?

Sorry for the paragraph, TLDR is ODing is not reliable.

 

[morrerempaz]

Is it possible that 30 tablets of morphine 30mg + 15 alprazolan tablets + 1 bottle of wine would do the job?

Would I be able to hold it without vomiting?

 

[Littlepaws]

I feel like most drug overdoses are done in the heat of the moment and with whatever just happens to be in the medicines cabinet at that time, which usually is a very limited amount of prescription drugs and maybe some otc products which are never in the quantities actually required to do any substantial damage.

Myself on the other hand is slowly acquiring enough amitriptyline and propranolol over the next few months to take at 3x the lethal dose. I do in theory have a lethal enough now, but I'm being ever so patient and disciplined to make sure I have enough to ensure my end, since I know can't fuck this up.

 

[windowinstaller]

cause they get the wrong meds to OD on.

most medicines have vwry high LD50s and only a select few are easy to OD on.