Help Has anyone ever overcame self hatred. If so how?

[TheCavernousDeep.]

I absolutely hate myself. It has gotten so bad that suicide is feeling like the only dignified choice that's left to me. I feel like I am lazy, wasteful, ignorant, selfish, unstable, pathetic, and just overall a low value human.

But I don't have any deeply rooted external trauma. I had good parents, lots of opportunities, etc. I really don't have any external thing to blame for my self hatred, from my pov I do just hate myself because I suck.

Is there any way past this? At all? I am living in torture at the hands of my own mind every day. I carry so much shame for who I am, it's absolutely crippling. I want to stop thinking like this so I can live my life but, loving myself feels like pretending the sky is green.

How do you overcome self hatred? Can it be done?

 

[Kanoh]

In general after years of doing it, I hold therapies in low regard but in your particular case I think it would work well.

 

[FoxSauce]

Im still working on it, short answer no

 

[westerly_merlin]

Working on it with therapist, it is hard though. Even when we work on positives about myself I can find many more negatives. Many years of being harsh on myself (and believing those that say/think bad things about me).

Hoping I will get there though, or at least be comfortable to share the same space as myself one day.

It is easier to see good in others than to believe you have good in you.

 

[Isolatedloner]

Working on unsticking my mind. Seems to be working.

 

[TheCavernousDeep.]

Working on it with therapist, it is hard though. Even when we work on positives about myself I can find many more negatives. Many years of being harsh on myself (and believing those that say/think bad things about me).

Hoping I will get there though, or at least be comfortable to share the same space as myself one day.

It is easier to see good in others than to believe you have good in you.

Any particular approaches that were helpful? I have struggled to get much out of therapy but I do see how it could be worth trying again.

 

[LittleJem]

It is risky, but psychedelics did help me with this, but in combination with other people ideally. That's tricky. I don't know if I recommend it or not, but ayahuasca removed my self hatred, but I still have horrendous depression. If you can do it/want to take the risk, find an experienced guide.

 

[pyamu]

yes... but i turn the self hatred i used to have to external hatred. Once you logic your way through how society, the various systems we cannot escape from, and how mean people affect us and our mental health, it becomes easy to move that hate from yourself to other people.

 

[westerly_merlin]

Any particular approaches that were helpful? I have struggled to get much out of therapy but I do see how it could be worth trying again.

partly thinking of myself in the third party and assessing myself as if I was someone else and give them support.

I am an older person and having a low sense of self worth has driven me really really hard, constantly trying to be perfect at everything I do was exhausting but had the effect of making me good at what I do and on the outside quite successful. I now manage a team of people and I am a supportive and nurturing manager. I just have to sometimes think of myself as one of my team rather than someone who is not as perfect as I should be.

So yes, I do now give myself a little pat on the back when I have done something well the same way I would give anyone else a cheer for doing the same.

It has taken me 50 years and a pretty big breakdown to learn that you don't have to get 100% every time or you are a failure.

I will caveat the above with "I am still my harshest critic" and do lapse in self abuse for making stupid mistakes still

 

[Celerity]

It took me years, I still struggle with being hard on myself, and I can't really pinpoint the exact moment I got better, but I did. I am doing much better than I did for most of my life in regard to self-hatred. These are the factors I think made the biggest difference.

• Healing the Shame That Binds You by John Bradshaw: I found the self-therapy "inner child" techniques he provides later in the book less helpful, but in my opinion, you cannot beat this book for fully assimilating the concept of toxic shame. I have not found a self-help book that so effectively balances speaking to you as a fellow sufferer while also providing an analytical framework you can use to evaluate your life. A lot of people like Brene Brown, but I tend to find her treatment too light. For me, she goes too far in normalizing experiences of shame to the point that the painful, soul-destroying toxic shame we struggle with gets lost in the mix.
• Drama of the Gifted Child by Alice Miller: This one is much more niche than Bradshaw. There will be plenty with toxic shame who do not relate at all to the essential situation describe here. However, even then, you may still get a lot out of her explanation for how non-obvious toxicity in family dynamics can cause suffering. Even doting and, for all appearances, well-adjusted parents can harm their children psychologically. As an aside, her book For Your Own Good provides an underappreciated view of Hitler's psychology and how he rose in German culture. Food for thought in this turbulent day and age. It also may help deepen your understanding of her other books.
• Attending Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families (ACoA) meetings: I paid for sessions run by a therapist for around a year. She served as a good mediator when the group got off topic, prevented arguments, and helped us better understand the program. Like with Bradshaw, you get a blend of understanding your situation more clearly and feeling heard. In my view, you can't get lasting psychological change with just the knowledge. You need to feel safe, accepted, and normal. Group therapy provides this in a way one-on-one can't. I would spring for a therapist-mediated sessions like I did, but you can also find free, peer-led groups on their website.
• Learning some DBT/Mindfulness techniques: There are many ways to do this. I did not find the DBT program itself all that great. I bought the workbooks and attended the peer groups. I think I would have gotten more out of it if I had stayed, but I found the mindfulness techniques it taught helpful enough on their own. Daily mindfulness practice is something I hope to achieve, but being able to apply these techniques during periods of acute stress has greatly improved my tolerance for life stressors. I can bounce back much more quickly because I can better avoid rumination. The Calm app is relatively cheap as well and offers a good introduction to learning meditation.
• Working customer service: This seems absurd, I know, especially given that plenty of people work these jobs depressed as hell. However, having a public-facing position introduces you to all kinds of people in a way that an office job never will. I learned from observing customers and coworkers and bosses that I am not all that bad. Seeing stupid and evil and ridiculous on the regular reminds me of my own priorities and strengths. When you do meet good people and can help them even in the context of corporate-mandated over-politeness, you also take the seemingly small wins and add them up into a rolling wave of usefulness and feeling good. That said, I was happy to start a healthcare career, which comes with a lot of thankless bullshit, so my advice here is probably niche. You can probably get a lot of the same benefits through volunteer work depending upon the population you work with.
• Sleep Hygiene: Getting a job with a somewhat regular schedule and performing some exercise will help with keeping a sleep schedule. It's hard with retail, but it can be done. I eventually got a set schedule being a stock clerk. I will never go back to rotating shifts unless I have no choice. The importance of keeping your circadian rhythm happy cannot be overstated for mental and physical health. The brain is a bodily organ at the end of the day. It will not work well for you if you do not take care of it. If you must drink (and who doesn't need a drink here or there?), try to stop drinking at least 4 hours before sleep. Psychoactive substances in general wreck sleep, most obviously caffeine but also alcohol.
• Getting older: I feel mean typing that out, but it's true. In my early 30s, I simply have a much easier time of it than I did in my 20s. Emotional lability is just something some of us have to age out of. Even setting aside my questionable retail recommendation, life experience itself can also help, albeit in a very haphazard way.

TL;DR Learn that you weren't born broken --> learn that your neuroses are not even unique and that plenty of lovely people have the same problems --> learn that you also aren't doomed, just like they aren't -->build a life aligned with your values that keeps your body healthy

 

[enjoytheride]

I absolutely hate myself. It has gotten so bad that suicide is feeling like the only dignified choice that's left to me. I feel like I am lazy, wasteful, ignorant, selfish, unstable, pathetic, and just overall a low value human.

But I don't have any deeply rooted external trauma. I had good parents, lots of opportunities, etc. I really don't have any external thing to blame for my self hatred, from my pov I do just hate myself because I suck.

Is there any way past this? At all? I am living in torture at the hands of my own mind every day. I carry so much shame for who I am, it's absolutely crippling. I want to stop thinking like this so I can live my life but, loving myself feels like pretending the sky is green.

How do you overcome self hatred? Can it be done?

Hi! In line with point 1 of westerly_merlin's message, I would say it has to begin with compassion towards yourself, being able to afford yourself at least some of the kindness you readily give others.

Then what helps me is trying to do good out there in the world, at work or outside of work. Doing my best to be compassionate to others. That is an objective and external proof that I cannot be that bad after all and my mind is probably being punitive for no reason, or is rather exaggerating mistakes I've made.

If you have people in your life that love you, even if just one person, there is your other direct proof you have worth and are lovable.

My final advice is: avoid staying alone for too long, if the weather is good go out with a nice book in hand, buy yourself some coffee, watch the birds. When at home, unless you are sleeping, keep yourself busy with something productive. Mowing the grass, studying, writing that poem - whatever is your thing, creating and working is another direct proof that there's no reason for anyone to hate you, including yourself.

Hugs!

 

[TheCavernousDeep.]

I ne

It took me years, I still struggle with being hard on myself, and I can't really pinpoint the exact moment I got better, but I did. I am doing much better than I did for most of my life in regard to self-hatred. These are the factors I think made the biggest difference.

• Healing the Shame That Binds You by John Bradshaw: I found the self-therapy "inner child" techniques he provides later in the book less helpful, but in my opinion, you cannot beat this book for fully assimilating the concept of toxic shame. I have not found a self-help book that so effectively balances speaking to you as a fellow sufferer while also providing an analytical framework you can use to evaluate your life. A lot of people like Brene Brown, but I tend to find her treatment too light. For me, she goes too far in normalizing experiences of shame to the point that the painful, soul-destroying toxic shame we struggle with gets lost in the mix.
• Drama of the Gifted Child by Alice Miller: This one is much more niche than Bradshaw. There will be plenty with toxic shame who do not relate at all to the essential situation describe here. However, even then, you may still get a lot out of her explanation for how non-obvious toxicity in family dynamics can cause suffering. Even doting and, for all appearances, well-adjusted parents can harm their children psychologically. As an aside, her book For Your Own Good provides an underappreciated view of Hitler's psychology and how he rose in German culture. Food for thought in this turbulent day and age. It also may help deepen your understanding of her other books.
• Attending Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families (ACoA) meetings: I paid for sessions run by a therapist for around a year. She served as a good mediator when the group got off topic, prevented arguments, and helped us better understand the program. Like with Bradshaw, you get a blend of understanding your situation more clearly and feeling heard. In my view, you can't get lasting psychological change with just the knowledge. You need to feel safe, accepted, and normal. Group therapy provides this in a way one-on-one can't. I would spring for a therapist-mediated sessions like I did, but you can also find free, peer-led groups on their website.
• Learning some DBT/Mindfulness techniques: There are many ways to do this. I did not find the DBT program itself all that great. I bought the workbooks and attended the peer groups. I think I would have gotten more out of it if I had stayed, but I found the mindfulness techniques it taught helpful enough on their own. Daily mindfulness practice is something I hope to achieve, but being able to apply these techniques during periods of acute stress has greatly improved my tolerance for life stressors. I can bounce back much more quickly because I can better avoid rumination. The Calm app is relatively cheap as well and offers a good introduction to learning meditation.
• Working customer service: This seems absurd, I know, especially given that plenty of people work these jobs depressed as hell. However, having a public-facing position introduces you to all kinds of people in a way that an office job never will. I learned from observing customers and coworkers and bosses that I am not all that bad. Seeing stupid and evil and ridiculous on the regular reminds me of my own priorities and strengths. When you do meet good people and can help them even in the context of corporate-mandated over-politeness, you also take the seemingly small wins and add them up into a rolling wave of usefulness and feeling good. That said, I was happy to start a healthcare career, which comes with a lot of thankless bullshit, so my advice here is probably niche. You can probably get a lot of the same benefits through volunteer work depending upon the population you work with.
• Sleep Hygiene: Getting a job with a somewhat regular schedule and performing some exercise will help with keeping a sleep schedule. It's hard with retail, but it can be done. I eventually got a set schedule being a stock clerk. I will never go back to rotating shifts unless I have no choice. The importance of keeping your circadian rhythm happy cannot be overstated for mental and physical health. The brain is a bodily organ at the end of the day. It will not work well for you if you do not take care of it. If you must drink (and who doesn't need a drink here or there?), try to stop drinking at least 4 hours before sleep. Psychoactive substances in general wreck sleep, most obviously caffeine but also alcohol.
• Getting older: I feel mean typing that out, but it's true. In my early 30s, I simply have a much easier time of it than I did in my 20s. Emotional lability is just something some of us have to age out of. Even setting aside my questionable retail recommendation, life experience itself can also help, albeit in a very haphazard way.

TL;DR Learn that you weren't born broken --> learn that your neuroses are not even unique and that plenty of lovely people have the same problems --> learn that you also aren't doomed, just like they aren't -->build a life aligned with your values that keeps your body healthy

I never replied to this. Sorry it took me so long. I've actually read that "healing the shame that binds you" book. I definitely found the deconstruction of shame very helpful. But… idk. In the book it really felt like identifying the external source of shame was important to handling it. And I haven't been able to do that, even with therapy. Maybe I should reread it again. Along with your other recs.

The customer service suggestion is an interesting one. I am trying to pivot rn jobs actually. I want to help people. My new job also will (ideally) have "fighting evil" as part of the job description (in a manner of speaking), so I hope it does give me some examples of how "actually I'm not so bad." Idk, most of my life experiences have only served to make me more aware of my own privilege, which has fueled the self hate quite a bit. But yeah I want a career where I interact with people more.

I was in a mindfulness group once and really struggled. Honestly… I just find it so boring my brain instantly wanders. But discipline over my thoughts could be good. I guess I should get back into it.

Insomnia definitely impacts my self hatred. Frankly being low on sleep makes me desperately suicidal like nothing else. It's crazy how dramatic an impact it has on my mental health for the day to be sleep deprived. I def need to manage my sleep better.

As for getting older? ): so far it has not helped. Idk. Sometimes I feel like I hate myself more than I did when I was young, then again when I was young I REALLY hated myself ( I know because I used to write about it). So idk. For now it doesn't seem like age is helping.

But thanks a lot for your reply. I think it's a bit of encouragement that some of the stuff I'm already focusing on could be helpful. And honestly it's just good to see someone else who overcame this, even partially. Most days, I feel like my self hatred will end up killing me, but I am still trying (for my family's sake, if nothing else). Again, thanks a lot.

 

[Celerity]

I ne

I never replied to this. Sorry it took me so long. I've actually read that "healing the shame that binds you" book. I definitely found the deconstruction of shame very helpful. But… idk. In the book it really felt like identifying the external source of shame was important to handling it. And I haven't been able to do that, even with therapy. Maybe I should reread it again. Along with your other recs.

The customer service suggestion is an interesting one. I am trying to pivot rn jobs actually. I want to help people. My new job also will (ideally) have "fighting evil" as part of the job description (in a manner of speaking), so I hope it does give me some examples of how "actually I'm not so bad." Idk, most of my life experiences have only served to make me more aware of my own privilege, which has fueled the self hate quite a bit. But yeah I want a career where I interact with people more.

I was in a mindfulness group once and really struggled. Honestly… I just find it so boring my brain instantly wanders. But discipline over my thoughts could be good. I guess I should get back into it.

Insomnia definitely impacts my self hatred. Frankly being low on sleep makes me desperately suicidal like nothing else. It's crazy how dramatic an impact it has on my mental health for the day to be sleep deprived. I def need to manage my sleep better.

As for getting older? ): so far it has not helped. Idk. Sometimes I feel like I hate myself more than I did when I was young, then again when I was young I REALLY hated myself ( I know because I used to write about it). So idk. For now it doesn't seem like age is helping.

But thanks a lot for your reply. I think it's a bit of encouragement that some of the stuff I'm already focusing on could be helpful. And honestly it's just good to see someone else who overcame this, even partially. Most days, I feel like my self hatred will end up killing me, but I am still trying (for my family's sake, if nothing else). Again, thanks a lot.

If Bradshaw didn't speak to you, there are always others. We all find different perspectives persuasive. Though I credit that you are willing to give it another shot, your priority needs to be finding someone with whom you can identify. It can be deeply alienating to feel like you're dealing with someone who just doesn't get it. There are a lot of recs in r/CPTSD. https://www.reddit.com/r/CPTSD/ Off the top of my head, a lot of people liked Pete Walker's book. Here is his website: https://www.pete-walker.com/complex_ptsd_book.html Another good one on YouTube is Dr. Scott Eilers. https://www.youtube.com/@DrScottEilers Both of these men are/were fellow sufferers.

I wish you the best on your new job, though now I am curious what it is (police? security?).

As for groups, ACoA is more of a peer support group. Mindfulness is definitely tough to do in a group setting, so I hear you. I also didn't like DBT partly for this reason. Our perspectives on the mindfulness practices were too diverse to find a lot of commonality. With ACoA we all had our different problems, but the unifying theme of toxic family dynamics was enough for fellowship and learning.

 

[turned_to_one]

though my initial self-loathing was certainly due to my upbringing, as an adult i've learned that mercy/forgiveness and failure recovery are skills to be honed like any other.

it can all be very unconscious.

i did x things that hurt or upset people.
im horrible at doing x.
every time i try x it fails.
my romantic advances are always rejected.
i want to be good at x, but im not.
i keep hurting people that i care about.

this can feel like evidence of your shortcomings, and over time it gives you a general lack of satisfaction with who you are. eventually, you may find that you've come to hate yourself.

to be "good" at a thing, you must be good at imperfection/failure, which is actually very difficult. failure doesn't usually feel good, and as a result many people stop trying to do things that they will do imperfectly.
in turn you have to be merciful with yourself and forgive yourself. this is also hard, because when we don't get what we want over and over again, it may feel impossible to forgive ourselves for the perceived shortcomings that deny what we feel will make us happy.

learning to be okay with imperfection, and forgiving ourselves are hard skills to learn, but it is possible. sometimes, medication and/or therapy are needed to help break the innate feelings and thoughts that keep you from progressing past the negative. or, from even locating where the negativity is coming from.

it is okay to be unhappy. it's okay to be unhappy about things that have happened or things you've done. the problem arises when those feelings persist and prevent you from moving forward.

you have to forgive yourself, even when no one else will. that's not a blanket statement about being allowed to do whatever you want.

it's "i did x thing. i was feeling a certain way, and it became overwhelming enough that i did something im not proud of. im sorry it happened. it was not wrong to feel that way, but it was not okay to do x thing because of it. i didn't want to do it, but i know why it happened. im a human with flaws and mistakes like everyone else. i can improve and move past this"

and you have to keep practicing it. I think a lot of therapist refer to this as a sort of mindfulness. ideally you get to the point where you can meet your feelings head on before they influence your actions.

even thoughts: "i thought about killing myself today. im not sure why, but i will acknowledge the thought without letting it dominate my day. maybe something stressful happened, or i thought about something that made me unhappy. thats okay. im allowed to have thoughts and ignore them. if it's hard to ignore, i can exercise curiosity to understand why i am feeling this way"

and similar with thoughts of worthlessness or self-hatred. there is probably a reason you are feeling this way!

https://youfeellikeshit.com/ is also an invaluable resource. it will walk you through a checklist so you can evaluate and see if your feelings are being triggered by a lack of some more base needs being unmet