Discussion Do you think psych wards should exist ? #5

[MeltingBrain]

I have seen a lot of people here have a go at psych wards on this forum. They hate the idea of being involuntarily committed . They argue it takes away their freedom, dignity and/or is simply not useful. On the other hand, the government argues, psych wards are equipped with giving appropriate care to the patient .

What are your thoughts ?
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Part of : https://sanctioned-suicide.net/thre...st-at-least-1-poll-daily.123125/#post-2051973
DailyPoll
#5
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[FuneralCry]

No they should never exist at all, to me they just sound like horrible prisons and they just create even more suffering.

 

[nothingissacred]

i honestly think they should exist for both voluntary and involuntary but i also think not every mental illness should be able to be put in there involuntarily if that makes sense?
i think there are cases where the person doesnt want to go into a ward but afterward is greatful for it and there are illnesses which definitely can be treated in psychwards
on the other hand i think you shouldnt be able to be put into one if you for example decided to kill yourself while not on drugs or anything like that

 

[Walilamdzii]

I am struggling to process the trauma of being placed in a psych ward, my life has never been the same since and it's a primary reason for me to CTB.. so in their current state, no, I don't think they should exist. They are the worst places I have ever been.

 

[nothingissacred]

No they should never exist at all, to me they just sound like horrible prisons and they just create even more suffering.

what about the ppl who want to go there to try to get help?

 

[Walilamdzii]

what about the ppl who want to go there to try to get help?

I think when you are actually in one, what you realise is that help doesn't exist...

 

[MeltingBrain]

I am struggling to process the trauma of being placed in a psych ward, my life has never been the same since and it's a primary reason for me to CTB.. so in their current state, no, I don't think they should exist. They are the worst places I have ever been.

I am so sorry
What happened if you don't mind sharing with us?

 

[nothingissacred]

Well as i said there are illnesses where help doesnt exist, there are some where it depends on the person and there are some which can be treated.
I think ppl should be able to decide for themselves if the want to go there or not

 

[delusionalgirl]

By some bizarre turn of events I've never been in one however I've known many and even visited them. Now I'm all these case I would say 85% maybe higher I vowed never to do anything to get me sent there. But I've seen a couple that we're not horrible. Staff was nice. Doctors seemed to care. But for instance. This is the same case for rehab. Big difference in quality of care, if you have money. So until quality of care is unilateral then no they shouldn't. Some people come out worse.

 

[exhaustedanonymous]

The thing is, I think they're necessary for people whose mental state is like. causing them to harm others? If I'm in a psychotic rage and hurt someone, going to jail would kinda be not the right place, I'd assume they should put me in a psych ward. And it's also necessary to make sure that people who want to be taken out of society for a bit because they think it'll help them breathe and recovery a little have a place to go.

The issue is, it's help over the heads of people a lot. I can't be honest with medical professionals cause they'd just stick me in there, even though it's guaranteed to just make it worse (in my case, at least) & that shouldn't be happening.

I think in some situations psych wards are good, but.. yeah. They shouldn't be used as a threat or some way to scare people to stop being open because it's easier to stick you somewhere then genuinely listen.

 

[vitbar]

There are people who have found themselves in situations where involuntary confinement is in their interests. I know people who have become completely psychotic and were engaging in harmful behaviour (themselves and others, but not suicidal).

 

[Walilamdzii]

I am so sorry
What happened if you don't mind sharing with us?

It's quite complicated, hard to explain everything... but I've been institutionalised for almost a year of my life now, in total (7 different times) and I'm just no longer the same person as I used to be. It changes your perspective on everything and how you feel about yourself. The worst thing that happened to me was being sexually assaulted three times. Twice by one man and a separate time by another. As in raped. Absolutely nothing was done about it. Other than that, you just see a lot of suffering, and the feeling of being trapped somewhere..

 

[Forever Sleep]

I've never been in one- so, I find it hard to really comment on. I've heard horror stories here but also times when it seemed to help people.

I think they probably do need to exist but I'm sure they need to be better than they are. One thing that stands out is the variation in cases. Some people are more 'disturbed' than others ie. prone to violence and outburts. I've often heard people saying that being around such severe cases only made things worse. Seeing as there are so many varying degrees of behaviour- I think there should be different clinics to reflect that. Some maybe need to be more 'secure' than others.

As to involuntary commitment- again, that's so difficult to answer not being a psychiatrist. I've watched documentaries though where people start to become physically violent towards their families. They haven't necessarily commited a crime yet- so- prison isn't appropriate- although- they do present a danger to others. In which case- yes- I think they need to be confined. As awful as that is.

When it comes to self harm/ suicide- I struggle because I only really know my experience with it. I don't feel like I'm mentally ill. I'd be furious if they tried to commit me. Other people may attribute their ideation to a mental illness though, or that it's something that takes control of them. In which case- I don't know- perhaps they welcome the intervention.

That's it though- I don't know. I think they should be talking to people more about it. I definitely expect that horrible things go on in them though- violations of people's rights etc. I feel like they probably need to still exist but be better.

 

[InaudibleEcho]

In my personal experience, I voluntarily went to a psyche ward and it was a mixed bag. I don't think I'd ever voluntarily go again. I sometimes think "oh, it wasn't so bad" but then I remember how the rooms were so cold I could hardly sleep, I never knew what time it was, and there were periods we stayed in our cement rooms with only a bathroom, beds, and whatever our families brought (no pens, pencils, technology, or clothes with strings were allowed). There were no clocks.
The best things about it were I got to talk to people my age and I ate three meals a day, something I never have in my normal life. It actually scared me out of being suicidal. I was horrified of even thinking about sh because I thought I'd have to go back.
I answered it's okay voluntarily but when I say that I mean when people are completely aware of what goes on in psyche wards. I know not all psyche wards are the same and I hope the worse ones get better in the future. There are people who want to recover and I don't like how difficult it is. Trust me, I really wanted to recover but nothing worked. That's why I'm here.

 

[winamp]

I would voluntarily go if I were in the position to do so

but also mental health care in my state needs to improve dramatically so I'd much rather go to a therapist

also I would be worried about my safety if I were to go I've heard too many stories of things going wrong when it comes to staff and other patients

 

[Kerrtu]

I think when you are actually in one, what you realise is that help doesn't exist...

Powerful, painful truth @Walilamdzii



After my first attempt, I was taken to Bellevue in NY. There was one shower for the entire ward, which was separated by the nurse's station: men on one side, women on the other. It was very easy to go from one side to the other; some patients were actually handcuffed to gurneys. Patients were given paper towels to dry off. It was filthy and fortunately they shuffled me out after 48 hours.

There's a hospital in North Carolina I checked myself into, Holly Hills, thinking it was one of the more humane ones but once I was inside, I learned it's nickname: Holy Hell.

Psych wards and Psych hospitals in the US need a complete overhaul, top to bottom, with the exception of maybe Mass General (they're treating PTSD and MDD with ketamine, which is pretty progressive for New England), and private hospitals which cost a fortune ie McLean.

 

[charlotte_]

I certainly could see how this could be both a good thing or a horrible thing, so I pick yes for voluntary and no for involuntary. There are people who certainly do want and need to go to psych wards if they are in need of help. If done right, psych wards and therapy can greatly improve one's life. The reason why there are so many threads abt bad mental health service on SS is because we are mostly focused on venting on the suicide discussion part of the forum, but in reality, people do get help sometimes. But ofc that doesn't mean we can disregard the bad experiences. To me, being forced into a closed off place, being on watch 24/7 without your consent is nothing different from being sent to prison. It's horrifying.

 

[timetodie24]

Involuntary commitment/sectioning seems to be overused in some countries for sure. I think sometimes it is necessary, such as someone who is violent and doesn't have the insight at that time to realise they're in psychotic state. Or someone in a manic state may believe they have powers and put their self in dangerous situations (e.g running through traffic or jumping from a height) They may need to be somewhere that can keep them and others safe until the medication works.

But it's not the right environment for many people. Especially acute wards can be a mix of a lot of different illnesses, it can be noisy and violent. There's often little to do, it's just medicate and wait basically.

In the UK people are locked up on wards for years because they need supported accomodation but lack of social care means it's not available . Often they don't even have mental illness, rather learning disabilities or autism. So they stay on wards indefinetly until council funds a place.

But in their current state, psych wards shouldn't exist. Far too many are dangerous places, they can be unsafe and staff can be abusive. Restraints and restrictive practices shouldn't be used as freely as they are. People often come out with worse trauma than when they went it . Therapeutic wards should exist, ones that are safe, where staff actually care, where restrictive practices are last resort, and there's other treatments instead of just medication. Where the focus is on planning for a safe discharge asap. But the problem isn't also just wards. Too often people end up on wards because of poor community services. So both need an overhaul as there'll always be a need for both.

 

[FormerlyFe(IV)]

I was taken in the night at a ward, against my will, and stayed their until evening the next day, for the SUSPICION I was suicidal. Welness checks seem to not be an option here in Brazil.

It was traumatising, and I have a thread where I extensively rant about my experience.

Despite that, I do think they should exist, but they need a LOT of improvement. Beyond SH/Suicidal people, there are other mental health conditions where a ward could help, like treating psychosis. But we need humane treatment in wards. Their current forms around the world are just unreasonable.

Sometimes worse than nothing, sometimes better than nothing. SS is most likely to attract bitter experiences about institutionalization, but I have heard from another older forum that teens doing SH found them helpful.

 

[Pidgeons_Sparrows]

voluntary is fine, however involuntary is fucking kidnapping, torture and slavery like straight up
that shit violates so many human rights it should not be legal

 

[Asingletwig]

I think both tbh, as much as I hate how they tend to treat people I do think its needed sometimes. Because sometimes it is just a person having a schizo moment and they don't want to actually hurt themselves or others. But threaten to in the moment.
But I do think there is alot of things to be done on the humanitarian side of things. Grabbing and locking someone up against their will is fucked up

 

[suicidalloser]

Obvious bait question #77
No it shouldn't. Unless you're sadistic getting off to torturing and imprisonment of the suffering.

 

[loyalskateboard]

Imo yes they should exist. They 100% need a complete overhaul though as the current system is a load of crap.

 

[suicidalloser]

Imo yes they should exist. They 100% need a complete overhaul though as the current system is a load of crap.

Well duh, not surprised you'd agree wholeheartedly to such folly.
Even if it paid a daily stipend it still should not exist. Nothing should ever mask or turn a blind eye to those abusive facilities. Speak up about it and you still get sent there regardless to have that same abuse repeated. The only good thing is when their malicious actions actually kill, leats the pain is over with then

 

[loyalskateboard]

Well duh, not surprised you'd agree wholeheartedly to such folly.
Even if it paid a daily stipend it still should not exist. Nothing should ever mask or turn a blind eye to those abusive facilities. Speak up about it and you still get sent there regardless to have that same abuse repeated. The only good thing is when their malicious actions actually kill, leats the pain is over with then

Excuse me? I don't understand what I did for such a passive aggressive reply. I'm not turning a blind eye towards abusive facilities, they need to be shut down. I've been admitted to psych wards where there were abusive staff. It's not acceptable at all. I just believe psych wards should exist in some capacity. Not in the current state, it needs to serious overhaul. But the complete absence of psych wards is not a good idea imo.

 

[Dot]

Imo if a persn = psychotc & d-tachd frm realty or in a temprry criss thn thy wll nd 2 b treatd smewhre -- somatc hosptls wll nt b enuf & speclsts wll b needd

Thnk th/ problm = whn thre = ovr-reach & abse happns

Thnk propr treatmnt nds 2 exst fr mentlly unwll ppl bt currnt m.h hospitls r nt adequ8 & as othrs hve st8td mny r abusve

Well duh, not surprised you'd agree wholeheartedly to such folly.
Even if it paid a daily stipend it still should not exist. Nothing should ever mask or turn a blind eye to those abusive facilities. Speak up about it and you still get sent there regardless to have that same abuse repeated. The only good thing is when their malicious actions actually kill, leats the pain is over with then

Kp thngs civil pls

 

[flyingrabbitt]

I think they should exist for both voluntary and involuntary but we do need major changes especially with involuntary. I think involuntary should be for people out of touch with reality (psychosis, mania, etc) rather than suicidal people with the exception of impulsive crisis where they should have a short stay to calm down and review their options and be moved to outpatient treatment which is significantly better in the long run.

In a perfect world psych wards would honour autonomy and have significantly less restraints/sedations because those are very traumatic. There should be a lot more therapy too, in my experience we got very little therapy when we should've been getting a lot more and treatment plans should be unique rather than a one size fits all. It gets tricky in the case of psychosis and such but those people still deserve autonomy even if they are resistant to medication because loss of autonomy is only going to hurt them in the long run.

There should be different wards for different issues where treatments and specialists are specific to that group for example psychotic people need different treatment compared to traumatised people and so on. The nurses should also be trained in the disorder groups they're treating because I've also found a lot of them have no idea on what mental illness actually is.

Reform of the mental health systems is actually one of my special interests so if anyone wants to know more about this from my point of view please dm!!

 

[conflagration]

I think when you are actually in one, what you realise is that help doesn't exist...

Took me 6 stays in mental wards to actually release this. Hope dies last...

 

[CTBookOfLife]

General psychwards should not exist, no.

But treatment centers? Yes.

Psychwards just throw a hundred people with different disorders and way of life together and give them little help.

Treatment centers SPECIALIZE in the disorder. OCD, EDs, etc.

Not to say it's perfect, but treatment centers and group therapy combined with better access to therapy/memtal help/resources in general could basically replace psychwards.

 

[d3j3ct3dl0s3r05]

General psychwards should not exist, no.

But treatment centers? Yes.

Psychwards just throw a hundred people with different disorders and way of life together and give them little help.

Treatment centers SPECIALIZE in the disorder. OCD, EDs, etc.

Not to say it's perfect, but treatment centers and group therapy combined with better access to therapy/memtal help/resources in general could basically replace psychwards.

On top of that, the staff don't seem to have any understanding of mental illness as a whole which just makes everything even more unproductive and toxic. At least where I am at least