Resource SN FAQ - Antiemetics, Benzo, Antacid, Beta-blockers, Painkillers [DRAFT]

[one4all]

<Quarky goes to the corner, opens notebook>
So, that's "one4all" .. 4 in the middle .. double l .. mm.. okay, added to my hit list, cool.

Crap.
I typed that in the wrong chat window!!!
I'll delete it from here. Please not the notebook!

 

[autumnal]

I can't remember where I read, but the dosage required for quetiapine is quite a lot higher than a lot of people are prescribed...so what @autumnal is saying concerns me too. I feel like I saw 300mg being a dose effective as an antiemetic, and that's 6x what I take regularly.

Agreed, I posted a reputable source suggesting that 300mg+ is needed to have antiemetic effects on the relevant dopamine receptors.

And from personal experience, increasing from a small prescribed regular dose around 50mg to an antiemetic dose of 300mg+ would probably cause unwanted side effects, although I can't say whether these would occur and/or be concerning within the narrow timeframe between taking the meds and death from SN.

 

[Quarky00]

Lol I don't reread entire threads every time I post in them, sorry for the inconvenience. Not all up with this forum culture stuff, wasn't trying to cause issues

I think this community appreciates people who comment after reading That's the culture. We are not Facebook ... FAQ is rather simple. Person was looking for specific part (quetiapine) , there's no "rereading every thread" . If one is about to kill oneself , one could spend extra 5m reading .

Agreed, I posted a reputable source suggesting that 300mg+ is needed to have antiemetic effects on the relevant dopamine receptors. And from personal experience, increasing from a small prescribed regular dose around 50mg to an antiemetic dose of 300mg+ would probably cause unwanted side effects, although I can't say whether these would occur and/or be concerning within the narrow timeframe between taking the meds and death from SN.

Your concerns are in place . This has been addressed . May use domperidone . I am not aware of people using meto+AP , members avoided that , testimonials show AP enough without meto . Do as you please . There's no point for me to repeat

I'm sorry I can't give you the answers you want , that it's okay to use AP and meto ... I'm sorry that currently no one will give such answer afaik .. do your own maths .. You were given planty of information , I have tried to be patient , time to move on


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Crap. I typed that in the wrong chat window!!!
I'll delete it from here. Please not the notebook!

Thank God someone is keeping me amused and smiling

 

[one4all]

Thank God someone is keeping me amused and smiling

I do what i can..when i can

I'm not sure if this has been addressed or not. I think in the discalimer you should included that everyone needs to do there own research also and come up with their own conclusions.

 

[autumnal]

[...]
This has been addressed
[...]

But that thread doesn't provide any answers as to dosage of Quetapine, and in fact Stan states there that he doesn't know whether a prescribed regular 25mg dose will have the desired antiemetic effects. Which according to the reputable source I linked to in my previous post, it definitely does not.

So I'm afraid I'm not following how you think that thread shows that further discussion of Quetapine dosage is somehow unnecessary or annoying? Sorry if we've gotten crossed wires somehow, but my sense from reading all (or most of) the relevant threads I could find do not provide a more definitive answer to the question that quite a few users seem to share. I'm not looking for answers that only agree with me, I'm looking for answers that confidently state one way or the other.

 

[xBrialesana]

@Quarky00 - i see you keep coming back to give people answers- that's so kind of you

@everyone- does ANYBODY have any sort of idea what dosage of Propanolol is recommended and when? I can't seem to find that anywhere, yes ive searched!

 

[squirtsoda]

I've seen 1g of propranolol

I've seen 1g of propranolol

*** to potentiate SN, not for tachycardia. I take 40mg for anxiety+tachycardia.

 

[Quarky00]

But that thread doesn't provide any answers as to dosage of Quetapine, and in fact Stan states there that he doesn't know whether a prescribed regular 25mg dose will have the desired antiemetic effects. Which according to the reputable source I linked to in my previous post, it definitely does not.

So I'm afraid I'm not following how you think that thread shows that further discussion of Quetapine dosage is somehow unnecessary or annoying? Sorry if we've gotten crossed wires somehow, but my sense from reading all (or most of) the relevant threads I could find do not provide a more definitive answer to the question that quite a few users seem to share. I'm not looking for answers that only agree with me, I'm looking for answers that confidently state one way or the other.

You got that right . How many times do you want me to say it ? There is no "proper" dosage for AP!!!! . It is specified everywhere , I've written several times , AP DO NOT HAVE DOSAGE . How many "we don't know" do you need to hear??

• We don't know if 25mg or 50mg is effective and more research is needed . The line about Xmg being antiemetic is repeated in several source but not corroborated .
• If you think it isn't -- you may use Domperidone , which IS effective .
• Quetapine affinity for D2 (antiemetic) is rather weak at 379nM , but may still be effective ; on the other hand affinity for "5HT2A/D2" is rather high at 2.41nM ; what does that mean ? I don't know .
• I do not think the other thread is annoying , on the contrary you may bump that thread , maybe someone will answer .
• But it shouldn't be rehashed here in the FAQ unless there is consensual conclusion . You got an answer : We don't know , if not sure use Domperidone . I find discussing that repeatedly on the FAQ , which should be clear and accessible for ALL members , extremely annoying and counterproductive .

 

[xBrialesana]

I've seen 1g of propranolol

*** to potentiate SN, not for tachycardia. I take 40mg for anxiety+tachycardia.

That's like, a hell of a lot right?
Sorry, I'm very well versed in my pharmaceuticals, not this one!
I imagine the dose with SN is on the smaller side?

Edit: I was given 180 40mg pills with my script I'm picking up. Sorry I'm not making sense either insomnina still kicking my ass

And everyone has different answers in terms of the dose. If there isn't a definite answer, fuck it I'll wing it/stay light (?)

 

[Quarky00]

@Briannacondaaa is right . I remember it discussed , that PPH 1g Prop is an OD in itself ... :)

I'd be glad if anyone could link the answer and we'll add it

If I remember correctly, the propranolol dosage after a heart attack is only 360mg. 2g is very excessive. And yes it tastes like absolute shit. No thanks

I do not understand why they would suggest 2 grams of propranolol crushed and dissolved into the SN mixture. I have taken 3.6g of propranolol crushed up and mixed into a drink and it was completely unpalatable and left me with a painful, burning mouth and I immediately vomitted.

PN also says to take a hefty overdose of propranolol with your SN, so I'm not sure how much I trust

 

[squirtsoda]

1g is a hell of a lot to take for sure. Nowhere near enough to kill you.

 

[xBrialesana]

@Briannacondaaa is right . I remember it discussed , that PPH 1g Prop is an OD in itself ... :)

Yeah that's what I thought? Thet was on a level of an OD itself. Thanks for reply.

If no one really has an answer I'll volunteer as tribute to test when I do ctb. Thanks again for all this info

 

[Quarky00]

I plan to CTB by summer 2020.
. . . .
1:00am - 600mg Ibuprofen and 20mg Propranolol

a little propranolol should keep any discomfort to a minimum.

Please feel free to correct me or suggest improvements:
. . . . .
2250: 1000mg Paracetamol + 100mg Propranolol

the propranolol dosage after a heart attack is only 360mg. 2g is very excessive.

We didn't know if it stood for 2 grams or if it was a typo for 2mgs (which also wouldn't make sense, too low)

Why don't members go to google and look up what is a normal dose, what is an overdose and what are the effects? Stop looking at one man's statement who's opinion changes every 6 months to keep updating and selling books. Do your own research. I could find ALL the relevant information in 5 minutes. I know - I did it. Using real medical or pharmaceutical websites.

 

[xBrialesana]

Thank you. And yeah Stan basically said it best. That's what I've been doing and going by. In this case paranoia does get the best and I don't want any fuckups. Thank you

 

[Quarky00]

Beta Blockers
What they do:	Reduce fast heartbeat after SN May reduce headache May hasten unconsciousness or death SN circulatory failure -- low blood pressure contributes. These meds reduce blood pressure.
What is the dosage?	Google , read Stan's comment . There is no recommended dosage -- use your own discretion: 40mg-80mg -- dosage for heartbeat , blood pressure , migraine , anxiety 20mg-100mg -- taken by members
PPH says 2g	IGNORE IT . WRONG . See: [1][2][3][4]

Fixes to AA and PPI:

Antacids & Regulators
Do I need those?	No. The least significant part of SN [1] Effectiveness is questionable. Many use them as considered widely-available, not dangerous, and common practice. Can be skipped.
Can I use other antacids? Sodium Bicarbonate?	We don't know. PPH previous practice was sodium bicarbonate. It was not bad. It is not considered very helpful [1] [2] PPH switch to acid-regulator (more effective, less interactions) Some used Rennie etc Gavison may not be good Better use H2 acid-regulators -- antacid effects are unclear (no consensus) If not available and you are unsure -- skip antacids
Why PPI not a solution?	May interfere with SN effects -- according research [1] [2]

Fasting has been added here: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-faq-storage-recovery-death.29714/post-577860

And revised: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/sn-faq-storage-recovery-death.29714/post-592774

 

[autumnal]

You got that right . How many times do you want me to say it ? There is no "proper" dosage for AP!!!! . It is specified everywhere , I've written several times , AP DO NOT HAVE DOSAGE . How many "we don't know" do you need to hear??

• We don't know if 25mg or 50mg is effective and more research is needed . The line about Xmg being antiemetic is repeated in several source but not corroborated .
• If you think it isn't -- you may use Domperidone , which IS effective .
• Quetapine affinity for D2 (antiemetic) is rather weak at 379nM , but may still be effective ; on the other hand affinity for "5HT2A/D2" is rather high at 2.41nM ; what does that mean ? I don't know .
• I do not think the other thread is annoying , on the contrary you may bump that thread , maybe someone will answer .
• But it shouldn't be rehashed here in the FAQ unless there is consensual conclusion . You got an answer : We don't know , if not sure use Domperidone . I find discussing that repeatedly on the FAQ , which should be clear and accessible for ALL members , extremely annoying and counterproductive .

Oh OK, I do apologise but it wasn't clear to me that you were stating the definitive answer was 'we don't know', rather I thought you meant there was an agreed numeric figure somewhere that I wasn't noticing.

Isn't the FAQ thread also for people to post their own questions, as well as the topmost post being a large set of frequently asked questions already anticipated and pre-answered by the OP? Because it does seem that the question of antipsychotic dosage for AE effects is asked at least somewhat frequently.

 

[Quarky00]

Are they available?

No. Prescription only (other than UK) , though many acquired AE easily: Ask physician – example (original post) Search Internet , common online pharmacies Consult existing threads (others looking for it) Notes Buccastem (prochlorperazine) - OTC in UK Reglan , Primperan -- common brands of Metoclopramide (dozens others check list) Acquiring or importing prescription-only medication without prescription is illegal. Not "restricted substance" but if caught may be fined. Forging prescription is serious crime.

Why not Histamine?

Responsible for movement (Vestibular nucleus) , treats motion sickness Little to do with poisons, stomach, or CTZ . Lack prokinetic activity See here Dramamine is not a good solution , though won't harm . We don't why PPH push these .

(AE addon)

 

[Quarky00]

Can I use other sedatives?

Perhaps real anesthetics, we don't know – be cautious. Little to no information about using anesthetics with SN Do proper research yourself Do trials and time the effects Usually taken before SN GBL – safe – Stan himself used some Propofol – dangerous – may cause respiratory arrest Ketamine – safe – member used

 

[Busdriver]

Should you advise to use Oxycodon (opiate) and Temazepan (benzo) and how much?
I think Oxycodon is a bit risky, because side effect is puking

EDIT: According to this thread morphine is not advised, because could trigger nausea, vomiting

 

[Quarky00]

Should you advise to use Oxycodon (opiate) and Temazepan (benzo) and how much?
I think Oxycodon is a bit risky, because side effect is puking

I don't advise anything :) I think you are right about your observation , better not to complicate things . As stated on this FAQ thread previously , we know little about opioid sedation with SN. So there are no answers .. I'd personally use very little if I had some , but I think most knowledgeable members would advise to avoid.

There is a documentation with morphine but IV. There's a link in this thread... It prolongs SN process (takes longer to die).

As for benzo -- Guide/FAQ answers it , again , in this thread

 

[Quarky00]

AE dump with many additions -- Buccastem , brand names , CTZ , affinity table , vomiting mechanism .

. Antiemetics .	(AE)
What they do:	Move SN to intestines quickly Reduce vomiting It's not just to 'reducing nausea' – prevent serious vomiting (complex stomach-brain interactions) and open GI valves (sphincters).
Do I need it?	No, though recommended. Many used SN fatally without AE Many vomited even with AE Success / vomiting varies, so there is no definitive answer. May be quicker and peaceful , but as Stan noted AEs are not required (may skip if trouble getting).
Are they available?	Depends on country . Usually prescription only OTC – UK, Brazil, Spain Otherwise many acquired AE with little trouble: Easy to ask a physician – example (original post) Search Internet , many online pharmacies Consult existing threads (others looking for it) Importing prescription-only meds without prescription is illegal. Antiemetics are very common , not "restricted substance" , investigation unlikely. Forging prescription is a crime (don't).
Warnings:	CAUTION Read medication side effects and warnings Meto & Prochlorperazine may cause problems. Others also have side-effects, for heart conditions etc. Check contraindication to existing meds – drug interaction calculator Medscape WebMD Drugs.com Test small dosage before ctb date Mild effects – try small dose 8h later (tolerance = less side effects) Severe effects – avoid. Do not combine AEs from the 19 mentioned – use just one type If Olanzapine taken – don't add Meto ; Quetiapine taken – don't add Meto
Types	6 AEs – antiemetics – 3 of which are very common 13 APs – antipsychotics All 19 medications are potent . .
Antiemetics (6)
most common​	. 1. Dromperidone 2. Metoclopramide 3. Prochlorperazine​
​	4. Olanzapine 5. Alizapride 6. Chlorpromazine​ . .
Will any antiemetic work?	NO. Guide provides 6 AEs – only use those. Must target dopamine (Domperidone, Prochlorperazine) Preferably serotonin in addition (Metoclopramide)
"Alternatives to Meto"	Yes . Plenty . Domperidone (with or without Ondansetron) , or Buccastem. There's a list – use it...
Will X work as AE?	If not in guide and you've searched threads, then NO.
AEs in detail​
	Substance Brand name Indication Availability EPS Risk D2 5HT3A 1. Domperidone Motilium AE Banned in US OTC in Asia None 7.5 - 2. Metoclopramide Reglan, Primperan brands AE Rx OTC in Spain, Brasil, Asia Low- 0.2% 7.5 6.2 3. Prochlorperazine Buccastem brands Antipsychotic AE OTC in UK HIGH- 5% 8.4 - 4. Olanzapine Zyprexa brands Antipsychotic CINV Rx Medium- 2% 8.7 - 5. Alizapride AE Rx 6. Chlorpromazine Thorazine, Largactil Antipsychotic AE Rx HIGH- 5% 7.5 - Domperidone efficient as Metoclopramide (research). Stan used Buccastem. Olanzapine very effective [1][2]
sources & notes	"No EPS": scarce cases Receptor Affinity: higher is "stronger" ; 1 pKi (100mM) – 9 pKi (10 nM) Effectiveness: mg ~ nM ~ effetive . Though not definitive (simple maths) . Therapeutic dose of a drug (mg) correlates to affinity for D2 receptor (low nM) Average clinical potency (effective) correlates to affinity for dopamine receptors Any drug with Ki < 50 nM would be remarkably helpful Drugs above 4 pKi are considered to be binding [1] Sources: History of Drug Discovery for Treatment of Nausea and Vomiting – Table 2 (text) Recommended management of nausea and vomiting Sanctioned Suicide Resource – Antiemetics Sanctioned Suicide – Domperidone Research
Other AEs?	DO NOT use – Ondansetron/Zofran Diphenhydramine/Benadryl Dimenhydrinate/Dramamine Serotonin or Histamine only are not as effective. No promotion of gastric emptying Less effective on brain vomiting mechanism for severe poisoning (wide & systematic). D2 receptors go through brainstem and stomach, Histamine do not (History of Drug Discovery for Treatment of Nausea and Vomiting – Figure 5) Effective AE targets both neural & muscular receptors. Read guide ; List of AE by type – dopamine antagonists (Wikipedia)
Why not Dramamine?	Histmine is responsible for body movements (Vestibular nucleus) , treats motion sickness Little to do with poisons, stomach, or CTZ . Lack prokinetic activity See here Dramamine is not a good solution , though won't harm (unkown why PPH push these)
Why not Ondansetron?	"Metoclopramide is used by Dignitas and i think it's the recommened antiemetic in OD, the second one being domperidone, both dopamine antagonists. Ondansetron (Zofran) is a serotonin receptor antagonist and it's used for cancer patients undergoing chemotherapy because the irritation of the GI mucosa by the medication used in chemotherapy (which is cytotoxic and increase the levels of serotonin in the blood) are transmitted through the vagal nerve to the chemoreceptor trigger zone via activating serotonin receptors (5-HT3). It has no effect on dopamine receptors. "
In simple words?​	Need broad systematic AE targeting both CTZ (brain) and stomach plus prokinetic.
How vomiting works	Complex interactions: Chemoreceptor Trigger Zone Vomiting Centre Nucleus Tractus Solitarius GI tract chemoreceptors See graphic schema . .
Antipsychotics	(13)
What are they?	If you do not take these regularly – DO NOT USE – this section is not for you. They affect over weeks – so only if it is your regular medication. Droperidol, Benperidol, Trifuperidol, Spiperone, Haloperidol, Bromperidol, Lurasidone, Sestindole, Paliperidone, Risperidone, Olanzapine, Clozapine, Quetiapine Stan listed with nM (receptor affinity); lower numbers may indicate stronger effects.
Warnings:	CAUTION Abrupt dosage change – harmful Tampering is done over weeks EPS effects Harsh withdrawal (psychosis) Therefore Don't take a single dose Don't double dose Don't change prescribed dosage Don't take Meto with Antipsychotics
How much should I take?	As prescribed, don't change Personally-tailored – dosage varies greatly between individuals (explained here & here) Example .
Do I need AEs with these?	NO. They cover all antiemetics requirements. If you use them regularly – you don't need any Meto or AEs.
How do I use with Stat?	Replace AEs completely – use Stat directions – without Meto. Read directions and ignore any AE/Meto reference. Continue your AP regimen as usual (same dosage same time) .
Quetiapine (Seroquel) is weak AE	It is considered a mild antiemetic – but still effective. No conclusive, definitive answer. Potency only above 300mg –not verified by research (dosage and clinical efficacy for vomiting). Receptor affinity is indicative , not conclusive. No simple maths here Accumulative effects, receptor thershold, systematic, individual parameters (weight gender). Lower dosages (<100mg) considered by some to be ineffective . Many 'veteran patients' still consider it to be effective (BPD_LE notes) . May use alternatives , well detailed here .
Stat / Regimen
What is it?	"Regimen/State" – only antiemetics. Two ways to take antiemetics: One single dose – Stat Over 24h-48h – Regimen Use only one of these schedules (either Stat or Regimen) For antiemetics only – nothing to do wit antipsychotics , benzo , antacids , etc
Stat or Regimen?	Both used with equal success. Depends on your sensitivities, conditions, and preferences.
Regimen​	Builds tolerance – reduces side-effects Increased effectiveness – accumulates (also) – increased stomach tone over time Comfortable – feel prepared for ctb
Stat​	Efficacy appears similar with less hassle (no schedule) Less worry – like side effects during 2 days Comfortable – not demanding, no anxious wait, quick & simple
So, which should I choose?	Up to you. Regimen came from PPH, for old/fragile/sick people. This may address you, could decrease discomfort. Stat is effective, easy option for many people. Take everything together. .
. Meto .	. (Metoclopramide).
Warnings:	Many are fine with it; some aren't; for a few poses a risk. Metoclopramide may have contraindications with: SSRIs, SNRIs, TCAs, many antipsychotics, and more (see Drug Interactions) EPS effects (may be relieved with diphenhydramine -Benadryl): muscle spasms, jerky movements, tremors Members reported other effects (non EPS): Serious(meto stopped): "I wanted to run out of my body" "extreme unease in body, driving me crazy" "made me feel very ill, my whole body" Mild(meto continued): "after taking meto went to sleep 4 hour" "throbbing headache"
Prochlorperazine	Not Meto, but same warnings. Prochlorperazine has higher EPS risk
Why Meto preferred?	Only antiemetic that: Targets both dopamine and 5HT3, and Crosses into the brain This means: Strong stomach emptying effect Strong anti-vomiting vomiting effect However alternatives (5) are fine.
Strong effects without Meto?	Ondansetron and Domperidone target peripheral receptors, not the brain (less side effects): Domperidone (Dopamine, less EPS) + Ondansetron (5HT3, less EPS) = Metoclopramide (Dopamine+5HT3 , Brain/EPS)
Bad Meto reaction – what to do?	Take Diphenhydramine/Benadryl 'Failing Meto' is fine Use any of the other 5 on the list, or Ctb without antiemetics (many have done so but follow guide) .
Stat & Regimen	Guidelines
Dosages / schedule?	Read guide. Follow everything there. – This section is only more details not in guide – .
Meto​
Regimen	See guide. Schedule is however more flexible – Just take 3 a day over 24-48h morning lunch evening, 7-9h apart
Domperidone​
Stat	Same as meto. Notes
Regimen	Same as meto. Best to stick with it. Member was fine after trying 48h regimen x 20mg (instead of 10mg) Research concludes: Acummulation – "2 to 3-fold accumulation observed with repeated 4 times daily every 5 hr for 4 days." But only 3+ a day – "after two weeks of single 30mg per day peak plasma level almost same"
Prochlorperazine​
General info	Buccastem tablets are 3mg each. Keep Benadryl/diphenhydramine on standby (used to treat EPS) Place tablets under upper lip and wait 1-2 hours to dissolve. Notes , Notes
Stat	Smaller dosage– 10 to 20 mg Suggestion: if you are small, take 4 tablets ; medium sized- 5 tablets ; large person- 6 tablets
Regimen	Same as Meto (10mg x 3 times a day) – but final dose smaller like Stat
Fasting​
Is it important?	Yes, SN to intestines. However it is flexible– don't overdo it, follow habits, see FAQ- Fasting. 5h – Empty stomach, partially small intestines – Good enough. 8h – Empty most small intestines – Good. 12h – Long fasting not required (may cause discomfort). According to your habits/feeling; if you eat just twice a day, 12h fine.

 

[Quarky00]

Benzo / Sedatives
What they do:	Reduce Anxiety Any physical reaction / sensations Induce sleep
Do I need it?	No, many didn't use these at all Considered useful for anxiety + peaceful journey
Are they available?	Kinda. Prescription only – but common and easy. GPs prescribe benzo under these circumstances: Immediate relief and occasional/temp/short-termuse of: Severe insomnia Severe panic attacks Anxiety – add-on therapy Do not ask for Xanax Occasional – be responsible cautious patient, say the truth: "once week" , "I don't want full box heard benzos not good" , "try 5 for emergency" Notes, notes
Warnings:	Yes, though not harmful: Benzos effects vary greatly: Potency, tolerance, onset (how quick), duration (how long) change. Some benzo affects within 10m, others take 1h, and this changes individually Taken too soon – may fall asleep before SN Test small dosage beforehand – time its effect Avoid extended-release – act too slow
Which benzo? Is benzo X good? How much to take? What if I have tolerance?	Can't answer that. There are dozens. Anything that affects you more than 4h. See above "Benzos effects vary greatly" Check this personally Benzo "half-life" does not indicate long/short effects. Tolerance – take more than usual
Z-Drugs, Gabapentinoids, Sleeping Pills .
Can I use Z-drugs?	Yes, similar to benzo: Less physical pain, discomfort, etc Induce strong sleep (peaceful) More drowsiness, may fall asleep – test and time it Anxiety - mild to moderate reduction (benzo more powerful) Notes, notes
Can I use Gabapentinoids?	Probably . Gabapentin – member used to ctb
Can I use other 'sleeping pills'?	No. Need strong GABA sedatives Antihistamines, Herbals, OTC – won't work: Drowsy but not asleep No reduction of sensations / anxiety
Anesthetics, Opioids .
Can I use other sedatives?	Perhaps real anesthetics, we don't know – be cautious. Little to no information about using anesthetics with SN Do proper research yourself Do trials and time the effects Usually taken before SN GBL – safe – Stan himself used some Propofol – dangerous – may cause respiratory arrest Ketamine – safe – member used
Can I use opioids?	Can be helpful , but: Check contraindications Small amounts (otherwise increase nausea) Any opioids significantly reduces: metabolism gastric emptying intestinal absorption Will take twice the time. See here and here.

 

[nitrogen]

Here's the story I used to get propranolol Rx in the US. All it took was one email. My pants are totally on fire and I'm proud of it.

 

[Quarky00]

Here's the story I used to get propranolol Rx in the US. All it took was one email. My pants are totally on fire and I'm proud of it.
View attachment 29975
View attachment 29977

I can't believe you did it

 

[Busdriver]

Your message regarding vomiting was soothing, but I did some thinking...

If you faint (around after 15 minutes) and you haven't vomited, you can assume CTB is going according to plan.
If you vomit in general, you should take a next serving.

You think vomiting after benzo/z-drug knockout is not a problem. I understand it won't be pretty (vomit will be after being unconscious, I assume), but can you not wake up because of all the stress and urge to vomit?

Why isn't that dangerous? The vomit could go in your windpipe and you could choke to death in your sleep or even worse, wake up and choke to death?

I like your personal Zolpidem-plan though: falling 5 minutes asleep after SN ingestion is close to the peacefulness of N.

 

[InTheAirTonight]

Your message regarding vomiting was soothing, but I did some thinking...

If you faint (around after 15 minutes) and you haven't vomited, you can assume CTB is going according to plan.
If you vomit in general, you should take a next serving.

You think vomiting after benzo/z-drug knockout is not a problem. I understand it won't be pretty (vomit will be after being unconscious, I assume), but can you not wake up because of all the stress and urge to vomit?

Why isn't that dangerous? The vomit could go in your windpipe and you could choke to death in your sleep or even worse, wake up and choke to death?

I like your personal Zolpidem-plan though: falling 5 minutes asleep after SN ingestion is close to the peacefulness of N.

Is zolpidem a good choice to fall asleep quickly for SN?

 

[Busdriver]

Is zolpidem a good choice to fall asleep quickly for SN?

I believe it so.
Zolpidem, a Z-drug (properties similar to benzos), has quick onset (time to kick in) and a long duration (works for a few hours). See e.g. description here.

Flurazepam, a benzo, also has quick onset and an even longer duration. See e.g. description here.

A lot of benzos and z-drugs are ok, as long as it is not 'time-released'. You can also use z-drugs/benzos with longer onset. Then you have to take the drug earlier before SN drink.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Here's the story I used to get propranolol Rx in the US. All it took was one email. My pants are totally on fire and I'm proud of it.
View attachment 29975
View attachment 29977

Lol! This is hilarious

 

[fluxis]

I am trying to research as much as I can about SN and I found the following article about methemoglobinemia : https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1071541/. What worries me is the following: "N-Acetylcysteine, cimetidine, and ketoconazole are experimental therapies in the treatment of methemoglobinemia that have shown some promising results.20,21,22 Exchange transfusion is reserved for patients in whom methylene blue therapy is ineffective."

We are taking cimetidine or famotidine or ranitidine as an antacid to INCREASE the chances of succes with SN but here it is said that cimetidine is actually considered to be a recovery therapy for methemoglobinemia. What am I missing here?

The minutia of experimental biochemistry with little result or use ;)

This was in original FAQ but omitted:


Cimtedine may slightly fix some metHb, but to a small extent, and there's little evidence of that. It's most effective with stomach acid. Or in simple terms:

Less stomach acid + more SN in intestine > Reduction of hematotoxins

That's not written in stone but pretty good estimate -- doctors themselves know even less on this; many still use oxygen and SDAC (charcoal) which are useless. Antacid and regulators are the least significant part of SN so there's no use in dwelling on that.

All the quotes and articles I've read of Cimetidine reducing metHb is from Dapsone-induced metHb. The Cimetidine inhibits conversion of dapsone to its oxidizing metabolite, dapsone hydroxylamine, by the P-450 system, thereby preventing further development of dapsone-induced methemoglobinemia.
Many articles have been wrought and this has been studied much. Apparently Cimetidine one of our acid regulators has been used a lot to cure and treat metHb- But only metHb induced by Dapsone medication.

Cimetidine, a histamine-2 receptor antagonist, can mitigate dapsone-induced methemoglobinemia by inhibiting
the cytochrome P450 metabolism of dapsone to its toxic hydroxylamine metabolites, which are believed to be the cause of
methemoglobinemia. Cimetidine can be given to prevent the further production of methemoglobin and thus further toxicity from
dapsone. In this patient, a significant decrease in methemoglobin level and clinical improvement were observed within 24 hours of
initiating cimetidine.

This metabolism it inhibits, fixes and stops metHb but does so through above. Do you think it would also stop or inhibit metHb cause by SN in anyway?
I was wondering if you had any more advice about the Cimetidine curing methHb thing?

All the quotes and articles I've read of Cimetidine reducing metHb is from Dapsone-induced metHb. The Cimetidine inhibits conversion of dapsone to its oxidizing metabolite, dapsone hydroxylamine, by the P-450 system, thereby preventing further development of dapsone-induced methemoglobinemia.
Many articles have been wrought and this has been studied much. Apparently Cimetidine one of our acid regulators has been used a lot to cure and treat metHb- But only metHb induced by Dapsone medication.

Cimetidine, a histamine-2 receptor antagonist, can mitigate dapsone-induced methemoglobinemia by inhibiting
the cytochrome P450 metabolism of dapsone to its toxic hydroxylamine metabolites, which are believed to be the cause of
methemoglobinemia. Cimetidine can be given to prevent the further production of methemoglobin and thus further toxicity from
dapsone. In this patient, a significant decrease in methemoglobin level and clinical improvement were observed within 24 hours of
initiating cimetidine.

This metabolism it inhibits, fixes and stops metHb but does so through above. Do you think it would also stop or inhibit metHb cause by SN in anyway?
I was wondering if you had any more advice about the Cimetidine curing methHb thing?

Cytochrome P-450 inhibitors are recommended only for patients with methemoglobinemia secondary to dapsone.
Cimetidine inhibits conversion of dapsone to its oxidizing metabolite, dapsone hydroxylamine, by the P-450 system, thereby preventing further development of dapsone-induced methemoglobinemia

Perhaps Tagamet our Acid Reducer, Cimetidine wont't stop our metHb from happening with Sodium Nitrite because Nitrite does not form metHb from cytochrome P-450 inhibitors like it does with dapsone-induced metHb?

Thanks for any advice or help. Many articles have been written about this cimetidine curing dapsone methb stuff.. here's a link

cimetidine methemoglobinemia - Google Search

 

[Cockatoo]

For now I have some questions.
1) Does the price of drugs matter? In Russia, the price of Cimetidinum(I'm talking about acid regulators) is way way higher than of Ranitidine.
2) Benzodiazepine: Zolpidem or Phenazepam (active substance of Phenozepam- bromdihydrochlorphenylbenzodiazepine)?
Previously Quarky00 said, that his/her choice is Zolpidem. I don't know, what's better, but this user seems to be much more awared of such things, so for me Zolpidem 1 : 0 Phenazepam yet.
3) Is it obvious that death is due to SN when my beautiful body would be found?

For now there is my list: Metoclopramide, Ranitidine, Zolpidem, Ibuprofen/Paracetamol (haven't searched about pain-killers yet, Stan recommends these) + SN.
(sorry for my grammar, eng isn't my native) )