CatLover2000

CatLover2000

Cool beans
Jan 4, 2023
6
23yo female. Dealing with chronic depression and loneliness. I'm also really tired of being seen as a sex object by men and assaulted and taken advantage of. Had one dude that told me he would help me with my rent to which I was greeted by a blowjob while I wasn't even fully awake. Got done really dirty by my ex who was emotionally abusive towards me and had me arrested. I've BEEN getting emotionally abused, so much so that I've turned to drinking alcohol all the time and have been living in absolute filth because of my depression. Feeling it harder and harder to want to stay alive.

That's why I wanted to immigrate to Canada. I actually qualify for a dual-citizenship because my father is a Canadian immigrant and I can get grandfathered to go there. Euthanasia is legal there and it's guaranteed to work. I'm just fucking tired of being miserable and feeling like I can't do anything in life. I'm 23 and feel like I'm 40 sometimes. Anyway, does anyone have suggestions? Which methods (I'm sure this has been asked ad nauseam) can I used to ensure a quick and painless death? I don't care about leaving messes because it's not like I'll be alive for it but I have no access to weapons. My dad does but he keeps them locked away.

Thanks.
 
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DEATH IS FREEDOM

DEATH IS FREEDOM

Death is the solution to unsolvable problems.
Sep 13, 2023
607
I wish I lived in Canada. But I live in a country without euthanasia and I don´t have the option to move to Canada. It is terrible that euthanasia does not exist in all countries and that the politicians have the power over euthanasia. It is difficult to die without a doctor´s help. But I believe that euthanasia will be accepted worldwide in the future.
 
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touhoufan

touhoufan

hello! feel free to pm
Feb 14, 2023
49
23yo female. Dealing with chronic depression and loneliness. I'm also really tired of being seen as a sex object by men and assaulted and taken advantage of. Had one dude that told me he would help me with my rent to which I was greeted by a blowjob while I wasn't even fully awake. Got done really dirty by my ex who was emotionally abusive towards me and had me arrested. I've BEEN getting emotionally abused, so much so that I've turned to drinking alcohol all the time and have been living in absolute filth because of my depression. Feeling it harder and harder to want to stay alive.

That's why I wanted to immigrate to Canada. I actually qualify for a dual-citizenship because my father is a Canadian immigrant and I can get grandfathered to go there. Euthanasia is legal there and it's guaranteed to work. I'm just fucking tired of being miserable and feeling like I can't do anything in life. I'm 23 and feel like I'm 40 sometimes. Anyway, does anyone have suggestions? Which methods (I'm sure this has been asked ad nauseam) can I used to ensure a quick and painless death? I don't care about leaving messes because it's not like I'll be alive for it but I have no access to weapons. My dad does but he keeps them locked away.

Thanks.
I don't mean to shut you down, but I have no idea where non-Canadians are getting this idea that the govnt would just administer euthanasia treatments willy nilly to anyone.

They've stated time and time again that when it'll become a full fledge procedure (March 2024) they will prioritize terminally ill patients, ergo patients who will be dying soon anyway. Psychological patients are not at the top of the list.

And for psychological patients, I can only assume they'd try every damn thing on you before they even begin to consider euthanasia. Probably send you to the ward, heavily medicated.

Do not waste your time and energy into moving here. The public healthcare system is already so bad and crammed. This is just Canada's way of emptying out a few hospital beds faster.
 
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G

Gonnerr

Enlightened
Mar 12, 2023
1,322
I live in Canada and never heard of any foreigner coming for that. Sorry.
 
P

pole

Global Mod
Sep 18, 2018
1,385
I don't mean to shut you down, but I have no idea where non-Canadians are getting this idea that the govnt would just administer euthanasia treatments willy nilly to anyone.

They've stated time and time again that when it'll become a full fledge procedure (March 2024) they will prioritize terminally ill patients, ergo patients who will be dying soon anyway. Psychological patients are not at the top of the list.

And for psychological patients, I can only assume they'd try every damn thing on you before they even begin to consider euthanasia. Probably send you to the ward, heavily medicated.

Do not waste your time and energy into moving here. The public healthcare system is already so bad and crammed. This is just Canada's way of emptying out a few hospital beds faster.

bumping this.

I understand the optimism around Canada's MAID. however, people's expectations need to be tempered down.

the requirements and application process will be stringent and make it less than impossible for the majority of us on this forum to be eligible for MAID.

a tiny percentage will have access and their circumstances would be special and unique. it just doesn't capture many of our pain and suffering.

a better way to understand this is looking at where the discussion of mental health and suicide is at in countries like Canada. it is nowhere near the level that we need. the discourse has barely changed for decades.

we're still stuck in the early stages of the mental health and suicide discussion, where it's pushing for increased access to mental health services and treating our pain and suffering with one-size-fits-all solutions. we're only now entering a new stage of the discussion where we ask ourselves why increased accessibility coincides with soaring suicide rates.

as a result, we're years away from discourse on mental health and suicide being at a stage where many of us would be able to fall into MAID.
 
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wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Unfortunately (fortunately) that's not how MAID works in Canada.

Even if you would get Permanent Residency in Canada and access to healthcare here, you would still have to apply for MAID with VERY stringent criteria applied to patients who suffer solely from mental illness.

The process requires you to show years (decades!) of unsuccessful medical treatments.
Unless you have tried every possibility drug and treatment available you would not qualify for MAID.

You need to prove that your condition can't be treated successfully and will not resolve over the years.

Considering that you are in your 20s it would take another 5-10 years at least of going through treatments, medications, medical trials etc until you can show that no treatment has worked.

I personally have nearly 20 years of unsuccessful treatments behind me and am not confident to qualify for MAID when it becomes available this year.

In addition to this:
You can't be suicidal.
Which disqualifies many, many patients who are currently hoping to apply for MAID.
If you have a history of suicidal ideation or attempts you'll be screened out.
You will have to be stable and non-suicidal for a few months, otherwise nobody will approve you for MAID.

The idea is that MAID is not an alternative to suicide. Suicide is considered a momentary lapse out of a crisis situation and not well thought out.

MAID is considered to be a conscience, well prepared and thought out approach that is only for those who absolutely cannot be helped with any available (or future) medical care.
 
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LaVieEnRose

LaVieEnRose

Angelic
Jul 23, 2022
4,247
Unfortunately (fortunately) that's not how MAID works in Canada.

Even if you would get Permanent Residency in Canada and access to healthcare here, you would still have to apply for MAID with VERY stringent criteria applied to patients who suffer solely from mental illness.

The process requires you to show years (decades!) of unsuccessful medical treatments.
Unless you have tried every possibility drug and treatment available you would not qualify for MAID.

You need to prove that your condition can't be treated successfully and will not resolve over the years.

Considering that you are in your 20s it would take another 5-10 years at least of going through treatments, medications, medical trials etc until you can show that no treatment has worked.

I personally have nearly 20 years of unsuccessful treatments behind me and am not confident to qualify for MAID when it becomes available this year.

In addition to this:
You can't be suicidal.
Which disqualifies many, many patients who are currently hoping to apply for MAID.
If you have a history of suicidal ideation or attempts you'll be screened out.
You will have to be stable and non-suicidal for a few months, otherwise nobody will approve you for MAID.

The idea is that MAID is not an alternative to suicide. Suicide is considered a momentary lapse out of a crisis situation and not well thought out.

MAID is considered to be a conscience, well prepared and thought out approach that is only for those who absolutely cannot be helped with any available (or future) medical care.
Jesus.

A lifetime of consistent suicidal ideation should be qualifying.

Some of us never experience stability or freedom from suicidal ideation at all. It seems enjoying those things even if for a few months would cast doubt on whether MAID is appropriate, not necessarily support it.

This distinguishing between MAID and suicide seems so silly.
 
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wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Jesus.

A lifetime of consistent suicidal ideation should be qualifying.

Some of us never experience stability or freedom from suicidal ideation at all. It seems enjoying those things even if for a few months would cast doubt on whether MAID is appropriate, not necessarily support it.

This distinguishing between MAID and suicide seems so silly.
I know.
It's incredibly difficult to walk that very thin line of talking openly with your care provider about your plans to apply for MAID and which documents you may need from your GP but at the same time not being able to talk about how fucking ready you are to get going.

It's a whole lot of administration stuff it seems and a slew of medical assessments that one has to endure (after decades of seeing incredible incompetent, insulting and dishonest medical professionals).

I'm still going to try and apply but right now all I can think is "fuck it. I don't have time for this. DIY baby!"
 
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LaVieEnRose

LaVieEnRose

Angelic
Jul 23, 2022
4,247
I know.
It's incredibly difficult to walk that very thin line of talking openly with your care provider about your plans to apply for MAID and which documents you may need from your GP but at the same time not being able to talk about how fucking ready you are to get going.

It's a whole lot of administration stuff it seems and a slew of medical assessments that one has to endure (after decades of seeing incredible incompetent, insulting and dishonest medical professionals).

I'm still going to try and apply but right now all I can think is "fuck it. I don't have time for this. DIY baby!"
Well, if you're up for all the probing you might as well apply because surely it's a superior experience than anything we can do ourselves, if only just for being able to be open about it.
 
CatLover2000

CatLover2000

Cool beans
Jan 4, 2023
6
I don't mean to shut you down, but I have no idea where non-Canadians are getting this idea that the govnt would just administer euthanasia treatments willy nilly to anyone.

They've stated time and time again that when it'll become a full fledge procedure (March 2024) they will prioritize terminally ill patients, ergo patients who will be dying soon anyway. Psychological patients are not at the top of the list.

And for psychological patients, I can only assume they'd try every damn thing on you before they even begin to consider euthanasia. Probably send you to the ward, heavily medicated.

Do not waste your time and energy into moving here. The public healthcare system is already so bad and crammed. This is just Canada's way of emptying out a few hospital beds faster.
I appreciate your response. Thank you.
 
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AshClouds

AshClouds

In time I started growing inward.
Apr 10, 2023
297
Thats terrible what happened to you.
I don't know much about the MAID program, but I heard its really difficult to get approved.

Not sure if they'd view you as a tourist if you're still a dual citizen.
 
wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Thats terrible what happened to you.
I don't know much about the MAID program, but I heard its really difficult to get approved.

Not sure if they'd view you as a tourist if you're still a dual citizen.
Eligibility is tied to being a resident in Canada and being eligible for provincial healthcare.

A dual citizen would have to physically live in Canada for a while to also receive provincial healthcare. Then they would have to fulfill all the other eligibility requirements.
 
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jbear824

jbear824

F*ck humanity. Let's end this.
Jul 4, 2023
409
Good luck, obtaining Canadian citizenship is very difficult these days
 
wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Well, if you're up for all the probing you might as well apply because surely it's a superior experience than anything we can do ourselves, if only just for being able to be open about it.
That's exactly (and the only) reason why I want to apply. Being able to be open about it, to plan, to organize my will and finances and to make preparations for what happens after I die.

I'm absolutely not up for the appointments and assessments.
The paternalistic gaslighting. The constant repeating of traumatic events in my past.

But if that means I can get shot organized and my friend prepared and get her to agree to scatter my ashes, that's all I want.
 
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lachrymost

lachrymost

finger on the eject button
Oct 4, 2022
344
Unfortunately (fortunately) that's not how MAID works in Canada.

Even if you would get Permanent Residency in Canada and access to healthcare here, you would still have to apply for MAID with VERY stringent criteria applied to patients who suffer solely from mental illness.

The process requires you to show years (decades!) of unsuccessful medical treatments.
Unless you have tried every possibility drug and treatment available you would not qualify for MAID.

You need to prove that your condition can't be treated successfully and will not resolve over the years.

Considering that you are in your 20s it would take another 5-10 years at least of going through treatments, medications, medical trials etc until you can show that no treatment has worked.

I personally have nearly 20 years of unsuccessful treatments behind me and am not confident to qualify for MAID when it becomes available this year.

In addition to this:
You can't be suicidal.
Which disqualifies many, many patients who are currently hoping to apply for MAID.
If you have a history of suicidal ideation or attempts you'll be screened out.
You will have to be stable and non-suicidal for a few months, otherwise nobody will approve you for MAID.

The idea is that MAID is not an alternative to suicide. Suicide is considered a momentary lapse out of a crisis situation and not well thought out.

MAID is considered to be a conscience, well prepared and thought out approach that is only for those who absolutely cannot be helped with any available (or future) medical care.
Hey wljourney. You seemed to be gone for a while, right? At least I thought so. I'm glad to see you. I appreciate your insight into MAiD, and I hope you keep us updated on how your assessment goes if the expansion does happen.

Here's my rant about MAiD (sorry to hijack this thread a bit):

I would be surprised if MAiD MD-SUMC even passes come March. I really, really need it to. Even though I know I wouldn't qualify any time soon, it would comfort me to think that we live in a society that understands, at least theoretically, that eventually enough is enough. Maybe instead of living to 88 years old, I can peace out at 58, or 48. Unfortunately I'm one of those people who can't imagine being able to do it themselves, no matter how much they contemplate it. I can't go to school, hold down a job, drive, or even figure out how to take the bus by myself. (Although, I've actually had a social worker try to teach me to use the bus system here and--I'm not making this up--after having a conversation in front of me with a bus driver, she gave up and said she didn't understand how anyone did this either.) My boyfriend and I broke my motherboard trying to install a graphics card once--something the internet told us "anyone can do".* I tried to do a simple plumbing fix with the help of a YouTube video and ended up fucking up the sink more. My point isn't that I'm a useless loser with no talents or abilities; that's not true. My point is: HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO TRUST MYSELF NOT TO BOTCH A SUICIDE ATTEMPT? Not to mention how hard it is for even competent people to kill themselves, for all the obvious reasons.

MAiD MD-SUMC gives the suicidal more of a voice. Since it's a legally sanctioned option, there's at least a little more freedom to talk openly about wanting to die. "If these treatments don't work, I hope to be eligible for MAiD one day" is hopefully less likely to get you sent to the psych ward than "if these treatments don't work, I hope I manage to hang myself". That said, it's always a gamble with those meddling mandated reporters.

Does anyone else think that the messaging around MAiD has been really confusing? The Orwellian redefining of "suicidal" certainly hasn't helped. They're coming up with the politically correct way to want to die, and everything else is "suicidality" and therefore bad. Who do they think they're fooling? When people say, "I don't think we should kill suicidal people", they're not going to be placated if the government says, "Oh, don't worry. If we killed them, that means we decided they weren't suicidal; they just consented to die." What the fuck? This just confuses and angers people. I listened to a video from Dying with Dignity where an assessor (I think) said that during a MAiD assessment, if they think a person is "suicidal", they may decide involuntary commitment is appropriate. Great! Love the risk. It's thrilling. I hope they're only talking about someone literally threatening to go home and hang themselves after a rejection. But who fucking knows what any of this opaque shit means.

"If you have a history of suicidal ideation or attempts you'll be screened out. You will have to be stable and non-suicidal for a few months, otherwise nobody will approve you for MAID." Really? Like, what on earth does it mean to want MAiD but not be suicidal? What surreal world do we live in? I've been thinking a lot about this for over a year and researching what it is you are supposed to act like as a model applicant, but there's little info out there. Probably because nobody public ally knows yet, really. @wljourney says we have to be non-suicidal for a few months, but what on earth does that even mean when you have to want to die to eventually decide on MAiD? Am I supposed to go into remission for a bit to demonstrate that I am of "sound mind", before the drive to die comes back, on queue? Who am I communicating this trajectory of my attitudes about suicide to and who's recording it? My doctor? The MAiD assessors? I worry about assessors scavenging social media for dirt on applicants. "On July 24, 2011, you tweeted, and I quote: 'wish I was dead lol'. Application DENIED." Or even: "You're a member of a Facebook group about the right to die? Oh ho ho, thought you could pull one over on us, dissident? DENIED."

"The idea is that MAID is not an alternative to suicide. Suicide is considered a momentary lapse out of a crisis situation and not well thought out. MAID is considered to be a conscience, well prepared and thought out approach that is only for those who absolutely cannot be helped with any available (or future) medical care." Here's another confusing part: the fact that you're supposed to be able to refuse some treatments that you find unacceptable. How will this work in practice, since we know damn well they won't care if I say I'm uncomfortable with the risks of antidepressants and ECT, and that therapy has made me feel worse? If I had cancer I could say, "Fuck no! I'm not getting gruelling chemo and radiation just to--best case scenario--look over my shoulder in fear of the cancer coming back for the rest of my life!" But if I'm in immense mental pain I'm just expected to risk my health and sanity with these horrible drugs and primitive seizure-via-electricity "treatments". I did EMDR therapy because I knew I needed more therapy for my MAiD resume, but I had to guess what evaluators might be impressed by, and I still don't know if I made the right choice. I did a self-taught CBT course, but there's no way I could stomach more gaslighting like that with another person. It's too bad the mental health industry is obsessed with CBT; it's torture.

Then there's "irremediability". That's where the "no hope with future medical care" part comes in. MAiD critics are right that it makes no sense to say a mental illness is irremediable. It's an impossible standard. I understand that the argument is that chronic illnesses are already a sanctioned reason for MAiD, and it can never be said that it's certain the suffering is indelible then, either, but that just shows how stupid a concept it is. Will two doctors judge my suffering as "irremediable"? Lol. Lmao. Of course not. Will they think so in ten years? Twenty? If I don't do another round of medication roulette because of my horrible trauma from psychiatry, does it mean the decades of suffering count for nothing? What if psychiatry had a crystal ball and could predict who would recover enough to find life worthwhile, and who wouldn't? What if it was guaranteed that, in ten years, life would be worth living for a given individual (by their own standards)? Well, they would mandate that person endure another ten years of suffering, of course, with no choice to throw in the towel! That's a ridiculous and inhumane standard. And we have no such crystal ball; there's no guarantee for anyone, and just as there's no bringing someone back once they're dead, there's no taking back a lifetime of suffering once it's been lived. Here the state is forcing us to gamble with our quality of life indefinitely, when some of us are begging to leave the casino.

I read a bunch of the interviews with people in the know that Dying with Dignity has up. I read that the assessments are sometimes going to take years. They're keeping you in suspense for years? How much do you have to interact with them over that period of time? Are they checking in with you every few months? What the hell? Are they going to keep talking to someone for two years and then at very end of that period tell them they've been disqualified? This is so cruel and bizarre. It makes me wonder if any of this is posturing for the benefit of people who are terrified of MAiD. They will also only ever talk about MAiD for mental illness in the context of a 65 year old (at the youngest, it seems) who has tried everything, including ECT. I would love to know what the minimum age is going to/would be, in practice. Why even bother with the pretense that it is 18 and up? Making it so vague and up to the discretion of individual MAiD providers is a real double-edged sword.

I almost wish that, instead, there was a list of treatments to make your way through to guarantee eligibility. That way I could just save ECT for dead last. But then, it would proabaly go something like this: Try multiple drugs from different classes of antidepressants for a year each, then add antipsychotics and repeat. Then add every type of therapy in combination with every type of drug. Then do sixty electroshock treatments over the course of ten years. Should take roughly 45 years and tens of thousands of dollars in therapy.

Imagine thinking that's a better fate than death.

It's infuriating to hear people fear monger and spread misinformation about MAiD, sharing their hyperbolic memes when I'm over here agonizing over how the fuck I'm ever going to convince the powers that be to kill me one day in the next thirty years. And that's if it actually passes and sticks around! "Canadian therapy dog" with a noose in their mouth. A young woman at the doctor with a broken leg--"have you considered euthanasia?" Yeah, right. We live in an absurd hell world. Ever feel like the hell you're in was orchestrated just for you? Someone on Xitter was saying that autistic people are going to be "death marched" into MAiD on the basis of being autistic and I (not impolitely) corrected them that neurodevelopmental disorders are not considered mental disorders, and don't qualify. They blocked me.

*I actually think the "anyone can do it" is just BS, to be fair.
 
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wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Hey wljourney. You seemed to be gone for a while, right? At least I thought so. I'm glad to see you. I appreciate your insight into MAiD, and I hope you keep us updated on how your assessment goes if the expansion does happen.

Here's my rant about MAiD (sorry to hijack this thread a bit):

I would be surprised if MAiD MD-SUMC even passes come March. I really, really need it to. Even though I know I wouldn't qualify any time soon, it would comfort me to think that we live in a society that understands, at least theoretically, that eventually enough is enough. Maybe instead of living to 88 years old, I can peace out at 58, or 48. Unfortunately I'm one of those people who can't imagine being able to do it themselves, no matter how much they contemplate it. I can't go to school, hold down a job, drive, or even figure out how to take the bus by myself. (Although, I've actually had a social worker try to teach me to use the bus system here and--I'm not making this up--after having a conversation in front of me with a bus driver, she gave up and said she didn't understand how anyone did this either.) My boyfriend and I broke my motherboard trying to install a graphics card once--something the internet told us "anyone can do".* I tried to do a simple plumbing fix with the help of a YouTube video and ended up fucking up the sink more. My point isn't that I'm a useless loser with no talents or abilities; that's not true. My point is: HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO TRUST MYSELF NOT TO BOTCH A SUICIDE ATTEMPT? Not to mention how hard it is for even competent people to kill themselves, for all the obvious reasons.

MAiD MD-SUMC gives the suicidal more of a voice. Since it's a legally sanctioned option, there's at least a little more freedom to talk openly about wanting to die. "If these treatments don't work, I hope to be eligible for MAiD one day" is hopefully less likely to get you sent to the psych ward than "if these treatments don't work, I hope I manage to hang myself". That said, it's always a gamble with those meddling mandated reporters.

Does anyone else think that the messaging around MAiD has been really confusing? The Orwellian redefining of "suicidal" certainly hasn't helped. They're coming up with the politically correct way to want to die, and everything else is "suicidality" and therefore bad. Who do they think they're fooling? When people say, "I don't think we should kill suicidal people", they're not going to be placated if the government says, "Oh, don't worry. If we killed them, that means we decided they weren't suicidal; they just consented to die." What the fuck? This just confuses and angers people. I listened to a video from Dying with Dignity where an assessor (I think) said that during a MAiD assessment, if they think a person is "suicidal", they may decide involuntary commitment is appropriate. Great! Love the risk. It's thrilling. I hope they're only talking about someone literally threatening to go home and hang themselves after a rejection. But who fucking knows what any of this opaque shit means.

"If you have a history of suicidal ideation or attempts you'll be screened out. You will have to be stable and non-suicidal for a few months, otherwise nobody will approve you for MAID." Really? Like, what on earth does it mean to want MAiD but not be suicidal? What surreal world do we live in? I've been thinking a lot about this for over a year and researching what it is you are supposed to act like as a model applicant, but there's little info out there. Probably because nobody public ally knows yet, really. @wljourney says we have to be non-suicidal for a few months, but what on earth does that even mean when you have to want to die to eventually decide on MAiD? Am I supposed to go into remission for a bit to demonstrate that I am of "sound mind", before the drive to die comes back, on queue? Who am I communicating this trajectory of my attitudes about suicide to and who's recording it? My doctor? The MAiD assessors? I worry about assessors scavenging social media for dirt on applicants. "On July 24, 2011, you tweeted, and I quote: 'wish I was dead lol'. Application DENIED." Or even: "You're a member of a Facebook group about the right to die? Oh ho ho, thought you could pull one over on us, dissident? DENIED."

"The idea is that MAID is not an alternative to suicide. Suicide is considered a momentary lapse out of a crisis situation and not well thought out. MAID is considered to be a conscience, well prepared and thought out approach that is only for those who absolutely cannot be helped with any available (or future) medical care." Here's another confusing part: the fact that you're supposed to be able to refuse some treatments that you find unacceptable. How will this work in practice, since we know damn well they won't care if I say I'm uncomfortable with the risks of antidepressants and ECT, and that therapy has made me feel worse? If I had cancer I could say, "Fuck no! I'm not getting gruelling chemo and radiation just to--best case scenario--look over my shoulder in fear of the cancer coming back for the rest of my life!" But if I'm in immense mental pain I'm just expected to risk my health and sanity with these horrible drugs and primitive seizure-via-electricity "treatments". I did EMDR therapy because I knew I needed more therapy for my MAiD resume, but I had to guess what evaluators might be impressed by, and I still don't know if I made the right choice. I did a self-taught CBT course, but there's no way I could stomach more gaslighting like that with another person. It's too bad the mental health industry is obsessed with CBT; it's torture.

Then there's "irremediability". That's where the "no hope with future medical care" part comes in. MAiD critics are right that it makes no sense to say a mental illness is irremediable. It's an impossible standard. I understand that the argument is that chronic illnesses are already a sanctioned reason for MAiD, and it can never be said that it's certain the suffering is indelible then, either, but that just shows how stupid a concept it is. Will two doctors judge my suffering as "irremediable"? Lol. Lmao. Of course not. Will they think so in ten years? Twenty? If I don't do another round of medication roulette because of my horrible trauma from psychiatry, does it mean the decades of suffering count for nothing? What if psychiatry had a crystal ball and could predict who would recover enough to find life worthwhile, and who wouldn't? What if it was guaranteed that, in ten years, life would be worth living for a given individual (by their own standards)? Well, they would mandate that person endure another ten years of suffering, of course, with no choice to throw in the towel! That's a ridiculous and inhumane standard. And we have no such crystal ball; there's no guarantee for anyone, and just as there's no bringing someone back once they're dead, there's no taking back a lifetime of suffering once it's been lived. Here the state is forcing us to gamble with our quality of life indefinitely, when some of us are begging to leave the casino.

I read a bunch of the interviews with people in the know that Dying with Dignity has up. I read that the assessments are sometimes going to take years. They're keeping you in suspense for years? How much do you have to interact with them over that period of time? Are they checking in with you every few months? What the hell? Are they going to keep talking to someone for two years and then at very end of that period tell them they've been disqualified? This is so cruel and bizarre. It makes me wonder if any of this is posturing for the benefit of people who are terrified of MAiD. They will also only ever talk about MAiD for mental illness in the context of a 65 year old (at the youngest, it seems) who has tried everything, including ECT. I would love to know what the minimum age is going to/would be, in practice. Why even bother with the pretense that it is 18 and up? Making it so vague and up to the discretion of individual MAiD providers is a real double-edged sword.

I almost wish that, instead, there was a list of treatments to make your way through to guarantee eligibility. That way I could just save ECT for dead last. But then, it would proabaly go something like this: Try multiple drugs from different classes of antidepressants for a year each, then add antipsychotics and repeat. Then add every type of therapy in combination with every type of drug. Then do sixty electroshock treatments over the course of ten years. Should take roughly 45 years and tens of thousands of dollars in therapy.

Imagine thinking that's a better fate than death.

It's infuriating to hear people fear monger and spread misinformation about MAiD, sharing their hyperbolic memes when I'm over here agonizing over how the fuck I'm ever going to convince the powers that be to kill me one day in the next thirty years. And that's if it actually passes and sticks around! "Canadian therapy dog" with a noose in their mouth. A young woman at the doctor with a broken leg--"have you considered euthanasia?" Yeah, right. We live in an absurd hell world. Ever feel like the hell you're in was orchestrated just for you? Someone on Xitter was saying that autistic people are going to be "death marched" into MAiD on the basis of being autistic and I (not impolitely) corrected them that neurodevelopmental disorders are not considered mental disorders, and don't qualify. They blocked me.

*I actually think the "anyone can do it" is just BS, to be fair.
Well.
You were right and sadly I'm not surprised that they are pushing it back yet again.

In fact I'm really struggling with EXACTLY THE SAME ISSUES you are discussing here and today at least I don't have the energy to appropriately reply.

Just know: you are not alone. I'm in the same boat.
More and more I think: we are on our own. We will always be on our own.

One federal election and this whole maid thing breaks down anyway.

So… I'm going to go and look at my plan B and C now and be fucking grateful that I have a way out. So so many people do not.

If I have learned one thing over the last 15 years: never trust a healthcare worker who claims "they are here to help".

72 hrs in an overcrowded loonie bin waiting room with only a chair, not even a bed, no privacy and people puking on your shoes has never helped anyone. Or at least not me.

Sorry for the rant.

Hugs!!!
 
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lachrymost

lachrymost

finger on the eject button
Oct 4, 2022
344
Well.
You were right and sadly I'm not surprised that they are pushing it back yet again.

In fact I'm really struggling with EXACTLY THE SAME ISSUES you are discussing here and today at least I don't have the energy to appropriately reply.

Just know: you are not alone. I'm in the same boat.
More and more I think: we are on our own. We will always be on our own.

One federal election and this whole maid thing breaks down anyway.

So… I'm going to go and look at my plan B and C now and be fucking grateful that I have a way out. So so many people do not.

If I have learned one thing over the last 15 years: never trust a healthcare worker who claims "they are here to help".

72 hrs in an overcrowded loonie bin waiting room with only a chair, not even a bed, no privacy and people puking on your shoes has never helped anyone. Or at least not me.

Sorry for the rant.

Hugs!!!
Thanks for the response and the empathy! I don't mind that you don't have the energy to address my points. I was curious how you've interpreted all this, but it's irrelevant now anyway. And even if it had happened, as you know, it could have been taken away long before I (or you, and you sound more qualified than me) got the chance to use it. It was just a silly little dream and emotional crutch for me. I guess my new crutch is "maybe there will be a right to die for the long-suffering mentally ill in my lifetime and I can knock like a decade off my life." Woohoo. Good luck to you; I'm sorry you've been abused by this awful system. 💔
 
-Link-

-Link-

Deep Breaths
Aug 25, 2018
591
One federal election and this whole maid thing breaks down anyway.
It's already dead.

99% chance that the Conservatives win, if an election were held today. Literally 99%, according to 338Canada. There's still 18+ months until the actual election, but there's no way the Liberals are going to overcome that.

At this point, the only hope is for someone with mental illness to create a case and push it all the way to the Supreme Court. Either that happens, or we'll have to wait for the Liberals to eventually come back into power and re-initiate the process.

Probably looking at a minimum 10-year delay here (15 years, more realistically), unless someone can force the government's hand through the Supreme Court (which, itself, would take several years, but that would be better than waiting another 10-15 years).
 
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TAW122

TAW122

Emissary of the right to die.
Aug 30, 2018
6,871
I used to think this way not too long ago, but now I think I'm just going with the DIY means. Hopefully I will find what I need to have a peaceful exit, if not at the very least, a reliable (and as pain and discomfort free exit from this world). Even though I live in the State, my living situation/arrangement isn't making it easy for me to just get a method and hide it indefinitely. Due to many life changing events since the pandemic, it has been hard to have a readily available method on a moment's notice. I've been suffering for too long and I do plan on 2024 being my last year. I keep putting things off, but it would be just a matter of time when the right catalysts push me to go through with CTB. I've also been a long time user of SaSu including my hiatus from 2021-mid 2022.

Anyways, yeah given all the effort it takes to become a permanent resident (or even a citizen) of Canada to then be eligible for MAID, it is just too much work and too much unreliability in getting approval (unless one is irremediably ill (mostly physical illnesses and chronic conditions) and has met all the critera like @lachrymost mentioned in their post). Furthermore, @Grumble had good points that it is (in practice) mostly dead and just because the program and policy exists, the providers are still the ones who will provide the service and if providers aren't going to for any reason or circumstance, then it is de facto dead. With regards to the politics of MAID and possibility of it being abolished or heavily cut back (to it's 2016 initial state), I think that may be a possibility depending on which government comes into power, but if there is a special case (similar to Adam Maier-Clayton's case), and taken to the federal level and through the Supreme Court of Canada, then it is possible for another new law to come into effect. This doesn't mean that the government in charge may try to then repeal it, thus continuing an arduous, contentious battle over ultimate bodily autonomy.
 
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wljourney

wljourney

Waiting for the bus
Apr 2, 2022
1,419
Yesterday CAN announced a delay in allowing MAiD for mental illnesses.
True

They're afraid of being overwhelmed by requests.
Not true.

.
.
.
Sorry but I really dislike unsubstantiated claims by notoriously unreliable sources when it comes to MAID. You might as well quote FOX news.

This topic has been dragged by anti-choice activists for the last few months with one goal: to delay the end of the sunset clause.

And that's exactly what they achieved and I'm pissed.

So:
The argument is not "they're afraid of getting too many applications".

The argument now is: healthcare providers are not ready. (The system has been overwhelmed since the beginning of the pandemic and potential MAID requests have nothing to do with that.)

Another argument is that HCPs haven't been sufficiently trained and some still question how to assess irremediable conditions when it comes to mental health.

I.e. "when is mental illness permanent and when can it still be treated/healed".

It's incredibly frustrating to see this happening but just like @Grumble said above - MAID for mental illness is dead. And after the next election they may even dial back Track 2 (access to MAID for not terminally ill patients)

So I'm back to DIYing it and yeah. Fuck.
 
ayb

ayb

"I'd feel trapped if I couldn't CTB at any time."
Feb 15, 2019
281
True


Not true.

.
.
.
Sorry but I really dislike unsubstantiated claims by notoriously unreliable sources when it comes to MAID. You might as well quote FOX news.

This topic has been dragged by anti-choice activists for the last few months with one goal: to delay the end of the sunset clause.

And that's exactly what they achieved and I'm pissed.

So:
The argument is not "they're afraid of getting too many applications".

The argument now is: healthcare providers are not ready. (The system has been overwhelmed since the beginning of the pandemic and potential MAID requests have nothing to do with that.)

Another argument is that HCPs haven't been sufficiently trained and some still question how to assess irremediable conditions when it comes to mental health.

I.e. "when is mental illness permanent and when can it still be treated/healed".

It's incredibly frustrating to see this happening but just like @Grumble said above - MAID for mental illness is dead. And after the next election they may even dial back Track 2 (access to MAID for not terminally ill patients)

So I'm back to DIYing it and yeah. Fuck.
Did Cons state that they're going to remove track 2? I thought it was permitted by court order.
 

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