TL;DR
- SN with oil should be fine -- but test size and quantity of result
- Perhaps create small "SN Pills" !
Preface
Tried to summarize aspects about "freezing SN" with previous ideas and notes. This is not suggested as a guide but rather a thought exercise. Collating some information and bouncing some ideas. If this is feasible and the end result is fine this could be a really nice solution,
not just to the taste issue but simplify general intake of SN: Instead of measuring and stirring right before we ctb, which could be troubling, this creates "SN Pills" that are really ready to use instantly. I could create my personal kit for myself -- with "dry pills" and "frozen pills" -- handy and friendly to use.
View attachment 33324
(The orange "pills" are honey/mint taken before and after, and the white "pills" are SN)
View attachment 33327
This is my actual pill box (dirty on-the-road), I would mark with a permanent marker how many minutes to take before SN (60,30,25). Like for idiots.
Technical Aspects - Oils & Salts
I used to make home suppositories, and coconut oil based creams for different applications. The oil does not become solid hard like a brick (okay), and once out of the freezer it turns soft quickly. Some ingredients do not mix well or easily, though I wouldn't say that it doesn't mix at all. It will not dissolve (like water) but remain a mixture which is not consistent. As the mixture settles SN particles could sink down and separate. So it's not as if that won't work -- it's just requires some practice and depended on the contents.
My experience is that
magnesium chloride flakes, which are pretty soluble in water, do not mix well with oil. There were spots of magnesium inside the frozen oil and it mostly seperated. Adding a magnesium water solution was even worse (water-oil cliche). People have suggested using an emulsifier, and I have Xantham Gum and tested it. Emulsifiers usually increase viscosity and lower freezing temperature so the resulting mixture doesn't freeze well. So emulsifier do not help (great for ice cream though).
As for this suggested Coconut Oil practice:
- SN will not dissolve in the oil -- it will be a mixture -- and can sink down and seperate
- The SN will probably not react so it would be potent / active / fatal
- The oil will somewhat slow digestion -- 2 tablespoon of oil is not much but significant.
Potency & Storage of Frozen Salts
I did notice that my
magnesium-oil mixture did
not harm the magnesium potency. It burned my tongue like hell. Unlike magnesium
sulphate (Epsom) or magnesium
hydroxide (Milk of Magnesia) which can be diluted and consumed in small amounts, magnesium
chloride is a harsh corrosive salt and should never be used orally. It's not salty but extremely burning.
However my taste buds are not reliable indication, perhaps my initial 100% magnesium chloride turned into 90% when frozen with oil. But this means the chloride and magnesium did not only separated to ions (which is normal and fine) but somehow actually converted to a new substance -- this is rare in general and especially under freezing conditions.
It was generally thought that freezing SN (with or without water) may hurt its potency.
- In a thread from December a member that had frozen her SN solution threw it away, after showing a reliable scientific resource which claimed frozen SN solutions change their qualities/properties. Sadly I cannot find that thread now. It was really insightful. I have no reason to doubt that scientific source at all, but I think those were microscopic interactions inside the solution and it does not change the composition and potency.
- As was mentioned several times in the FAQ- Storage , and after thorough research, it appears that labs that handle delicate samples and require extremely precise amounts of pure NaNO2 cannot store SN solutions, however labs that are fine with 1% variability (like us: 95%-99%) are fine with refrigeration for up to 3 weeks (Image 1). This is done in sterile environment and with distilled water. Doing so at home will introduce tiny amounts of minerals and bacteria that may interact with NaNO2 very slowly and slightly degrade it. If a lab requires 3 weeks to maintain reasonable SN purity, I guess at home we would limit that to 1 week (or even just a few days). I still wouldn't recommend refrigeration for longer than a day as a practice, because I haven't tested it. But it does not seem to pose a problem.
- Different threads had touched on SN (solid) durability in extremely cold temperatures. For example: SN exposed to —55 degrees C. @Dear Flabby, that had fatally ctbed, detailed that her SN was potent even after exposure to extreme cold.
- In a different discussion @nitrogen gave some information about SN solubility in cold temperatures, which crystallizes (it's not bad). The Honorable Lady later suggested it might be possible to freeze SN in tiny ice balls (Image 2), which at the time I found flimsy and not practical
for no apparent reason (Stupid @Quarky00 )because the ice balls appear large and we'd need several of those for 50ml. The suggestion in that thread was to swallow the SN ice balls quickly, thus avoiding taste.
- The Lady had suggested it would dissolve in stomach much faster than any capsules (or Rizla "bombs" for that matter), and I concur.
- The Lady noted that frozen would be absorbed in stomach slower than liquid SN, since it will require some time to 'melt' into liquid. That is true, but I think it should still be quick, especially if it's tiny ice balls taken with water.
- To conclude: the ice balls method could be nice. That said the ice balls seem too big to swallow.
Handling "SN Balls" in this Recipe
Regarding step (7) "Shape them into 1, 2 or 3 bullets (So Easy To Swallow)":
- I don't think it is dangerous but we should warn about handling SN with your hands. It could burn and/or mildly irritate the skin. I don't if that is true, but if so I don't think it's dangerous or harmful. Still keep in mind.
- Why should we shape it in the form of bullets? That could hurt the throat (see @nitrogen reference bellow). Should form pill-like balls.
- Would that indeed amount to 3 balls? If using those amounts that could be 5, or perhaps 10 balls, I don't know. I'm just noting that we need to check this, I mean, 5 nice tiny balls are still doable (easy to swallow).
Regarding step (8) "Swallow immediately"
- I wonder if, after making the perfect "pill" like that, we could or should keep it frozen for when needed. Why bother through all the hassle of 'sculpturing' frozen stuff right before ctb, with SI in the background, and when we might have some hazy feeling (benzo? tired?), if we could freeze those and keep them for later, instant, usage.
Experiment
Sadly I cannot experiment now since I don't have my kitchen/lab and materials, but I suggest others could try. I don't know how many "pills" would a 25g SN solution requires (arrrg miss my kitchen), if it's 10-20 that would be nice.
- Nuke 2 tablespoons of Coconut oil for 1 minute
- Add 2 teaspoons of regular kitchen salt (NaCl)
- Stir for 20 seconds -- it won't dissolve well, you will see grains, that is fine. Try to spread it in the mixture.
- Freeze till it's hard -- in a container like small pills
Frozen pill-sized balls should be a nice intake form of SN. Considering
@nitrogen suggestion, and looking at the size of these small ice balls, that could be a problem. If it's the size of a finger (
Image 3) it would be hard to swallow such a big thing. I have considered other ice cube trays but the smallest one I could find (
Image 4) is
1cm x 1cm x 1cm, which I consider a bit big to swallow.
My multi-vitamin tablets are similar in size and so are my Calcium-Magnesium tablets, and they get stuck in my throat often, taking time to slide down. While swallowing these daily is a negligent inconvenience, (a) I wouldn't want an SN cube stuck in my throat (yikes), (b) I wouldn't like to be thinking about this when I ctb. So it's not about being spoiled and some ridiculous perfection -- when you're standing at the edge of the cliff looking down towards death anything can be scary.
Solution - "SN Pills" and 'afterpills'
I can't believe we haven't thought about it sooner, but what about freezing SN solution, either water or oil based, in
PILLS PACK? As I was googling and refining further I came to a "
tiny ice cube tray" result (
Image 5). That tutorial was "strictly for adults who are miniature collectors" (
Image 6). So why not just use pills pack? I know in many places those come in a bottle, but in many instances there are OTC medication that come in a
blister pack . That could be perfect to freeze tiny "SN pills" (
Image 7).
- There could be dozen of those, who cares if we swallow them quickly.
- We don't need the 50ml water -- because we drink the water with the pills.
- We can use 20ml of water, SN will not dissolve (which is fine) -- and freeze mixture
- Intake: need to throw 'SN pills' quickly in mouth and drink water instantly -- otherwise 'pills' will melt in mouth
The last point is important, so maybe we can freeze 2
mint or honey pills, take 1 before and 1 after. The "frozen mint ball" is probably some mint extract frozen. It's better than just taking a mint because the frozen 'pill' (with the mint) will decrease the taste buds sensitivity before, as well as soothing. This could be a nice idea to create a
before pill and
after pill. I don't think it's a hassle because one wouldn't do that on the ctb day, but several weeks before. And during intake one would have an orderly 1 mint/honey frozen pill (to
suck), 5-10 SN pills (to swallow quickly), and finish with 1 mint/honey pill (
suck). All in order, in the same small frozen pills' blister pack.
Another solution would be to use any other container that is of small size or narrow proportions , and/or use the bottom of it, to create some form of small pills / balls / rounded bullets (
Image 8). In that case one could wait a minute or two after taking the frozen pack from the freezer to allow some minimal melting -- since, as
@nitrogen wrote,
"sharp edges that can scratch the esophagus as they go down".
Otherwise Bypassing Taste
As
@Jumper Geo suggested humorously:
So I was thinking about what could be added to those SN pills, like flavour extracts (some are very strong and concentrated). Well, actually --
nothing! Since I have tasted magnesium chloride (extreme instant burning) and kitchen salt (extremely salty), I don't think anything can be added to SN to reduce its taste. I do believe that SN is
not worse than these two substances I have tasted. These were really unbearable and according to what people say SN should be milder. Digressing..
Anyway, the only winning strategy here is not to add anything to SN, but to take something that reduce taste buds sensitivity before, and soothes or overwhelms any residues after. If we are taking 10 small "SN Pills" that should take us 5 seconds of actual discomfort, bad taste (minimized beforehand and by freezing), and then we can clear the palate.
SN Intake Outside
This is really out of this thread's scope, but since I will ctb outside and others have asked what to do and got confused about taking stuff (scales etc), there is another possibility. I'd freeze a solution of 25g of SN with 50ml water in the smallest bottle/container possible. When needed I'll take it with me outside, it should melt within 60m, and ready to use. Despite the warnings not to freeze SN, that is a possibility.
Since this is not possible for those with parents or supervision (storing poisons in the freezer lol), another possibility is to prepare well beforehand 25g of SN in a small plastic bag (
Image 9) or small plastic sauce container (
Image 10). Put that in a plastic bag (like for sandwiches) and it should be fine for several good months, even a year. When needed I'll take that with me and about ¼ of a 250ml mineral water bottle (use eyes for rough estimate it's fine), pour powder in bottle, shake, and drink. That is my plan.
Along with the "dry" pills box (paracetamol benzo etc) this could be a nice on-the-go kit, which is better than my clumsy big January kit (
Image 11): Small SN bag and well prepared pill box will measure
5cm X 2cm (or
2inch X 1inch), and just add small bottle of water. Really tiny neat pack.
Image 1: Storage of 2.5% Sodium Nitrite Solution
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Image 2: Nitrogen's ice balls tray
https://sanctioned-suicide.net/attachments/screen-shot-2020-02-06-at-11-32-24-am-png.26534/
Image 3: Ice Balls too big
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Image 4: Smallest Tray is 1cm
Image 5: Tiny Ice Cube Tray
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Image 6: Miniatures (Hobby)
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Image 7: Blister Packs could be used to freeze "SN pills"
Image 8: Other small container can be used as well
Image 9: Small Plastic Bag, SN Powder
Image 10: Small Plastic Sauce Container
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Image 11: My January Clumsy Kit
https://sanctioned-suicide.net/attachments/20200126_ctb_kit_2-jpg.25623/