Procreation is the worst crime anyone can commit

[DEATH IS FREEDOM]

Procreation is the worst crime anyone can commit:

- to force an innocent individual to live against their consent.
- to force an innocent person into an imaginary existence.
- to force an innocent individual to work until retirement age.
- to force someone into slave labor.
- to force an innocent individual to torture for life.
- to force someone to die an agonizing death of illness.
- to deny the innocent individual suicide or euthanasia.

And because of this crime, many people find themselves here, some of them in catch-22 with no way out.

 

[Z-A]

I despise the way this existence has been built. That's why most people want to go to "paradise" and think that this world is a "test" because even the pro-lifers know what a shit world this is.

 

[FuneralCry]

I know, it truly is so hellish and disturbing how humans procreate even know nobody can suffer from never existing at all yet existence is nothing but meaningless suffering, in fact existing can potentially get so torturous beyond how anyone could imagine. More than anything I wish I never existed, it's evil how this society is so anti-suicide with humans doing all they can to force others to continue suffering even know none of us consented to any of this in the first place.

Procreation is an absolutely horrifying crime, it's unacceptable how it's not viewed as a crime, it's criminal as it's literally causing other people to suffer and procreation is the source of all human suffering. All that procreation causes is immense harm and it's tragic how we are being punished all because other humans lacked the awareness not to so harmfully impose existence.

 

[LunarLight]

I understand what you're saying. That's why I don't want to procreate myself: I don't want a poor soul to inherit my flawed genes and grow up in an unhealthy environment. They would be mentally ill just like me and suffer a lot.
But on the other hand, procreating is part of the human instinct. It's like SI. We're programmed to survive and procreate so that the human species don't go extinct.
So I wouldn't say it's the "worst crime anyone can commit". It's not even a crime.
However, the fact that unconditional euthanasia (which could be translated into "good death" in Ancient Greek), based on informed consent, is not a fundamental human right, is concerning. It should change slowly over time, but we won't be there to see it, CTB or not. Bodily autonomy is a fundamental human right, so we should have the right to choose our death in dignity. Not die alone by sometimes violent and painful means, which could result in permanent organ damage.

 

[UKscotty]

But what about the significant majority who are happy and grateful to be alive? Deprivation of 99% to save us 1% from mental suffering is not very balanced.

 

[sserafim]

It is but there's no legal recourse

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I think that procreation can be okay if euthanasia was available to those who ask for it here. Yes, it's unfortunate that we were brought here without our consent but the ability to peacefully leave this existence with our consent should nullify the act of procreation. However, until then, I'll agree with you

 

[sserafim]

But what about the significant majority who are happy and grateful to be alive? Deprivation of 99% to save us 1% from mental suffering is not very balanced.

Are you gonna have kids? What if your kids get depressed too?

 

[Darkover]

how dare they bring us alive to a place where I am in trouble

But what about the significant majority who are happy and grateful to be alive? Deprivation of 99% to save us 1% from mental suffering is not very balanced.

1,280,000,000 billion people have a mental health problem
1,000,000,000 billion people go hungry every day
that 28 percent of the population
It's estimated that around 6% of the world's population had cancer in 2019.
thats 480,000,000
It is estimated that 415 million people are living with diabetes in the world,

 

[sserafim]

I understand what you're saying. That's why I don't want to procreate myself: I don't want a poor soul to inherit my flawed genes and grow up in an unhealthy environment. They would be mentally ill just like me and suffer a lot.
But on the other hand, procreating is part of the human instinct. It's like SI. We're programmed to survive and procreate so that the human species don't go extinct.
So I wouldn't say it's the "worst crime anyone can commit". It's not even a crime.
However, the fact that unconditional euthanasia (which could be translated into "good death" in Ancient Greek), based on informed consent, is not a fundamental human right, is concerning. It should change slowly over time, but we won't be there to see it, CTB or not. Bodily autonomy is a fundamental human right, so we should have the right to choose our death in dignity. Not die alone by sometimes violent and painful means, which could result in permanent organ damage.

I believe that procreation is a crime because it's a violation of consent. We're basically all r*ped into existence (brought into it against our will). Just because it's instinct doesn't mean that it's right. So what if the human race goes extinct?

 

[tbroken]

Procreation is the worst crime anyone can commit:

- to force an innocent individual to live against their consent.
- to force an innocent person into an imaginary existence.
- to force an innocent individual to work until retirement age.
- to force someone into slave labor.
- to force an innocent individual to torture for life.
- to force someone to die an agonizing death of illness.
- to deny the innocent individual suicide or euthanasia.

And because of this crime, many people find themselves here, some of them in catch-22 with no way out.

I partially agree with you. The point is that the ones who should never procreate are ignorant ppl, and even when you think you are not, because you have a degree, a well paid job, you are a scientist or an engineer or stuff, you can still be ignorant, without knowing it.
Imo what a person should understand before procreation, is that we are just evolved animals, and our natural habitat, our savannah, is Society.
If you are not perfectly sure that your children could survive in Society, htf do you even think about procreation?
I don't say you should do an IQ test before thinking about procreation, but at least have an high one and also achieve many REAL milestones in life.
I would think about procreation if I just had more friends with my same understanding of life and purposes, but I'm alone, and most of the times i meet idiots or just ppl to randomly entertain myself with.
Btw... i just think the world is just a mess and everything is ruled by the case...

 

[sserafim]

I know, it truly is so hellish and disturbing how humans procreate even know nobody can suffer from never existing at all yet existence is nothing but meaningless suffering, in fact existing can potentially get so torturous beyond how anyone could imagine. More than anything I wish I never existed, it's evil how this society is so anti-suicide with humans doing all they can to force others to continue suffering even know none of us consented to any of this in the first place.

Procreation is an absolutely horrifying crime, it's unacceptable how it's not viewed as a crime, it's criminal as it's literally causing other people to suffer and procreation is the source of all human suffering. All that procreation causes is immense harm and it's tragic how we are being punished all because other humans lacked the awareness not to so harmfully impose existence.

Literally

 

[LunarLight]

Just because it's instinct doesn't mean it's right. So what if the human race goes extinct?

I'm not saying it's right. I'm saying it's natural.

 

[sserafim]

I'm not saying it's right. I'm saying it's natural.

Natural things can be crimes too. Some people have the urge to be aggressive or kill people. They murder others and get put in jail. They get punished for their crimes. However, there's no penalty for procreation

 

[LunarLight]

Natural things can be crimes too. Some people have the urge to be aggressive, they murder others and get put in jail

These are not natural things lmao. Just because you have an urge doesn't mean it's natural.

 

[tbroken]

I think that procreation can be okay if euthanasia was available to those who ask for it here. Yes, it's unfortunate that we were brought here without our consent but the ability to peacefully leave this existence with our consent should nullify the act of procreation. However, until then, I'll agree with you

This... I totally agree. If we could just undo things, that would be a really nice world. But i think we are moving in that direction. Think about Information Technology, where you can undo actions whenever you wish. We'll soon reach the point where we can undo our own life without any problem.

 

[sserafim]

These are not natural things lmao. Just because you have an urge doesn't mean it's natural.

Extremely normal! Recently, a smart, well-adjusted pre-teen opened up about his interest in such things

We're animals; we have some level of such impulses as part of our genetic heritage

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/something-embarrassing-i-wanted-to-ask.155647/#post-2401139

 

[TAW122]

I understand what you're saying. That's why I don't want to procreate myself: I don't want a poor soul to inherit my flawed genes and grow up in an unhealthy environment. They would be mentally ill just like me and suffer a lot.
But on the other hand, procreating is part of the human instinct. It's like SI. We're programmed to survive and procreate so that the human species don't go extinct.
So I wouldn't say it's the "worst crime anyone can commit". It's not even a crime.
However, the fact that unconditional euthanasia (which could be translated into "good death" in Ancient Greek), based on informed consent, is not a fundamental human right, is concerning. It should change slowly over time, but we won't be there to see it, CTB or not. Bodily autonomy is a fundamental human right, so we should have the right to choose our death in dignity. Not die alone by sometimes violent and painful means, which could result in permanent organ damage.

This is spot on, and I bolded and colored the part that is most important for us as pro-choicers. I too, do hope that things will change over time, but even if they allowed an expansion for those who are non-terminal, but severely physically impaired, that would be a big step in the right direction.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

This... I totally agree. If we could just undo things, that would be a really nice world. But i think we are moving in that direction. Think about Information Technology, where you can undo actions whenever you wish. We'll soon reach the point where we can undo our own life without any problem.

How long do you think it would take for this to happen? Also, I can't comprehend any technology that can undo the effects of being born without euthanasia

 

[LunarLight]

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/something-embarrassing-i-wanted-to-ask.155647/#post-2401139

What's your point exactly? It's not natural to want to kill somebody; on the contrary, it goes against the principle of perpetuation of the species.
There are two natural instincts in human beings: survival instinct and sexual instinct. Period. And you can't blame someone for wanting to survive or procreate. That's why such a thing as the right to self-defence exists in law.

 

[Tesha]

Procreation is the worst crime anyone can commit:

- to force an innocent individual to live against their consent.
- to force an innocent person into an imaginary existence.
- to force an innocent individual to work until retirement age.
- to force someone into slave labor.
- to force an innocent individual to torture for life.
- to force someone to die an agonizing death of illness.
- to deny the innocent individual suicide or euthanasia.

And because of this crime, many people find themselves here, some of them in catch-22 with no way out.

I'm a parent and getting a bit bored of this 'all procreation is evil' mindset. I'm grumpy today, so I'll bite, but may not interact further.

None of your points have anything to do with the act of procreation.

Your circumstances led you to believe you shouldn't have been born. I'm sorry you feel like that, but calling me the worst criminal in the world demonstrates a lack of critical thinking. In my opinion.

 

[sanitystruggle]

1,280,000,000 billion people have a mental health problem
1,000,000,000 billion people go hungry every day

1.28 billion billion (quintillion) is more humans than have ever lived, about 117 billion throughout history. Think you've got a few too many zeros there.

 

[sserafim]

What's your point exactly? It's not natural to want to kill somebody; on the contrary, it goes against the principle of perpetuation of the species.
There are two natural instincts in human beings: survival instinct and sexual instinct. Period. And you can't blame someone for wanting to survive or procreate. That's why such a thing as the right to self-defence exists in law.

People should be able to sue their parents for damages (like giving birth to them without their consent), and win. Consent was violated in this case. An Indian guy was on the news a while back for doing so. Unfortunately, I don't think he won though

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-47154287.amp

 

[LunarLight]

People should be able to sue their parents for damages (like giving birth to them without their consent), and win. Consent was violated in this case. An Indian guy was on the news a while back for doing so. Unfortunately, I don't think he won though

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-47154287.amp

That's not what consent is about. You don't have any arguments (because sorry, quoting a guy who goes by the username "SexyIncél" is not an argument of authority). Let's agree to disagree.

I'm a parent and getting a bit bored of this 'all procreation is evil' mindset. I'm grumpy today, so I'll bite, but may not interact further.

None of your points have anything to do with the act of procreation.

Your circumstances led you to believe you shouldn't have been born. I'm sorry you feel like that, but calling me the worst criminal in the world demonstrates a lack of critical thinking. In my opinion.

Couldn't have said better.

 

[divinemistress36]

But what about the significant majority who are happy and grateful to be alive? Deprivation of 99% to save us 1% from mental suffering is not very balanced.

It's higher than 1 percent

 

[tbroken]

How long do you think it would take for this to happen? Also, I can't comprehend any technology that can undo the effects of being born without euthanasia

IMO, if the world is populated by smart ppl, it will take less than 10 years.
We really reached a point of no return, because we have many suicide cases, ppl don't marry or procreate anymore(at least in my country) and illegal immigration is at its highest. Plus, trappers and ppl show their guns and cocaine on YT, everyone is taking cosmetic surgery(even extreme one) and you cannot talk about suicide? SERIOUSLY???

In my mind i have three scenarios:

1: Rich people and politicians are not evil, they just completely lost control of the situation and, like everyone else, they are just thinking for themselves. So, we have to fight our way to freedom(either living a nice life or finding a nice way to ctb).
In this scenario, no doctor would ever expose himself, speaking about or promulgating legal euthanasia, that would be really dangerous for their social status.

2: As many say, rich ppl, scientists, politicians, etc.. are evil and don't need us anymore.
They can have their in-vitro children, print money(now they don't even need anymore, since it is all digital) and just do what they want. They planned our disgrace, and if we don't fight back, we'll just get erased or replaced by someone else.

3: None of the above. We just live in a free world, where we can do what we want and choose our own fate.
So it will be all up to the medical community, to fight for legal euthanasia and eventually make profit out of it. I don't think doctors would ever speak about that without profit or without the assurance they will not end-up in social pillory.

 

[divinemistress36]

I despise the way this existence has been built. That's why most people want to go to "paradise" and think that this world is a "test" because even the pro-lifers know what a shit world this is.

I think this world is a test to but I have no interest in continuing the test

 

[Darkover]

1.28 billion billion (quintillion) is more humans than have ever lived, about 117 billion throughout history. Think you've got a few too many zeros there.

learn to count

16 percent of the world's population have a mental disorder
Globally, there are 24 million people with schizophrenia or 1 out of 300 individuals in every country. This amounts to 0.32% of the worldwide population.
What is the evidence on worldwide prevalence of bipolar disorder? Moderate to high quality evidence suggests the lifetime worldwide prevalence of bipolar disorder is around 1% thats 80 million people, and the one-year prevalence is around 0.5%.
How many people have autism? According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), about 1% of the world's population has autism spectrum disorder – over 75,000,000 people. That may be a large number, but autism spectrum disorder (ASD) features a wide range of symptoms and levels of severity.
ADHD is estimated to affect around 5% of children thats 400 million and 2.5% of adults worldwide 200 million, according to the World Health Organization (WHO).
What percentage of people have depression? Depression is common. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), about 280 million people worldwide have depression, including 5% of the world's adults and 5.7% of adults above age 60.
Worldwide: Anxiety disorders are the most common mental illness in the world. Roughly 301 million people, an estimated 4% of the global population, have an anxiety disorder . Age group: One survey found that young people are more likely to experience symptoms of anxiety than older adults

 

[divinemistress36]

learn to count

16 percent of the world's population have a mental disorder
Globally, there are 24 million people with schizophrenia or 1 out of 300 individuals in every country. This amounts to 0.32% of the worldwide population.
What is the evidence on worldwide prevalence of bipolar disorder? Moderate to high quality evidence suggests the lifetime worldwide prevalence of bipolar disorder is around 1% thats 80 million people, and the one-year prevalence is around 0.5%.
How many people have autism? According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), about 1% of the world's population has autism spectrum disorder – over 75,000,000 people. That may be a large number, but autism spectrum disorder (ASD) features a wide range of symptoms and levels of severity.
ADHD is estimated to affect around 5% of children thats 400 million and 2.5% of adults worldwide 200 million, according to the World Health Organization (WHO).
What percentage of people have depression? Depression is common. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), about 280 million people worldwide have depression, including 5% of the world's adults and 5.7% of adults above age 60.
Worldwide: Anxiety disorders are the most common mental illness in the world. Roughly 301 million people, an estimated 4% of the global population, have an anxiety disorder . Age group: One survey found that young people are more likely to experience symptoms of anxiety than older adults

I think it's higher than what is reported in statistics . Not everyone gets help

 

[LunarLight]

IMO, if the world is populated by smart ppl, it will take less than 10 years.
We really reached a point of no return, because we have many suicide cases, ppl don't marry or procreate anymore(at least in my country) and illegal immigration is at its highest. Plus, trappers and ppl show their guns and cocaine on YT, everyone is taking cosmetic surgery(even extreme one) and you cannot talk about suicide? SERIOUSLY???

In my mind i have three scenarios:

1: Rich people and politicians are not evil, they just completely lost control of the situation and, like everyone else, they are just thinking for themselves. So, we have to fight our way to freedom(either living a nice life or finding a nice way to ctb).
In this scenario, no doctor would ever expose himself, speaking about or promulgating legal euthanasia, that would be really dangerous for their social status.

2: As many say, rich ppl, scientists, politicians, etc.. are evil and don't need us anymore.
They can have their in-vitro children, print money(now they don't even need anymore, since it is all digital) and just do what they want. They planned our disgrace, and if we don't fight back, we'll just get erased or replaced by someone else.

3: None of the above. We just live in a free world, where we can do what we want and choose our own fate.
So it will be all up to the medical community, to fight for legal euthanasia and eventually make profit out of it. I don't think doctors would ever speak about that without profit or without the assurance they will not end-up in social pillory.

The thing is, the richest need us to work to make them richer and participate in economic growth. So euthanasia will maybe be available for the disabled and the elderly, but not for all.