On some level, it is all our fault.

[Unhirable]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

 

[BeansOfRequirement]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

Do you find the concept of fault helpful? I don't. Maybe a sense of responsibility for the future/present, if anything. Saying that you and others are weak is basically weak, no? What's strong would be to come up with ideas to make things better, the opposite of what you are now doing.

 

[WhatPowerIs]

Everyone's situations are different. If a person has a terminal illness or chronic pain or something, is it their fault that they want to kill themselves or they have come to that conclusion? Physical ailments like that can completely warp you mentally.

With regards to my case, yeah, a lot of it is my fault, and it's entirely a mental battle. I'm making strides to improving myself. I know.

 

[TLEEA]

Agreed. Considering the patience and care it takes to craft any particular suicide method (peaceful pill, gunshot), suicidal people in that regard don't particularly consider themselves mentally-ill, but they have reasonably concluded that they should kill themselves.

There are so many reasons to find meaning in life. Likewise, there are many reasons to find meaning in death. How people feel convicted to follow through with these reasons is a long, sustained choice they have to make.

Mentally-ill people can be suicidal but would not even move an inch to go kill themselves. Suicide, on the other hand, requires motivation to pursue, in a level beyond their illnesses. Anger. Spite. Guilt. A chance at happiness, if they believe in the afterlife.

Suicide is belief. Suicide is salvation. Suicide is faith.

 

[Julgran]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

You seem to be basing this judgment on the idea that there's some meaning to life, which means that suicide makes the person who commits suicide miss out on this life meaning. Contrary to this view, I see life as a temporary existence that has no reason to start or to go on, since it will ultimately end.

Everyone who's alive today already "missed out" on thousands of years of human history, since we weren't alive back then, and no one seems to lament that fact, and just because we are alive today doesn't make the world of today any more important than the world of yesteryear.

 

[hamvil]

This argument is bullshit. I do not feel I have to apologize for being born in a 1st world country. I did not even asked to be born and it would have been much better if I was not. I had a terrible childhood with verbal and physical abuse from parents and teachers (i was in a catholic school). I grow up with all kind of problems about how to relate with people, somehow I manage to succeed on the workplace and indeed as you said I fucked it up eventually. I do not know if I will managed to kill myself, maybe I will never do it and I will live depressed until the end. Moreover, usually i never "just" depression but there is much more on top of that.

 

[Pluto]

It can also be framed the opposite way, when people with 'very shit lives' push on because they are too mentally weak to plan and execute a final exit. It becomes a question of one's philosophy of life. Is life a heroic struggle of overcoming hardship, or a pointless chore with no benefit? Which religious or irreligious philosophy are you going to base your life-or-death choice on, and is it really true?

A lot of motivational talk revolves around concepts like 'stop being a whiny loser' and 'pull yourself up by your bootstraps'. This is very helpful for some people. One motivational speaker from Sydney decided one day to stop being a 'fat piece of shit', overcame immense childhood traumas through brute force and went on to become an elite athlete. But there's a catch. A overweight young lady in Australia famously committed suicide after being bullied at the cafe she worked at, leading to new anti-bullying legislation being passed. So this tough love approach is not a nice simple fix for everything.

There was a study (unfortunately I don't have a citation) done in the US regarding racial justice and the claim that poor African Americans could improve their lot with the right effort. The surprising result is that despite all the disadvantages of growing up in a slum, it is possible for a poor person to put up a huge fight despite lacking fancy tuition or a good environment at home and go on to attain a respectable career.... however, doing so requires so much stress and strain that the same people start to run into major health issues in later adult life. The disturbing conclusion is that, from a health perspective, they were better off settling for poverty and petty crime.

So where does this leave us? Pushing for mental toughness can be a valid strategy. In theory it can lead to success (whatever 'success' means) so long as basic opportunities are there. But is it a solution to everything, rendering the rest of us as losers? No.

The claim that every single situation can be overcome simply by being mentally strong is a very dubious one, to put it politely.

 

[Install-Gentoo]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

Is this like... A problem you wish to solve? I mean yes you have a point. Many people don't have an excuse beyond "they're mentally weak" or "they're lazy" or whatever for not "just being successful"
But there are many rich and famous people who still feel depressed or suicidal. One example is Notch, the creator of Minecraft, who felt very depressed as a result of his fame - he just wanted to work on a fun project and instead he became some sort of icon he never wanted to be seen as.
Imagine being a famous actor and yet nothing you do feels satisfying or fulfilling. "Maybe I need to try a new type of role or new genre of movie," but it never works, it just feels empty, so they decide to give up on life. Is this person weak? They have all the material means to live, and yet they don't want to live.
I'm struggling to find your point. People are mentally weak, and so therefore... what? They don't deserve suicide? Or is it the reverse: "you're just weak and aren't mentally capable enough for the world, so dying is a good thing"?
I don't understand your post.

 

[SunshineAndSuicide]

This post reminds me of a transformation coach who once said that it's your own fault if you become poor because you were kind to poor people, and it's your own fault if you get cancer because we can think ourselves successful, healthy etc.
Sure you can make such an argument, but you're gonna make an awful lot of people feel even shittier than they already do. What's the point in that.

 

[JustSwingingTheD]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

What does intelligence or self control have to do with being suicidal?

Hate yourself all you want, but this is bullshit.

 

[lionetta12]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

I have always known this since the day I became depressed and always taken 100% full ownership of it. I feel intense guilt about it every day ever since. I regret ever telling anyone when I was 11 that I was being abused, if I kept my mouth shut and kept pretending that everything was fine and could continue to block it out like I had been, I wouldn't have angered everyone and caused my mental health to be in the state that it is in today. Worst desicion of my life.

 

[noname223]

I think this post is short-sighted and very absurd.
I think many feel worse due to this comment but in my opinion it is also objectively wrong.

It is pretty obvious it is a generalization. Such a statement about all humans in the first world is stereotypical. The lives of them are way too heterogenous to make such a simplified statement.
"We messed up." Your knowledge about the concerned humans is that they live in the first world and they are suicidal. I hugely doubt this knowledge is enough to come to such a bold conclusion.
To blame all people merely for those two characteristics is... I don't know not very well thought through.

I am not really angry about this post. Though I cannot really take it seriously because it is pretty obvious this logic is flawed.
Noone who reads it should take it seriously.

 

[FuneralCry]

I personally think that it can be smarter and more rational choosing to ctb rather than suffering until old age just to die anyway eventually. I would rather die at a time of my own choosing than at a time out of my control. There is no benefit, purpose or point to choosing to suffer, life is completely meaningless, if people want to endure low quality lives that then that is their choice but there is nothing wrong with someone deciding to ctb.

Someone deciding to leave this world doesn't mean that they are weak, in fact suicide can be very difficult and someone staying alive doesn't exactly mean that they are always strong as if we don't ctb we have no choice but to stay alive and endure this life. I think that the whole post assumes that ctb is a negative thing which it really isn't. For me to die would remove the cause of all problems in the first place which is life itself so therefore it's ideal. I see no point to suffering when instead I could be peacefully not existing.

 

[theboy]

This article is interesting to me because I live in the 3rd world. It is informative to have the perception of someone who lives in the 1st world because many times people from all over the world say "I would like to live in a developed country", but they don't know about the sad people who live there

 

[Anonymus]

I am deterministic, so nothing exists that is because of me and no one is ultimately responsible for absolutely anything. Everyone has had to live the life they have, no one has earned it or deserves to suffer.
//
Sóc determinista, per tant no existeix res que sigui per causa meva i ningú és en última instància responsable d'absolutament res. A cadascú li ha tocat viure la vida que te, ningú se l'ha guanyat ni es mereix patir.

 

[Install-Gentoo]

This article is interesting to me because I live in the 3rd world. It is informative to have the perception of someone who lives in the 1st world because many times people from all over the world say "I would like to live in a developed country", but they don't know about the sad people who live there

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.

 

[Superdeterminist]

Blame yourself all you want, but I'd rather be kept out of your wacky idea

 

[Lullaby]

I can't speak for everyone, but my thoughts about suicide have always been unwanted.
It's like static in the background for a lot of people, and I'm sure most here would prefer not to think about dying almost every minute of the day.

Saying that someone is weak because of this is a bit ludicrous.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

I don't take full blame for where I am right now in life. Some circumstances in my life were completely out of my control. It is the totality of life's circumstances that make us who we are. We are all different and have varied "tools" available to us to deal with life's BS. Everyone has their own breaking point. I make no apologies for reaching mine. I see no point in going on at this stage of my life. At this stage of (my) life, things are typically on the decline for most people. I feel at this stage I'm just wasting precious resources (food, energy, etc) that could be better utilized for others who are making a go in life, or even those that aren't, but still have enough hope in their lives to try and make things better for themselves. Am I to continue on in a life that brings me no happiness whatsoever, maybe just so I can continue to pay taxes? What does this accomplish? My actual living stopped a long time ago. I'm numb, broken, and tired. It would be a futile exercise to keep going on.

 

[whatevs]

I am deterministic, so nothing exists that is because of me and no one is ultimately responsible for absolutely anything. Everyone has had to live the life they have, no one has earned it or deserves to suffer.
//
Sóc determinista, per tant no existeix res que sigui per causa meva i ningú és en última instància responsable d'absolutament res. A cadascú li ha tocat viure la vida que te, ningú se l'ha guanyat ni es mereix patir.

On a metaphysical level we all deserve what we got but that's a level of understanding most will never attain. Suffice to say that we're playing a game that's also playing us.

 

[Superdeterminist]

On a metaphysical level we all deserve what we got but that's a level of understanding most will never attain. Suffice to say that we're playing a game that's also playing us.

That's not a 'higher' understanding, it's just your opinion, based on your feelings. You feel like everyone gets what they deserve. Well, I feel pretty much the exact opposite.

 

[Mr2005]

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

Damn right. The world has nothing to do with it. That's for the starving people to get depressed about not us. It's clear many people couldn't give a shit because they fucked their lives up. It's easy to find something to blame but that's not going to make the world any better only delay our suicide for another week

 

[akirat9]

no what do is blatantly invalidate the struggle and pain.
is can be a reflection of yourself, not everyone else here
on levels, it is not my fault

Saying that someone is weak because of this is a bit ludicrous.

is very rdidclous. is take lot of strenght to endure pain this long
like physical pain of injruies being endured . this no different, pain is pain and still living with pain is not weak

 

[freedompass]

I have always known this since the day I became depressed and always taken 100% full ownership of it. I feel intense guilt about it every day ever since. I regret ever telling anyone when I was 11 that I was being abused, if I kept my mouth shut and kept pretending that everything was fine and could continue to block it out like I had been, I wouldn't have angered everyone and caused my mental health to be in the state that it is in today. Worst desicion of my life.

You seem to be judging your 11 year old self extremely harshly for not staying quiet about a serious wrong that was done to you through no fault of your own. It is most definitely not your 'fault' that caregivers who should have acted to protect and help you instead appear to have blamed the victim.

Fwiw I was a victim of incest at 9 (my father) and only realised what it was when I was 11. I did NOT tell anyone until I was 20, and felt like I was blamed for not telling my mother at the time. I had my reasons! The child in that situation is NEVER to blame, period. The responsibility is on the parents/caregivers if they failed to protect or blamed an innocent child for having been violated and their innocence and trust stolen.

At 11 you should not even have to make 'decisions' as weighty as that. Please never blame and hate on yourself for the shortcomings, mistakes and evil deeds done by others.

This will be unpopular but whatever.

The world is messed up in a lot of ways but for everyone living in a 1st world country the standard of living is so high that it IS the fault of the depressed person that they are suicidal.

Someone can be depressed and it not be "their fault" but wanting to commit suicide is definitely on the individual. Plenty of people live very shit lives, some where they are depressed for years, but they never take things to the length of planning their suicide.

"B-But my situation is-" No. You are simply weak mentally, for whatever reason (there are many). Even someone who is depressed does not go this far because they are better put together than people like us... its that simple. We messed up and they did not. They are smarter, have better control of themselves, etc.

Not hating just telling the truth.

'The truth' as you see it remains your opinion. My impression of this site is that many if not most members who post already hate on and blame themselves disproportionately for what has gone on in their lives. Perhaps this includes you. Your post while it has received some interesting responses is not helpful in my opinion, and merely feeds into that self loathing.

Arguably we are actually strong for everything we survived and continue to live with from one day to the next. Arguably it takes strength and courage to go through with ctb that many here have not yet mustered.

Oh and as others commented it is a nonsense to say 'those in a first world country have no excuse' (I'm paraphrasing your argument for brevity). That just isn't how it works. It's also somewhat insulting to 'developing' countries. We judge and are judged by what we see around us. Do you live in or have you ever been to a poorer or less developed country? There are plenty of happy people there who seem to be living their best lives. Studies have shown that there is not only less depression, anxiety and so forth, the prognosis for severe mental health conditions like schizophrenia and other psychotic disorders is actually better there. What does that tell you.

I'm not denying that desperate poverty is a terrible thing but poverty is relative to the society we happen to find ourselves in and there are sooo many other considerations that determine happiness! Chief among those are strong family ties and social networks.