Discussion Nitrogen Needed for Successful Exit Bag

[SheKilledMe]

Hi everyone,

I want to start off and say that I'm absolutely overjoyed by the fact that this forum exists. It's been extremely helpful so far!

This brings me to my question.

I've decided on the exit bag method using Nitrogen.

I still need to source everything, but have a few questions since I can't find the answer to these anywhere else.

• How big does the nitrogen tank need to be in litres? (I was thinking 20 litre)
• What does the concentration need to be for it to work successfully?
• How wide open should the gas valve be for it not to be too much or too little?
• Will my gym strap grips be enough to secure the bag around my neck?

Any guidance on this would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

 

[outrider567]

Inert Gas Mega Thread will answer your questions---but here's a start--You should have a tank at least 400 liters of Nitrogen at 99.0% pure or higher

 

[BlackDog81]

Inert Gas Mega Thread will answer your questions---but here's a start--You should have a tank at least 400 liters of Nitrogen at 99.0% pure or higher

400 litres are you sure? Like SheKilledMe said I thought 20 litres might be enough? I agree about the purity though.

 

[bluemoon96]

I've read 15l/min. I'd recommend u look into the pph . It's really well written.i have the nitrogen yet when I bought the gas flow regulator it wasn't compatible to the tank which is so annoying !!! . I haven't found a compatible yet.I Actually think n would b easier and less scary ... In the pph explains about all these details including the physiology of it.

 

[Kapsyl]

400 litres are you sure? Like SheKilledMe said I thought 20 litres might be enough? I agree about the purity though.

It takes approximately 12-15 min to ctb while breathing 0% oxygen. The usually recommended gas flow is 15/lpm, 15min X 15/lpm = 225 liters. We want some redundancy of course so 225x2= 450 liters.

Inert gas is usually contained in a compressed cylinder, the empty volume in the cylinder way well be 20 liters (all trough very large cylinder). The gas is compressed usually around 100-200 times (bar), so a 20 liter cylinder compressed 100 times 20x100= 2000 liters of inert gas.

My cylinder for example is only 5 liters but at 200 bar it has 1000 liters of nitrogen.

 

[BlackDog81]

It takes approximately 12-15 min to ctb while breathing 0% oxygen. The usually recommended gas flow is 15/lpm, 15min X 15/lpm = 225 liters. We want some redundancy of course so 225x2= 450 liters.

Inert gas is usually contained in a compressed cylinder, the empty volume in the cylinder way well be 20 liters (all trough very large cylinder). The gas is compressed usually around 100-200 times (bar), so a 20 liter cylinder compressed 100 times 20x100= 2000 liters of inert gas.

My cylinder for example is only 5 liters but at 200 bar it has 1000 liters of nitrogen.

Thank you so much for clarifying/explaing that as all this technical stuff is not my strong point. The tanks I am looking at should be adequate.

 

[Kapsyl]

Thank you so much for clarifying/explaing that as all this technical stuff is not my strong point. The tanks I am looking at should be adequate.

I'm happy to help! I've spent so much time researching my setup so I can understand it may be deterring at first glance.

 

[BlackDog81]

This is definitely my preffered method based on all my research to date. I can't risk a botched attempt.

Am I right in thinking food grade is amongst the purest? I am in the early stages of preparing my set up as I have been focusing on my will and some of the other practicalities. I was thinking about this tank which would be 4,000 litres is that right? Do you think that's too much? Rather too much than too little was my thinking.

 

[Kapsyl]

This is definitely my preffered method based on all my research to date. I can't risk a botched attempt.

Am I right in thinking food grade is amongst the purest? I am in the early stages of preparing my set up as I have been focusing on my will and some of the other practicalities. I was thinking about this tank which would be 4,000 litres is that right? Do you think that's too much? Rather too much than too little was my thinking.

View attachment 140806

What I have gathered food grade doesn't necessarily correlate with an extremely high purity and is more about hygiene standards in the gas and the fittings. But mostly is around the 99% mark, I would check with the site before to be sure the purity to be sure. Anything above 98-99% is good enough. 4000 liters is a lot of inert gas, that would last you almost 3 hours even at a higher lpm setting.

There have been certainties were ctb has taken well over 30 min to complete because of faulty air seal, so having gas for an hour isn't a bad idea. But I would say over 2000 liters is overkill but it does really matter.

 

[BlackDog81]

Thanks, yes I will definitely be checking the purity I wish I could test it myself, but I understand that's very hard to do.
I am considering buying a smaller tank to test my set up with first? I think I know which regulator to purchase but I am feeling a bit overwhelmed by the technicalities of this method for sure, especially when it comes to achieving a good seal on the regulator and of course getting the hood right. I think I will opt for a hood as opposed to a mask such as scuba as I think this complicates things even further.
I do like the idea of having more gas than I need just in case, sort of belt and braces.

 

[Kapsyl]

Thanks, yes I will definitely be checking the purity I wish I could test it myself, but I understand that's very hard to do.
I am considering buying a smaller tank to test my set up with first? I think I know which regulator to purchase but I am feeling a bit overwhelmed by the technicalities of this method for sure, especially when it comes to achieving a good seal on the regulator and of course getting the hood right. I think I will opt for a hood as opposed to a mask such as scuba as I think this complicates things even further.
I do like the idea of having more gas than I need just in case, sort of belt and braces.

With professional vendors which sell nitrogen for specific uses (food, welding) I wouldn't bother checking it. These products are sold for specific uses that requires an extremely high purity and I doubt even professionals even bother to check since they frequently uses these products with good results.

Personally I would only get the cylinder I intend to use, this way you can be ensured all the equipment works with the intended cylinder rather than find out something doesn't work with the "real" cylinder. With 4000 liters you have enough to experiment and test and ctb several times over.

Finding a regulator with a flowmeter can be challenging sometimes, be sure to know what fitting the cylinder you intend to source. The company that provides the cylinder possibly even sells regulators?

I wouldn't worry about the seal on the regulator, these are reliable and tested systems just use the intended tools to tighten the regulator and you will be fine. For leaks from the regulator it's relatively low pressure (2-6 bar) and only lazy or particulate bad fittings will leak.

Hoods is a popular and affordable choice that eliminates co2 build up and is efficient. I personally don't like them since they're cheaply made and intended to emergency use only. But they're much better then the ordinary exit bag.

 

[BlackDog81]

Yes I take your point about just getting the cylinder I intend to use, especially as I understand some regulators literally bite onto the thread when tightened with a spanner/wrench to mske a good seal, so I wouldn't want to be putting my regulator on and off different tanks.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply to me, I really appreciate it. I did a huge amount of research into this a year or so ago and then my circumstances changed a bit so I felt I had to hang on for a while longer. I have forgotten a lot of what I learnt and some suppliers have changed but I will start piecing it together soon like a jigsaw puzzle. I dont want to over complicate my set up but it has to work. May I ask you what you would choose as an alternative to a hood?

 

[Kapsyl]

Yes I take your point about just getting the cylinder I intend to use, especially as I understand some regulators literally bite onto the thread when tightened with a spanner/wrench to mske a good seal, so I wouldn't want to be putting my regulator on and off different tanks.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply to me, I really appreciate it. I did a huge amount of research into this a year or so ago and then my circumstances changed a bit so I felt I had to hang on for a while longer. I have forgotten a lot of what I learnt and some suppliers have changed but I will start piecing it together soon like a jigsaw puzzle. I dont want to over complicate my set up but it has to work. May I ask you what you would choose as an alternative to a hood?

Well taking it off and on occasionally is not going to cause problems, it's just easier doing it once and be done with it.

Sure I'm always happy to help those who are grateful!

I'm using my own experimental method with a gas mask instead of hood, it's approximately same mechanics but with a higher quality mask instead of hood.

Read about it here

Gas mask with reservoir, inert gas

I'm looking for advice for a variation of the inert gas method but using a military grade gas mask which is connected to a nitrogen filled environment instead. I haven’t seen this variation of inert gas proposed so I figured it was worthy its own thread I propose using this gas mask...

sanctioned-suicide.net

 

[BlackDog81]

Sounds really interesting, I'll check that out.
I am extremely interested in Scuba methods and a few masks I've seen but with little real world experience with this type of equipment, I feel tried and tested might work better for me. Even the homemade bags I'd looked into making from the PPH seemed a bit complicated.
Ultimately I think this method is still the best even though it's not the most straightforward. with a bit more research I hope to be able to get hold of everything I need.