Method Gas mask with reservoir, inert gas

[Kapsyl]

I'm looking for advice for a variation of the inert gas method but using a military grade gas mask which is connected to a nitrogen filled environment instead. I haven't seen this variation of inert gas proposed so I figured it was worthy its own thread

I propose using this gas mask



Connecting it by a hose such as this with the correct tread



Which is connected to a vessel, about 6 liter big or bigger




This airtight 6 liter container for medical use i intend to create a nitrogen filled environment which i will be breathing from. Since I don't want the container to blow up I intend to use one way ventilation valves so the positive pressure from the nitrogen will push out the last remaining air after i prefilled it. Then after I'm sure the container is filled with nitrogen and the pressure is 15 liter/minute I put on the mask and it should be all nitrogen.

The mask itself is airtight, I've tried it myself with teargas numerous time, as long as you shave. It also have 6 straps to ensure it stays on the head and will not fall of or break the seal.The mask have an inner mask for the mouth which help to expel co2.

I though about this method for about 2 weeks now and can't seem to find any problems about the design, any feedback or thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[Tears in Rain]

I'm looking for advice for a variation of the inert gas method but using a military grade gas mask which is connected to a nitrogen filled environment instead. I haven't seen this variation of inert gas proposed so I figured it was worthy its own thread

I propose using this gas mask

View attachment 128726

Connecting it by a hose such as this with the correct tread


View attachment 128727
Which is connected to a vessel, about 6 liter big or bigger


View attachment 128728

This airtight 6 liter container for medical use i intend to create a nitrogen filled environment which i will be breathing from. Since I don't want the container to blow up I intend to use one way ventilation valves so the positive pressure from the nitrogen will push out the last remaining air after i prefilled it. Then after I'm sure the container is filled with nitrogen and the pressure is 15 liter/minute I put on the mask and it should be all nitrogen.

The mask itself is airtight, I've tried it myself with teargas numerous time, as long as you shave. It also have 6 straps to ensure it stays on the head and will not fall of or break the seal.The mask have an inner mask for the mouth which help to expel co2.

I though about this method for about 2 weeks now and can't seem to find any problems about the design, any feedback or thoughts would be appreciated.

Only a small minority of people go with the inert gas method, and the posters on the inert gas megathread who seemed to be fairly expert on SCBA/SCUBA masks etc(e.g. @GasMonkey, @ztem, @befree) are no longer on this site.


Why are you using a reservoir container as opposed to directly attaching to a gas regulator on a cylinder?

Like I mentioned elsewhere, a poster previously didn't think masks like that are suitable for a constant-flow setup; something about a difficulty in maybe keeping the inner mask supplied with enough gas. Though I came across one post of theirs that said if a large flowrate is used, or a reservoir bag is used between a gas regulator and the mask, it could work.

is there any alternative to using a plastic bag?

Yep, SCBA, SCUBA, EEBD Hoods, constant flow hoods.

I was thinking of a diving mask

A mask connected to a flow regulator is not viable unless you use a huge flow rate (to meet the demands of inhalation) or it has a reservoir bag in the middle like Non-ReBreather masks.

Is that the point of your reservoir container?

Your setup, a constant flow of nitrogen to a mask, is probably what they used for the Alabama nitrogen execution a few weeks back, though the mask was probably a little bit different. So, in theory, as long as the mask makes a tight seal, I guess it should work.

 

[Kapsyl]

Only a small minority of people go with the inert gas method, and the posters on the inert gas megathread who seemed to be fairly expert on SCBA/SCUBA masks etc(e.g. @GasMonkey, @ztem, @befree) are no longer on this site.


Why are you using a reservoir container as opposed to directly attaching to a gas regulator on a cylinder?

Like I mentioned elsewhere, a poster previously didn't think masks like that are suitable for a constant-flow setup; something about a difficulty in maybe keeping the inner mask supplied with enough gas. Though I came across one post of theirs that said if a large flowrate is used, or a reservoir bag is used between a gas regulator and the mask, it could work.

Is that the point of your reservoir container?

Your setup, a constant flow of nitrogen to a mask, is probably what they used for the Alabama nitrogen execution a few weeks back, though the mask was probably a little bit different. So, in theory, as long as the mask makes a tight seal, I guess it should work.

Yes unfortunately the great minds has seemed to gone away but left huge amounts of information for us, hope they finally find peace.

This setup would more closely be related to the classic exit bag then the other methods (hood, scba, scuba). The exit bag creates a nitrogen filled environment with over pressure and pushes out any air trying to get in through the ventilation hole of the bag. My method achieve the same thing but using a reservoir connected with a hose.

The advantage I see with my method is clearing co2, which I have seen some Chinese hood having problem with. The other is as long as I am unconscious and somehow still alive when the gas runs out, I will still suffocate because of the one way valves.

The reason I don't connect directly to the mask is the pressure has to go somewhere, if I stop breathing it will build pressure and leak from the mask and may be uncomfortable breathing al that gas coming.

By using an external vessel which operates at overpressure and bleeding the excess gas, it should create an environment I could breathe with ease and not by force. With the co2 removed I could just wait until unconsciousness arrives.

I'm planning the build such a setup to se the airtightness, first step would be connecting the vessel to the mask and breathing until the air is out and seeing what effects that makes.

 

[Tears in Rain]

Yes unfortunately the great minds has seemed to gone away but left huge amounts of information for us, hope they finally find peace.

This setup would more closely be related to the classic exit bag then the other methods (hood, scba, scuba). The exit bag creates a nitrogen filled environment with over pressure and pushes out any air trying to get in through the ventilation hole of the bag. My method achieve the same thing but using a reservoir connected with a hose.

The advantage I see with my method is clearing co2, which I have seen some Chinese hood having problem with. The other is as long as I am unconscious and somehow still alive when the gas runs out, I will still suffocate because of the one way valves.

The reason I don't connect directly to the mask is the pressure has to go somewhere, if I stop breathing it will build pressure and leak from the mask and may be uncomfortable breathing al that gas coming.

By using an external vessel which operates at overpressure and bleeding the excess gas, it should create an environment I could breathe with ease and not by force. With the co2 removed I could just wait until unconsciousness arrives.

I'm planning the build such a setup to se the airtightness, first step would be connecting the vessel to the mask and breathing until the air is out and seeing what effects that makes.

Yeah, those SCBA/SCUBA mask setups that those people posted about use on-demand regulators. They are expensive setups.
As for the hoods, there seemed to be some issues with the lack of exhalation valves on a certain Draeger hood model, but others seemed to work fine, including some Chinese ones. But I presume your mask has a superior exhalation valve.

Makes sense about the potential build-up of gas pressure in the mask alright.

 

[Kapsyl]

Yeah, those SCBA/SCUBA mask setups that those people posted about use on-demand regulators. They are expensive setups.
As for the hoods, there seemed to be some issues with the lack of exhalation valves on a certain Draeger hood model, but others seemed to work fine, including some Chinese ones. But I presume your mask has a superior exhalation valve.

Makes sense about the potential build-up of gas pressure in the mask alright.

The main reason i choose to use that particular mask is that I already have it and have some training in it.

Training dictates that anytime putting on the mask you're supposed to perform an air tight test by blocking the filter and feel a vacuum forming around the face to ensure tight seal. The air runs out quickly in the mask and you start to feel suffocating very quick, so it works.

The biggest risk is making the reservoir not failing in anyway, either by rapturing by excess pressure or leaking in air.

An ordinary soda bottle will hold around 100 psi or 6.8 bar, my container is a bit thicker plastic so maybe little higher. The question is if a singel check valve will suffice bringing down the pressure below 6 bar when running 15-L/M, not sure what pressure is used for that flow rate.




I'm mostly thinking out loud here as it helps my think, so it's alright if you don't have any answers. But I appreciate the feedback so far!

 

[Kapsyl]

I'm so fucking angry!! The company who sold me the connecting hose just e-mail me and informed me that product sold out and doesn't exist anymore. That was the most crucial component fucking hell. Now I must find a replacement or go with a different strategy, just let me die already.

"Edit" found a replacement an Israeli extension hose which I believe will fit, cost a little more because of shipping but I'm on track again.

 

[Justnotme]

The biggest risk is making the reservoir not failing in anyway, either by rapturing by excess pressure or leaking in air.

Damn, I'm also very afraid that my nitrogen cylinder may suddenly burst due to the fact that the nitrogen in it is under very high pressure..

That's why I've never opened the cylinder valve or even attached a regulator to it.

The biggest risk is making the reservoir not failing in anyway, either by rapturing by excess pressure or leaking in air.

Damn, I'm also very afraid that my nitrogen cylinder may suddenly burst due to the fact that the nitrogen in it is under very high pressure..

That's why I've never opened the cylinder valve or even attached a regulator to it.

 

[Kapsyl]

Damn, I'm also very afraid that my nitrogen cylinder may suddenly burst due to the fact that the nitrogen in it is under very high pressure..

That's why I've never opened the cylinder valve or even attached a regulator to it.


Damn, I'm also very afraid that my nitrogen cylinder may suddenly burst due to the fact that the nitrogen in it is under very high pressure..

That's why I've never opened the cylinder valve or even attached a regulator to it.

I think you misunderstood me, I'm talking about the low pressure reservoir which I will be breathing from. The high pressure gas will probably never exceed 4-6 bar from the regulator which is very low.

The tank probably will hold 300 bar during pressure test so if it hasn't exploded yet I will not spontaneously explode.

 

[Justnotme]

I think you misunderstood me, I'm talking about the low pressure reservoir which I will be breathing from. The high pressure gas will probably never exceed 4-6 bar from the regulator which is very low.

The tank probably will hold 300 bar during pressure test so if it hasn't exploded yet I will not spontaneously explode.

I just use a translator, but even with it it is difficult to understand some of the messages :(

 

[Kapsyl]

After weeks of delays and distractions, I can now finally present a working reservoir tank using the parts I listed in the tread. It consists of 3 main components, first an inlet were the nitrogen will continuously flow adjusted to around 20/lpm.

Second the pressure relief valve which keeps the overpressure down to a normal level and stops the nitrogen to become forced into the mask. It also serves to bleed out the oxygen inside the reservoir in the beginning of the operation.

Third and final component is the filter and hose, a 40mm dust filter is screwed into the base of the container and connected on the other side with the hose. This ensures a tight seal to prevent oxygen leaking in, for the other components I used gaskets to achieve the same result. A simple test of blocking the relief valve and blowing confirms it's indeed working. Either way a small leak would be prevented by the overpressure anyway.





As the picture shows I have mounted it beside the chair, the hose is not particular long but this position ensures I have no restrictions of moving my head in the seated position. It also is a convenient place to protect it from damage, it's rather durable nonetheless.

A fault i didn't anticipate is the relief valve doesn't work correctly in this position and is constantly open. It relies on gravity to keep it shut and thus doesn't work upside down. I have fixed the issue with a rubber band and a spacer to put pressure keeping it shut during atmospheric pressure. A more appropriate position for the relief valve would be up on the reservoir but I failed to take that into account.

The valve is mostly there to ensure ctb even when the nitrogen runs out, since it closes when the pressure returns to normal inside the reservoir, it is possible to skip this and just have a relief hole. But I like the extra security it provides.

I will post additional photos of the final setup when I'm at my apartment where I have my other equipment.

 

[Kapsyl]

The creation is almost complete! I mounted to hose from the flowmeter into the reservoir and tried to pressurize it. It never fails to surprise me how little 15/lpm feels like and when mounted into the reservoir it was really quiet.

I was curious how the system would feel like and decided on test it. Keep in mind during the test the pressure relief valve was open so oxygen could be sucked in and I had a beard which doesn't provide a particular good seal to the mask.

Nonetheless I would conclude the test a success! It was really easy breathing in the mask with emphasis on easy, the slight overpressure made it blow ever so slightly into the mask and it felt just like ordinary air.
I experienced no claustrophobia and felt very comfortable, maybe because it was so easy to breath absolutely no sensation of suffocation of any kind!

I tested it for 40 seconds maybe and I felt my heart rate significantly increased. It was only a small test and I need to either change the position on the pressure relief valve or put faith on my rubber band, probably going to change position. I left my apartment extremely happy and it felt like a huge weight had been lifted of my shoulders. There are some work to be done and some straps to the chair but I can see the beginning of the end.

 

[Kapsyl]

Final version update.

Having a beard is really not ideal when using a mask. This became very apparent when I could still breathe in a supposed airtight container lol, so no wonder why it was so easy breathing my last test. So we can discard the last test.

I finally shaved my beard and the difference was immense, good news is that it's indeed airtight. When no nitrogen is disturbed I ran out of air in like one breath and a vacuum started to form, no indication of air sipping in. The partly negative news that it's not as light to breathe as in the previous tests and a higher Lpm is required than I expected. 25-30 LPM is required to be able to comfortably breathe in my latest test, even then I couldn't take huge deep breath and instead breath shallow and often instead. Not really a problem but something to consider, being calm and relax state is very much preferred. My gas supply is 1000liters so I still have approximately 30 min of gas, if somehow I'm still alive the airtight reservoir would still suffocate me as a backup method.

Felt no SI problems but could be a result of knowing it was a test. Feels strange that I was potentially 10-20 seconds from being dead since I'm all alone and rescue wouldn't come.

I also changed to position of the reservoir tank from under the seat to over me instead, secured to my bookshelf. This allows me to use my current position of the relief valve without modifying it further, is also a steadier position.

I didn't perform a full out black out test of fear of wasting my gas, but after approximately 30-40 seconds I was very near unconsciousness. 10-20 seconds more and I would be out. I thus conclude my method as effective in my mind and I'm confident that it will work. Ideally I would use an oxygen sensor and a foam head to measure the oxygen level inside the mask but I feel like I don't have the time for that.

Overall In my opinion I would rate this method superior to exit bags/eebd hoods but slightly worse than scuba/scba. It's basically DIY poor man's scuba setup.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

May I ask, what's to keep you from just ripping off the mask should SI set in?

 

[Kapsyl]

May I ask, what's to keep you from just ripping off the mask should SI set in?

Nothing really, I actually prefer having the option to abort whenever I like until unconsciousness sets in. If I would strap my hands the opposite may happen and actually cause more SI then having no straps at all. A strap around your chest would make sense to stay secured in the seat trough.

Worth mentioning is there isn't really a physical SI since there is no co2 build up at all. It's only the knowledge that once you become unconscious it's over.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

It's only the knowledge that once you become unconscious it's over.

That's the one that I feel is the largest obstacle to overcome.

 

[Kapsyl]

Turns out SI is a very real phenomenon and it caught totally by surprise. I of course knew about SI prior of my "attempt" but what really surprised me was the level of coordination and swiftness it produced.

What I remember is sitting calmly down in my chair and just really focusing on my breathing, my mind was essentially blank and I really didn't think of it too much. Next thing I knew it all went black and I suddenly found myself standing starring at the wall confused and completely apathetic. I then started the shutdown procedure when I finally came to my senses and realized what really happened. I wasn't sad nor angry on what just taken place, I was just empty.

In retrospect I feel kinda stupid for allowing myself to abort in this way and it's painfully apparent my body wasn't as ready as my mind. Handcuffs seems like the logical next step to acquire since the body can't really be trusted in those final moments before total unconsciousness

This is of course nothing new in the lucrative suicidal community but I figured I'd share my experience and thoughts about SI.

 

[limeoctave]

Turns out SI is a very real phenomenon and it caught totally by surprise. I of course knew about SI prior of my "attempt" but what really surprised me was the level of coordination and swiftness it produced.

What I remember is sitting calmly down in my chair and just really focusing on my breathing, my mind was essentially blank and I really didn't think of it too much. Next thing I knew it all went black and I suddenly found myself standing starring at the wall confused and completely apathetic. I then started the shutdown procedure when I finally came to my senses and realized what really happened. I wasn't sad nor angry on what just taken place, I was just empty.

In retrospect I feel kinda stupid for allowing myself to abort in this way and it's painfully apparent my body wasn't as ready as my mind. Handcuffs seems like the logical next step to acquire since the body can't really be trusted in those final moments before total unconsciousness

This is of course nothing new in the lucrative suicidal community but I figured I'd share my experience and thoughts about SI.

thank you for sharing

was it your first attempt? if you don't mind answering

did you make tests before the attempt? was it different?

 

[Kapsyl]

thank you for sharing

was it your first attempt? if you don't mind answering

did you make tests before the attempt? was it different?

That depends on what you consider an attempt, but this was probably the most determined I've been compared to previous tries.

I've tried three times previously but aborted them all consciously because of limited nitrogen flow and stress. My previous routine was to first put on the mask and ensuring a good airseal, then threading the hose onto the mask by hand. The problem was that in all attempts I struggled to attaching the hose quickly enough and it resulted in a limited nitrogen flow and resulted in a serious suffocated feeling.

Another change is that I used a higher flow rate than previously, like 35L/pm instead of 25L/pm.

Before my previous tries I did perform an efficiency test, were I aborted just before unconsciousness. I concluded it was efficient even with the lower 25L/pm, but I was a lot calmer since it was only a test. Kinda a shame I survived since unconsciousness really comes as a surprise and I was really close to it.

 

[limeoctave]

That depends on what you consider an attempt, but this was probably the most determined I've been compared to previous tries.

I've tried three times previously but aborted them all consciously because of limited nitrogen flow and stress. My previous routine was to first put on the mask and ensuring a good airseal, then threading the hose onto the mask by hand. The problem was that in all attempts I struggled to attaching the hose quickly enough and it resulted in a limited nitrogen flow and resulted in a serious suffocated feeling.

Another change is that I used a higher flow rate than previously, like 35L/pm instead of 25L/pm.

Before my previous tries I did perform an efficiency test, were I aborted just before unconsciousness. I concluded it was efficient even with the lower 25L/pm, but I was a lot calmer since it was only a test. Kinda a shame I survived since unconsciousness really comes as a surprise and I was really close to it.

thanks, and I just wanted to say thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge about the inert gas method on this site. It's very informative and I really appreciate it

 

[Kapsyl]

thanks, and I just wanted to say thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge about the inert gas method on this site. It's very informative and I really appreciate it

Thank you! I very much appreciate the recognition. I will most likely continue to provide my services until I die or have a miraculous recovery. If I would mysteriously disappear you know my method works at least.

 

[Kapsyl]

To combat my apparent strong SI, I've purchased some handcuffs. I first considered some "toy" handcuffs (read bdsm cuffs) with a quick release function. But I quickly dismissed these since it would be too easy to simply use this quick release function. Wearing fluffy pink cuffs wouldn't look particularly good either lol.

I settled with plastic zip tie handcuffs, mostly because of cost and curiosity since I never handled plastic cuffs before. I ordered 3 of them for practice and redundancy, one will probably suffice if nothing goes wrong.

The only way to release these cuffs is to cut them open, I will place a knife behind my back in case something happens. But honestly I don't know what scenario that would happen, it's basically a emotional support knife

I also ordered the Kalashnikov energy drink, I give it a 5/10 ️ It has that distinctive "cheaply" flavor which is mostly found in off brand drinks. But sometimes you crave that particular taste, the branding also scores some extra points.

 

[xxtwistedredxx]

I want to do a gas method, but in my car because I don't want to accidentally harm someone in my home, ya know? Think something similar to this may be rigged up in one?

I'd use the exhaust, but I've heard that's absolutely painful. And if I'm honest, I've suffered enough at this point. Would rather my last few moments at least be as peaceful as possible.

 

[Kapsyl]

I want to do a gas method, but in my car because I don't want to accidentally harm someone in my home, ya know? Think something similar to this may be rigged up in one?

I'd use the exhaust, but I've heard that's absolutely painful. And if I'm honest, I've suffered enough at this point. Would rather my last few moments at least be as peaceful as possible.

Co poisoning and inert gases are significantly different methods, you'd have better luck starting your own tread instead.

 

[limeoctave]

@Kapsyl are you here?