Help N date is closing by

[Lovemykids]

I'd be scared of the taste too, given what I've read - but you have tasted it, said you were okay with it, even said that the taste was not the reason you were diluting it. Is the taste *that* bad?

Do u drink alcohol without mix? Then don't worry have some test sample u will get used to it

 

[violetskin96]

i tasted it and whether id actually vomit or not idk but i'll for sure be gagging the whole way through, so anti-emetics are a must for me, and i dont throw up easy or have a hard time drinking hard liquor.

 

[Chinaski]

I don't think they are necessary. I've seen a livestream of Phillip Nitschke from Exit International, where he discussed anti-emetics. He regularly talks about exit-methods and streams from facebook. According to him, anti-emetics are needed for people who suffer from an illness that makes feel nauseos. For example, cancer-patients that undergo chemo-therapy face a higher risk of vomiting due to the treatment-therapy. So if they would vomit after digesting N, they would also puke it up again before it could be fully taken up by the body, which increases the risk of surviving of course. That's why anti-emetics are recommended, because people with a terminal illness usually seek to ctb and vomiting is usually a byproduct of said illness or a byproduct of a therapy.

He talks about it at the 25:04 mark:

To be fair Nitschke is all over the place on vomiting atm. Check this thread on the latest (very poor) PPH revision on it.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/october-2018-vomiting-chapter.6919/

There's so much contradictory info around re anti-emetics that it's actually slightly concerning, the idea that N without an anti-emetic is fine by Nitschke is not only at odds with literally every other end of life advocate, but also puzzling when you consider that until his October revision his recommended dose of meto was the highest by far of any pro-euthanasia doctor.

 

[Chinaski]

Christ.

August PPH: take 60mg meto half an hour before.

October PPH: take 30mg meto 1 hour before.

That video: take 30mg meto half an hour before.

Fucking hell Nitschke, get your act together eh?

 

[RainAndSadness]

To be fair Nitschke is all over the place on vomiting atm. Check this thread on the latest (very poor) PPH revision on it.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/october-2018-vomiting-chapter.6919/

There's so much contradictory info around re anti-emetics that it's actually slightly concerning, the idea that N without an anti-emetic is fine by Nitschke is not only at odds with literally every other end of life advocate, but also puzzling when you consider that until his October revision his recommended dose of meto was the highest by far of any pro-euthanasia doctor.

Hm. He also lists diseases or a very high sensitivity to vomiting as the major reasons to take anti-emetics in that PPH. I personally think you'd be fine if you did it without them but it's probably the safest way to take some, just to erase all possible risks. I highly doubt N alone would make you puke though. I didn't taste N yet but I think many people exaggerate the bad taste of it.

Regarding the anti-emetics schedule: I would actually go with the standards of euthanasia-organizations. I think they have the most experience regarding Nembutal for life-ending purposes. I don't know if they are transparent about it though. Do they even use anti-emetics? I have no clue. They probably don't communicate that openly, I assume. I will go with the recommended schedule of A. I know he is a vet so this isn't his field of expertise either but it's better than nothing.

 

[Chinaski]

I know dignitas use 30mg of liquid meto an hour or so before. Whether or not this is more potent than in tablet form (l assume it is tbh, otherwise why bother?) is probably the issue, so I'd go for 40mg as a stat dose. I've read Derek Humphrey state that you're better served with the 3 day regimen and should take one every hour the day before, as without anti emetics vomiting is a certainty. So contradictory, it's unhelpful - especially when the leading voice on the matter is glibly changing his mind on a monthly basis.

 

[TiredHorse]

N is the most peaceful exit out there if done right. It doesn't require much expertise beyond "don't eat, take pills, drink N, eat chocolate". If you're going to over complicate this because you don't feel ready to follow that regimen, then don't do it at all in my opinion. There's nothing wrong with not feeling ready; there's plenty wrong with ending up in a hospital bed puking your innards up before being whisked off to a psych ward.

I can't imagine any clearer or steadier advice than this.

If you aren't ready, then take a deep breath and wait until you are. You're not on stage; you're among people who understand how big a journey it is that you're considering and how frightening it can be.

 

[TheLastTrip]

In the PP handbook it doesn't seem to have a problem with dilution apart from making 'a greater volume of an equally unpalatable substance'. The one warning they do have is being able to finish the whole drink before it puts you to sleep, which if you mix it with 2 litres of orange juice or something beforehand might be an issue.

 

[Lovemykids]

I'm doing beer + entiemetics + N. If beer makes me throw up after all the drinking I've done I deserve to end up in a hospital.

I'm probably gonna do the same thing

 

[TiredHorse]

Keep your eye on the ball, Dubs. I won't tell you not to get lit first, but if the idea is to ctb, do you really want to risk losing the opportunity to go with N? That shit's too rare/expensive to waste.

 

[Chinaski]

Keep your eye on the ball, Dubs. I won't tell you not to get lit first, but if the idea is to ctb, do you really want to risk losing the opportunity to go with N? That shit's too rare/expensive to waste.

The PPH does point out that "chronic" alcohol use can lead to cross tolerance. Derek Humphry also strongly advises to avoid fizzy drinks.

Obviously it's up to the individual, but if that has to be the way it's probably best to try drinking with antiemetics in advance to ensure there are no side effects with that.

 

[Lovemykids]

Cross tolerance in terms of throwing up?

 

[Chinaski]

Cross tolerance in terms of throwing up?

I think tolerance suggests it'll take ages.

 

[Lovemykids]

I take alcohol daily like 2-3 cans of beers
Does that affect

 

[Chinaski]

Doubt it, but as l say, I'd avoid before ctb. The pph is in the resources on here, look for yourself.

 

[TiredHorse]

I suppose this is something I need to be aware of myself: there's the ideal scenario I envision for how I ctb --for me, with eb/N2, lying on my porch swing looking up at the sky-- and there's what is proven to actually work --sitting up, carefully braced so that I don't fall over and dislodge the bag when I become unconscious. Those small discrepancies between my fantasy and the pragmatism of efficacy can be difficult to reconcile.

It seems N, for all its perfection, is not without such compromises as well.

 

[Chinaski]

I was about to post a similar thing. We all have to compromise to reach the end result. None of us expect to ctb in the throes of post-coital ecstasy in Catherine Zeta Jones' bed. If you want to get hammered, get hammered. If you want to ctb peacefully, then get the N and do so, but it's perhaps asking too much to expect to combine the two.

 

[Fcancer]

I can't get a test kit due to not being over 50. So I will just have to trust our mate A has the goods.

I will take the stat dose of anti, spray mouth with lidocaine, empty 2 bottles into 1 glass and drink, then have like a mouthful of juice ready in another glass to chase hopefully not throw up.

How come you say eat chocolate Chinaski?? I think PPH says you can have a bit of toast like 1 hour prior to having N aswell??

 

[TiredHorse]

Does lidocaine kill the taste buds? I know whenever my dentist used it, it tasted NASTY.

 

[Empty RN]

I can't get a test kit due to not being over 50. So I will just have to trust our mate A has the goods.

I will take the stat dose of anti, spray mouth with lidocaine, empty 2 bottles into 1 glass and drink, then have like a mouthful of juice ready in another glass to chase hopefully not throw up.

How come you say eat chocolate Chinaski?? I think PPH says you can have a bit of toast like 1 hour prior to having N aswell??

A is very reliable. I've heard from people who ordered the same time I did, had similar experiences in receiving and places they received from who tested it and turned out legit. I trust these accounts. Mine came within two days of being sent out. The chocolate was recommended in the PPeH as the bitter taste of dark chocolate helps mask the after taste of N.

 

[Empty RN]

Does lidocaine kill the taste buds? I know whenever my dentist used it, it tasted NASTY.

The taste of lidocaine is nasty?? I'm going to look for it and try it too

 

[Fcancer]

The taste of lidocaine is nasty?? I'm going to look for it and try it too

The lidocaine I think I read on another site or maybe ppeh I forget, I have never personally used it myself but think can get from any regular pharmacy.

 

[Empty RN]

The lidocaine I think I read on another site or maybe ppeh I forget, I have never personally used it myself but think can get from any regular pharmacy.

Without prescription?

 

[Fcancer]

In

Without prescription?

In Aus anyway it calles Xylocaine 10% spray, no prescription.

 

[TiredHorse]

As regards diluting, I just posted this on another thread (https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/my-journey-for-nembutal-beginning-of-the-ending.7015/) about N:

I just came across this via another thread here:

"Barbiturates are derivatives of barbituric acid and are classified as either short- or long-acting. The short-acting barbiturates (e.g., pentobarbital) when compared to long-acting agents differ by more rapid onset [...] have a shorter duration of action [...] . Pentobarbital possesses a duration of action of three to four hours and a variable elimination half-life of 15 to 48 hours."

If I read this correctly, pentobarbitol --aka N-- acts quickly, but doesn't last very long. Which would mean not only is a lethal dose of X amount, but you need to get that dose into your system rapidly, rather than spread out over time. So depending on how fast your body can absorb liquid, diluting X with whatever --beer, fruit juice, etc.-- could slow uptake of that dose and make it ineffective.

The information is via a link recently posted here: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/a-good-n-case.7225/

 

[Chinaski]

I can't get a test kit due to not being over 50. So I will just have to trust our mate A has the goods.

I will take the stat dose of anti, spray mouth with lidocaine, empty 2 bottles into 1 glass and drink, then have like a mouthful of juice ready in another glass to chase hopefully not throw up.

How come you say eat chocolate Chinaski?? I think PPH says you can have a bit of toast like 1 hour prior to having N aswell??

Dignitas give you chocolate afterwards to quell the aftertaste .

 

[Chinaski]

Just to clarify by the way, when tasting N l presume you stuck a syringe in the bottle. Won't this cause the N to deteriorate? Or would it be okay?

 

[Goldie]

Yes, as is fasting beforehand, no alcohol prior, no diluting with juice and a wait of twelve hours iirc.

N told me himself that you can dilute it 50%.

 

[Lovemykids]

Just to clarify by the way, when tasting N l presume you stuck a syringe in the bottle. Won't this cause the N to deteriorate? Or would it be okay?

Pph says as long you don't break the seal

 

[Chinaski]

N told me himself that you can dilute it 50%.

N? I'm presuming you mean A here, who is a vet. As far as l know Dignitas don't dilute it, and both the PPH and Final Exit recommend taking it neat. Obviously it's up to the individual, but going against all end of life advice in this way seems a tad reckless, l doubt very much anyone goes to Dignitas and insists on having a twist of lemon in their drink.