Venting I fucking HATE being a man

[DownwardSpiral]

*I am NOT making the claim that being a man is harder than being a woman* *I am not sober & I am just ranting so don't take this as some kind of manifesto*
I am genuinely afraid to say all this because I don't want to be seen as a bad person, but it's my experience. Being an average (or below average) & single man in this society in this day & age is absolutely AWFUL. NOBODY takes you seriously. The loneliness is so intense & so brutal. Women either don't pay attention to you or are AFRAID of you. Women literally cross the street to avoid me, avoid eye contact, and act super uncomfortable when we're just having simple small talk. At parties, I like to have conversations so I'll try & talk to the women there even if they have boyfriends, but I guess thats not allowed because they think I'm some kind of creep with ulterior motives when I'm just trying to have a normal conversation? They'll cling to their boyfriend's side the entire time, or with the other girls, & they will ONLY talk to guys who are ALREADY TAKEN. They avoid single men like the PLAGUE, me & all the other single guys around.

Other men look down on you & compete with you. They tear each other down to try to look like the best "mate" for women. If you have any perceived weakness or difference, other men will POUNCE on you to bully you & make you look worse than them. Men don't have any good role models to look up to. Most successful male figures are pieces of shit who lie, cheat, steal, & take advantage of people. Men also don't get any support, not from their friends, not from teachers in school, not from women, not from their families (mostly). At least in my case, my father is a piece of shit. He stares at attractive women, makes comments about their appearance or clothes, he never taught me how to talk to girls or respect them or flirt with them appropriately or anything. I grew up watching lots of media & almost every man in popular shows or movies is some big buff guy who takes what he wants & always gets the girl in the end. This is not healthy for men to internalize. Also the men in youtube videos or even celebrities & athletes & stuff would often treat women badly, make jokes about women ("women belong in the kitchen" & whatnot). Trying to figure out how to be a kind man in this world is like doing a 10,000 piece puzzle where every piece is the same solid color, while everyone around you is trash talking you & telling you you're doing it wrong. Good luck with that.

I get that being a woman is insanely difficult. I will never understand how it feels to live as a woman. There are lots of terrible men who prey on women & women have been treated terribly through all of society. I understand they have to look out for themselves & be careful of men. My question is, WHY DO I SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES? I wasn't around for all of the terrible history. I didn't make the patriarchy. I never laid my hands on a woman or catcalled them. However, because OTHER MEN treat women terribly, now I, ME, have to get ignored, scoffed at, lectured, belittled, hear "Kill All Men" & get called a creep, loser, weirdo, & pervert. Just because I'm a little awkward & trying to smile & be kind & learn & have an EMOTIONAL CONNECTION with someone like EVERYONE ELSE ON THE PLANET wants to do, both men & women. (besides asexual people of course). I just don't understand why my human feelings, emotions, & urges are wrong & bad while women get to do whatever the fuck they want & it's "empowering" & they get support from their friends, men, & support groups. It's a glaring double standard. Yes there are lots of people who give women shit, but there are lots of people who want to help women too. As a man, you ONLY have people giving you shit. It feels terrible to be treated this way to be honest. Every time I approach a woman for any reason, and I say something to get their attention, or even GLANCE at them, they react like I am a MONSTER that they have to be fearful of. It feels like I'm not allowed to even exist around women. Like I'm supposed to make myself completely invisible, never open my mouth, & never go outside so that I never make any woman uncomfortable. Fuck that. My sympathy for women is waning. If me just being a normal person is a problem to women, then they can cry about it.

Women always say that treating women with respect is the best way to connect with them. This is a lie. It's mostly about looks. My sister was very popular & would go to lots of parties, & she would always complain about the toxic men there. She was at a pool party once where a bunch of guys were talking about how women don't deserve the right to vote! Looking back, it's fascinating that while I was the weird, awkward kid at home all alone trying my best to learn & become better because I wanted people to like me, popular girls were going to pool parties in their swimsuits with tall, buff, handsome guys who treat women like property. These are the guys who get attention, handsome guys I mean. It literally doesn't matter what you believe or what you say, as long as you look good. Good looking men get attention from women & other men trying to piggy back off of their success. They will have people listen to them & agree with them just to be liked. They will get invited to things all the time because people want them around. They will be treated kindly by most people at work, or school, or in public even when they make mistakes. They have the "Halo Effect" where they basically cannot do anything wrong, which is flipped for guys who don't meet the looks standards because then everything you do is wrong. This is the "Failo Effect."

Women also always tell men to "be better," to call out bad behavior when you see it. However, trying to be a better guy means sacrificing your own relationships & looking like a fool to everyone. My friends would say misogynistic shit all the time, & once I started pushing back on it you know what happens? They give me shit, make fun of me, & belittle me. They don't change their minds & grow along with me, & no woman magically appears to say "wow! Im proud of you for standing up for women! Wanna be friends?" You just get outcast from the only people who bother to interact with you & end up more alone. Women will even give you shit for it too. They DO NOT believe you when you claim to respect women or be a feminist. They will say you are just being performative, just doing it to get in their pants. They will never EVER believe that you, as a lonely single below average man, GENUINELY want to support women out of the goodness of your heart. You will always be treated as suspicious in every single situation ever.

I DO want connection though I admit, but not just sex. What's so wrong with that? Humans are social creatures. We are literally designed by evolution to want to be close to each other. Also, whats so bad about wanting sex? EVERYONE IS OUT HERE TO GET SOME! Women too, believe it or not, they are just not as open or aggressive about it as men are. I have seen many times women complaining about not getting sex, like complaining to their friends that it's been months since they've had sex, or good sex. Humans need connection & sex. For women, it's okay to want that, but suddenly when men want the same thing, it's a huge problem. At least, for below average men.

People always wonder why men are so toxic or desperate or whatever nowadays, but I think it's painfully obvious. What people need to understand about men is that we come from a place of desiring love & connection. That's what human being NEED. Food, water, shelter, & CONNECTION. PURPOSE. In this society however, it is incredibly rare for a man to get to experience this. He either needs to be born incredibly lucky with good looks or a supportive family, or get lucky finding a partner who accepts him. Most men are COMPLETELY STARVED of ANY KIND of emotional connection as well as any guidance, so they are frustrated, alone, and confused. Men also want to be PROTECTORS, but women will laugh in your face & tell you they are "strong & independent" & they "don't need a man," then go complain that men don't treat women with enough respect. Why would they if women say they don't need them? Society offers NO PATH for good men. I WANT to learn from women. I ACKNOWLEDGE that I have fallen short in many ways with my behavior like women say men should do, but even then, nobody cares. Men sure don't, & no woman will give me the time of day, give me a shred of respect or attention, or even bother to look at me. Also, no man is out here trying to guide men to be better. Men will just find their ONE PARTNER who they connect with, & then DITCH all their friends to be with their woman instead. Where am I supposed to go? What am I supposed to do? There is nowhere to be a kind, gentle man in this world while also getting respected by people. It's always an uphill battle, everyday, everywhere I go. As a man if you try & be better, (unless you are super attractive), then nobody will care about you. In fact, lots of men & women will treat you WORSE. They will take your kindness as weakness. I am absolutely not surprised at all that most men wind up being immature, selfish, toxic, & treat women terribly. It's not good, but it's not surprising at all. Every aspect of society is pushing them towards that.

SO finally, whether it's women or other men, people need to stop blaming individual men. It's a societal problem. Women could try to encourage men more instead of shaming them, & stop enabling toxic men & older men to take advantage of them, then blaming random innocent men for their problems. Still I don't blame women for the way they act either. We are all victims. I apologize if I'm being too mean or ignorant. I just hate my body & my urges, I hate how people treat me, I hate being alone every day, I hate that nobody thinks I'm attractive or "desires" me in that way, I hate that nobody wants to listen to me, & I hate that nobody is ever nice to me in real life. It's dehumanizing. I don't even feel like a real person anymore. It's hard to put everything down in the right way. I don't think I made much sense. I'm sure I forgot some things. It doesn't matter anyways, my opinion as an excess uneducated loser virgin male is absolutely worthless. I'd rather share my stupid thoughts than hold them in. Share your experience if you relate or argue with me if you want.

 

[DownwardSpiral]

I feel bad for the women on this forum who have to wade through post after post like this.

why?

 

[BlackNugget]

Get a grip.

You aren't owed anything for basic courtesy; to some extent, I do feel bad to hear about your struggles of connection in general, but you need to understand individuality. You are making heavy overgeneralizations grounded on either imagination or certain people in your life, and it's weird to hear you list out the very reasons some women are cautious around most men yet still not understand it, especially as a stranger. Yet, again, you also talk on those who aren't so cautious, do you not see the pattern here?

Each person is their own individual, with their own characteristics and sense of judgement, how would strangers know you're one of the good ones?

They aren't judging you personally; they're managing risk in situations where they have incomplete information. Whether that judgment is fair or not is ultimately their decision to make. Some people are trash, some aren't; some people can accurately distinguish the trash from everyone else while others struggle to, that's a general issue beyond gender. A general precaution is often better than making the wrong judgment.

 

[N-methylamphetamine]

I get that being a woman is insanely difficult. I will never understand how it feels to live as a woman. There are lots of terrible men who prey on women & women have been treated terribly through all of society. I understand they have to look out for themselves & be careful of men. My question is, WHY DO I SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES?

Because this society sucks and actual brotherhood is dead

now I, ME, have to get ignored, scoffed at, lectured, belittled, hear "Kill All Men" & get called a creep, loser, weirdo, & pervert. Just because I'm a little awkward & trying to smile & be kind & learn & have an EMOTIONAL CONNECTION with someone like EVERYONE ELSE ON THE PLANET wants to do, both men & women. (besides asexual people of course). I just don't understand why my human feelings, emotions, & urges are wrong & bad while women get to do whatever the fuck they want & it's "empowering" & they get support from their friends, men, & support groups. It's a glaring double standard.

get off of the internet and stop talking to those people

Every time I approach a woman for any reason, and I say something to get their attention, or even GLANCE at them, they react like I am a MONSTER that they have to be fearful of. It feels like I'm not allowed to even exist around women. Like I'm supposed to make myself completely invisible, never open my mouth, & never go outside so that I never make any woman uncomfortable. Fuck that. My sympathy for women is waning. If me just being a normal person is a problem to women, then they can cry about it.

I get your frustration, im Indian and loads of people think we are creeps for being Indian (good luck trying to explain Indian culture and how its not 100% true to them). But dont blame all woman. Thats a really slippery slope and a bad way of thinking

Women also always tell men to "be better," to call out bad behavior when you see it. However, trying to be a better guy means sacrificing your own relationships & looking like a fool to everyone. My friends would say misogynistic shit all the time, & once I started pushing back on it you know what happens? They give me shit, make fun of me, & belittle me. They don't change their minds & grow along with me, & no woman magically appears to say "wow! Im proud of you for standing up for women! Wanna be friends?" You just get outcast from the only people who bother to interact with you & end up more alone. Women will even give you shit for it too. They DO NOT believe you when you claim to respect women or be a feminist. They will say you are just being performative, just doing it to get in their pants. They will never EVER believe that you, as a lonely single below average man, GENUINELY want to support women out of the goodness of your heart. You will always be treated as suspicious in every single situation ever.

no it doesn't?? you need better friends and thats not how things work

People always wonder why men are so toxic or desperate or whatever nowadays, but I think it's painfully obvious. What people need to understand about men is that we come from a place of desiring love & connection. That's what human being NEED. Food, water, shelter, & CONNECTION. PURPOSE. In this society however, it is incredibly rare for a man to get to experience this. He either needs to be born incredibly lucky with good looks or a supportive family, or get lucky finding a partner who accepts him. Most men are COMPLETELY STARVED of ANY KIND of emotional connection as well as any guidance, so they are frustrated, alone, and confused. Men also want to be PROTECTORS, but women will laugh in your face & tell you they are "strong & independent" & they "don't need a man," then go complain that men don't treat women with enough respect. Why would they if women say they don't need them? Society offers NO PATH for good men. I WANT to learn from women. I ACKNOWLEDGE that I have fallen short in many ways with my behavior like women say men should do, but even then, nobody cares. Men sure don't, & no woman will give me the time of day, give me a shred of respect or attention, or even bother to look at me. Also, no man is out here trying to guide men to be better. Men will just find their ONE PARTNER who they connect with, & then DITCH all their friends to be with their woman instead. Where am I supposed to go? What am I supposed to do? There is nowhere to be a kind, gentle man in this world while also getting respected by people. It's always an uphill battle, everyday, everywhere I go. As a man if you try & be better, (unless you are super attractive), then nobody will care about you. In fact, lots of men & women will treat you WORSE. They will take your kindness as weakness. I am absolutely not surprised at all that most men wind up being immature, selfish, toxic, & treat women terribly. It's not good, but it's not surprising at all. Every aspect of society is pushing them towards that.

Bro ima be fr i understand your pain and frustration but i promise to you people in real life are not like this.

 

[Forever Sleep]

From an individuals perspective and personal experience- I can appreciate how lonely and frustrating this must be to experience.

When it comes to expecting women to change their behaviour though, I think it's a little more complicated. They absolutely shouldn't be nasty to a man they find awkward or whatever else.

That said- you can't expect them not to feel afraid if they have had bad experiences in the past and- an alarming number of women will have. A women being interviewed once said that literally every woman she had ever spoken to had experienced some kind of sexual harassment.

I think it's also important to point out that men like that don't need much encouragement at all to continue. The fawn response- polite, appeasing- but not encouraging in any way- is seen as a green flag by many. So- some women may seem more overly cold in order to discourage that behaviour.

Ultimately though- it comes down to risk. You could potentially be anyone. To put it another way- let's say you had a daughter. Would you encourage her to be friendly towards a random guy that came up and started talking to her?

Would you prefer to put her at risk to make that random guy feel better about himself? Maybe the probability is in her favour- there's maybe a far higher chance of him being harmless but- would you really want her to risk that? It's not to say she should be unkind but- I absolutely think it's fair enough women should be wary of men. Plenty of them aren't harmless!

With regards to finding peer support- I agree and I find it baffling to be honest. So many men do seem to be struggling with the same issues- even here. I'm not sure why there isn't more understanding and support between men. I often hear that men are jealous of the close bonds that women form between one another but- that doesn't just happen. We are vulnerable and supportive with each other. It doesn't make sense (to me) that each individual man says they are struggling but can't find another man who is struggling in similar ways to relate to. When there are so many posts saying the same thing.

 

[thruDeathPeace]

Hey Dude, old guy here. I was in your shoes once and I've been there and done it. I hope you know that you're not alone and you will figure things out even if it takes some time.

There's a lot more that I'd like to say, things I would've wanted to know, but I get it if you're venting and just want to cuss about all this shit.

Fuck it, here's some info anyway. I'm typing this shit on a phone so hopefully it helps someone somehow. If you're just venting feel free to ignore it.

Obviously you aren't uniquely repulsive to women. Turns out single women are some of the least courteous people you will ever meet. Especially these days they've got it in their heads that everyone wants their gooch. So guess what, the golden rule applies here: These women are treating you the way they expect to be treated. If you show up with this golden retriever bullshit to them thats boyfriend energy. And doing that makes them feel obligated to return girlfriend energy and that grosses them out. Notice you already got a "we don't owe you shit" replies? This is why.

The other thing I want to say and this is probably going to be hard to swallow but your father and the guys your sister is talking about are not unkind. They are treating women much more kindly than you realize. Their approach lets women know right upfront what they are about with no confusion or nonsense. If the girls are about it too then great, and if they aren't then oh well. End of the day there is no confusion and the ladies are free to decide for themselves which makes them feel in control and that makes them feel safe.

On the other hand, coming up to girls with this soft wishy washy kinda friends energy confuses them. They don't know if you want to be friends, they don't know if you want the gooch, they don't know what to think so they don't like it because they aren't in control anymore. You don't realize it, I know I didn't until years later, but it takes away their agency because they don't have all the information to make an informed decision on you. Save that shit for someone who cares.

I could go on but this already took forever and I'm probably rambling. Either way, take it easy out there and good luck realizing everything you thought you knew was wrong!

 

[EternalShore]

It'd be nice if people weren't so cruel, evil, and selfish in this world~ :(

 

[DownwardSpiral]

sorry people. im clearly losing it. most of what i wrote is over exaggerated, untrue, & thoughtless. i dont know why i let these things bother me so much. ive been watching too much blackpill content i guess. yall are too kind to me. all of you make good points. thanks for talking some sense into me. it felt good to let that out & my feelings are real, but i was way too harsh. its a problem with society & a problem within myself, not something to lash out at people for. dont take me seriously, im always irritated & on edge. im basically like those abused dogs you see being rescued, when they back into a corner & attack the person helping them. i promise ill keep trying to do better.

 

[UserFromNowhere]

sorry people. im clearly losing it. most of what i wrote is over exaggerated, untrue, & thoughtless. i dont know why i let these things bother me so much. ive been watching too much blackpill content i guess. yall are too kind to me. all of you make good points. thanks for talking some sense into me. it felt good to let that out & my feelings are real, but i was way too harsh. its a problem with society & a problem within myself, not something to lash out at people for. dont take me seriously, im always irritated & on edge. im basically like those abused dogs you see being rescued, when they back into a corner & attack the person helping them. i promise ill keep trying to do better.

It's understandable to get upset. Honestly, I think most people in this life just haven't met "their people." The ones that will care for them, the ones that aren't going to instantly resort to calling you a creep or a weirdo just for having a conversation, the ones who you can be friends with. I've seen a lot of people on this site and in my own personal life and there's a common thread (not to imply it's universal, just that it exists). That is, a lot of people don't have anyone they can share their true feelings with anymore, at least not like in the days of old. You chat to someone in person and there's a threat that instead of truly hearing you out and listening to you, they'll just call the police or emergency services because they don't want to have to deal with the guilt if you do happen to take more extreme actions. Online, it's the same, except even if the other person doesn't report you, the platform itself may flag your messages and send them to the relevant agencies.

Personally, I can't really say I can relate to the experience of men that either have felt excluded from society or their social group because they want to be a good person when everyone around them is stuck in their pretensive notions of what is fine versus what is abnormal. I never really had a problem talking to anyone regardless of gender because I just didn't think too much of (what I consider to be) superficial aspects like that when I've always been more interested in what the person had to say. But I've also been moderately lucky in this life as well, certainly not the most attractive person but also not someone who has problems with my self-appearance. I have been excluded from some places due to my views and behaviors, and it does suck, especially when you were so intertwined with those places and then get shut out because you express a view that others don't agree with. But that happens, it's life, and as people told me: "if they can't accept and appreciate you, they don't deserve you."

It may take time to find the right group of people, the right person that you can share things with openly and freely, but I'm sure they're out there. I'm certainly not going to pretend it's easy, but I'd say that it's worth it.

 

[NutOrat]

sorry people. im clearly losing it. most of what i wrote is over exaggerated, untrue, & thoughtless. i dont know why i let these things bother me so much. ive been watching too much blackpill content i guess. yall are too kind to me. all of you make good points. thanks for talking some sense into me. it felt good to let that out & my feelings are real, but i was way too harsh. its a problem with society & a problem within myself, not something to lash out at people for. dont take me seriously, im always irritated & on edge. im basically like those abused dogs you see being rescued, when they back into a corner & attack the person helping them. i promise ill keep trying to do better.

Do not invalidate your words, I don't think any of what you wrote is unreasonable, especially when you're systematically faced with these responses, interactions, looks. Yes, we shouldn't generalize people into groups and act like everyone who belong to a group is culpable, but it is real. Your pain is real, do not apologize for your pain.

 

[N-methylamphetamine]

sorry people. im clearly losing it. most of what i wrote is over exaggerated, untrue, & thoughtless. i dont know why i let these things bother me so much. ive been watching too much blackpill content i guess. yall are too kind to me. all of you make good points. thanks for talking some sense into me. it felt good to let that out & my feelings are real, but i was way too harsh. its a problem with society & a problem within myself, not something to lash out at people for. dont take me seriously, im always irritated & on edge. im basically like those abused dogs you see being rescued, when they back into a corner & attack the person helping them. i promise ill keep trying to do better.

no your fine. It's actually nice seeing people on forums and social media apologize and be kind.