Has anyone else tried convincing a loved one to kill them and how did it go?

[Touhou]

Yah so is ctb

CTB isn't illegal, though.

 

[spooky_kxtty]

NO.

1. It would have been traumatizing and illegal for them in most countries' jurisdictions' (in some countries, suicide or having attempted suicide have been decriminalized; but assisting suicide would very much get your loved one into trouble).

IMHO, we can be "selfish" about wanting to end our lives; but we don't have the right to involve anyone else who would then suffer ramifications; legally and/or psychologically in the aftermath.

2. This should be an autonomous decision and action by our own selves, when we have exhausted all means. To inflict the pain of planning and suffering on anyone else as a result of our actions, other than to ourselves is completely unacceptable, in any case.

This is assuming the one you want to kill you didn't want to, but in my head the person that's killing me isn't doing it because they don't want too and wouldn't necessarily bring them trauma. It would be thst the person I love is so tired of seeing me suffer and to bring me to peace they bring me it in a place where I wouldn't be alone and I'd feel loved. Not to traumatize them but for them to know I'd be in a better place. I'm well aware it's illegal in most countries, but did you know there's a 50 square foot area in Yellowstone national park where it's federally lawless and is a loophole for getting away with murder. I'm not heartless, if I were to find a person who would want to kill me, I'd make sure they wouldn't be imprisoned

CTB isn't illegal, though.

It is in some parts of the world

 

[Touhou]

This is assuming the one you want to kill you didn't want to, but in my head the person that's killing me isn't doing it because they don't want too and wouldn't necessarily bring them trauma. It would be thst the person I love is so tired of seeing me suffer and to bring me to peace they bring me it in a place where I wouldn't be alone and I'd feel loved. Not to traumatize them but for them to know I'd be in a better place. I'm well aware it's illegal in most countries, but did you know there's a 50 square foot area in Yellowstone national park where it's federally lawless and is a loophole for getting away with murder. I'm not heartless, if I were to find a person who would want to kill me, I'd make sure they wouldn't be imprisoned

You're contradicting yourself here; you said earlier that you begged your best friend to do it to the point of literal tears, clearly going against your pillar of keeping things consensual. The fact that you don't possess a shred of empathy for her tells me a lot about you. Alongside this, Congress is actively working on closing the loophole in Yellowstone.

 

[spooky_kxtty]

You're contradicting yourself here; you said earlier that you begged your best friend to do it to the point of literal tears, clearly going against your pillar of keeping things consensual. The fact that you don't possess a shred of empathy for her tells me a lot about you. Alongside this, Congress is actively working on closing the loophole in Yellowstone.

No I wasn't reading their social cues well and got caught up in my desire. We're still friends to this day and haven't asked them to kill me ever since. I stopped asking because I do feel empathy.

 

[underscore]

in the 2nd grade i blankly asked my mamma 2 kill me, she sobbed ofc & told my teacher out of concern but nothing ever came from it besides lunches with the counselor....i wonder a lot if id have turned out different if id got real help sooner??

 

[jorheslen428]

Most people would not be ok with anything like that and would possibly be traumatized, not to mention the legal consequences if anyone else find out. You'd have to find a very understanding loved one, and even then I can't imagine they would ever want to do anything but help you pass peacefully.

 

[Walpurgisnacht]

Neither of you can control your connection. I think it's a beautiful thing, regardless of any pain that comes from being honest about reality.

Aw, thank you. I had thought I was maybe a bit insane for thinking it was nice. It's nice I'm not the only person that has these kinds of connections and beliefs about them.

Good luck finding a new way to live in life. I hope your connection with him can help you want to keep going. It seems like he has such deep empathy for you that life for him would be better if he could just help in any way, even if that meant life in prison.

Yeah I agree, I think that's what he sees it like. He really wanted to help me, he has as long as I've known him; but he doesn't feel like he has ever succeeded. I find this really sad honestly. Because he actually has helped me a lot, he just doesn't think it's enough... I don't think there's anything I can do to convince him that really without what he did for me I never would've experienced any amount of joy in my adult life at all.

I don't think he values his own life enough. He might only want to live for you. You're the most important thing in his life. Maybe he hasn't brought it up so as not to upset you, but I wonder if he never considered prison because he would plan his own death after yours. Does it seem like he wants anything for himself in life independently of you? More than a friendship, it's as if your souls are connected. I'm sure he fears losing that connection more than anything else.

Yeah, he doesn't value himself at all... I tried to help him, but his life is just stuck in misery, he's suffered so much from birth to now, terrible parenting and medical malpractice left him with brain damage, he's terrified of developing schizophrenia since it runs in his family almost entirely, his mother has a unknown degenerative neurological disease that he's showing early symptoms of... He doesn't even have enough will to die, though I know he wants to, and I know he'd go with me if I asked; I probably would because I'd be afraid of what would happen to him after I'm gone... It's not fair that my suffering would end and he'd be left to pick up the pieces while suffering even more.
I would respect his wishes obviously but I would at least give him the option of going with me if it comes to that.

I don't know why, but I'm kinda the only person that can get him to feel desire to do anything, but it's hard to do when I can't like physically see him. We all went on vacation together last summer, which was really fun. I want to try and organise some way we can do that again this year just to give him some enjoyment.
Other than his girlfriend (who I know very well too) I'm basically the only person he talks to, and ever since the shit economy forced them to move back to Poland they've been stuck in a single room in her parents house unable to really do anything with their lives -- and not for lack of trying. Such unfair horrible things have happened to both of them their whole lives, I am at a loss on how any of us could fix it honestly...

 

[Vizzy]

Yah so is ctb

Yes ctb is illegal in some countries but not in all countries, even if you get caught attempted suicide doesn't get you a lot of jail time, most of the countries maximum jail time is 1 year with a fine

But what you described is partner killing you by cutting your throat which will be considered as first degree murder or minimum manslaughter, your partner is going to prison for a longtime, the guilt and shame he is gonna get from your loved ones which is not worth it, for sure your partner will be in all national news front cover, YouTube and social media which will make his life living hell

So comparing ctb with partner killing you with a consent doesn't make any sense and it is selfish because it is involving a lot of people other than you!

 

[spooky_kxtty]

Yes ctb is illegal in some countries but not in all countries, even if you get caught attempted suicide doesn't get you a lot of jail time, most of the countries maximum jail time is 1 year with a fine

But what you described is partner killing you by cutting your throat which will be considered as first degree murder or minimum manslaughter, your partner is going to prison for a longtime, the guilt and shame he is gonna get from your loved ones which is not worth it, for sure your partner will be in all national news front cover, YouTube and social media which will make his life living hell

So compared ctb with partner killing you with a consent doesn't make any sense and it is selfish because it is involving a lot of people other than you!

Eh there's a 50 square mile area in Yellowstone national park that is federally lawless where you actually could get away with murder so killing someone there wouldn't ruin your life.

 

[Vizzy]

Eh there's a 50 square mile area in Yellowstone national park that is federally lawless where you actually could get away with murder so killing someone there wouldn't ruin your life.

You are really underestimating fbi, your local police department, media investigation reporters lol, whatever you say it doesn't justify that idea of partner killing you

Just a big no!

 

[spooky_kxtty]

You are really underestimating fbi, your local police department, media investigation reporters lol, whatever you say it doesn't justify that idea of partner killing you

Just a big no!

I'm not underestimating no one. It's a place called the zone of death; If you do a bit of research, there can be as much evidence of the murder as there could be but federal jurisdiction doesn't apply there so you wouldn't be imprisoned or anything of that matter. I'm actually doing a bit better now but back then if my partner agreed I would let them kill me there

 

[borderline-feline]

While I understand the appeal to some degree, it's definitely not my cup of tea. I'd rather not involve another person since I want to be forgotten.

 

[Vizzy]

I'm not underestimating no one. It's a place called the zone of death; If you do a bit of research, there can be as much evidence of the murder as there could be but federal jurisdiction doesn't apply there so you wouldn't be imprisoned or anything of that matter. I'm actually doing a bit better now but back then if my partner agreed I would let them kill me there

Not really

Can You Commit a Felony in Idaho's Portion of Yellowstone and Not Face Charges?

According to this paper, due to the wording of the Sixth Amendment, someone can commit a felony in this area and get away with it. Is this true?

slate.com

I'm not underestimating no one. It's a place called the zone of death; If you do a bit of research, there can be as much evidence of the murder as there could be but federal jurisdiction doesn't apply there so you wouldn't be imprisoned or anything of that matter. I'm actually doing a bit better now but back then if my partner agreed I would let them kill me there

No, the entire Park is in the Federal District of Wyoming even the Montana and Idaho portions of it. As far as I know it is the only US Federal District to cross from one State into another but it's not the only Federal District to cross State lines as Federal Territorial waters extend beyond State waters along the coasts and the District of Hawaii includes many islands that are not part of the State of Hawaii.
Yellowstone National Park handles it's own court cases as it has its own jail and courthouse within the park at its headquarters in Mammoth, WY. The Park is Exclusive Jurisdiction of the Federal Government meaning that Federal Officers and Courts (not State or County) are the only Authority in the Park. This means that law enforcement falls primarily to the NPS Rangers that work there and the FBI on large cases (although other Federal Agencies like the USFWS have Jurisdiction as well). If it was Concurrent Jurisdiction (like many other parks) then both the State and the Feds would have their full Jurisdiction within the park but Yellowstone is Exclusively Federal. In Yellowstone's case its Exclusive Jurisdiction is a result of the Park being older than any of the three states it is in.
One of the characteristics of United States Exclusive and Concurrent Jurisdictions is that the Feds enforce all Federal Laws on that land and also adopt all State Laws within the boundaries of the State that do not conflict with an existing Federal Law. So If you break an Idaho State law within the section of the park that is in Idaho you most likely will be contacted by a Federal Park Ranger and the Ranger will charge you with breaking an Idaho State Law as a Federal Crime. You will then be prosecuted for that crime in the Federal Court System which will start with the Courthouse in Mammoth, WY. The punishments for breaking the laws are also adopted from the State as well. So, if you murdered someone on Exclusive Federal Jurisdiction in a State where the maximum penalty is life in prison that's the maximum you could get. If the State has a Death Penalty then that's the maximum sentence you could get. The only difference is that if convicted and sentenced you'd spend your sentence in a Federal Prison instead of a State Penitentiary and all your legal proceedings would be in the Federal Court System instead of going through the State Court System.
If you could only be prosecuted by a jury within a "State" then all crimes that take place in U.S. Territories including Puerto Rico, Guam, Washington D.C., the Virgin Islands, and any Air or Sea that the U.S. Claims territory over would not be enforceable. That is clearly not the case. Federal crimes are enforced by the Federal District they occurred in and State crimes are enforced by the State they occurred in. Each Authority (State and Federal) both have Sovereignty meaning the Feds are not beholden to State boundaries for their districts and the States are not beholden to try crimes in the same Federal District they occurred in. For a Federal crime the Jury then falls to the people living in the U.S. District that it occurred in not the State. For a State crime they are tried in the State the crime occurred in not the Federal District. Many states have more than one Federal district in them and the State doesn't have to worry about if they are crossing a Federal District boundary when they try a suspect in the State Court System. Federal Districts and States may occupy the same land and share the same name but they are completely independent of each other. Examples include Federal District of Wyoming vs. State of Wyoming and the Southern, Northern, Eastern and Western Districts of New York are all Separate Federal Districts and a completely different Government from "the State of New York."
Crimes in Yellowstone will therefore be tried in the Federal District of Wyoming, not the State of Wyoming. In addition to the Federal District of Wyoming, the Federal area of Yellowstone has enough residents to make a Jury on its own .
***For the record Proprietary (State is primary Authority except for violations of Federal Law) and Partial (State and Feds decide amongst themselves which level of Government has Authority over which type of laws) are the other two types of Jurisdiction Federal land (including parks) can be in.

Courtesy to quora

I'm not underestimating no one. It's a place called the zone of death; If you do a bit of research, there can be as much evidence of the murder as there could be but federal jurisdiction doesn't apply there so you wouldn't be imprisoned or anything of that matter. I'm actually doing a bit better now but back then if my partner agreed I would let them kill me there

American justice system and the attorneys will find some way to convict you or some way to make sure you stay in prison for a longtime, I would say not to play with them lol!

 

[Mirrory Me]

 

[spooky_kxtty]

Not really

Can You Commit a Felony in Idaho's Portion of Yellowstone and Not Face Charges?

According to this paper, due to the wording of the Sixth Amendment, someone can commit a felony in this area and get away with it. Is this true?

slate.com

No, the entire Park is in the Federal District of Wyoming even the Montana and Idaho portions of it. As far as I know it is the only US Federal District to cross from one State into another but it's not the only Federal District to cross State lines as Federal Territorial waters extend beyond State waters along the coasts and the District of Hawaii includes many islands that are not part of the State of Hawaii.
Yellowstone National Park handles it's own court cases as it has its own jail and courthouse within the park at its headquarters in Mammoth, WY. The Park is Exclusive Jurisdiction of the Federal Government meaning that Federal Officers and Courts (not State or County) are the only Authority in the Park. This means that law enforcement falls primarily to the NPS Rangers that work there and the FBI on large cases (although other Federal Agencies like the USFWS have Jurisdiction as well). If it was Concurrent Jurisdiction (like many other parks) then both the State and the Feds would have their full Jurisdiction within the park but Yellowstone is Exclusively Federal. In Yellowstone's case its Exclusive Jurisdiction is a result of the Park being older than any of the three states it is in.
One of the characteristics of United States Exclusive and Concurrent Jurisdictions is that the Feds enforce all Federal Laws on that land and also adopt all State Laws within the boundaries of the State that do not conflict with an existing Federal Law. So If you break an Idaho State law within the section of the park that is in Idaho you most likely will be contacted by a Federal Park Ranger and the Ranger will charge you with breaking an Idaho State Law as a Federal Crime. You will then be prosecuted for that crime in the Federal Court System which will start with the Courthouse in Mammoth, WY. The punishments for breaking the laws are also adopted from the State as well. So, if you murdered someone on Exclusive Federal Jurisdiction in a State where the maximum penalty is life in prison that's the maximum you could get. If the State has a Death Penalty then that's the maximum sentence you could get. The only difference is that if convicted and sentenced you'd spend your sentence in a Federal Prison instead of a State Penitentiary and all your legal proceedings would be in the Federal Court System instead of going through the State Court System.
If you could only be prosecuted by a jury within a "State" then all crimes that take place in U.S. Territories including Puerto Rico, Guam, Washington D.C., the Virgin Islands, and any Air or Sea that the U.S. Claims territory over would not be enforceable. That is clearly not the case. Federal crimes are enforced by the Federal District they occurred in and State crimes are enforced by the State they occurred in. Each Authority (State and Federal) both have Sovereignty meaning the Feds are not beholden to State boundaries for their districts and the States are not beholden to try crimes in the same Federal District they occurred in. For a Federal crime the Jury then falls to the people living in the U.S. District that it occurred in not the State. For a State crime they are tried in the State the crime occurred in not the Federal District. Many states have more than one Federal district in them and the State doesn't have to worry about if they are crossing a Federal District boundary when they try a suspect in the State Court System. Federal Districts and States may occupy the same land and share the same name but they are completely independent of each other. Examples include Federal District of Wyoming vs. State of Wyoming and the Southern, Northern, Eastern and Western Districts of New York are all Separate Federal Districts and a completely different Government from "the State of New York."
Crimes in Yellowstone will therefore be tried in the Federal District of Wyoming, not the State of Wyoming. In addition to the Federal District of Wyoming, the Federal area of Yellowstone has enough residents to make a Jury on its own .
***For the record Proprietary (State is primary Authority except for violations of Federal Law) and Partial (State and Feds decide amongst themselves which level of Government has Authority over which type of laws) are the other two types of Jurisdiction Federal land (including parks) can be in.

Courtesy to quora

American justice system and the attorneys will find some way to convict you or some way to make sure you stay in prison for a longtime, I would say not to play with them lol!

Thank you for explaining this; I'm still learning about the court system and federal laws and such. If id known this before I'd probably not think of this place as an ideal place for murder

 

[Vizzy]

Thank you for explaining this; I'm still learning about the court system and federal laws and such. If id known this before I'd probably not think of this place as an ideal place for murder

You are welcome, I am not from America but I have studied a lot of complicated crime cases from America, I would say America is one country in the world that no criminals should mess with, American justice system is ready to do anything legally to convict the criminals who harm their citizens!

 

[audison]

My top fantasy of how I'd wanna die is being killed by someone I love, preferably a partner. To be killed in a beautiful forest, to have them hold me in a bed of white rose petals just to slash my throat and let my blood drip onto the petals coloring them red. I'd love it if the last thing I saw was the eyes of someone I care for; it'd bring me so much peace and would be perfect.

I've had this fantasy for about a year now and everyone who knows about it thinks I'm crazy and wants nothing to do with killing me. I begged so much for it I made my best friend cry and seeing the effect it has on them I no longer try to convince them and very rarely talk about it anymore. Knowing how much it'd hurt them I can't ask them anymore but I can still silently dream.

I get the appeal but that's a pretty fucking heavy thing to ask of somebody, especially considering the trauma and legal consequences. Also feel like anyone who would consent to that is not someone to be trusted with your livelihood, lol

 

[willitpass]

What the fuck.

 

[crimsonpool]

i understand this feeling,ive never asked because the person i fantasize about doing it doesn't actually know me lol. but even if he did i wouldn't ask because it's honestly an odd thing to ask of someone and the chance that they would actually do it is really low,not worth the risk to the relationship imo. but i do understand

 

[suicidalloser]

i've never had one of those

 

[Jolene79]

I find it hard to take threads like this seriously. You do know that this is a pro choice forum to discuss suicide as being a personal decision that can only be made by the individual. I just don't really think that murder and assault fantasises are appropriate for this site honestly, especially as the second is why a lot of people want to die. This thread is just insensitive.

I completely agree. I'm really uncomfortable reading these threads and it makes this site look really messed up. Wanting an end to suffering is what I thought most people here would be seeking. These dark violent fantasy threads are another level of seeking suffering. How can those of us desperate to escape an horrific misery possibly relate to this stuff

 

[saddestbunny]

I completely agree. I'm really uncomfortable reading these threads and it makes this site look really messed up. Wanting an end to suffering is what I thought most people here would be seeking. These dark violent fantasy threads are another level of seeking suffering. How can those of us desperate to escape an horrific misery possibly relate to this stuff

unsure why U bumped this if U dislike it this much but yeah - I can see where op was coming from though. they don't necessarily know if they have the strength to do it themselves / fantasize about someone "safer" helping them find peace or whatever. sounds messed but I see the base ideal, doesn't mean appropriate for this site so I agree with u

 

[Jolene79]

unsure why U bumped this if U dislike it this much but yeah - I can see where op was coming from though. they don't necessarily know if they have the strength to do it themselves / fantasize about someone "safer" helping them find peace or whatever. sounds messed but I see the base ideal, doesn't mean appropriate for this site so I agree with u

Having someone do it for you- I understand that for sure. I even spoke with a close loved one asking if we could discuss all possible options to painlessly end it. I'm struggling with the violence fantasy element. There have been a few on here and it's so dark. I don't want to feel any darker than I do over this situation. Yet I appreciate everyone's having their own issues on here

 

[vitbar]

No, but I was asked before.

 

[way_of_meatgrinder]

I would never want loved one to see it, forget about participation in actual process. I can see it as a fantasy, but in reality it would be very traumatizing for them... Grim stuff.

 

[Chara]

Would but don't have anyone in real life who cared about Chara so it would be pointless to try. Don't want to die from someone trying to commit a cruel act if that makes sense?

 

[Pg.964]

My brother begged me to kill him a few years ago. I responded with annoyance. It's unfair that he would get to die while I get arrested and deal with the trauma that that would cause me and his family. But I also completely understand his desperation, I feel the same.

 

[WonderingSoul]

I've never asked any of my loved ones, but if they did the favor, I really wouldn't mind at all.