Discussion God will send you to hell?

[lopsidedcrawdad1]

So

God cannot contradict reason because he IS REASON. He did not create reason, so he can't change it. All-powerful does not mean he can do literally anything you want. God cannot create a married bachelor, because it is a contradiction in terms. He cannot create liquid solids for the same reason.

He is all powerful because he is the creator of the universe and rules over everything inside of it. He has complete control and is able to perform miracles that go against the laws of physics. He cannot perform miracles that go against the laws of mathematics and logic because he did not create those. I feel like this is a simple concept.

He created a world with suffering so we could experience real Joy. If you are anti-joy, then you should retrace your steps to find out where your philosophy went so sideways. Most people, happy or not, would prefer joy over mind-numbing heroin addiction.

what do you think the word "all" means?

 

[Holu]

If god exists, then happiness is only relative because he chose to make it that way. Again, very simple concept.

Spoiler: Anti Religious Warning

Ive seen people talk about how "god is the only true good" and "all powerful" despite the fact that he allows such suffering to exist. Many would argue that by giving us free will, it's our fault that we cause suffering, but it's hard to imagine than an "all knowing" diety wouldn't foresee this. If a god exists he enjoys watching us suffer. If there is a god he condemned his own child to suffer. If there is a god he allowed his followers to enslave, rape, pillage, and murder, all to increase his following. In the 1 in a googolplex chance that god is real, I'll gladly go to hell before I worship a tyrant who heralds himself as a saint

 

[lopsidedcrawdad1]

God cannot contradict reason because he IS REASON. He did not create reason, so he can't change it. All-powerful does not mean he can do literally anything you want. God cannot create a married bachelor, because it is a contradiction in terms. He cannot create liquid solids for the same reason.

He is all powerful because he is the creator of the universe and rules over everything inside of it. He has complete control and is able to perform miracles that go against the laws of physics. He cannot perform miracles that go against the laws of mathematics and logic because he did not create those. I feel like this is a simple concept.

He created a world with suffering so we could experience real Joy. If you are anti-joy, then you should retrace your steps to find out where your philosophy went so sideways. Most people, happy or not, would prefer joy over mind-numbing heroin addiction.

all-pow·er·ful
/ˌôlˈpouərfəl/

adjective

1. having complete power; almighty.
   "an all-powerful dictator"
   
   
   
   

all-pow·er·ful
/ˌôlˈpouərfəl/

adjective

1. having complete power; almighty.
   "an all-powerful dictator"
   
   
   
   

Key word there is "complete"… if theres ANYTHING that god cant do, then hes not all powerful… this is beyond simple

Spoiler: Anti Religious Warning

Ive seen people talk about how "god is the only true good" and "all powerful" despite the fact that he allows such suffering to exist. Many would argue that by giving us free will, it's our fault that we cause suffering, but it's hard to imagine than an "all knowing" diety wouldn't foresee this. If a god exists he enjoys watching us suffer. If there is a god he condemned his own child to suffer. If there is a god he allowed his followers to enslave, rape, pillage, and murder, all to increase his following. In the 1 in a googolplex chance that god is real, I'll gladly go to hell before I worship a tyrant who heralds himself as a saint

To be honest I think the odds of there being a god are probably greater than 1 in googleplex haha but if there is one, its certainly a piece of shit god thats not worthy of worship or praise.

 

[obligatoryshackles]

It's pretty funny to say that a world without suffering can't be good considering Adam and Eve were originally meant to live in literal paradise with no suffering forever.

Within a biblical framework, I will also say this - Adam and Eve gave up eternity in paradise for the ability to know good and evil so I will damn well use that ability to tell you that God, at least according to scripture, is comically evil.

Whether or not the biblical God is representative of the real God, I will not comment. Since this post is fundamentally about the experience of living in a world dictated by people who claim the bible is the ultimate authority on reality, any argument outside of that should be largely irrelevant.

 

[Unattainable666]

Hallo. I appreciate your words, and naturally there is going to be a difference of beliefs. I apologize and should have spoilered off the post. I do not mean to offend anyone regardless of religion. I'm atheist, but I'm not gonna press anyone for their religion.

Holu - you have no reason to apologize. If someone asks question like that then they need to realize that theyre going to push buttons. Besides whoever that is has only been on her since today!

 

[Holu]

Holu - you have no reason to apologize. If someone asks question like that then they need to realize that theyre going to push buttons. Besides whoever that is has only been on her since today!

i feel I do need to apologize. I was one of the people who initially argue with huntfish about religion, but I knew to some degree it was hurting him so I stopped. Sure they are kinda asking for a response, but I just want to mitigate the overall suffering I cause.

 

[John Ryder]

God cannot contradict reason because he IS REASON. He did not create reason, so he can't change it. All-powerful does not mean he can do literally anything you want. God cannot create a married bachelor, because it is a contradiction in terms. He cannot create liquid solids for the same reason.

He is all powerful because he is the creator of the universe and rules over everything inside of it. He has complete control and is able to perform miracles that go against the laws of physics. He cannot perform miracles that go against the laws of mathematics and logic because he did not create those. I feel like this is a simple concept.

He created a world with suffering so we could experience real Joy. If you are anti-joy, then you should retrace your steps to find out where your philosophy went so sideways. Most people, happy or not, would prefer joy over mind-numbing heroin addiction.

San Miguel? I used to frequent a phenomenonal family owned Mexican restaurant named that. Thank you, ye of the newly banned acct, for stirring the memory

 

[Holu]

San Miguel? I used to frequent a phenomenonal family owned Mexican restaurant named that. Thank you, ye of the newly banned acct, for stirring the memory

Actual Mexican food sounds really good rn

 

[Unattainable666]

i feel I do need to apologize. I was one of the people who initially argue with huntfish about religion, but I knew to some degree it was hurting him so I stopped. Sure they are kinda asking for a response, but I just want to mitigate the overall suffering I cause.

You are a kind and wonderful human being.

 

[Holu]

Also wtf did bro bro actually get banned that's hilarious. Man did not last a day lol.

 

[John Ryder]

Actual Mexican food sounds really good rn

When does it not? Best cuisine on earth imo

 

[Holu]

I'm so confused why did three people get axed lmao. Is there some way besides not dying or getting banned to get your name crossed out?

Edit: I'm dumb didn't realize it was an old forum. RIP to those who are now deceased. Sorry for disturbing.

 

[Kerrtu]

When does it not? Best cuisine on earth imo

I fucking love Mexican food. There was a restaurant called Casa Lupita, and the building was like a mansion, white stucco and the barrel style roofing. It was on a hill directly across from a Toys R Us. Whenever we went to Toys R Us, my sister and I would look longingly at Casa Lupita.

One particular night, our father was driving drunk with us in the car, you know - as most parents do (smfh), and he almost flipped the car over when he drove into the very firmly planted stop sign. This was the stop sign before turning into the parking lot for Toys R Us.

Sigh.

When I was living with my high school best friend, we got on the topic of Casa Lupita, and I was saying how I always had wanted to go there, etc. and friend casually drops that every year for her birthday, her parents took her to Casa Lupita.

I'm still not recovered.

 

[Deleted member 65988]

You'd think belivers would be able to see the issues of defining their God as "all-powerful" or "all-knowing", I mean how is a fallible human being even able to quantify what all-powerful even is.

 

[Holu]

I fucking love Mexican food. There was a restaurant called Casa Lupita, and the building was like a mansion, white stucco and the barrel style roofing. It was on a hill directly across from a Toys R Us. Whenever we went to Toys R Us, my sister and I would look longingly at Casa Lupita.

One particular night, our father was driving drunk with us in the car, you know - as most parents do (smfh), and he almost flipped the car over when he drove into the very firmly planted stop sign. This was the stop sign before turning into the parking lot for Toys R Us.

Sigh.

When I was living with my high school best friend, we got on the topic of Casa Lupita, and I was saying how I always had wanted to go there, etc. and friend casually drops that every year for her birthday, her parents took her to Casa Lupita.

I'm still not recovered.

This is reminding me of the South Park episode where cartman wants to go to Casa Bonita.

 

[Doz]

I really hope Christianity and the bible and all that bullshit is wrong because you can live your life and be the best possible version of yourself, but if you weren't christian and didn't accept god into your heart and all that you go to hell. The good will suffer despite everything they've done all because they had no reason to believe the invisible man in the clouds exists or perhaps never gave it any thought. If god really exists then existence itself was a cruel mistake where you are rewarded for being a brainwashed zealot and punished for free-thinking.

 

[Kerrtu]

This is reminding me of the South Park episode where cartman wants to go to Casa Bonita.

I haven't felt real hunger in quite a while but this talk of Mexican food has me officially hangry.

The Casa Lupita of my childhood is no longer there - the building…that beautiful building was torn down and now it's an insurance company HQ.

 

[Huggs]

There is no conceivable way, at least to me, that a loving god would have created or rule over this reality. That becomes clear when you're aware of just how deeply and how long some creature or person is able to suffer here. Maybe an evil or indifferent one.

 

[Holu]

I haven't felt real hunger in quite a while but this talk of Mexican food has me officially hangry.

The Casa Lupita of my childhood is no longer there - the building…that beautiful building was torn down and now it's an insurance company HQ.

Sadge. Basically every Mexican place in my area got clapped by covid. Really disappointing.

 

[John Ryder]

One particular night, our father was driving drunk with us in the car, you know - as most parents do (smfh), and he almost flipped the car over when he drove into the very firmly planted stop sign.

Trauma? Hah. I defy anyone who thinks they've stared trauma in the face to read this harrowing account and not walk away understanding their "problems" are ants in the sun. This is trauma. Also this part cracked me up, ngl. I can tell that place was delicious just off the description. Barrel roofing is a wrap. RIP Casa Lupita

 

[Holu]

There is no conceivable way, at least to me, that a loving god would have created or rule over this reality. That becomes clear when you're aware of just how deeply and how long some creature or person is able to suffer here. Maybe an evil or indifferent one.

I usually like this perspective more. I'd sooner believe in Zeus, the crazy rapist who threw thunder at farmers for fun and was incredibly vain over a god who preaches himself as selflessly good

 

[John Ryder]

Zeus, the crazy rapist

This doesn't get enough traction, people too distracted by the shiny object of lightning bolts

 

[Kerrtu]

The Mexican food aspect of this thread aside, I'm taking a moment to remember the mighty philosopher George Carlin and his thoughts regarding being sent to hell…

 

[Huggs]

The Mexican food aspect of this thread aside, I'm taking a moment to remember the mighty philosopher George Carlin and his thoughts regarding being sent to hell…

He loves you and he NEEDS MONEY!
God bless George Carlin.

 

[EndJstifiesTheMeans]

I prefer an antichrist like my pfp who try to free the world from every type of suffering but commiting involuntary mistakes, than a God that didn't do nothing for free the world from suffering

 

[John Ryder]

The Mexican food aspect of this thread aside, I'm taking a moment to remember the mighty philosopher George Carlin and his thoughts regarding being sent to hell…

Carlin was so gangster. Ever see this CK bit? Sorry it's a fucking tik tok link but all youtube clips of this special are blocked

 

[brokeandbroken]

According to most Christians, of course God will send you to hell for committing suicide.

But not just that, you aren't saved if you're depressed according to them. Now submitting to God out of fear is a no no to, to save your ass. Because you need to "love" God with all your heart.

And God wants a "loving" relationship. You go to hell too if you worship God out of fear basically.

But if you try to love God, and try to be happy big fail, you aren't saved either they say.

You need to be cheery, happy, grateful, obidient, never angry, etc.

That's a sign of bering saved they say. Now they say Christians aren't perfect, but at the same time they say forgiveness isn't a license to sin, and "true" Christians behave a certain way.

Salvation has no conditions, but at the same time it does have many many conditions.

Also if you have any sexual desires outside of marriage you aren't saved either basically. Oh and in marriage only missionary sex is acceptable of course.

Also many protestant Christians atleast online said to me if I just turn to God, submit to him fully, everything will become fine in my life. And I will be "cured".

Seems to me you can never win with their version of God right? So many conditions.

But somehow they themselves present themselves as holy little angels.

And I'm the horrible wicked sinner.

Yeah I think you are taking two things and conflating them. First it is true some Christians in my mind falsely contend it is an unforgiveable sin. I disagree if you believe in God/Jesus, etc... And you commit suicide I believe you will still go to heaven. Is it a sin. Yes. What's sin. It means you missed the standard of good God has set forth. Everyone has already missed it. It says in the bible God isn't keeping track of your sins. They are all the same. Does this mean we should all engage in a Jonestownian mass suicide to all go to heaven. No. But if you are struggling with mental health it doesn't seem to me God is going to banish you from his presence for all of eternity. To me I don't think God is going to say to one that is suffering. "You thought you were in hell? No, welcome to hell!". Jesus himself suffered. He knows what it is like. So no I don't think one is automatically going to hell for suicide.

 

[Kerrtu]

Carlin was so gangster. Ever see this CK bit? Sorry it's a fucking tik tok link but all youtube clips of this special are blocked

Louis C.K. "I wasn't there, I don't know…"

I hadn't seen this clip before or heard the this fig tree story but I'm

I was raised as a Jehovah's Witness which was…interesting. Frightening. Confusing. All the Armageddon talk made me especially afraid of Jehovah. I can vividly remember asking my mother why our neighbors would die in Armageddon - I was a kid and in my mind I didn't understand why everyone on the block would be wiped out.

Anyhow, the fig tree story definitely wasn't told at the Kingdom Hall we went to

P.S. Carlin was so great. I love the interview
with Charlie Rose where he's rooting for the comet ☄

(the comet emoji reminds me more of an escaped, flaming meatball )

 

[John Ryder]

Louis C.K. "I wasn't there, I don't know…"

I hadn't seen this clip before or heard the this fig tree story but I'm

I was raised as a Jehovah's Witness which was…interesting. Frightening. Confusing. All the Armageddon talk made me especially afraid of Jehovah. I can vividly remember asking my mother why our neighbors would die in Armageddon - I was a kid and in my mind I didn't understand why everyone on the block would be wiped out.

Anyhow, the fig tree story definitely wasn't told at the Kingdom Hall we went to

P.S. Carlin was so great. I love the interview
with Charlie Rose where he's rooting for the comet ☄

(the comet emoji reminds me more of an escaped, flaming meatball )

It's from his latest, At the Dolby. Yeah Jehovah, that must've been wild. "I've seen some shit". I came up Methodist, much more vanilla. Had doubts from a young age, and the rents to their credit didn't really try to force it on me once I left the house. Which rebukes the idea every Christian household is a fanatical coven that will wholesale disown you if you so much as question shit, though that clearly exists

 

[Holu]

This doesn't get enough traction, people too distracted by the shiny object of lightning bolts

Fr they focused on the wrong kinda rods that man was throwing out. (In all serious Zeus is a disgusting POS)

I was raised as a Jehovah's Witness

Plz don't knock on my door I'm anti social and don't want to talk >:(.

Also, I'm sorry for whatever trauma a religious family pushed into you. Idk if ur still a practicing Jehovah's Witness, but regardless I want to say that parents really should do everything in their power to not force religion on their kids, especially one with tales of Armageddon.