Method Exit bag and inert gas megathread

[KevG]

Has anyone had success with purchasing a full tank of nitrogen on line? Can't find it anywhere but I know some of you have stated you were able to buy on line. It seems that this method with nitrogen is well known and concerned a welding supply store would ask questions. I see I can purchase empty tanks on line. Would it be better to buy an empty tank and take it to a welding supply store? Perhaps the would not ask questions if I have a tank to exchange?? I'm in the US.

 

[Vizzy]

@GasMonkey which connector I need to connect cga 580 to the scba kit?

 

[GasMonkey]

What's the connector of your SCBA regulator? DIN#13 (G5/8")?

 

[Vizzy]

What's the connector of your SCBA regulator? DIN#13 (G5/8")?

Yes scba connector is g5/8

 

[Das Nichts]

Yes scba connector is g5/8

Wtf is this glas cabinet ? Can you pick on freely ?

Looks like these Dräger PSS90 which have a metal ring behind the plastic screw so the adapter might not fit.

 

[anonaon]

Has anyone had success with purchasing a full tank of nitrogen on line? Can't find it anywhere but I know some of you have stated you were able to buy on line. It seems that this method with nitrogen is well known and concerned a welding supply store would ask questions. I see I can purchase empty tanks on line. Would it be better to buy an empty tank and take it to a welding supply store? Perhaps the would not ask questions if I have a tank to exchange?? I'm in the US.

I've found plenty of sources that sell full tanks in the US. You're just not looking hard enough (even a quick Google search shows results). Feel free to pm if youre still having trouble finding one

 

[Vizzy]

Wtf is this glas cabinet ? Can you pick on freely ?

Looks like these Dräger PSS90 which have a metal ring behind the plastic screw so the adapter might not fit.

It's Chinese supplier, they just display like that lol

 

[GasMonkey]

@GasMonkey which connector I need to connect cga 580 to the scba kit?
Yes scba connector is g5/8

escMode was the only supplier of real solid 1-piece DIN#13 to CGA-580 adapters. There are some SCUBA shops that have lesser quality adapters that use 2 adapters together.​

 

[Das Nichts]

It's Chinese supplier, they just display like that lol

Isn't your method eebd ? Cause this stuff is for SCUBA/SBCA.

 

[Vizzy]

escMode was the only supplier of real solid 1-piece DIN#13 to CGA-580 adapters. There are some SCUBA shops that have lesser quality adapters that use 2 adapters together.​

This Chinese supplier say he can make for me and he ask how many I want lol

I just want one but I can't say it lol

Isn't your method eebd ? Cause this stuff is for SCUBA/SBCA.

Yes I am just trying to create scba setup if possible

 

[simplymiserable]

How does the demand valve work? If I open the cylinder does the regulator restrict air flow until the mask demands oxygen?

 

[Vizzy]

escMode was the only supplier of real solid 1-piece DIN#13 to CGA-580 adapters. There are some SCUBA shops that have lesser quality adapters that use 2 adapters together.​

I can get everything, only that adapter is missing, it is rare than finding N lol

 

[GasMonkey]

I just want one but I can't say it lol

If they are from Alibaba, it's possible that they won't sell to you when they realize that you are an individual/end-user instead of a business, that happened to @steve_s5 when trying to buy regs/demand valves there.​

How does the demand valve work? If I open the cylinder does the regulator restrict air flow until the mask demands oxygen?

In the case of SCBA it maintains a positive pressure (some millibars over ambient) inside the mask, so when you inhale the demand valve detects the decrease in pressure and pumps gas to maintain the positive pressure. The goal of this mechanism is to create a perfect seal so it's impossible for any external gas to enter the mask, any hypothetical airtightness defects of the mask are covered by the demand valve by increasing the pressure.

In the case of SCUBA it pumps gas when the negative pressure created by inhalation is detected (lacks any positive pressure protection).​

 

[simplymiserable]

If they are from Alibaba, it's possible that they won't sell to you when they realize that you are an individual/end-user instead of a business, that happened to @steve_s5 when trying to buy regs/demand valves there.


In the case of SCBA it maintains a positive pressure (some millibars over ambient) inside the mask, so when you inhale the demand valve detects the decrease in pressure and pumps gas to maintain the positive pressure. The goal of this mechanism is to create a perfect seal so it's impossible for any external gas to enter the mask, any hypothetical airtightness defects of the mask are covered by the demand valve by increasing the pressure.

In the case of SCUBA it pumps gas when the negative pressure created by inhalation is detected (lacks any positive pressure protection).​

So it's safe to open the cylinder valve once everything is connected?

 

[Vizzy]

If they are from Alibaba, it's possible that they won't sell to you when they realize that you are an individual/end-user instead of a business, that happened to @steve_s5 when trying to buy regs/demand valves there.


In the case of SCBA it maintains a positive pressure (some millibars over ambient) inside the mask, so when you inhale the demand valve detects the decrease in pressure and pumps gas to maintain the positive pressure. The goal of this mechanism is to create a perfect seal so it's impossible for any external gas to enter the mask, any hypothetical airtightness defects of the mask are covered by the demand valve by increasing the pressure.

In the case of SCUBA it pumps gas when the negative pressure created by inhalation is detected (lacks any positive pressure protection).​

They selling to Thailand because Thailand and China have trade agreement so even if you are a individual buyer Chinese supplier will sell it to you, if you are in Thailand

They will take care of everything including customs

 

[GasMonkey]

So it's safe to open the cylinder valve once everything is connected?

If the demand valve is closed (red button) yeah.

 

[Das Nichts]

So it's safe to open the cylinder valve once everything is connected?

Open it gently at first to see if the adapter Is screwed on enough. It here is no leakage turn it down.
Connect the LDV to the regulator and make sure the ldv is closed! (Push the reset button)

After that you can turn on the gas valve fully, the manometer on the regulator should show you how much
pressure is in your bottle.

 

[Vizzy]

@GasMonkey

Can I connect it with two separate adapter

First connector cylinder cga 580 to g 5/8 then another connector from g 5/8 to the scba

 

[GasMonkey]

@Vizzy wtf is this shit that every post you do here you also send me a copy of it via PM? lol

 

[Das Nichts]

@Vizzy wtf is this shit that every post you do here you also send me a copy of it via PM? lol

Lucky you it doesn't support read markers ✓

 

[Vizzy]

@Vizzy wtf is this shit that every post you do here you also send me a copy of it via PM? lol

Lucky you it doesn't support read markers ✓

Good to see you both had good laugh at my expense, I am just desperate guys as I don't have time, I have to plan this asap anyway I didn't get answer for my question, I guess I have to figure out myself!

 

[Das Nichts]

Good to see you both had good laugh at my expense, I am just desperate guys as I don't have time, I have to plan this asap anyway I didn't get answer for my question, I guess I have to figure out myself!

I didn't mean to offend You. Sorry If this was inappropriate.

As for your question: if there is no direct connection available you will have to go with multiple adapters.

@GasMonkey

Can I connect it with two separate adapter

First connector cylinder cga 580 to g 5/8 then another connector from g 5/8 to the scba

Did you take the second picture yourself ?

 

[Vizzy]

I didn't mean to offend You. Sorry If this was inappropriate.

As for your question: if there is no direct connection available you will have to go with multiple adapters.

Did you take the second picture yourself ?

No direct connection for cga 580, that's the problem

second picture is taken by the supplier because scba is an expensive purchase, I don't wanna buy without the right adapters

 

[GasMonkey]

I already linked you 8 days ago in the PM an adapter from a SCUBA shop that uses 2 adapters to form the DIN#13-to-CGA580.


Btw I don't like this stuff of stacking adapters, not like it's unviable (fister did it) but it decreases the quality of the setup, is not a good idea to stack adapters while working with such high pressures. In regions where the air-to-nitrogen adapter is not available I'd go for an EEBD setup.

 

[Vizzy]

I already linked you 8 days ago in the PM an adapter from a SCUBA shop that uses 2 adapters to form the DIN#13-to-CGA580.
View attachment 112079

Btw I don't like this stuff of stacking adapters, not like it's unviable (fister did it) but it decreases the quality of the setup, is not a good idea to stack adapters while working with such high pressures. In regions where the air-to-nitrogen adapter is not available I'd go for an EEBD setup.

This website ship only to Europe, yes I am looking into eebd setup too

 

[readytogo28]

I'm talking with a guy who is testing an implementation of the SCBA setup with an industrial Nitrogen regulator and it seems like the regulator is not sensitive enough to maintain the proper pressure for the demand valve, so I don't recommend trying to implement that type of setup anymore.

They way to go is using full SCBA equipment and connect it to the Nitrogen cylinder using an air-to-nitrogen adapter (like my setup) or with the EM SCBA which uses a Nitrogen medical regulator that connects natively to the cylinder (like Bengal's or imcadt99's setups).​

I want to do this but I'm so fucking stupid, I can't follow simple instructions. I need a su partner

I want to do this but I'm so fucking stupid, I can't follow simple instructions. I need a su partner

would you be willing to help me with it

Exit Bag and Inert Gas Basics —A very, very long post, I know, but I feel like I've fielded a lot of questions about this, so I figured I'd spell out everything I know. Others on the forum should please add to this thread whatever reliable technical information they feel is appropriate for someone attempting this method to have.

The idea behind using an exit bag with inert gas is to create an atmosphere around your head that is both free of life-sustaining O2 and can carry away the exhaled CO2 that would activate your hypercapnic alarm.

The Gas:

You will need to keep the inert gas flowing at 15 liters per minute (Lpm) for 40 minutes to be confident of ending your life —in other words, you'll need a minimum of 600 liters of inert gas. In the past this would have been helium (He), but due to the uncertain availability of genuinely pure He, the best current options are nitrogen (N2) and argon (Ar). Both are reliably available in pure form (no air contamination) from stores that supply welders. N2 is also available from some brewery supply houses, but the purity of the gas should be confirmed to your satisfaction. Both N2 and Ar should work to ctb and are similar enough in their properties to be treated identically for use with an exit bag.

Pressurized gas cylinder sizes are not standardized across the industry, nor internationally, and it can be difficult, if not impossible, to tell how much gas they contain from a photograph on a website.

In the US, a 20 cubic foot (cf) cylinder is the smallest you should use for ctb; a 40cf will allow some margin for flinching, practicing, etc. "A 20cf" and "a 40cf", or "a 20" and "a 40" is nomenclature US welding supply houses will recognize, so asking for either should get you the desired product. A 20cf cylinder is quite small for industrial use; I've had clerks tell me, "well, we have a 40, but we'll need to special order a 20." It's up to you what you do in that situation. Personally, I have a 40cf cylinder. It has allowed me to flinch and abort my attempt three times now, and I don't need to worry about refilling it. I bought my N2 at AirGas, a national company here in the US. They do not demand any sort of professional certification for purchasing inert gas, and no more than the usual forms of ID depending on payment method.

I know nothing of gas cylinders outside the US, so if you are using other than US-typical cylinders, you'll need to call and ask to make sure whatever tank you're contemplating holds 600L of compressed gas. Hopefully knowledgeable forum members will add cylinder sizing information to this knowledge base.

Cover story: N2 and Ar are both used for welding. N2 is used in beer brewing. In my day job, I use both N2 and Ar to flood partial cans of expensive paint, to displace the O2 in the cans and prevent the paint from skinning over and going bad. It's a cost saving measure. The clerks I've bought gas from have never heard of that trick, which has meant they don't know enough to interrogate me on my motives or to try and quiz me on my welding knowledge. They have merely said, "huh! That's a new one!"

The store clerk may ask how you're carrying the pressurized cylinder "back to your shop," since pressurized cylinders can be very hazardous to transport (the valve is vulnerable to damage in an accident). I haven't had any trouble when I have told the clerk, "in the back footwell of my car, and very carefully padded!" What they really want to know is that you are aware that a pressurized cylinder is a missile waiting to explode if anything damages it, and that you know enough to not let that happen.

I wish my brain wasn't so fucked up and I can follow these instructions. Ever since I was a teenager I've had suicidal thoughts. Just the past year they became intense to where im 100 percent sure I want to go through with it. I just don't know how. I have no means to a gun and my brain is too fried to do anything that needs preparation. Even hanging myself I don't know where I would hang the other side of the rope and I feel like I'll put the rope in the wrong spot on my neck and not even succeed

 

[GasMonkey]

I discovered the other day a SCBA regulator that looks similar to an "industrial" Nitrogen regulator:



Maybe the setup with a Nitrogen regulator is possible if the regulator has enough quality and a low output pressure range, like this one that has a 0-10bar output (demand valves work at ~7.25bar):


This one would be even better coz it's dual-stage:


You should experiment with this @Das Nichts.

This stuff is interesting for regions where there is no air-to-nitrogen adapter to use a native SCBA regulator, but it is more simple to just get an EEBD hood and connect it to a Nitrogen regulator with a flow meter.

 

[anonaon]

I want to do this but I'm so fucking stupid, I can't follow simple instructions. I need a su partner

Hey man, take it easy on yourself. Executing a peaceful death is pretty difficult to accomplish. This method seems complicated at first but its actually pretty straightforward. On the 'resources' mega-thread, there are videos that have step-by-step instructions on how to CTB using this method by Phillip Nitschke & Derek Humphrey - the pioneers of this method. Be patient & good luck

* Keep in mind that the Party time helium tanks shown in those videos are no longer viable since manufacturers filled it 20% air, which is why most opt for nitrogen instead

 

[Das Nichts]

This one would be even better coz it's dual-stage:

Holy fuck this reg is a beast

 

[readytogo28]

Thank you for the acknowledgement. It's it's overwhelming having A.D.D and reading all these instructions, all the things I need to buy, all the things that can go wrong. I literally look things up for hours on methods that might work for me and I keep coming up empty. I'm having trouble locating the link that says resources for the step by step instructions. Could it be under something else?