Why is life even a thing?

[LetMeGoPlease]

Odd thing to aks but I've always stood out in how I think. I just don't understand the point of existence, of life. Of the entire universe. Who does this serve? Why are electrons and protons and neutrons a thing? Where did they come from? Why did they organize into such a versatile life? And why do we have the drive to evolve? Where are we going to? It just all doesn't make sense. And why all the suffering? If we're just a coincidence then suffering doesn't make sense, we're slaves to those alive who profit(ed) off of us. If it's not a coincidence, then our suffering isn't a coincidence, that means someone or something that is bigger than us is profiting off of our suffering. I don't know which scenario is worse.
Anyway I just wanted to express this, I feel really lonely with these thoughts. How can people just be born and be like oh well I guess I should just live this life now that I'm here. Without ever questioning what the fuck is going on. I am so confused. I'm not even trying to be philosophical, I literally don't understand how all this material and space happened.

 

[usernameforhere]

Ok so you kinda just got interested philosophy. Mostly metaphysics and ontology so far.

the short answer is no one knows. The long answer is do you really expect me to believe we're on a wet rock spinning at least three different ways around a fission reaction in an intimate vaccum? I'll leave my personal disbelief out of it.

Philosophy is interesting. It's also circular. From where you are now you might get drawn to existentialism... who knows. Existentialism has some useful thoughts... life is about making your own meaning. This makes sense to me. you wake up on day with a doctor slapping your ass, there's little guidanc, a million contradictions and here's these people saying make your own meaning.

Making your own meaning can be dangerous. Sometimes it leads people down a path of hedonism, that rarely seems to serve people well. I'd ask this question though, what if you start asking yourself questions? What if you learn out your interests and motivations, look for the best way to serve your higher self and use that to inform your activities and decision? That might make someone fulfilled.

 

[WornOutLife]

I don't understand the point either.

How can something come from nothing? Why did we and the universe have to exist in first place?

Eternal nothingness sounds cool but I think there's something more waiting for us because otherwise, existing would make no sense.

I just want an answer. Even if they told me I'm just and NPC programmed by a freak in the "real world" and my life is worth nothing, I would still be happy because I'd know the truth at least.

 

[demuic]

Odd thing to aks but I've always stood out in how I think. I just don't understand the point of existence, of life. Of the entire universe. Who does this serve? Why are electrons and protons and neutrons a thing? Where did they come from? Why did they organize into such a versatile life? And why do we have the drive to evolve? Where are we going to? It just all doesn't make sense. And why all the suffering? If we're just a coincidence then suffering doesn't make sense, we're slaves to those alive who profit(ed) off of us. If it's not a coincidence, then our suffering isn't a coincidence, that means someone or something that is bigger than us is profiting off of our suffering. I don't know which scenario is worse.
Anyway I just wanted to express this, I feel really lonely with these thoughts. How can people just be born and be like oh well I guess I should just live this life now that I'm here. Without ever questioning what the fuck is going on. I am so confused. I'm not even trying to be philosophical, I literally don't understand how all this material and space happened.

The fact that it's all a coincidence is kind of what makes suffering "make sense" to me. There's no grand purpose, no grand plan. It just happened. If it wasn't you, it could've been anyone else. In a way we're all unlucky like that.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

Ok so you kinda just got interested philosophy. Mostly metaphysics and ontology so far.

the short answer is no one knows. The long answer is do you really expect me to believe we're on a wet rock spinning at least three different ways around a fission reaction in an intimate vaccum? I'll leave my personal disbelief out of it.

Philosophy is interesting. It's also circular. From where you are now you might get drawn to existentialism... who knows. Existentialism has some useful thoughts... life is about making your own meaning. This makes sense to me. you wake up on day with a doctor slapping your ass, there's little guidanc, a million contradictions and here's these people saying make your own meaning.

Making your own meaning can be dangerous. Sometimes it leads people down a path of hedonism, that rarely seems to serve people well. I'd ask this question though, what if you start asking yourself questions? What if you learn out your interests and motivations, look for the best way to serve your higher self and use that to inform your activities and decision? That might make someone fulfilled.

Damn this is more chaotic than my mind.

I don't understand the point either.

How can something come from nothing? Why did we and the universe have to exist in first place?

Eternal nothingness sounds cool but I think there's something more waiting for us because otherwise, existing would make no sense.

I just want an answer. Even if they told me I'm just and NPC programmed by a freak in the "real world" and my life is worth nothing, I would still be happy because I'd know the truth at least.

That scenario only leads to furher questions though

The fact that it's all a coincidence is kind of what makes suffering "make sense" to me. There's no grand purpose, no grand plan. It just happened. If it wasn't you, it could've been anyone else. In a way we're all unlucky like that.

I wish it wasn't possible to poke so many holes into that fact.

 

[Superdeterminist]

I'm wondering about that as well 24/7. I listen to a lot of conversations with religious people and many of them have a tendency to try and justify the cruelties of life, attributing them to a divine plan which we can't know about because it's too grand for us to comprehend, and/or we aren't entitled to know because we're just worms (that kind of energy). It's amazing to me that some people's minds work like this, neurodiversity is very real.

 

[watchingthewheels]

"Why are we here?" /
Because we're here/
Roll the bones/
"Why does it happen?"/
Because it happens/
Roll the Bones/"

 

[GenesAndEnvironment]

Purpose and meaning do not exist in the real world, they are made up by the human mind (in the same way that God, spirits, new age things, etc, are). Asking "why?" in the first place sets us up for failure.

 

[popcorn]

just for bants i recon

 

[Aloken]

In my opinion, there's no point. There's no purpose. At least there's not a "higher" purpose. We live this physical life for the experience of it. And that is all. There's no higher point in suffering nor happiness. It just doesn't matter. There's no right or wrong, no good or bad. There's no justice or injustice. Only if you believe there is. What you believe you get.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

I'm wondering about that as well 24/7. I listen to a lot of conversations with religious people and many of them have a tendency to try and justify the cruelties of life, attributing them to a divine plan which we can't know about because it's too grand for us to comprehend, and/or we aren't entitled to know because we're just worms (that kind of energy). It's amazing to me that some people's minds work like this, neurodiversity is very real.

True, neurodiversity is extremely real. What you're talking about sounds pretty manipulative though, like religion usually is.

Purpose and meaning do not exist in the real world, they are made up by the human mind (in the same way that God, spirits, new age things, etc, are). Asking "why?" in the first place sets us up for failure.

Okay then scratch the why. Why is too philosophical I guess. The better question is "How?" How is this all real? Also because a question doesn't have an answer doesn't mean the question isn't legitimate.

 

[RainAndSadness]

If certain chemical, physical and biological parameters are fulfilled, life simply happens, on a very primitive and simple level. And in some cases, due to evolution, it develops into complex intelligent beings that are capable of overthinking their own silly existence - aka us.

 

[AnnonyBox]

Vast universe, it had to happen somewhere, statistically speaking. There really is no point to it.

 

[killedbypsychiatry]

Who does this serve? Why are electrons and protons and neutrons a thing? Where did they come from? Why did they organize into such a versatile life? And why do we have the drive to evolve? Where are we going to? It just all doesn't make sense.

I have the same questions and it drives me crazy lol. This existence just seems too bizarre... like why the heck is this real? Why why why? I just don't understand...

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

In my opinion, there's no point. There's no purpose. At least there's not a "higher" purpose. We live this physical life for the experience of it. And that is all. There's no higher point in suffering nor happiness. It just doesn't matter. There's no right or wrong, no good or bad. There's no justice or injustice. Only if you believe there is. What you believe you get.

If certain chemical, physical and biological parameters are fulfilled, life simply happens, on a very primitive and simple level. And in some cases, due to evolution, it develops into complex intelligent beings that are capable of overthinking their own silly existence - aka us.

But what created the chemical and biological parameters? My question goes beyond that.

I have the same questions and it drives me crazy lol. This existence just seems too bizarre... like why the heck is this real? Why why why? I just don't understand...

Right?? I'm glad I'm not completely alone in this thinking.

 

[Good4Nothing]

It's these kinds of questions that led cavemen to invent God and religion.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

Vast universe, it had to happen somewhere, statistically speaking. There really is no point to it.

But where did the vast universe come from then?

It's these kinds of questions that led cavemen to invent God and religion.

God and religion is deterministic limited way of thinking. Any organized religion is. It is the most flawed possible answer to this question.

 

[watchingthewheels]

This is the great dual between Plato vs. Aristotle..."Primacy of consciousness" vs. "Primary of existence."
Plato- "ideal" realm of "Forms", which OUR world is just an imperfect copy, vs. Aristotle, who said "existence PRECEDES consciousness", or, "A is A." Matter and Energy simply IS.


"In The Duel Between Plato And Aristotle, Leonard Peikoff describes their opposing views succinctly:"

For two millenia, Western history has been the expression of a philosophic duel. The duelists are Plato and Aristotle.
Plato is the first thinker to systematize other-wordliness. His metaphysics, identified in Objectivist terms, upholds the primacy of consciousness; his epistemology, intrinsicism and its corollary, mysticism; his ethics, the code of sacrifice. Aristotle, Plato's devoted student for twenty years, is the first thinker to systematize worldliness. His metaphysics upholds the primacy of existence; his epistemology, the validity of reason; his ethics, the ideal of personal happiness.

Plato vs. Aristotle: The Classic Philosophical Duel

This inset from Raphael’s painting: School of Athens shows Plato (left) schooling his pupil Aristotle. The painting features many names from classic philosophy, but these two figures: Plato a…

thecriticalthinker.wordpress.com

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

This is the great dual between Plato vs. Aristotle..."Primacy of consciousness" vs. "Primary of existence."

Not really, none of that answers anything about how and why is existence a thing in the first place.

 

[Worndown]

Amino acid compounds, heat, lightning and luck made life. Shake your fist at the sky.

 

[watchingthewheels]

Not really, none of that answers anything about how and why is existence a thing in the first place.

I didn't say it answered it, I said it's their debate.

 

[NoSurprises]

"Purpose of life" and "life's meaning" are just terms coined by religion and some old dudes in the XIX century while snorting cocaine and drinking whisky.

The real truth no one knows it but it's almost certainly that we are casually here because our animal species evolved just like every other very old form of life but we managed to became aware of our own selves thanks to the size of our brain.

so we are self aware and at the same time not enough evolved or smart to avoid suffering and painful death of our own children.

in other words we are just stupid animals no different to pigs or lions in a incredibly lucky planet that had every ingredient to develope life like ours, in an universe with probably millions of planet like ours, theres nothing significant or interesting here, just some very primitive guys killing each other and pretending to be smart.

 

[TotallyIsolated]

Its commonly regarded that 'nobody knows' but with respect for people's various beliefs I think we do know, and the answer is "there is no reason".

Personally I'd go further than that and say that there no such thing 'a reason' nor of meaning. Its just something that we invented to help us try to rationalise the world and our own actions. We make up little stories to help explain and justify the complex and sometimes cruel twists and turns of fate. Nobody wants to live in a world where bad things happen to good people, so we just choose to believe that there "must" be a reason, when the tragic and rather bleak truth is that life is just inherently unfair.

One might ask "why did [something] happen?" - the only correct answer is just to go through the complex interconnected chain of events that unfolded, stretching back years or even millennia. Many of the difficulties we face in our lives are just unintended or unforeseen consequences of decisions made long before we were born, or even just by accident or coincidence.

Do you know why the sun and the moon have almost exactly the same apparent size in the sky? Pure coincidence. Think of all the people who looked up at the sky over the past 10,000 years and saw providence in that. The basis of entire cultures and systems of belief, possibly even the very concepts of duality, balance, and harmony. All based on simple coincidence.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

Amino acid compounds, heat, lightning and luck made life. Shake your fist at the sky.

And why are amino acids and heat and lightning a thing?

"Purpose of life" and "life's meaning" are just terms coined by religion and some old dudes in the XIX century while snorting cocaine and drinking whisky.

The real truth no one knows it but it's almost certainly that we are casually here because our animal species evolved just like every other very old form of life but we managed to became aware of our own selves thanks to the size of our brain.

so we are self aware and at the same time not enough evolved or smart to avoid suffering and painful death of our own children.

in other words we are just stupid animals no different to pigs or lions in a incredibly lucky planet that had every ingredient to develope life like ours, in an universe with probably millions of planet like ours, theres nothing significant or interesting here, just some very primitive guys killing each other and pretending to be smart.

Forget the purpose and meaning. How is this all possible. It's a scientific question. "Big bang" or "god created it" is the weirdest answer to everything. But the majority of people on this planet just go with it.

 

[WornOutLife]

That scenario only leads to furher questions though

Agreed.
I think our minds are nerfed so as not to understand the true meaning of life and this universe.
I just hope not to be a random guy who was bored's experiment.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

Its commonly regarded that 'nobody knows' but with respect for people's various beliefs I think we do know, and the answer is "there is no reason".

Personally I'd go further than that and say that there no such thing 'a reason' nor of meaning. Its just something that we invented to help us try to rationalise the world and our own actions. We make up little stories to help explain and justify the complex and sometimes cruel twists and turns of fate. Nobody wants to live in a world where bad things happen to good people, so we just choose to believe that there "must" be a reason, when the tragic and rather bleak truth is that life is just inherently unfair.

One might ask "why did [something] happen?" - the only correct answer is just to go through the complex interconnected chain of events that unfolded, stretching back years or even millennia. Many of the difficulties we face in our lives are just unintended or unforeseen consequences of decisions made long before we were born, or even just by accident or coincidence.

Do you know why the sun and the moon have almost exactly the same apparent size in the sky? Pure coincidence. Think of all the people who looked up at the sky over the past 10,000 years and saw providence in that. The basis of entire cultures and systems of belief, possibly even the very concepts of duality, balance, and harmony. All based on simple coincidence.

So big bang is a coincidence too? What was before the big bang then? I just want to know how is this sscientifically possible.

 

[TotallyIsolated]

And why are amino acids and heat and lightning a thing?

The origins of life itself, and the evolution of the earth and organic chemistry are fascinating subjects. Organic life as it exists today is incredibly complex and sophisticated, but life was much simpler billions of years ago.

Amino acids can actually be formed from inorganic compounds, a discovery that was made in the 50s (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller–Urey_experiment). There are also experiments that show how cell-like structures can form spontaneously from lipids in solution.

All this stuff had billions of years to just happen, and the random events that happened to lead to organic chemistry and life-like structures just compounded, building upon themselves little by little.

Look at coronavirus. Viruses aren't considered to be living things - they're just bits of organic molecules that happen to react a certain way when they come into contact with cells. They certainly have no will of their own, and no plan set out collectively. Just like a living thing though it moves from cell to cell, reproducing, and even defends itself. It came about by being just slightly different that the virus that came before it, which was just slightly different to the one before that. Because viruses have such a short lifecycle, and because there are so many little virions (billions in one infected person) small changes due to mutation add up quickly. The changes that dont work go nowhere, but the changes that help the virus spread more quickly or survive outside the cell for longer mean that that particular mutation is more likely to replicate itself and create the next little viral generation.

So big bang is a coincidence too? What was before the big bang then? I just want to know how is this sscientifically possible.

Well, yes. The big bang is kind of at the limits of our understanding of nature but it just sort of... happened. Strictly speaking time didn't exist 'before' the big bang, but there are theories that attempt to describe what might have led to the big bang. I think theres something in string theory about cosmic structures colliding with each other, causing universes to be formed. Other theories have it that time just loops around or bounces back and there is neither beginning nor end.

The big bang isn't really about 'why' there is a universe, more like 'what' it was like when the universe was very young (spoiler - it was small and hot).

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

The origins of life itself, and the evolution of the earth and organic chemistry are fascinating subjects. Organic life as it exists today is incredibly complex and sophisticated, but life was much simpler billions of years ago.

Amino acids can actually be formed from inorganic compounds, a discovery that was made in the 50s (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller–Urey_experiment). There are also experiments that show how cell-like structures can form spontaneously from lipids in solution.

All this stuff had billions of years to just happen, and the random events that happened to lead to organic chemistry and life-like structures just compounded, building upon themselves little by little.

Look at coronavirus. Viruses aren't considered to be living things - they're just bits of organic molecules that happen to react a certain way when they come into contact with cells. They certainly have no will of their own, and no plan set out collectively. Just like a living thing though it moves from cell to cell, reproducing, and even defends itself. It came about by being just slightly different that the virus that came before it, which was just slightly different to the one before that. Because viruses have such a short lifecycle, and because there are so many little virions (billions in one infected person) small changes due to mutation add up quickly. The changes that dont work go nowhere, but the changes that help the virus spread more quickly or survive outside the cell for longer mean that that particular mutation is more likely to replicate itself and create the next little viral generation.

Well, yes. The big bang is kind of at the limits of our understanding of nature but it just sort of... happened. Strictly speaking time didn't exist 'before' the big bang, but there are theories that attempt to describe what might have led to the big bang. I think theres something in string theory about cosmic structures colliding with each other, causing universes to be formed. Other theories have it that time just loops around or bounces back and there is neither beginning nor end.

The big bang isn't really about 'why' there is a universe, more like 'what' it was like when the universe was very young (spoiler - it was small and hot).

Still doesn't answer why or how any of it exists.

 

[NoSurprises]

And why are amino acids and heat and lightning a thing?

Forget the purpose and meaning. How is this all possible. It's a scientific question. "Big bang" or "god created it" is the weirdest answer to everything. But the majority of people on this planet just go with it.

Forget about that " big bang vs creator" question man, you gonna get crazy trying to find the answer to a question that we as a species can't respond because of our lack of insight about the principles of universe.

Its like trying to teach a person with an iq of 50 mathematical physics. He could try with all his passion but will never make it because of his complete lack of contextual understanding.

This is why people invented god, to explain stuff we cannot understand.

 

[LetMeGoPlease]

Forget about that " big bang vs creator" question man, you gonna get crazy trying to find the answer to a question that we as a species can't respond because of our lack of insight about the principles of universe.

Its like trying to teach a person with an iq of 50 mathematical physics. He could try with all his passion but will never make it because of his complete lack of contextual understanding.

This is why people invented god, to explain stuff we cannot understand.

I am already crazy, this is why I need answers.