What I learned about suicide and weakness

[somethingsmthgirl]

I'm in contact and have done advocacy work for incarcerated trans and gender nonconforming people here in the US. The stories you hear... the extent of cruelty people are capable of... It's left me with very little interest in taking part in this world.

But many of the people I talked to, in spite of having endured such extreme suffering, were totally secure in their will to live. The thought of dying had no appeal to them. They had some kind of will which I seem to lack, to persevere through adversity and trauma and pursue a future for themselves. I know with a great deal of certainty that, as a trans woman, I would rather end my life than get locked up in a men's jail. But that sentiment is not universal.

It leads me to wonder what the difference is between me and them. I'm slowly coming to the belief that some of us have a great inner strength which others lack. I am one of those without that strength, with a profound weakness of heart. I can barely endure even the slightest fronts of adversity, so when push comes to shove, I lose my will to endure. And push always, always comes to shove.

What I want to better understand, and what this has to do with recovery, is to know what it's like being that strong. Do those people experience a kind of joy through their conviction which counteracts the pain, or are they deluded in their will to find a better future? Do they suffer more or less?

 

[TheCavernousDeep.]

I really agree with you here. I've also been around people who have suffered just insane amounts, but who have a completely indomitable will to live. And I have a similar conclusion that there's just some kind of inner strength that you either have or you don't. I definitely don't. Idk, your statement about a "profound weakness of the heart" is really exactly how I feel about myself.

Strength is so weird! How did other people build resilience when I built weakness? I had a really good upbringing and sometimes I blame that for my weakness. I imagine it must be easier if things start off worse, then once things get better you always have a reference point to how bad things could be, and you know you're own strength through what you've overcome. But even that doesn't make sense, because I know people who were destroyed by their trauma, who are still haunted by it despite it being firmly in the past and despite them building admirable lives.

I really despise my own weakness. I think it's the thing I hate about myself the most. I wish I understood strength. I wanna be strong more than anything. Recently I took up running and working out, I figured, maybe if I could be physically strong I'd understand it. But I think all it'll end up amounting to is me dying in the best shape of my life.

IDK. Your question here is THE question IMO. If you get an answer please keep us posted.

 

[YourLocalSadGirly]

I could never tell you what it's like because the strongest people I know are all suicidal. I don't feel particularly strong myself, but my late girlfriend was one of the strongest people I've ever known. She suffered so much in her life, beginning to end, and eventually I think her will to live ran out. She tried so hard for me and everyone else to stay alive but she unfortunately lost her battle. I don't know if there's a certain type of strength that makes you 100% certain in your will to live, but I certainly don't have it, and neither do my friends who are struggling now. I think there must be a difference between strength that comes through surviving suffering and strength that is just natural to a person.

 

[somethingsmthgirl]

I really agree with you here. I've also been around people who have suffered just insane amounts, but who have a completely indomitable will to live. And I have a similar conclusion that there's just some kind of inner strength that you either have or you don't. I definitely don't. Idk, your statement about a "profound weakness of the heart" is really exactly how I feel about myself.

Strength is so weird! How did other people build resilience when I built weakness? I had a really good upbringing and sometimes I blame that for my weakness. I imagine it must be easier if things start off worse, then once things get better you always have a reference point to how bad things could be, and you know you're own strength through what you've overcome. But even that doesn't make sense, because I know people who were destroyed by their trauma, who are still haunted by it despite it being firmly in the past and despite them building admirable lives.

I really despise my own weakness. I think it's the thing I hate about myself the most. I wish I understood strength. I wanna be strong more than anything. Recently I took up running and working out, I figured, maybe if I could be physically strong I'd understand it. But I think all it'll end up amounting to is me dying in the best shape of my life.

IDK. Your question here is THE question IMO. If you get an answer please keep us posted.

It's always troubled me that no matter how physically strong or capable I make myself, I'll never fully be able to protect myself. I hear that all the time. If you're up against a group of people, you're probably fucked. You can do everything right and still be hurt. How do we expect hurt people to push through their hurt when we understand nothing about it?

 

[wantingdignity]

I honestly don't know if I agree. These are obviously all just my opinions, but I think that every single person has a breaking point to being suicidal. However, I think it has more to do with narrative than anything else.

If you know what you're doing in life and don't give a fuck about what gets in your way because you are connected to something greater than yourself, your mind is not going to constantly debate on whether or not you should just die instead of living today. I have witnessed people be joyful in impossible circumstances, and I think it's because of this.

But on the other hand, I think the soul and spirit are like a muscle. Even if you exercise it constantly, it's not immune to injury. Sometimes it can be hurt from overuse or underuse, or unexpected twists. After I sprained my ankle at 16, I learned that it is very easy to resprain it. I think once the door is opened to the possibility of suicide, the brain will always remember the way back to the door. It's more of a mission to build resilience and invest in other doors that are more appealing.

I am where I am now because I have lost the narrative again. I'm traumatized have lost a lot of my dreams. I don't have new dreams yet, so there is only one door and I'm sick of waiting around for things to get better. But I see others who have gone through it more than me. I'm trying to learn resilience, but it's hard as fuck.

 

[orpheus_]

I don't think that
suicidal = weak
and wanting to live = strong.
Honestly it's a lot more complicated than that. I used to think like this, but life made me change my mind... I don't know, I just met many people who do not fit into this rule. Whether someone is suicidal or not in a crisis situation depends on many factors. Cultural conditioning, past experiences, being able to think about a better future or not, brain chemistry, physical health, having other people's support, having something to escape into, the last time someone's been happy... Some of these things can be changed and I don't think that any people are innately "not strong enough"

 

[somethingsmthgirl]

I could never tell you what it's like because the strongest people I know are all suicidal. I don't feel particularly strong myself, but my late girlfriend was one of the strongest people I've ever known. She suffered so much in her life, beginning to end, and eventually I think her will to live ran out. She tried so hard for me and everyone else to stay alive but she unfortunately lost her battle. I don't know if there's a certain type of strength that makes you 100% certain in your will to live, but I certainly don't have it, and neither do my friends who are struggling now. I think there must be a difference between strength that comes through surviving suffering and strength that is just natural

I don't think that
suicidal = weak
and wanting to live = strong.
Honestly it's a lot more complicated than that. I used to think like this, but life made me change my mind... I don't know, I just met many people who do not fit into this rule. Whether someone is suicidal or not in a crisis situation depends on many factors. Cultural conditioning, past experiences, being able to think about a better future or not, brain chemistry, physical health, having other people's support, having something to escape into, the last time someone's been happy... Some of these things can be changed and I don't think that any people are innately "not strong enough"

That's probably true. I often struggle with simplifications in my head. I'm sure there's some way to reduce everything in life to a matter of strength or weakness, control or no control. But that doesn't really help us to understand on a more human level

I honestly don't know if I agree. These are obviously all just my opinions, but I think that every single person has a breaking point to being suicidal. However, I think it has more to do with narrative than anything else.

If you know what you're doing in life and don't give a fuck about what gets in your way because you are connected to something greater than yourself, your mind is not going to constantly debate on whether or not you should just die instead of living today. I have witnessed people be joyful in impossible circumstances, and I think it's because of this.

But on the other hand, I think the soul and spirit are like a muscle. Even if you exercise it constantly, it's not immune to injury. Sometimes it can be hurt from overuse or underuse, or unexpected twists. After I sprained my ankle at 16, I learned that it is very easy to resprain it. I think once the door is opened to the possibility of suicide, the brain will always remember the way back to the door. It's more of a mission to build resilience and invest in other doors that are more appealing.

I am where I am now because I have lost the narrative again. I'm traumatized have lost a lot of my dreams. I don't have new dreams yet, so there is only one door and I'm sick of waiting around for things to get better. But I see others who have gone through it more than me. I'm trying to learn resilience, but it's hard as fuck.

It's all too complicated for me to understand