Discussion What are your thoughts on looksmaxxing?

[ImpairedLowlife]

I know it's often seen as a joke or straight up harmful incel ideology/thing, but if you look past that, idea itself isn't bad at all, imo.
I'm not talking about hitting yourself with a hammer or believing looks are all that matters. But genuinely improving and optimizing your appearance if you're unhappy with it.

Personally, it's been a life changer for me more than anything else pretty much.
I've hated myself as long as I remember myself; never took pictures of myself and avoided all sorts of group pics, rejected all compliments I got, hated seeing myself in mirrors and constantly compared myself to other people who didn't have my issues. Nothing ever helped that, even random girls saying "I look good and should be modeling" or happy relationships where my ex. actually liked the way I looked a lot.

But after getting braces and seeing good progress here, improving hair, skin quality, overall grooming, growing a stubble (kind of always wanted one but couldn't grow it before using minoxidil) I still feel surprised at how much my life and self esteem had become. It still feels almost surreal looking at myself in the mirror and actually kind of liking what I see. And I'm pretty sure I'm not developing body dysmorphia, as with every improvement I do feel more and more confident and happy with myself.
Also it pushed me into becoming healthier; getting bloodwork done, taking vitamins, being physically more active etc. For me, seeing positive changes is a huge motivation to keep living and improving my life.

If you avoid harmful parts of that sphere (eg. comparing yourself to others and especially top models, doing dangerous and useless stuff to yourself, becoming a lookist) it could be great for self esteem and quality of life, especially if you're unhappy with the way you look.

Accepting yourself doesn't always work for everyone and everything. Realizing and fixing the issue might be better for some people.
If you're or anyone is happy with the way they look, it's great and I'm happy for them. But not everybody are.

Curious to hear y'all's thoughts on this one

 

[MonkeyButter]

I don't care what I look like. I have no love for myself or random people who might see me.

 

[lastappleonearth]

I mean, I've been working out for awhile now and I've significantly improved my body in the process and I'm pretty proud of it, but I wouldn't call it looksmaxxing, even though it technically fits the definition I guess. To me looksmaxxing just seems too excessive and in general it's pretty sad that it has become so popular in our generation now

 

[witchcraft]

I suppose it's another one of those things where it depends on how you define it.

If "looksmaxxing" means going to the gym or being more physically active, showering regularly, updating your wardrobe and wearing stuff that you personally like and feel confident in, keeping your skin healthy, grooming and just all around being more presentable, I don't see the issue.

Straightening your teeth with braces also seems to fall into a different category than, idk, plastic surgery or whatever.

Ultimately seems to boil down to a case-by-case basis imo. If the person genuinely feels healthier, is healthier (as shown by bloodwork or something else), and are realizing the potential best appearance that they were born with, generally speaking I don't think that's bad.

As per usual, what COULD and SHOULD be healthy improvements and lifestyle choices gets wrapped up in an ideology with a lot of negative baggage, dubious claims and promises. The same thing happened with the word incel, which originally was quite simply just to define someone, anyone who is involuntarily celibate, not the culture that sprung up around it. Just don't call it looksmaxxing, call it something else, call it "basic things that can help you feel a little better about yourself—YMMV."

 

[ImpairedLowlife]

I suppose it's another one of those things where it depends on how you define it.

If "looksmaxxing" means going to the gym or being more physically active, showering regularly, updating your wardrobe and wearing stuff that you personally like and feel confident in, keeping your skin healthy, grooming and just all around being more presentable, I don't see the issue.

Straightening your teeth with braces also seems to fall into a different category than, idk, plastic surgery or whatever.

Ultimately seems to boil down to a case-by-case basis imo. If the person genuinely feels healthier, is healthier (as shown by bloodwork or something else), and are realizing the potential best appearance that they were born with, generally speaking I don't think that's bad.

As per usual, what COULD and SHOULD be healthy improvements and lifestyle choices gets wrapped up in an ideology with a lot of negative baggage. The same thing happened with the word incel, which originally was quite simply just to define someone, anyone who is involuntarily celibate, not the culture that sprung up around it. Just don't call it looksmaxxing, call it something else, call it taking better care of yourself.

I wouldn't say much of what I've done is a "classic looksmaxxing", but it all improved the way I look, so I don't think it's a far off call.

As for healthy improvements, would you consider plastic surgeries or cosmetology treatments that aren't related to health issues excess if they are performed well and make person happier about the way they look?

The term is just really convenient to use and describe overall improvements of appearance, weather it's getting in shape, doing surgeries or learning to take better care of yourself.
I agree about negative baggage though.

 

[21Guns]

I suppose it's another one of those things where it depends on how you define it.

If "looksmaxxing" means going to the gym or being more physically active, showering regularly, updating your wardrobe and wearing stuff that you personally like and feel confident in, keeping your skin healthy, grooming and just all around being more presentable, I don't see the issue.

Straightening your teeth with braces also seems to fall into a different category than, idk, plastic surgery or whatever.

Ultimately seems to boil down to a case-by-case basis imo. If the person genuinely feels healthier, is healthier (as shown by bloodwork or something else), and are realizing the potential best appearance that they were born with, generally speaking I don't think that's bad.

As per usual, what COULD and SHOULD be healthy improvements and lifestyle choices gets wrapped up in an ideology with a lot of negative baggage, dubious claims and promises. The same thing happened with the word incel, which originally was quite simply just to define someone, anyone who is involuntarily celibate, not the culture that sprung up around it. Just don't call it looksmaxxing, call it something else, call it "basic things that can help you feel a little better about yourself—YMMV."

Improvement at which cost?
We're trivializing the fact that we should judge a difference as systematically bad feature.

If you look at my first posts, you'll see that i did't mentionned LM but well it was it.

Some things doesn't need to change for the pleasure of others.

I'm pretty much mitigated because well, if I'm talking about myself, i have a nose i disliked as a teenager, now sure i think it could be different in a better way but according to what?

If you go to middle east, nose like myself are super common and women would like masculine nose with character like myself. Same for the Asia.

But ofc in Europe it would be a different game tho listen : i had a pretty much taller GF and another super beautiful GF when i didn't isolated myself and though about my self image that much than now.

Because since a few time I did overthinked about it, kinda let opportunities flies, isolated myself in part because of the fact i granted tol much importance to how i looked in society.

I think the whole LM thing is toxic and would eventually lead to an higher depression & suicide rate BUT in the world we live in I understand.

Cultivate yourself, be intelligent, try your best but if you can stay away from toxic communities like that

 

[limenlux]

Becoming as handsome and well put-together as you can reasonably be is something that people will appreciate; doing the exact same thing while letting the term "looksmaxxing" escape your lips will turn you into Clavicular, and no one likes Clavicular, especially Clavicular.

 

[witchcraft]

Improvement at which cost?
We're trivializing the fact that we should judge a difference as systematically bad feature.

If you look at my first posts, you'll see that i did't mentionned LM but well it was it.

Some things doesn't need to change for the pleasure of others.

I'm pretty much mitigated because well, if I'm talking about myself, i have a nose i disliked as a teenager, now sure i think it could be different in a better way but according to what?

If you go to middle east, nose like myself are super common and women would like masculine nose with character like myself. Same for the Asia.

But ofc in Europe it would be a different game tho listen : i had a pretty much taller GF and another super beautiful GF when i didn't isolated myself and though about my self image that much than now.

Because since a few time I did overthinked about it, kinda let opportunities flies, isolated myself in part because of the fact i granted tol much importance to how i looked in society.

I think the whole LM thing is toxic and would eventually lead to an higher depression & suicide rate BUT in the world we live in I understand.

Cultivate yourself, be intelligent, try your best but if you can stay away from toxic communities like that

I don't think we disagree.

I was more just coming at the issue from this perspective: if a person wishes to improve their image, it should at least be equally for themselves as it is for anybody else. Because the response from other people will always be unreliable.

Fashion trends come and go, and even certain ideas about what a given populace generally finds "attractive" (which, as you correctly point out, varies from culture to culture). The main thing that stays pretty consistent is symmetry and hygiene, although even there one can find examples where having crooked teeth isn't a big deal in certain countries, or where people in certain countries typically don't wear as much cologne or deodorant or something.

But yes, ideally one should prioritize how they feel toward themselves, and their own physical-mental health, over the more arbitrary and fickle opinions of other people. Otherwise it is indeed easy to go down a rabbit hole of chopping up your nose, buffing your boobs, and becoming neurotic, finding some new """flaw""" every time you look at yourself in a mirror, or anytime some random person shares their unsolicited opinion about your appearance or what constitutes attractiveness in their eyes.

To answer your question, the cost-benefit analysis is for each person to decide. And everyone is going to have a different experience. Going to the gym weekly and just generally taking better care of my appearance in university did not make me the next Hugh Hefner. I know that's clearly a hyperbolic example, but that's my point when I say YMMV. Nothing I've ever done in terms of my appearance for my entire life has ever made me more attractive to women. Yet I've been told, by women other than ones in my family, that I'm of moderate attractiveness, and guys who I judge as being of equal-if-not-lesser physical attractiveness than me get way more attention from the ladies than I ever have or will. Because fundamentally there is something broken about my personality and temperament that women do not like. Or, I'm just the most unlucky, possibly most-lied-to person of all time.

I digress. I don't give a shit about dating anymore, so any "looksmaxxing" I do is purely for myself. What people don't often talk about is that there is an internal, personality equivalent of toxic looksmaxxing, where you tear yourself apart on the inside trying to figure out why you fucking suck. Not confident enough, not confident in the right way, am I creepy, no I'm not creepy, but now I'm too passive, but now I'm too pushy, but now I'm this, but now I'm that. Now I'm being myself, but that doesn't work either. Now I'm not trying at all, and that doesn't work either. Meanwhile there are other guys who were born to slay and literally do not have to try or think about this whatsoever, not a single iota, women are just falling on their cock. Ope, now I'm being bitter for 3 seconds, write that down on the ever lengthening list of my personality-maxxing problems lest somebody who doesn't even fucking know me armchair-psychologizes my ass and determines I have some cognitive complex where I apparently don't see women as people. Whatever.

Looksmaxxing, as the term is commonly used, is stupid. People should focus on their own self-satisfaction and health per their own standards rather than trying to kick a fieldgoal through the ever moving goalposts of other people. Obligatory imo.

 

[NonEssential]

No idea if that would work for me. When I look at the mirror, the hate feels to be much deeper than just appearance.

 

[PimpHand]

I tried to improve my looks, but nobody ever said I was pretty or anything.

I was quite into the femboy/non-binary thing. The idea of me being an attractive femboy genuinely made me happy, beyond any kink or sexual connotation.

Once I posted my photo on Reddit and it got like, 150 upvotes, people saying I looked like a Persian beauty, that was amazing.

But like, that didn't help me with my trauma and my depression. And once I realized I was not part of the LGBTQ community, I decided to throw all my "feminine" things into the trash can. I threw dresses, collars, earrings, skirts, socks, lots of things, even estradiol.

I was genuine into skincare. I would clean and hydrate my body and facial skin everyday, do exercises, eat well, but like, that didn't change anything at all, it didn't bring peace of mind, so I got rid of that.

Nowadays, I'm almost another person from who I was. Shaved hair, beard, body hair, slightly overweight, man-like clothes, don't do anything other than deodorant. I just don't care about my image at all. I just wanted the peace of mind.

But yeah, I think it can be good for some people. Hit the gym, do some skincare, buy new clothes, do some refreshing work on the body. If that's what makes you better. Just remember that this, alone, won't bring the happiness you long for.