Discussion Thoughts and Opinions as a Funeral Director

[Theresnoescape]

Following, very interesting stuff.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

Oh please people joke in here all the time. There are people in the world whose job is death. They look at it differently. They're actually interested in the hows and whys. They tend to think about it differently.

Short derailment. It's not a question of thinking but doing. We aren't colleagues talking shop. We used to have a mortician member here who created an AMA resource type thread as well. They also mentioned the necessity of gallows humor. Everyone knows that's what people in these professions do. But even so they never said a statement like that which I couldn't help but bristle a bit at myself. It is understandable why a member here would have that reaction. People don't like feeling misunderstood especially by relevant people. That mortician identified themselves as having dealt with the types of feelings themselves this site revolves around so if they had said something like that in relation to their work, it probably would have been more palatable. That's a key difference as has been noted as to how people may respond differently.

 

[OutOfThisBody]

Short derailment. It's not a question of thinking but doing. We aren't colleagues talking shop. We used to have a mortician member here who created an AMA resource type thread as well. They also mentioned the necessity of gallows humor. Everyone knows that's what people in these professions do. But even so they never said a statement like that which I couldn't help but bristle a bit at myself. It is understandable why a member here would have that reaction. People don't like feeling misunderstood especially by relevant people. That mortician identified themselves as having dealt with the types of feelings themselves this site revolves around so if they had said something like that in relation to their work, it probably would have been more palatable. That's a key difference as has been noted as to how people may respond differently.

Tbh the humor from the first post didn't even stand out to me as offensive when I read it. But that's me.

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

A friend of me is necrophile, thougth she has a university degree she prefers to work in a business like yours. Is it true that many necrohile people are working in jobs where they come close to corpses legally? If so, how do you deal with it?

 

[anopenwound]

@InterestedParty

You said families are devastated when their loved ones disappear. Can the same be said for their friends?
What if the person who died brought them suffering in life? Has anybody ever complained about how selfish and sick and toxic their loved ones were when they were alive?
Has anybody ever come in saying "I'm glad this person is dead"?

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

I think most people lack creativity in that in the past 30 days I had 2 by train, 1 by gunshot, and 3 by hanging. But other than that I did not see any other method this month.

We live in a free market economy, so why should someone be creative if nobody pays for it? The payment couldbe be something you need for a painless death.

 

[InterestedParty]

I think you're so awesome for taking the time to post here and answer our questions! We appreciate you!

Thank u <3

With gun suicides, do you see a majority of these going through the mouth (aimed towards back of head), at the temple, under the chin, at forehead? I'm sure it's all different types but wondering what you see the most and what is the most disfiguring...

I thought about this for a few minutes but i couldn't really come to a consensus.

I have never seen one aimed at the forehead.

It would have to be between through the mouth and at the temple that I have seen most of.

As for most disgusting it was a under the chin with a shotgun, because well, you know.

A friend of me is necrophile, thougth she has a university degree she prefers to work in a business like yours. Is it true that many necrohile people are working in jobs where they come close to corpses legally? If so, how do you deal with it?

Big stuff to have admitted to hahaha.

Well, the hiring managers at these sort of places, get a lot of weirdos. Now dont get me wrong, you have to be a weirdo to be in this field, but there is supposed to be a balance between your weirdness and professionalism.

However, a lot of these weirdos become very transparent during the interview as to their unprofessional intentions and are vetted out then and there. So, the few weirdos that remain, and do get hired, they are the ones that would know not to be making any comments about idk fucking bodies. So what my point is, no but maybe, not anything we would talk about.

@InterestedParty

You said families are devastated when their loved ones disappear. Can the same be said for their friends?
What if the person who died brought them suffering in life? Has anybody ever complained about how selfish and sick and toxic their loved ones were when they were alive?
Has anybody ever come in saying "I'm glad this person is dead"?

The same could be said just as much for their friends.

As for your other questions, I only ever know what they tell me, so wouldnt know if the person had brought suffering to their lives.

Never had a funeral where there was feelings of animosity to the person who had died, those would most likely just go to direct cremation, but I have had a few with ambiences of indifference.

We live in a free market economy, so why should someone be creative if nobody pays for it? The payment couldbe be something you need for a painless death.

I already got chewed out once for my sarcasm, ill have to stay quiet hahaha

 

[-Link-]

@InterestedParty I hope it's OK for these two conversations to coexist in this thread because you are sharing valuable insight, and people here are very interested in what you have to say and where you're coming from with your perspective. You've been totally respectful in all your replies here, and we appreciate it.

It's just that this thread happened to relate to a very important issue to this community.

Tbh the humor from the first post didn't even stand out to me as offensive when I read it. But that's me.

To follow up on what @LaVieEnRose said, it's not so much an offensiveness or even about the jokes themselves.

It's more that it's a representation of how this community is misunderstood by outsiders, as well as the consequences of this persistent lack of understanding.

Outside of this forum, we are universally vilified as death-mongering, pro-suicide monsters who are too incompetent to know what's best for us. Nobody ever makes an effort to understand us. Nobody bothers to consider the reasons why this forum exists in the first place and why all of us would be here.

Maybe some members here don't care about that, but they should care about it. If it wasn't for the stigma against this community and suicidal people in general, then maybe discussions could be had about medically-assisted dying and this forum wouldn't even be necessary. None of us would have to look at painful, risky, or horrific modes of death that might not work or leave lasting after-effects in survival. We'd be able to be with our families in those final moments. We wouldn't have to traumatize our loved ones or bystanders or first responders. And we'd be able to have dignity in our deaths.

So when an outsider comes in here and says something like what's stated in the OP here, it's a representation and reinforcement of that stigma. And it especially hurts when it comes from someone who is involved in any relevant industries like healthcare, law enforcement, or death because these are the people whose voices are the loudest and best positioned to actually have an impact outside of here.

@InterestedParty I want to reiterate you are very welcome here and are handling yourself in a remarkably respectful way in your replies here, so thank you for that, and I hope this sidetrack here doesn't dissuade you from staying engaged with us.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

I'm not sure if my questions are something that you are able to answer, but I'll ask anyway just in case (since the mortician we once had on the forum doesn't seem to be here anymore).

Do you know if university body donation programs accept suicides? I'm signed up for my local university's school of medicine body donation program, and the only exemptions are severely obese people and those with a history of contagious diseases. Nothing I can find says they don't accept suicides.

And more specifically:

Do you think they'd accept a sodium nitrite suicide? Given how it works in the body (skin color change, blood turns brown, cell death from anemic hypoxia), I'm not sure if that would play a factor in rejection.

And if I happen to get autopsied, how invasive would it be do you think? If it's just a blood serum analysis for toxicology, that would be fine. But if they have to go chopping up my corpse to examine my organs, it'd be an instant rejection.

Thanks in advance for any info you're able to provide, or simply for reading if you're unable to answer.

 

[InterestedParty]

I'm not sure if my questions are something that you are able to answer, but I'll ask anyway just in case (since the mortician we once had on the forum doesn't seem to be here anymore).

Do you know if university body donation programs accept suicides? I'm signed up for my local university's school of medicine body donation program, and the only exemptions are severely obese people and those with a history of contagious diseases. Nothing I can find says they don't accept suicides.

And more specifically:

Do you think they'd accept a sodium nitrite suicide? Given how it works in the body (skin color change, blood turns brown, cell death from anemic hypoxia), I'm not sure if that would play a factor in rejection.

And if I happen to get autopsied, how invasive would it be do you think? If it's just a blood serum analysis for toxicology, that would be fine. But if they have to go chopping up my corpse to examine my organs, it'd be an instant rejection.

Thanks in advance for any info you're able to provide, or simply for reading if you're unable to answer.

I dont personally know of any institution that accepts suicides. Theyre just not very suitable for their intended purposes. You will have already been autopsied at the coroners. Just cross referencing it to universities specifically, UCLA's documentation specifically mention not accepting suicide donations.

Think that answers the rest of your questions, but even if the autopsy is not invasive, suicides just not accepted

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

I dont personally know of any institution that accepts suicides. Theyre just not very suitable for their intended purposes. You will have already been autopsied at the coroners. Just cross referencing it to universities specifically, UCLA's documentation specifically mention not accepting suicide donations.

Think that answers the rest of your questions, but even if the autopsy is not invasive, suicides just not accepted

Ah damn. That sucks. One of the main benefits of donating one's body is to significantly reduce the post-mortem costs, as everything except death certificates are free of charge; no funeral costs or anything.

So in lieu of this, what would happen then? My family wouldn't be able to cover any significant costs. I think I remember reading that the state covers expenses in the event that the next of kin is unable to pay, is this the case? I would hate to dump a financial burden on top of the emotional one in my wake.

 

[wren-briar]

Re: costs

To be very clear, my sibling and I loved our mother very much, but when she died, we asked for the state to cremate her and do with her ashes what they would do for any pauper.

If there had been an affordable and more ecologically responsible alternative, we would have taken that route, but there simply wasn't in our area.

 

[InterestedParty]

Ah damn. That sucks. One of the main benefits of donating one's body is to significantly reduce the post-mortem costs, as everything except death certificates are free of charge; no funeral costs or anything.

So in lieu of this, what would happen then? My family wouldn't be able to cover any significant costs. I think I remember reading that the state covers expenses in the event that the next of kin is unable to pay, is this the case? I would hate to dump a financial burden on top of the emotional one in my wake.

Varies from place to place. There is almost definitely a way for your state to pay for the costs of a simple direct cremation.

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Re: costs

To be very clear, my sibling and I loved our mother very much, but when she died, we asked for the state to cremate her and do with her ashes what they would do for any pauper.

If there had been an affordable and more ecologically responsible alternative, we would have taken that route, but there simply wasn't in our area.

So if I'm understanding you right, they covered the major expenses?

I am very sorry about your mother. I hope her passing wasn't agonizing and marked with suffering. And I hope that you and your sibling are as okay as you two can be now.

 

[InterestedParty]

Re: costs

To be very clear, my sibling and I loved our mother very much, but when she died, we asked for the state to cremate her and do with her ashes what they would do for any pauper.

If there had been an affordable and more ecologically responsible alternative, we would have taken that route, but there simply wasn't in our area.

What Wren said ^

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Varies from place to place. There is almost definitely a way for your state to pay for the costs of a simple direct cremation.

That is very good news.

I appreciate you answering my questions. You're providing a valuable service here.

 

[InterestedParty]

That is very good news.

I appreciate you answering my questions. You're providing a valuable service here.

welcome

 

[wren-briar]

So if I'm understanding you right, they covered the major expenses?

Correct. They covered expenses for everything except copies of the death certificate.

I am very sorry about your mother.

Thank you.

I hope her passing wasn't agonizing and marked with suffering.

As such things go, she suffered very little. She also had advanced dementia (which her own doctor had never diagnosed, but the medical staff in her last months made clear was profound), the upshot of which is that she didn't remember anything for very long, so things that would have caused her massive embarrassment (in years past) she forgot almost as soon as they happened. As much as dementia sucks, their is that tiny blessing.

I hope that you and your sibling are as okay as you two can be now.

I was made actively suicidal before our mom's health plummeted, so I had already been pulling away. It's been a few months, and I can't say her loss has been hard for me. (I can't say that's a blessing of having been made actively suicidial, but it definitely made her loss less impactful than it would have been otherwise.) Although, her absence is still very, very surreal! (https://wrenbriar.gitlab.io/#Mourning)

 

[Plato'sCaveDweller]

Correct. They covered expenses for everything except copies of the death certificate.

That is wonderful to hear, and that's exactly what I planned for with donating my body. So it sounds like it'll all work out regardless of where my body ends up going.

Thank you.

Of course!

As such things go, she suffered very little. She also had advanced dementia (which her own doctor had never diagnosed, but the medical staff in her last months made clear was profound), the upshot of which is that she didn't remember anything for very long, so things that would have caused her massive embarrassment (in years past) she forgot almost as soon as they happened. As much as dementia sucks, their is that tiny blessing.

I am glad to hear that it was not a rough process. But dementia is so brutal, I am so sorry. But I suppose that sort of worked in her favor, given she wouldn't be able to remember anything or properly process things. The silver lining, I suppose. But fuck man, dementia... I hope she's at peace now.

I was made actively suicidal before our mom's health plummeted, so I had already been pulling away. It's been a few months, and I can't say her loss has been hard for me. (I can't say that's a blessing of having been made actively suicidial, but it definitely made her loss less impactful than it would have been otherwise.) Although, her absence is still very, very surreal! (https://wrenbriar.gitlab.io/#Mourning)

I can relate in a way. Prior to my grandfather passing, I had been thinking quite heavily about CTB. I had been emotionally distant from everyone for a while up to that point, like you. When he passed, it was indeed surreal. And I didn't cry until the next day. But it didn't last very long before I began to move on. That isn't to say it wasn't world-shattering; of course it was. But in terms of the attachment and actual loss, it wasn't as bad for me as it was for my grandmother.

I suppose in your case that's yet another silver lining. Wanting to CTB involves a degree of detachment from the world and for some, the people they care about, so that certainly makes it easier to bear the loss of a loved one. I'm glad to hear that things sort of worked out in your favor, in that regard. Grief from loss can be devastating, and some people never recover.

 

[Just_Another_Person]

As for awful for first responders, train suicides are always pretty graphic.

All good thx

Id say the only thing in an urn that matters are the ashes, most urns are just mass produced junk that eventually gets thrown out.

They would probably care as much as you.

Yup yup, mortuary makeup will even out whatever color you might end up

Thanks for answering!

 

[vanillamilkshakes]

Have you ever seen a sodium nitrite overdose?

 

[InterestedParty]

Have you ever seen a sodium nitrite overdose?

love vanilla milkshakes,but

no, not common at all

 

[vanillamilkshakes]

love vanilla milkshakes,but

no, not common at all

thank you

 

[CannotAnymore]

This website strikes me as interesting though in that many people on here seem so motivated to learn and try out these elaborate suicides methods.

I would say take some of the things that you see on here with a grain of salt. I came to this site, downloaded the guide and tried SN which unfortunately did not work for me. Unfortunately it's look like a handgun to the head is going to be my method. Ideally I don't want to do something so 'violent'. I am really scared of that method and it not working and traumatizing some poor soul who has to find me. My preference would be to be able to go somewhere, be put to sleep and have my organs donated to people who want to live and then be creamented or terramation to not create any polution...

There are alot of people who come on this site and post their morbid curiosities as opposed to people really being supported, there are usually big influx of fake profiles and 'saviors' who show up when an article comes out linking this page. Some person is guilt ridden and blames this site for the person ctbing.. you work with death so I am sure you have seen the guilt, the greed, the greif.. don't need to explain that to you.

With that being said, there are some very 'normal' people on here.. We are just tired of this world and tired of exisiting, there are some here who are physically sick and would prefer to go out on their own terms instead of having to spend months or years in severe pain and suffering.


Out in the 'real' world you can't talk about it.... People want to label those of us who don't want to be here as 'crazy'... Hey spend a week in a facility or chin up or get medicated and you'll be fine... just 'be happy'.. or someone has it worse, or don't worry it will get better... or whatever other bullshit people say that makes them feel better.

Anyway. Welcome to our little corner of the internet.

 

[InterestedParty]

I would say take some of the things that you see on here with a grain of salt. I came to this site, downloaded the guide and tried SN which unfortunately did not work for me. Unfortunately it's look like a handgun to the head is going to be my method. Ideally I don't want to do something so 'violent'. I am really scared of that method and it not working and traumatizing some poor soul who has to find me. My preference would be to be able to go somewhere, be put to sleep and have my organs donated to people who want to live and then be creamented or terramation to not create any polution...

There are alot of people who come on this site and post their morbid curiosities as opposed to people really being supported, there are usually big influx of fake profiles and 'saviors' who show up when an article comes out linking this page. Some person is guilt ridden and blames this site for the person ctbing.. you work with death so I am sure you have seen the guilt, the greed, the greif.. don't need to explain that to you.

With that being said, there are some very 'normal' people on here.. We are just tired of this world and tired of exisiting, there are some here who are physically sick and would prefer to go out on their own terms instead of having to spend months or years in severe pain and suffering.


Out in the 'real' world you can't talk about it.... People want to label those of us who don't want to be here as 'crazy'... Hey spend a week in a facility or chin up or get medicated and you'll be fine... just 'be happy'.. or someone has it worse, or don't worry it will get better... or whatever other bullshit people say that makes them feel better.

Anyway. Welcome to our little corner of the internet.

Thank you

Best of luck with whatever you end up doing with your life

 

[Duro]

Well, if they really wanted to, they could ask to see you at the coroners, before we even get the body, but this is not a common request at all, and is usually discouraged by every party involved

Well this is my first post on this website, as I very recently found it while prowling through the CoE website.

I am a funeral director in a major Californian city, so naturally, I see my fair share of suicides a month.

This website strikes me as interesting though in that many people on here seem so motivated to learn and try out these elaborate suicides methods.

I think most people lack creativity in that in the past 30 days I had 2 by train, 1 by gunshot, and 3 by hanging. But other than that I did not see any other method this month.

But what I was trying to get at is that is from my personal experience, hanging is by far the most popular method at least in this part of California...

Also, yes, I can confirm that many families look ruined after one of their loved ones decides to go through with it, so keep that in mind I suppose.

If anyone has any questions though would be more than happy to answer them :)

If someone were to ctb with SN will it always be apparent that it was suicide? Will the cyanosis fade if they are not found for a few hours?

If someone were to ctb with SN will it always be apparent that it was suicide? Will the cyanosis fade if they are not found for a few hours?

My health is bad enough that natural causes would be an acceptable explanation as long as there's no direct evidence otherwise

 

[LunarLight]

But if they have to go chopping up my corpse to examine my organs, it'd be an instant rejection.

I don't think you can refuse an autopsy. The coroner is supposed to do it no matter what, especially in case of a suicide.

If someone were to ctb with SN will it always be apparent that it was suicide?

Yes. You cannot make it look like death from natural causes.