thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
One example I saw was someone saying that every suicidal person should be an anti-natalist, because they [the anti-natalist] would prefer to not exist and suffer than to be born

Jesus Christ, @Mistiie... you came to this thread just to stalk me, didn't you!? 🫠

Well... you certainly have a not-so-veiled way of getting "someone's" attention, don't you?! You could've at least tagged/mentioned me...

I will be audacious and state that all — and I really mean ALL — the people in this forum, with their diverse life backgrounds, if they were given the option between (1) Killing themselves or (2) Never being born, they would choose (2) because it's always "better" never to have been in the first place. For suicidal people, this is what anti-nalism truly means. (And that should include you, despite your reluctance against it.)

Or you could've had a minimum of intellectual honesty and quoted what I actually said ☝️

To be fair: I actually suggested that, as you wrote, "every suicidal person should be an anti-natalist".

I did it, however, in a very specific context of a dillema. That changes the overall meaning of the sentence.

I'm not saying "all suicidal people ought to be anti-natalists", as you surreptiticiously suggest...
 
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pthnrdnojvsc

pthnrdnojvsc

Extreme Pain is much worse than people know
Aug 12, 2019
2,497
This site is pro choice.

I think most on here believe life is good in general but they think that people should have the choice to commit suicide. They think that it's just their life is bad but that life is good in general.

I think life is bad in general but I don't care what others do so Im pro-choice.

However when i post why I think life is bad I guess many on here might think im pro-death whatever that means.

For example I posted that there is nothing in life that makes it wort the extreme pain possible in life . This is the only place I posted my condemnation of DNA based life .

I guess if I told normies this they will think I'm insane

99% of people think life is good .

1.I would like to challenge normies and prolifers to tell me the objective reason to live. Nobody ever has 2.tell me what is so good about life that it makes the worst imaginable torture possible worth it.
 
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thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
99% of people think life is good .

Most people are deceiving themselves, as I've argued for...

(A). A majority of people constantly — and actively — deceive themselves to believe that they have, overall, a more pleasureable predicament than a painful one.

Life is way more "crappy" than people like to think.
 
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Mistiie

Mistiie

This is a Junly moment
Nov 10, 2023
205
Jesus Christ, @Mistiie... you came to this thread just to stalk me, didn't you!? 🫠
wtf? no i didnt?
you realise that no one can see what threads u post on right? no one cares about you enough to scour through every thread to talk about you lmao...so much for calling me a "narcissist"
Well... you certainly have a not-so-veiled way of getting "someone's" attention, don't you?! You could've at least tagged/mentioned me...
what does this even mean lol
Or you could've had a minimum of intellectual honesty and quoted what I actually said ☝️
dude stop with the intellectual honesty shit lol, you really don't care about it at all given in the other thread you were just insulting me. i don't know why you keep saying this because it's blatantly obvious you don't actually care about intellectual honesty in the slightest and only care about petty arguments, not actually relevant discussions. you didnt even address anything i said about that either and only focused on weird things about idioms which just proves that anyways
To be fair: I actually suggested that, as you wrote, "every suicidal person should be an anti-natalist".

I did it, however, in a very specific context of a dillema. That chances the overall meaning of the sentence.

I'm not saying "all suicidal people ought to be anti-natalists", as you surreptiticiously suggest...
i really don't see how you differentiate "every suicidal person should be an anti-natalist" from "all suicidal people ought to be anti-natalists" even if it's purely in a hypothetical format. it doesn't matter whether or not it's in a dilemma or whatever. it's what you suggested regardless of whatever setting or condition is applied to it to make it true.

at this point i think i might just block you cause no one can get anywhere with you and you're just devolving into random arguments about language, settings of discussion, etc. rather than the actual topic at hand and i just really don't have the time to be dealing with all the weird stuff you're saying
 
MeltingBrain

MeltingBrain

Mage
May 29, 2023
563
A majority of people has, overall, more "happy" "moments" than painful ones in their lives.
This is based on anecdote + polls you can find online.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/470888/americans-largely-satisfied-personal-life.aspx
For people who are unhappy (and voted that way) , there is still hope because in majority of cases happiness and sadness ebbs and flows . Generally grieviences are not permenant .

Regarding the human development index, I agree there is a lot of space for improvement but look at the progress we have made over the years . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human...ment_Index_regions_evolution_1990-2021-fr.svg

From 2000 to 2011 we have pulled out 700 million people out of poverty . China alone has pulled out 745 million people out of poverty in 30 years time .
Propogation of existing tech and advancements in new tech like AI , electric vehicles will further improve all our lives . Considering all this an average person has a lot to be optimistic for .

https://www.bbc.com/news/56213271
TLDR: If you can't get consent from a person who's will can possibly contrapose your own will or who's well-being is going to be directly affected by your action, without them having any say-so whatsoever, you should not commit said action. It's no nonsense, it's no irrationality — and, conversly, it's a pretty well thought, reasonable, moral standard to live by.
I get where you are coming from , but the circumstances around this also matter a lot in my view . If there is a child who is adamant in sticking his fingers in a socket and someone restraints him , he would have done so against the childs consent but it will still be the right thing to do in order to minimize the child's suffering . The context has to be taken into consideration in many such scenarios.
Who says-so that an anti-natalist is advocating against procreation because he's "fearful"...?! Not the anti-natalist, for sure.

That's not a fair statement. Anti-natalism is not in any way a cowardice, as you ignorantly suggested. Not wanting to GAMBLE with other people's lives is not cowardice. It's actually an act of empathy and genuine respect for others.
Coward is too strong a word. Not gambling with making an offspring is based on the fear that things may turn out bad for him . So I think fear is the right word.
If someone pours their life savings in a great business idea , over someone who in similar circumstances doesn't , I will have a little more appreciation for the guy who does . That is not to say that the guy who doesn't is a coward .

Not all fear is bad too , if someone is suffering from extreme poverty they should refrain from having a child .

...hear from "pro-life" idiots ALL the time: "I have no respect in my book for suicidal people... Choosing to kill oneself is sheer cowardice."
I never said it was cowardice. Some pro-lifers do call us cowards and I think it's wrong . I never said I have no respect for anti-natalists .
 
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MrDarkness

MrDarkness

Left sasu, to improve my life
Jun 18, 2023
1,067
Wow... That's a very well thought reply! Top notch Sarcasm is definitely the winner in any debate!
Anti natalism suits people who have had no world experience, have had a very sheltered life, and truly can't grasp the concept of life, or your so blinded your just following others to fit in. Work around children and then your thought on this immoral act will change 🤣
 
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thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
Anti natalism suits people who have had no world experience, have had a very sheltered life, and truly can't grasp the concept of life, or your so blinded your just following others to fit in. Work around children and then your thought on this immoral act will change 🤣
OMG! I think I underestimated how funny you truly are! 🤣

You must get a lot of women easily interested in you... Chicks dig men with a sharp sense of humor! 🤣🤣🤣

And the way you talk... Sounds like you're an experienced middle aged, mature, independent man!

How many kids do you have? Are you married? You don't seem like the kind of guy who would settle with your high school sweetheart... But you sure had one, i'm pretty certain of It! Your sense of humor is a pussy magnet! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Work around children and then your thought on this immoral act will change 🤣

You being a well-experienced man and your pussy magnet funny jokes and sarcasm reminded me of a great movie! You should watch It with your highschool sweetheart!

Idiocracy DVD bb7d571b 070e 476c 885e c194d2c17c1b5fb950cdb6e49000c02f677d9320ec7f
 
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MatrixPrisoner

MatrixPrisoner

Enlightened
Jul 8, 2023
1,407
Well, the way I see it, pro-choice and pro-death pretty much go hand in hand. The only alternative to living is dying.
 
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LonelyStarrySky

LonelyStarrySky

they/them, menhera
Oct 27, 2023
78
I am pro-choice, I think that people should be allowed make their choices about their own lives, I don't think that this life is entierly meaningless and that even I have found some small joys inside which are still holding me alive despite everything that is going on. That being said, I don't want to be the one to stand in the decision other's have made to end their own lives, because after all I have chosen the same fate eventually. That is why I will support somebodies decision for whatever they chose to do with their own life. I think its wrong to encourage people to end their own lives, which is why I won't encourage anyone to do it, but I also think it is wrong that when somebody who made a decision that they believe is the best for them even if it is CTB to encourage(even prevent) them to do otherwise(which is what pro-life does). My opinion comes from a place of care for other people, and respecting whatever they chose to do. It is saddening when somebody decides to CTB but I understand this decision and feel that I have no right to say otherwise, because I don't want anybody to say otherwise to my own decision to pass on, nor do I want others to encourage me as well. For me it just matters to be supportive of others.
 
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MrDarkness

MrDarkness

Left sasu, to improve my life
Jun 18, 2023
1,067
OMG! I think I underestimated how funny you truly are! 🤣

You must get a lot of women easily interested in you... Chicks dig men with a sharp sense of humor! 🤣🤣🤣

And the way you talk... Sounds like you're an experienced middle aged, mature, independent man!

How many kids do you have? Are you married? You don't seem like the kind of guy who would settle with your high school sweetheart... But you sure had one, i'm pretty certain of It! Your sense of humor is a pussy magnet! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣



You being a well-experienced man and your pussy magnet funny jokes and sarcasm reminded me of a great movie! You should watch It with your highschool sweetheart!

View attachment 123480
this is the biggest cope/insecurity post of seen on this site lmao
 
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thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
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MatrixPrisoner

MatrixPrisoner

Enlightened
Jul 8, 2023
1,407
OMG! I think I underestimated how funny you truly are! 🤣

You must get a lot of women easily interested in you... Chicks dig men with a sharp sense of humor! 🤣🤣🤣

And the way you talk... Sounds like you're an experienced middle aged, mature, independent man!

How many kids do you have? Are you married? You don't seem like the kind of guy who would settle with your high school sweetheart... But you sure had one, i'm pretty certain of It! Your sense of humor is a pussy magnet! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣



You being a well-experienced man and your pussy magnet funny jokes and sarcasm reminded me of a great movie! You should watch It with your highschool sweetheart!

View attachment 123480
This movie predicted the future to a T. We will soon be watering our crops with Prime energy drink.
 

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thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
This movie predicted the future to a T. We will soon be watering our crops with Prime energy drink.

It totally did. Kanye "Ye" West is yet to be seen as president of the World. 🤣
 
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thewalkingdread

thewalkingdread

Life is a pointless, undeserved, unnecessary pain.
Oct 30, 2023
489
99% of people think life is good .

This is obviously another instance of the notorious recurring common sense meme of the 99% vs 1% social-economic issue...

I would rephrase this for a even more persuasive force, in spite of the inaccuracy of this statistics:

99% of people deceive themselves into thinking that life's "good" — while, deep down, most of them know that they are just mere replaceable units in a semi-slavery work exploitation system. (Afterall, what can they do... There is no "Keanu Reeves" to "save" them)

Meanwhile, only the 1% billionaires live an actual "good" life.

(I would argue that 100% of people are not living any "good" lives at all... But that's another completely different discussion to be had, under no misleading statistics)


However when i post why I think life is bad I guess many on here might think im pro-death whatever that means.

"Pro-death whatever that means"

You've made a very astute remark here, my friend. There is no such a thing as being "pro-death" (At least not by itself; and I'll explain what I mean by this later on)... Period.

People love to give stupid, inaccurate, names to things they have a very poor comprehension of or a very bad take on — as if they were Elon Musk naming his children x-something. 🫠🙈

So... meaningless, inaccurate, names take over the public debate in order to satiate our pettyful, stupid, inclinations to tribalisms.

And terms/expressions/dichotomies like "Left vs Right", "Western civilization vs Barbarians", "American Dream vs Communism", "Pro-life vs Pro-death" and etc, rise into — undue — prominence, in accordance to the specifics of the political issue, or debate, being entertained.

At this point in time, It's no surprise to anyone that the "Pro-life vs Pro-death" tribalism has it's origins on the abortion/women's rights issue — not the right-to-die one.

This dichotomy is essentially anchored in a fundamental, intellectual, dishonesty. Regardless of what specific religion they subscribe to, most religious people believe that life is a "sacred miracle" that "begins" at conception.

(This belief is not warranted in any way whatsoever by any scientific evidence or serious philosophical scrutiny... and it's plagued with gross, misleading, conceptual failures — no pun intended.)

But the kernel of the dishonesty in here, in the abortion issue, lies in the fact that abortionists aren't "pro-death" at all.

This is a gross, straw man fallacy, where the "pro-life" advocates — being manipulative as usual — are frequently using the expression "pro-death" as an eufemistic, polite, way of suggesting that his opponents' stances are "pro-murdering babies" — the horrible, hidious, despicable crime we call 'infanticide'.

Aborting an embryo, however, or a fetus at an early stage of development, isn't in any way equivalent to purpusefully causing the death — i.e. killing — a fully developed, concious, human baby. They're two different things, with two very much distinct moral statuses.

There is also a much foggy scenario when we stop to think about how we use the word 'death' in polyvalent, ambiguous — and arbitrary! — ways.

Virtually all people would agree that it's an absolute sheer nonsense to ascribe any practical, moral or legal, value to the "genocidal" aspect of millions and millions of bacteria dying, when someone takes antibiotics, for instance. But — suddenly! — an irrelevant cluster of cells inside a woman's womb provokes a hysterical war between people, much like the one protagonized by Greeks and Trojans.

If you think about it, the real "pro-death" advocate is, conversly, the self-proclaimed "pro-lifer". Because it's only when "pro-lifers" get what they want — i.e. more babies being born "into life" — that the word 'death' will assume the most serious, relevant, meaning we attach to it.

TLDR: "Pro-life vs Pro-death" is a false dichotomy. Being "pro-death" has no real meaning on it's own, since it's somewhat nonsensical to think that people can choose to die or not to die once they're born. Being "pro-life" entails being "pro-death" because the death of a person is necessarily determined at birth....whilst being "pro-choice", strictly speaking, does not entail anything related with death.
 
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pthnrdnojvsc

pthnrdnojvsc

Extreme Pain is much worse than people know
Aug 12, 2019
2,497
This is obviously another instance of the notorious recurring common sense meme of the 99% vs 1% social-economic issue...

I would rephrase this for a even more persuasive force, in spite of the inaccuracy of this statistics:

99% of people deceive themselves into thinking that life's "good" — while, deep down, most of them know that they are just mere replaceable units in a semi-slavery work exploitation system. (Afterall, what can they do... There is no "Keanu Reeves" to "save" them)

Meanwhile, only the 1% billionaires live an actual "good" life.

(I would argue that 100% of people are not living any "good" lives at all... But that's another completely different discussion to be had, under no misleading statistics)




"Pro-death whatever that means"

You've made a very astute remark here, my friend. There is no such a thing as being "pro-death" (At least not by itself; and I'll explain what I mean by this later on)... Period.

People love to give stupid, inaccurate, names to things they have a very poor comprehension of or a very bad take on — as if they were Elon Musk naming his children x-something. 🫠🙈

So... meaningless, inaccurate, names take over the public debate in order to satiate our pettyful, stupid, inclinations to tribalisms.

And terms/expressions/dichotomies like "Left vs Right", "Western civilization vs Barbarians", "American Dream vs Communism", "Pro-life vs Pro-death" and etc, rise into — undue — prominence, in accordance to the specifics of the political issue, or debate, being entertained.

At this point in time, It's no surprise to anyone that the "Pro-life vs Pro-death" tribalism has it's origins on the abortion/women's rights issue — not the right-to-die one.

This dichotomy is essentially anchored in a fundamental, intellectual, dishonesty. Regardless of what specific religion they subscribe to, most religious people believe that life is a "sacred miracle" that "begins" at conception.

(This belief is not warranted in any way whatsoever by any scientific evidence or serious philosophical scrutiny... and it's plagued with gross, misleading, conceptual failures — no pun intended.)

But the kernel of the dishonesty in here, in the abortion issue, lies in the fact that abortionists aren't "pro-death" at all.

This is a gross, straw man fallacy, where the "pro-life" advocates — being manipulative as usual — are frequently using the expression "pro-death" as an eufemistic, polite, way of suggesting that his opponents' stances are "pro-murdering babies" — the horrible, hidious, despicable crime we call 'infanticide'.

Aborting an embryo, however, or a fetus at an early stage of development, isn't in any way equivalent to purpusefully causing the death — i.e. killing — a fully developed, concious, human baby. They're two different things, with two very much distinct moral statuses.

There is also a much foggy scenario when we stop to think about how we use the word 'death' in polyvalent, ambiguous — and arbitrary! — ways.

Virtually all people would think that it's an absolute sheer nonsense to ascribe any practical, moral or legal, value to the "genocidal" aspect of millions and millions of bacteria dying, when someone takes antibiotics, for instance. But — suddenly! — an irrelevant cluster of cells inside a woman's woomb provokes a hysterical war between people, much like the one protagonized by Greeks and Trojans.

If you think about it, the real "pro-death" advocate is, conversly, the self-proclaimed "pro-lifer". Because it's only when "pro-lifers" get what they want — i.e. more babies being born "into life" — that the word 'death' will assume the most serious, relevant, meaning we attach to it.

TLDR: "Pro-life vs Pro-death" is a false dichotomy. Being "pro-death" has no real meaning on it's own, since it's somewhat nonsensical to think that people can choose to die or not to die once they're born. Being "pro-life" entails being "pro-death" because the death of a person is necessarily determined at birth....whilst being "pro-choice", strictly speaking, does not entail anything related with death.
that's what it seems like to me 99% of people think life is good. even on here imo most people think life is good. just that their life is bad but life in general they believe life is good . I think the 99% are brainwashed. i think life is bad and have posted about why and might add to this post later but busy now.people don't know how beliefs are formed . what did anyone know at age 2 years or 3 years, nothing. does a 1 year old know they are going to die anyway ? no only at ages 5-7 do they begin to realize the permanence of death. people don't know that the brain is formed the mind is formed mainly from ages 0 to 7 but continously reshaped , it's called livewired and neuroplasticity



 
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Arihman

Arihman

Efilist, atheist, pro-right to die.
Jun 8, 2023
133
Anti natalism suits people who have had no world experience, have had a very sheltered life, and truly can't grasp the concept of life, or your so blinded your just following others to fit in. Work around children and then your thought on this immoral act will change 🤣
Nice ad hominems there. Also, I like how, when it comes to natalists, one time the accusation is "oh, you're just depressed, so your opinon is invalid" (meaning you likely were not really sheltered, so you do have life experience), and the next it is "oh, you're some spoilerd brat with no life experience, otherwise you'd agree with my obviously wise (but unexplained/unproven) idea of what life means".

That aside, an act doesn't become ethical because you're some kind of "tough guy", or working around children gives you warm fuzzies.

That also appies to antinatalists, btw. If you're one just because your life sucks, or because you hate kids, that's stupid: having children doesn't become ethical or unethical based on those reasons. And your quality of life doesn't change the nature of life itself as a phenomenon.

With one big difference: not procreating due to a negative assessment of your own life doesn't deprive anybody of positives (even if the prospective child would have had a good life), and it prevents negatives, whereas assuming a new creation will like life (in spite of you not being able to control the experiment, or the simple fact that people have differerent
pain tolerances, meaning not only you can't really know what their circumstances will be, but also how they will affect the prospective child) creates the risk of torture for unnecessary benefits. And if you're wrong, someone else will pay for your actions.

And since such a risk, unlike the risks we take everyday (e.g I need to go out to buy groceries, and risk being run over by a car, because the alternative is starving to death), is not in service of avoiding some worse outcome for the prospective child, as there is no harm in nonexistence, there is no rational reason to take it. Especially when all life does is create needs that didn't need to exist, i.e. (imperfectly) solve problems it itself created in the first place. And that's precisely what our pleasures and joys are. It's like creating a sickness for the sake of curing it, because you like to play doctor, and then saying it's worth it to create torture victims because all the other patients have been cured well enough after you yourself made them addicted to the cure in the first place. Therefore, I'm sure you'll excuse me if I don't see any profound wisdom, bravery, or rationality in all that.
 
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Rhizomorph1

Rhizomorph1

May you find peace in living or dying
Oct 24, 2023
599
Culture is multifaceted and overlaps with other cultures. Thus why there are dominant cultures and subcultures, etc.

There are also unconscious cultures and emotional ones.

Thus, the site is probably explicitly/dominantly pro-choice, but the grassroots nature of the forum undoubtedly produces some proportion of pro-death rhetoric, at least unconsciously.

Given the lack of regulations its impossible to truly conceptualize the site with a single cultural "tag" per say.

It is mostly pro choice but definitely has pro death influence, at least for some.

Remember guys, cultures can and invariably do co-exist.
 

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