Interesting article on the threat posed by incels.

[Britvik]

"Researchers also drew attention to "behavioural threat assessment themes" uncovered from years of research – honing in on concerning and threatening communications, an interest in violence, intense or escalating anger, blaming other people, bizarre or inappropriate behaviour and interpersonal difficulties.

Other themes identified by researchers were harassment, failed life aspirations, lack of consequences, financial instability, and a history of being bullied, among other issues."

‘Incels’ are growing threat in America, Secret Service report finds

Report examines instances where men linked to incel movements have killed women

www.independent.co.uk

 

[TooConscious]

I guess there's the possibility of many people having 'nothing left to lose' mentality. But I honestly believe people, the vast majority, even the worst of the worst, extremists, have now mostly been bought off and silenced by all the worthless garbage but addictive entertainment and foods, drugs these days. It's not like they are all hiding underground ready to come up and pounce. By 2030 everyone will be safely in a cage (metaphor) but not far from the reality of it (see 'you will own nothing and be happy' anyway. The world is a joke. Somehow I'm not laughing.

 

[Crazy4u]

Lack of consequences is huge in my opinion. The legal system in the US is a joke. It will only get worse before it gets better.

 

[callme]

Lack of consequences is huge in my opinion. The legal system in the US is a joke. It will only get worse before it gets better.

And blame those people for something they do out of bad life conditions? How is it their fault they were bullied in school, or their parents didn't love them?

 

[Crazy4u]

And blame those people for something they do out of bad life conditions? How is it their fault they were bullied in school, or their parents didn't love them?

The article is about serious crimes like murder. Is "something they do" in your response = serious crimes like murder?

Does not being loved by parents justify serious crimes like murder?

 

[YourNeighbor]

If you live in the States, there is a good chance you live close to where an incel engaged in mass violence. And still, they're coddled here, despite their hate, despite making a mockery of those here who are ill, and despite making this site look even worse to the public and hostile to the women who could benefit from this place.

It's also a bit ironic that there is nothing involuntary about being an incel. It's a purely voluntary choice to identify as one.

 

[Grav]

Does not being loved by parents justify serious crimes like murder?

I've seen it come up in defense arguments. Interesting that the secret service has time to be on the watch for incels but casual things like human trafficking just never seem to get someone looking into them. Oh well.

 

[callme]

The article is about serious crimes like murder. Is "something they do" in your response = serious crimes like murder?

Does not being loved by parents justify serious crimes like murder?

Of course not. Not as an incel myself. But it unfortunately becomes a solution in the end, in their minds. Even if they tried to get better, they never could. Their anger gets to be directed either to themselves or to others, so probably, if they didn't kill somebody else, they'd kill themselves.

I have thought about it, do in somebody of my choosing before going myself. When you're bottled up with failure and disappointment to where you can't even have a normal life, it comes out as the option necessary. Either you become a slave to the medical system, while being told you're not crazy which you full well know you are, and are dying inside to admit, so you can get the burden over with, you admit to your thoughts and go to jail, or you realise finally, that life is pure and simply not for you and you're the worst it has to offer, and you do in yourself.

I don't dispute they are not in their best mind when they choose to kill undeserving people before themselves, far from it. But it shouldn't be forgotten they are only human acting on their only impulse. Somewhat like suicidal people with nothing more in it in this world.

 

[DeprivedofLife666]

I'm a female who can't get a guy bc of my controlling grandparents (31, still residing with them even though I really don't want to, but I can't get away from them sadly.) Yeah I get super jealous and resentful when I see other women with their dream guys, but I don't go around killing them. It only makes me cry and want to ctb even more.

 

[Al Cappella]

Maybe some of you here will have heard of the incel van attack in Toronto in 2018, where one of these pathetic psychopaths killed 11 people, 9 of which were women. And yes, to read even slant empathy, never mind identifying with, these asshats is distressing. It's nothing but obscene entitlement turned misogynistic terrorism. Ick.

 

[Grav]

I've heard of it but it's one of those "hey they're all like this" kind of sweeping assessments that does nothing for anyone. What about the Colorado movie shooter? Maybe we start assessing the threats of red-heads? I have no sympathy for most people including most incels I hear (no I don't know a bunch and the ones I hear are probably not fully in, just "complainers"), and murderers definitely not. The government puts out this blurb along with the "oh there's 5 serial killers roaming around like Lector" talk instead of addressing another actual issue again.

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

All of the men who abused and hurt me throughout my life were popular and charismatic, the complete opposite of shut-in, unsocialised loners who struggled to converse with the gender they're attracted to. Young women often get preyed on by this type of man, because people don't expect the well groomed, socialised guys to be the most conniving and dangerous, precisely because of stereotypes about what is suspicious and what isn't.

Abusers can wear many masks. It is unwise to paint every psychopath as an incel, or claim that someone has a proclivity for violence simply because they have been unable to find romantic connection in their lives. Most of the men (and women) on this site who identify with what could be described as the incel community have been kind and understanding to me, rather than violent in nature or misogynistic, and I don't see why they are an issue if they have never spouted any hateful rhetoric/ideology or been unkind to others.

There have always been criminals throughout history who had histories of neglect, abuse, and ostracisation, much like many incel types. Until the root causes of malicious actions are addressed and dealt with, unfortunately, there will always be people who fly off the handle and do unspeakable, atrocious things, because there are no preventative measures in place to steer them off that course.

Telling people they've failed at life for being lonely only poisons the well even further, there are deeply rooted societal issues of isolation which are leading to more and more criminal and desperate behaviors. There is often no sense of community in this world, so it makes sense that people cling to a label, hoping they will find some understanding and compassion with others in similar circumstances.

Unfortunately, there are bad actors everywhere, and there needs to be a lot more moderation within communities where there are vunerable people who may be at risk of going down a dark path.

 

[Julgran]

If you see it from a political perspective - first it was the nazis, then it was the communists, then it was Al-Qaeda, then it was the Taliban, then it was Kim Jong-Il, and then it was the incels. My point is that there will always be an external or internal threat, because that's how the USA operates, and the rest of the world tries their best to mimic them.

Try to look further into the future, and you will soon look at a reflection of your own face

I wonder how so-called "intelligence agencies" can come up with such un-intelligent conclusions....

If it's of any interest to you, Norway is starting to comprehend the underlying issues regarding the incel issue, and it doesn't all have to do with blaming lonely people - but, rather, finding the source of the problem.

 

[Cathy Ames]

And blame those people for something they do out of bad life conditions? How is it their fault they were bullied in school, or their parents didn't love them?

I went looking for the actual report mentioned in the article. It was a case study of a particular mass shooter (the one who killed the people in the yoga studio in Florida). By "lack of consequences," I think they were referring to some extreme behavior from this person in the past that had NO consequences or minimal consequences. Like he had some really inappropriate contact with a high school student but continued to teach afterwards. So in his case, maybe whatever happened in the past that caused him to be this way was not his fault. But going forward he refused to see the role his OWN inappropriate behaviors and actions played in what happened to him. He was doing some scary and inappropriate things and then he blamed the women that he was targeting.

I don't know if this link will work. But here is the report.

https://www.secretservice.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2022-03/NTAC%20Case%20Study%20-%20Hot%20Yoga%20Tallahassee_0.pdf

 

[come to dust]

Can we stop associating lonely, ugly men with violence?

Plenty of history's most famous serial killers have been handsome men who get female admirers writing to them in jail.

Putin and Kim Jong Un have no shortage of female suitors either.

Frat boy Chads are 3x more likely to sexually assault women than your average man.

Incel haters, your lookism and ableism shows when you act like incels are the main perpetrators of modern day violence. Being involuntarily celibate does not make a man more likely to be violent.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Can we stop associating lonely, ugly men with violence?

Plenty of history's most famous serial killers have been handsome men who get female admirers writing to them in jail.

Putin and Kim Jong Un have no shortage of female suitors either.

Frat boy Chads are 3x more likely to sexually assault women than your average man.

Incel haters, your lookism and ableism shows when you act like incels are the main perpetrators of modern day violence. Being involuntarily celibate does not make a man more likely to be violent.

I think the headline and the original article do not accurately characterize the report itself. People should be able to differentiate between "involuntary celibacy" (which includes lots of people) and the smaller subset or subculture (or something like that) which expresses "anti-woman hate, sexual objectification of women, and calls for violence targeting women" (as stated in the report).

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Well I might as well do my part in eliminating a fraction of the incel problem by killing myself. Sounds like this article is saying more incels should totally follow suit and stop being a burden to normal good people. Long as they don't take anyone else with them I don't see the harm in letting all of us incels remove ourselves peacefully and leave everyone else alone.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Well I might as well do my part in eliminating a fraction of the incel problem by killing myself. Sounds like this article is saying more incels should totally follow suit and stop being a burden to normal good people. Long as they don't take anyone else with them I don't see the harm in letting all of us incels remove ourselves peacefully and leave everyone else alone.

Yeah, that article was an inaccurate depiction of the actual REPORT, which concerned "MISOGYNISTIC EXTREMISM," it was not written about all "incels."

 

[YourNeighbor]

Yeah, that article was an inaccurate depiction of the actual REPORT, which concerned "MISOGYNISTIC EXTREMISM," it was not written about all "incels."

"Incels" are misogynistic extremists by any objective definition.

They seek validation by equating themselves with "loneliness" and similar tropes. These are not synomymous concepts. Plenty of people are lonely, yet do not spew hate or celebrate violence. Let's get a grip people.

 

[houseofleaves]

I've seen it come up in defense arguments. Interesting that the secret service has time to be on the watch for incels but casual things like human trafficking just never seem to get someone looking into them. Oh well.

Incels (those ones who murder and/or rape people) are bad. Human trafficking is bad, but is much more difficult to uncover because of the corruption and threats by powers that be (remember Epstein's island, for example). I don't understand what you're trying to say.

Plenty of history's most famous serial killers have been handsome men who get female admirers writing to them in jail.

Yeah, and there've been plenty of "lonely, ugly and misunderstood" killers.

Putin and Kim Jong Un have no shortage of female suitors either.

They are powerful, they have money. They're not incels.

Frat boy Chads are 3x more likely to sexually assault women than your average man.

Source?

Incel haters, your lookism and ableism shows when you act like incels are the main perpetrators of modern day violence.

They're not, but they have a potential to become them. Do we want that?

Being involuntarily celibate does not make a man more likely to be violent.

Are you sure? Doesn't loneliness lead to aggression and hate towards the "more lucky" ones? I'm saying that because i'm a little bit incelish* and i sometimes catched myself thinking something like "oh i wish these happy couples on valentine's day would suffer as much as i do" and yadda yadda ya (still, i would NEVER assault, rape or kill anyone and i have no desire to).

*i can elaborate of course, if you wish

Of course not. But it unfortunately becomes a solution in the end, in their minds.

Pedophiles can say, for example, that fucking a 12 year old child was the only solution, would you believe them?
oh my god poor pedo, he/she/them couldn't do anything except hurting others and destroying their lives oh my god

Even if they tried to get better, they never could. Their anger gets to be directed either to themselves or to others, so probably, if they didn't kill somebody else, they'd kill themselves.

Then they should kill themselves. It's for the best. I'm incelish myself, and one of the reasons for my upcoming CTB is the inability to find love. It's a valid reason.

If you see it from a political perspective - first it was the nazis, then it was the communists, then it was Al-Qaeda, then it was the Taliban, then it was Kim Jong-Il, and then it was the incels. My point is that there will always be an external or internal threat, because that's how the USA operates, and the rest of the world tries their best to mimic them.

sorry to disappoint you, dude, but right now it's Al-Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS, Kim Jong Un, Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, whistleblowers, incels and i've probably forgotten something.

 

[callme]

I'm a female who can't get a guy bc of my controlling grandparents (31, still residing with them even though I really don't want to, but I can't get away from them sadly.) Yeah I get super jealous and resentful when I see other women with their dream guys, but I don't go around killing them. It only makes me cry and want to ctb even more.

Women have considerably more means. At least you will never be shamed for the size of your vagina too. 31 year old virgin woman doesn't sound bad either, she hasn't found the right one yet.

But if you were a 31 year old virgin man? What a fucking loser jacking off his ingrown baby penis in his mother's basement to her underwear.

Plenty of people are lonely, yet do not spew hate or celebrate violence. Let's get a grip people.

Isn't suicide violence? And if they are "celebrating", why do they kill themselves after?

but right now it's Al-Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS, Kim Jong Un, Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, whistleblowers, incels and i've probably forgotten something.

Sure, forgot it's the US' own fault. Funded Al-Qaeda and the Taliban, funded ISIS, interfered in the Korean war and split Korea forever, appeased Russia all through the 90s with their jack shit promises and let thousands of war crimes slide under the carpet and offered million dollar real estate on a silver platter, invited China on the world trading stage in 1972, created its trite murderous "intelligence" agencies and pussified its entire culture from the bottom up.

Norway is starting to comprehend the underlying issues regarding the incel issue, and it doesn't all have to do with blaming lonely people - but, rather, finding the source of the problem

They can't keep it up, because it's too cold up there?

In all seriousness, Norway seems socially too conscious to have solutions applied anywhere else successfully. Maybe except Sweden and Denmark.

 

[kiuya]

Women have considerably more means. At least you will never be shamed for the size of your vagina too.

Aren't we shamed about our vulva's size? Innie and outie, all that. It goes both ways, it's not just men or women.

 

[callme]

Aren't we shamed about our vulva's size? Innie and outie, all that. It goes both ways, it's not just men or women.

Not nearly as much, for obvious reasons. For us, just a couple of inches make or break you as a man and a human.

 

[kiuya]

Not nearly as much, for obvious reasons. For us, just a couple of inches make or break you as a man and a human.

Could you tell those obvious reasons? I think that you just haven't put much thought on women being shamed so you haven't really noticed it.

 

[Cathy Ames]

"Incels" are misogynistic extremists by any objective definition.

No. The term has been co-opted. The objective definition is "involuntarily celibate." In fact, the report by the Secret Service even makes a distinction. There is no need to point fingers at people who are involuntarily celibate and say that their condition "by objective definition" means they are misogynistic extremists (or even misogynistic). They might be? Or they might not be.

 

[callme]

Could you tell those obvious reasons? I think that you just haven't put much thought on women being shamed so you haven't really noticed it.

You are right, very conservative (eastern european) culture here. Still, what applies everywhere is that men are breadwinners. We are not allowed to cry, to complain, to abandon life. Most reasons pointing to the men that already did so also shows the decline of civilisation, at least the most important reasons.
Also, we are completely expected to be in the driving seat of a relationship, as much as that has been negated by more and more equality of the sexes. It's for a reason that I think the erosion of traditional relations in marriage contribute to higher than ever divorce rates.
Let's not forget we also are expected to be mentally stronger, but we suffer for longer and receive less understanding for it, this will be the new epidemic soon enough.

It's just an assertion of historical consideration. Women have somehow always been protected, just as much as their issues were ignored. Too bad they are still shamed in some places. I acknowledge especially the more you move east, being a woman is easily a nightmare which doesn't seem it will stop anytime soon, because it's steeped by tradition or harsh political debate.

And by the way, the way we describe types of puss, ass and tits is just playful adoration for no other reason, but to show we like it. None of those determine how good a mother a woman will be, or if she cheats or anything like that, so comparing small size shaming with men is out of the question.
Also, getting enlargement is a very very different outcome.

 

[YourNeighbor]

No. The term has been co-opted. The objective definition is "involuntarily celibate." In fact, the report by the Secret Service even makes a distinction. There is no need to point fingers at people who are involuntarily celibate and say that their condition "by objective definition" means they are misogynistic extremists (or even misogynistic). They might be? Or they might not be.

Incel is short for involuntarily celibate. That, of course, is a gibberish term, not the definition. This is why we do not take any hate group's definition of itself at face value. The KKK are not defenders of Christianity. The Democratic People's Republic of Korea is neither democratic nor a republic. If you want an objective definition of the term incel, you have to go outside of the group to get it. Educate yourself and stop apologizing for what is identified as a male supremacist subculture whose adherents spew hate and even engage in violence. Their comments here are consistent with that definition, and make a mockery of this place and everyone here who is contemplating suicide over insurmountable problems.

Incel - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

There is nothing involuntary about being an incel.

 

[callme]

everyone here who is contemplating suicide over insurmountable problems.

So they aren't allowed to be suicidal if they can't bear the burden of being undesirable anymore? And being destined to be alone all your life is not an insurmountable problem? Complete failure to do the only thing we are on this planet for isn't an insurmountable problem?

Sounds like applying to them the same reasoning healthcare does to the suicidal. "It's your depression speaking", "you are just seeing things", "you haven't tried hard enough". So if an incel' last desire is to kill themselves without any intent whatsoever but to hurt themselves the most, they should never have access to it, because of the actions of a few, and become a statistic in doing something stupid out of a lack of information and a place for them to belong to? Could it be they aren't all mass murderers?

There is nothing involuntary about being an

Poor parents, boring personality by default, lack of talent, speech impediments, small person syndrome, micropenis, blindness, face and body deformations. Just the ones I can think of.

 

[Cathy Ames]

Incel is short for involuntarily celibate. That, of course, is a gibberish term, not the definition.

No. That is the actual definition and it is certainly not a "gibberish" term.

 

[YourNeighbor]

So they aren't allowed to be suicidal if they can't bear the burden of being undesirable anymore? And being destined to be alone all your life is not an insurmountable problem? Complete failure to do the only thing we are on this planet for isn't an insurmountable problem?

Stop the gaslighting nonsense. Loneliness/isolation is not synonymous with being an incel. The latter is a conscious choice to adhere to a hateful subculture. There are scores of people even here who are isolated and lonely and do not spew incel garbage or identify as one.

Poor parents, boring personality by default, lack of talent, speech impediments, small person syndrome, micropenis, blindness, face and body deformations. Just the ones I can think of.

Again, see above. Most people who are poor or have disabilities do not embrace hate. Being blind is not a choice. Being an incel, and embracing their garbage, is a choice.