Help How do I Speedrun moving on from a crush?

[Dr Iron Arc]

Maybe you can get an escort?

This is illegal. You might as well be suggesting I join a mafia in order to gain friends. I'd have about the same level of success. I don't even think having a regular one night stand would help me get over her either since that's only half of the problem here. I've entertained this idea before but I've come to the conclusion that it will not work as intended for me and is also very likely to make things much much worse.

I also don't even think any woman would want to be with me even if they were paid to do it. The amount of money I'd probably need to make one woman tolerate my presence for one minute would have to be at least $10,000 and I just don't have that kind of money.

 

[Gangrel]

Why do you think it's bad to be with you?

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Why do you think it's bad to be with you?

Should be obvious to anyone who's read this thread, though I don't blame anyone who hasn't.

Basically they would just wind up being a new target of my obsession. And before anyone tries to chime in "but therapy can help with that". No it can't. I've been studying limerence and it seems like the problem with it is that even if I were to somehow move on and meet someone else and not be obsessed with them, then that person will inherently feel like a much worse choice. When compared to the people who were my obsessions, any new person would either have to be doomed to become another obsession or they would have to forever live with being an inferior choice to the obsessions.

So I guess this thread is moot. It's all hopeless for me here.

 

[Trismegistus_13]

Maybe this is bs advice because I still needed time to pass regardless to fully move on but I'll explain it anyways. To move on from past crushes I analyzed which specific attributes attracted me towards them and tried implanting or embodying them in myself to not feel any sort of deprivation. For example, if I was attracted to the attribute 'funny' in someone, it reflected how stressed I was at the time and how my subconscious mind wanted to balance out my life by using that person to include more humor in my own life. To move on, I had to implement whatever thing that attracted me towards them in another way that doesn't involve them, and in this case I watched more light hearted tv shows such as 'friends' or 'community' in my spare time. By filling in the void that made you experience the crush you might be able to move on quicker.

This works very well for me. I've had crushes on girls I went to school/college with, and although I was way too shy to do anything, I think taking on a trait (in a healthy way) is a great way to process that yes, for a time, they meant a lot to you.

In my own life, I joined my high school archery club because I really liked one of the girls in it. I thought she was so cool because she did archery, so I picked it up wanting to spend time with her. Fast forward years, and I still practice archery (just got a new riser today!!) and I think it's wonderful she was able to have a positive effect on me, even if we didn't have a relationship.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

This works very well for me. I've had crushes on girls I went to school/college with, and although I was way too shy to do anything, I think taking on a trait (in a healthy way) is a great way to process that yes, for a time, they meant a lot to you.

In my own life, I joined my high school archery club because I really liked one of the girls in it. I thought she was so cool because she did archery, so I picked it up wanting to spend time with her. Fast forward years, and I still practice archery (just got a new riser today!!) and I think it's wonderful she was able to have a positive effect on me, even if we didn't have a relationship.

I moved a little forward on @wCvML2 's original advice and have started trying to listen to more music that isn't from a video game. I used the vocalist from the Sonic Frontiers boss themes as a bridge and found his band Sleeping With Sirens. Some of the songs did resonate with me but I don't consider myself a total fan. It all feels so alien to me, or maybe I'm the alien for not being comfortable with regular music. Perhaps this is the crux of my attraction to her since she's studying music. Maybe I just wanted someone else's music taste to latch onto like I'm some kind of parasite. I was also maybe aiming for some kind of symbiosis where I can also show someone my music taste and hopefully they'll like it too and I figure that people who study music theory would be more open to that since I see a lot of YouTube videos about musicians reacting to video game osts and they usually love them.

 

[Cinnamorolls]

That would imply that the other types are widely available and interested in me though, which I don't believe they are. The only likes I even received on dating apps from women was with white ones who were KPop fans that assumed I was Korean and then gave up when they realized I wasn't. I started liking one type of woman because this type has been the only type to even show interest in me in the first place even though they eventually backed out. There was even once someone from this very forum who was white and she was the one who initiated with me without even knowing about my preference then it turned out she had a thing for only Asian guys but it didn't work out between us since I don't have a place of my own. We were really compatible besides that according to her.

It sounds like those women were in fact not interested in you at all. They have a fetish for Koreans and were only interested when they thought you were Korean, then lost it as soon as they found out you aren't? That means they weren't interested in you as an individual whatsoever. I agree with @cryone that you seem to be projecting idealistic fantasies onto these women vs what actually happened. Maybe the last one you mentioned might have been different but it still sounds like it was mainly just a race fetish thing. Have you tried the Asian dating apps that were suggested to you yet? It's very hard to believe that only white women ever sent you likes on apps - seems more likely you just didn't swipe back on anyone who wasn't white so you wouldn't have known if other types of women liked you - but either way that won't happen on these other apps. All the likes you get will be from fellow Asians. But it seems you're intentionally avoiding interaction with them in continuing subconscious hopes that white girls will flock to you instead.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Have you tried the Asian dating apps that were suggested to you yet? It's very hard to believe that only white women ever sent you likes on apps - seems more likely you just didn't swipe back on anyone who wasn't white so you wouldn't have known if other types of women liked you - but either way that won't happen on these other apps. All the likes you get will be from fellow Asians. But it seems you're intentionally avoiding interaction with them in continuing subconscious hopes that white girls will flock to you instead.

You are right that I haven't tried because of my stubbornness but I'm also intentionally avoiding interaction on those apps because I still think Asian girls would be more difficult to attract anyway. Being an Asian man myself who isn't a doctor, engineer, or some other extremely wealthy profession might as well have a success rate equivalent to searching in lesbian bars for a potential partner. Even if somehow one did like me, then there would likely be the matter of her parents which I have even less of a chance of impressing. At least with white people their parents tend to be way more chill or understanding and when they aren't, usually they've already been disowned by their stricter parents while Asians in my experience have been forced to stay with them and keep contact. I'm speaking from experience. I've gone to school with almost exclusively Asians my whole life and they never showed any interest in me because I was too poor and stupid for them. At least white women would be less likely to care and that's why one reason why I find that more attractive.

But then again, if an Asian woman did truly show interest in me then maybe I would consider it. My current crush is someone I probably wouldn't have been interested in if you had asked me a year ago. Even though she's white she's still shorter than I thought I liked and she's a brunette instead of blonde. I think I'm able to erode my preferences but only if someone who doesn't match them appears to show interest in me first. In this case I was wrong in my assessment of her feelings but I suppose at least it struck down some preferences of mine. I don't think that would always work though so who knows.

 

[Gangrel]

I feel like you're very uptight on what you like on woman and expect from her, her family, her likings, etc... That's kinda of a recipe for disaster for depressed people looking for relationships. You can't just go into situations with whole scenarios already made up on your mind about how things should/will happen.

 

[Cinnamorolls]

You are right that I haven't tried because of my stubbornness but I'm also intentionally avoiding interaction on those apps because I still think Asian girls would be more difficult to attract anyway. Being an Asian man myself who isn't a doctor, engineer, or some other extremely wealthy profession might as well have a success rate equivalent to searching in lesbian bars for a potential partner. Even if somehow one did like me, then there would likely be the matter of her parents which I have even less of a chance of impressing. At least with white people their parents tend to be way more chill or understanding and when they aren't, usually they've already been disowned by their stricter parents while Asians in my experience have been forced to stay with them and keep contact. I'm speaking from experience. I've gone to school with almost exclusively Asians my whole life and they never showed any interest in me because I was too poor and stupid for them. At least white women would be less likely to care and that's why one reason why I find that more attractive.

Again it feels like you're projecting idealized fantasies onto white people. Many white families would absolutely not be "chill" about their daughter dating a nonwhite man. If not outright disapproving of it, they'll almost certainly make racist and ignorant comments towards the nonwhite individual to make them uncomfortable as possible. Being accepted into the family would be immense task. The internet is full of nonwhite men talking about their struggles with exactly this. Assuming that white women have lower standards than other women is also incredibly offensive and untrue. I'll also go ahead and link this study that shows white women are the least likely group to have a partner of another race, by a huge margin, lowering your chances even more than they already may be due to your life circumstances. Really shooting yourself in the foot with this fixation in every way.

You've created a caricature of white women in your head being Manic Pixie Dream Girls who will accept you and be everything you want, versus the caricature you've created of Asian women being high-maintenance harpies who would judge you. There's nothing healthy or normal about these thoughts. This is such a weird hill to die on and defend so profusely.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Again it feels like you're projecting idealized fantasies onto white people. Many white families would absolutely not be "chill" about their daughter dating a nonwhite man. If not outright disapproving of it, they'll almost certainly make racist and ignorant comments towards the nonwhite individual to make them uncomfortable as possible. Being accepted into the family would be immense task. The internet is full of nonwhite men talking about their struggles with exactly this. Assuming that white women have lower standards than other women is also incredibly offensive and untrue. I'll also go ahead and link this study that shows white women are the least likely group to have a partner of another race, by a huge margin, lowering your chances even more than they already may be due to your life circumstances. Really shooting yourself in the foot with this fixation in every way.

You've created a caricature of white women in your head being Manic Pixie Dream Girls who will accept you and be everything you want, versus the caricature you've created of Asian women being high-maintenance harpies who would judge you. There's nothing healthy or normal about these thoughts. This is such a weird hill to die on and defend so profusely.

I don't really think that study is very useful. I think I'm just weird among Asian men. Most of them are intolerant in a different way where they only prefer Asian women, and even then only the same type of Asian as them. Where I come from, almost every white person I know is either in a relationship with a nonwhite partner or clearly prefers men or women of a different race. The "idealized fantasies" in question come from anecdotes from all my Asian female friends who've had white partners. Three of my aunts also all married white men for the same reason. Why is it suddenly wrong when the genders reverse? I also don't think white people are as ignorant as you say, at least not here in the Silicon Valley where most of them are so far left, they're more likely to make the Asian parents cry.

I admit these preferences aren't very helpful though and I even said I would be willing to change my preference, but only if someone gave me a reason to. The Manic Pixie Dream Girl hope is accurate, because no matter what race the girl is, they would be the only reason life would be worth living to me. I can't really help that my only interest in living is either "find a wife and raise a family" or "die on this hill". I guess that's another way I'm doomed and this was all a mistake. I often believe that having a girlfriend won't save me, but it will give me a reason to even want to save myself. I suppose that's just the same thing which is why I'll never want to save myself at this rate but if it were so easy to just change my mind then I'd have done it by now.

I feel like you're very uptight on what you like on woman and expect from her, her family, her likings, etc... That's kinda of a recipe for disaster for depressed people looking for relationships. You can't just go into situations with whole scenarios already made up on your mind about how things should/will happen.

That's the anxiety at work I guess. I don't see how I'm being uptight about it considering I'm very low class in terms of my cultural tastes and my job. I'm only saying that I'm the one who's likely to be rejected by certain women because in my experience they're the ones who are more likely to be uptight. Not guaranteed, just more likely. I don't do well with low odds though.

 

[astr4]

Three of my aunts also all married white men for the same reason. Why is it suddenly wrong when the genders reverse?

ur aunts are wrong for this too

bro as an asian i hate the internalized racism and its p egregious amongst other women. they make excuses that oh i could never date an asian man, they remind me of a sibling etc etc it's all nonsense.

at the end of the day it all comes from this weird perception that we're more submissive and delicate and obedient somehow as asians. and for women that leads to us getting fetishized and for men it leads to you getting emasculated.

tbh i think even ur conception that no asian woman would ever be attracted to you is flawed and grounded in this same belief in obedient/docile/traditional asians. if you're being honest and descriptive in ur dating app profiles, for example, there are tons of more liberal/westernized asians that yk don't value money and family the way you think. ESPECIALLY the ones that grew up in the west. heck, i'm one of them lol. why are you so hung up on the parents piece? you're dating the girl not her family, right?

anyways i don't have any advice on the rest of the dating stuff but i feel very passionate about the internalized racism stuff. i get where you're coming from. i grew up around it too and it pissed me off. so much "asian men just aren't my type". but i hope other peoples racism hasn't put u off asian women forever bc i think ur doing urself a disservice there too, eliminating people with similar backgrounds to you from your dating pool, yk?

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

ur aunts are wrong for this too

bro as an asian i hate the internalized racism and its p egregious amongst other women. they make excuses that oh i could never date an asian man, they remind me of a sibling etc etc it's all nonsense.

at the end of the day it all comes from this weird perception that we're more submissive and delicate and obedient somehow as asians. and for women that leads to us getting fetishized and for men it leads to you getting emasculated.

tbh i think even ur conception that no asian woman would ever be attracted to you is flawed and grounded in this same belief in obedient/docile/traditional asians. if you're being honest and descriptive in ur dating app profiles, for example, there are tons of more liberal/westernized asians that yk don't value money and family the way you think. ESPECIALLY the ones that grew up in the west. heck, i'm one of them lol. why are you so hung up on the parents piece? you're dating the girl not her family, right?

anyways i don't have any advice on the rest of the dating stuff but i feel very passionate about the internalized racism stuff. i get where you're coming from. i grew up around it too and it pissed me off. so much "asian men just aren't my type". but i hope other peoples racism hasn't put u off asian women forever bc i think ur doing urself a disservice there too, eliminating people with similar backgrounds to you from your dating pool, yk?

Isn't it more likely that westernized Asian women would rather not have an Asian male partner? That's also been what I've seen at least. I know that's just another unhelpful generalization but like with all of them, they add up and still loom over me.

Other people being racist towards me is not what got me to turn away from Asian women. In fact, I went through most of my early life being surrounded by other Asians. The most anti-Asian things I ever heard came mostly from Indian people but I don't hold that against them especially since I consider them a part of Asia too. The main reason for shifting preferences was my first crush who I was friends with in 5th grade that I never got over until I was in my 2nd year of college and even now I still might have some lingering deep buried feelings for her. I don't feel like I hate myself for being Asian. I can hate myself for plenty of things but being Asian, Chinese, or Taiwanese is not among any of those things. I'm actually quite thankful that I even have a cultural background at all.

I probably do have some level of internalized racism that comes from growing up watching lots of western media but even if I do then that's not something that disappears overnight. For me, something like that doesn't even disappear with self awareness. I've been sitting on uncomfortable facts like this my whole life and yet I don't do anything about it. It's frustrating for everyone involved, including me.

 

[Cinnamorolls]

I don't really think that study is very useful. I think I'm just weird among Asian men. Most of them are intolerant in a different way where they only prefer Asian women, and even then only the same type of Asian as them. Where I come from, almost every white person I know is either in a relationship with a nonwhite partner or clearly prefers men or women of a different race. The "idealized fantasies" in question come from anecdotes from all my Asian female friends who've had white partners. Three of my aunts also all married white men for the same reason. Why is it suddenly wrong when the genders reverse? I also don't think white people are as ignorant as you say, at least not here in the Silicon Valley where most of them are so far left, they're more likely to make the Asian parents cry.

I happen to live around the same area and I don't want to be mean, but this is delusional. Yes, there's a lot of white men with Asian women here - mostly for fetish reasons as noted by @astr4 - but the reverse barely exists. The vast majority of white women here have white partners, much more rarely Latino or black, and almost never Asian. And white people here are still very much racist, they just don't say things in front of you because you're not also white. If you could be a fly on the wall in a room full of white people with no nonwhites present, you would be shocked what comes out of their mouths.

I want to ask this in the most neutral possible way: Why do you bump and ask for more people to respond to your posts if you are just going to argue with everyone...? Multiple people have noticed the same kind of things and pointed it out to you, yet you argue back at every one of us. It seems like you don't want advice, you just want to keep doing whatever you feel like and continue the cycle that makes you miserable. What's the point?

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

I want to ask this in the most neutral possible way: Why do you bump and ask for more people to respond to your posts if you are just going to argue with everyone...? Multiple people have noticed the same kind of things and pointed it out to you, yet you argue back at every one of us. It seems like you don't want advice, you just want to keep doing whatever you feel like and continue the cycle that makes you miserable. What's the point?

I guess I'm just terrible like that. I see people who are genuinely trying to help me by telling me truths I need to hear and suddenly I get defensive even though I'm usually used to beating myself up anyway. I also feel obligated to respond no matter what which is why I keep bumping my own thread.

You are correct that I do somewhat enjoy keeping this cycle going and making myself miserable. In many ways I feel validated in keeping myself this way because I deserve being an incel loser for how awful of a human being I've been. At the same time, I equally hate this situation I'm in. This perpetual loneliness has been gnawing at me and dragging me further into suicidal despair but the reality is that my anxiety has caused me to put up tons of mental defenses that can't be broken down easily just because I get called out a few times or just because I get confronted with my own failures over and over and over again.

I hope to clarify that even though I am arguing back against some of these points, I am still grateful for the advice at all and I am also definitely still taking them into consideration. I know that's not enough for some people and that actions should mean more than mere thoughts and wishes but I suppose part of what makes me such a piece of shit is that oftentimes when I ask for advice on something like this, I often feel like if it doesn't immediately feel like something I can do right away with zero stress or anxiety then it's just not worth doing at all. Perhaps this is partly due to some of my mental burnout or a whole host of other issues but if even a therapist gave up on me I just don't see any way out unfortunately.

 

[astr4]

in a strange twist when confronted with your intense level of self hatred i feel like i can see my own irrational thoughts more clearly ha

thinking about how i wanna tell u that surely you have more to offer the world and sometimes we keep ourselves stuck because it feels safer and familiar and reassuring

and then pulling an uno reverse card on myself and wondering why i won't offer the same compassion and understanding to myself hmm

anyways not to therapize us both but i wonder what we've done in our lives that makes us so undeserving of love. that there are murderers and rapists and serial killers in jail who get married and fall in love etc i know i certainly haven't hurt anyone to that extent and i doubt you have too

anyways just thinking today about "am i awful? or am i just human?" and i wanted to share that piece with u

it's okay to not feel ready to make a change or take any advice or whatever idk sometimes just talking about it and receiving validation and feeling heard is helpful in its own way

i know for my own mental defenses they are not logical in any way shape or form and i'm sure i'll address them one day but i kind of… carrot over the stick yk? these negative feelings won't go away if we beat them down and tell ourselves we're stupid for feeling this way etc etc

idk i hope you can be more patient with ur own coping mechanisms and behaviours. they come from a place of hurt and won't change overnight and that's okay. but it's like idk coaxing a turtle out of its shell, the irony, we can't be better versions of ourselves until we learn to accept our most flawed versions.

anyways i'm sorry i keep rambling in this thread i'm a little loopy rn but you don't seem like a bad person at all just someone stuck and i sympathize and i hope one day you receive the love you deserve.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

in a strange twist when confronted with your intense level of self hatred i feel like i can see my own irrational thoughts more clearly ha

thinking about how i wanna tell u that surely you have more to offer the world and sometimes we keep ourselves stuck because it feels safer and familiar and reassuring

and then pulling an uno reverse card on myself and wondering why i won't offer the same compassion and understanding to myself hmm

anyways not to therapize us both but i wonder what we've done in our lives that makes us so undeserving of love. that there are murderers and rapists and serial killers in jail who get married and fall in love etc i know i certainly haven't hurt anyone to that extent and i doubt you have too

anyways just thinking today about "am i awful? or am i just human?" and i wanted to share that piece with u

it's okay to not feel ready to make a change or take any advice or whatever idk sometimes just talking about it and receiving validation and feeling heard is helpful in its own way

i know for my own mental defenses they are not logical in any way shape or form and i'm sure i'll address them one day but i kind of… carrot over the stick yk? these negative feelings won't go away if we beat them down and tell ourselves we're stupid for feeling this way etc etc

idk i hope you can be more patient with ur own coping mechanisms and behaviours. they come from a place of hurt and won't change overnight and that's okay. but it's like idk coaxing a turtle out of its shell, the irony, we can't be better versions of ourselves until we learn to accept our most flawed versions.

anyways i'm sorry i keep rambling in this thread i'm a little loopy rn but you don't seem like a bad person at all just someone stuck and i sympathize and i hope one day you receive the love you deserve.

Don't feel sorry for rambling. It would be quite hypocritical for me to be offended by that when that's literally all I've done in most of my replies in this entire forum. Thanks for sympathizing and I hope you'll find some way out of your self hating too.

Often when I come across other people who hate themselves I think "surely they couldn't be as bad as me." I don't want to dismiss their own assessment of themselves. I never know how to tackle their self-hatred though without bringing up my own or by staying silent or by bringing up certain cliches since I'm just not informed enough about the person to know why they hate themselves so much which is crazy to ask for because I can't even fully name all of the reasons I hate myself. I'm not saying this is what you've done here. Again, I'm thankful that you've chimed in at all.

I only know what's going on in my own head and I try not to pretend I am an expert on anyone else. I truly believe though that if other people were somehow able to take an objective look at every single thing I've ever done and tallied up the good versus the bad, then the result would show I am overwhelmingly bad.

This thread alone clearly lays out how just my anxiety has caused me to say, think, believe, and do genuinely evil things worthy of whatever the opposite of praise is. There are other factors that have also led me to this point so much. I was probably traumatized somewhat in some way in my past that seems relatively minor and I came out of it worse than others who have suffered way worse and that just shows how weak and worthless I am.

I should apologize, I am sorry for taking your and other people's positive assessments of me and basically constantly trying to undermine any positive perception of me just to win negative brownie points in my own eyes. I don't know why I'm like this or how it came to be but it seems I can hardly stop tearing my dignity to shreds whether voluntarily or not. While I personally can't see how they are correct, I can see why people may think I am better and/or deserving of love more than I really am.

 

[Terios]

I know this might sound weird but I once got over a stupid obsession of four years by obsessing over a video game character instead, which eventually quickly wore off when it hit me that it was just a stupid thing to do, especially at my age... I dont think I could use this trick twice though but at the very least it did help me immensly.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

I know this might sound weird but I once got over a stupid obsession of four years by obsessing over a video game character instead, which eventually quickly wore off when it hit me that it was just a stupid thing to do, especially at my age... I dont think I could use this trick twice though but at the very least it did help me immensly.

First of all, big fan of your username. Not sure if it's meant to be a reference to the original concept art for Shadow the Hedgehog or not but either way it's still cool.

Secondly, I've already used this trick actually. With my first crush I was only able to move on thanks to Lucina from Fire Emblem Awakening. That was over ten years ago and even though I still hold Lucina in my heart it's just not enough anymore. My lizard brain wants the physical aspects of a relationship. I suppose this further makes me undeserving.

 

[Terios]

First of all, big fan of your username. Not sure if it's meant to be a reference to the original concept art for Shadow the Hedgehog or not but either way it's still cool.

You're on point, that's where I got it from.

Secondly, I've already used this trick actually. With my first crush I was only able to move on thanks to Lucina from Fire Emblem Awakening. That was over ten years ago and even though I still hold Lucina in my heart it's just not enough anymore. My lizard brain wants the physical aspects of a relationship. I suppose this further makes me undeserving.

Wanting the physical aspects of a relationship doesn't make you undeserving of it, it's all pretty normal and human. Hell there's a whole lot of actual horrible people who do get all the romantic love they need and want.
unfortunately when it comes to relationships (or other aspects of life), not everybody gets the happy ending, as shitty as it is that's just how life works.

 

[pyx]

necroing. did u end up succeeding? i'm suffering from a similar problem now, where my oneitis is a purely parasocial one. thread consists of a lot of advice being battered against a wall, so i'm not sure if that will help. interested to know how you manage these feelings, if at all

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

necroing. did u end up succeeding? i'm suffering from a similar problem now, where my oneitis is a purely parasocial one. thread consists of a lot of advice being battered against a wall, so i'm not sure if that will help. interested to know how you manage these feelings, if at all

Funny you should say that, it feels like only recently that I've even made any meaningful progress in this endeavor and I'm still not fully over her I'd say. I don't even know what I did. It's just that one day she started to make me panic less than usual (with Hydroxyzine medication though). I still haven't talked to her at length or been able to apologize yet but I guess it seems like this speed run has devolved into more of an idle game.

Perhaps another thing that may have helped for me is assuring myself that when I CTB it will be the best thing I can do for her. I believe part of why I even fell for her might be because I selfishly saw her as a way out of suicide and my survival instinct refuses to let go of her. Managing my survival instincts and reminding myself of why I need to die soon has actually been more helpful than anything else.

I hope my advice can help. I don't know if I've ever had to contend with a parasocial crush before. I suppose like with any stupid thing like this, the boring answer is just to limit exposure to them and to wait it out which sucks I know but at least it works, somewhat.

 

[pyx]

Funny you should say that, it feels like only recently that I've even made any meaningful progress in this endeavor and I'm still not fully over her I'd say. I don't even know what I did. It's just that one day she started to make me panic less than usual (with Hydroxyzine medication though). I still haven't talked to her at length or been able to apologize yet but I guess it seems like this speed run has devolved into more of an idle game.

Perhaps another thing that may have helped for me is assuring myself that when I CTB it will be the best thing I can do for her. I believe part of why I even fell for her might be because I selfishly saw her as a way out of suicide and my survival instinct refuses to let go of her. Managing my survival instincts and reminding myself of why I need to die soon has actually been more helpful than anything else.

I hope my advice can help. I don't know if I've ever had to contend with a parasocial crush before. I suppose like with any stupid thing like this, the boring answer is just to limit exposure to them and to wait it out which sucks I know but at least it works, somewhat.

did hydroxyzine decrease any limerent attachment, or did it just reduce the amount of stress when dealing with this person? i don't particularly feel any stress when thinking about my oneitis, but instead an overwhelming melancholy

but you're right in that i need to limit my exposure to them, which is what i have been trying to do. but for some reason, i derive a feeling of comfort whenever i am exposed to them, such that it brings me back to a time before everything went to hell. it's a nice feeling, but the melancholy is too much to bear

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

did hydroxyzine decrease any limerent attachment, or did it just reduce the amount of stress when dealing with this person? i don't particularly feel any stress when thinking about my oneitis, but instead an overwhelming melancholy

but you're right in that i need to limit my exposure to them, which is what i have been trying to do. but for some reason, i derive a feeling of comfort whenever i am exposed to them, such that it brings me back to a time before everything went to hell. it's a nice feeling, but the melancholy is too much to bear

Hydroxyzine is actually just an antihistamine. It basically works in reducing my anxiety by making me so tired that it's hard for me to even get worked up at all. It doesn't stop the limerent thoughts from sprouting every now and then though. Reminding myself that I don't deserve the benefits of love are all I can use to cope with. I guess that doesn't help my own malaise when it comes to realizing that this was just another example of continued failures to have a relationship. I can only take some small comfort in the fact that it's too late for me already and that I'll try to be dead soon in order to prevent future suffering both for me and for other women who I need to understand will never be interested in me because no woman ever would. I'm not sure if it's a good idea to follow my example though.

When I originally made this thread and for quite a while afterwards, I too kept going back to the moments with her that made me feel happy like when she complimented me or when I got to have pleasant conversations with her or when I was deluding myself into thinking she may have been interested in me. Dwelling on these memories and fantasies were both painful and comforting for me so I had to redirect them by focusing more on the pain instead of the pleasant parts. It still hasn't fully worked obviously but I suppose it helps a little.

 

[WearyDragon]

This thread stuck out to me because we have a lot of similarities. I too am a male in his 30s. Suffered a lot of rejection from women despite it being something I desperately want, likely also prone to limerence. Take a long time to get over rejection, and I take rejection hard. Way below average relationship experience for people our age. I have had similar self-hating and suicidal thoughts. Even have some hydroxyzine myself. And not least of all, I too was recently rejected by a coworker that I fell head-over-heels for and am trying desperately to emotionally survive the situation until I can gtfo.

Maybe this opinion is just bias because of how much I sympathize, but I feel like some of the responses here have erred on being too antagonistic with you. It's obvious you spend a great deal of your focus on self-recrimination, so as such, even if we hypothetically took for example a worst-case assumption that you're a total racist, this confrontational strategy would only cause you to double down in whatever that tendency is.

As it stands, I don't see any notable prejudice or discrimination in your words beyond what any average human has. You simply have a preference, and there's nothing morally wrong with that. I do think men are villainized more for having preferences, but honestly I don't think there's anything malicious in that. I think biologically, humans are driven to think what's correct is that females are selective and males are non-selective, as our survival for most of human history favored that.

But I'm getting distracted from the main thing I wanted to talk to you about, which is your hatred of yourself. I'm not going to directly attack it and tell you you shouldn't hate yourself, that you shouldn't say these things. I know at least a part of you knows you shouldn't. I know you've tried not saying these things. I know if I told you to stop talking about yourself like that, it will only make you do it harder. I know this because I'm the same way. If I tell someone I'm a loser and they tell me no, it's actually started to upset me a lot.

How can they lie to me like that? Clearly I'm a loser. I could almost win a debate with God Himself on the topic: I'm a stronger subject matter expert in what a piece of shit I am than anybody is a SME on anything. I have an impressively full bingo chart of ways I'm not good enough. Just the other day I was saying to a counselor a similar thing to what you've said in this thread: If you balanced all of the negative I've brought into this world against the positive, I have taken/hurt way more than I've given/helped. The counselor made a formidable reply regarding how that's not really something that could be measured. While I agree it's very subjective, you and I both know we can make damn good cases for why it's a substantial claim, even if not mathematically provable.

And in case you haven't already seen how similar our perspectives are on this, I'll tell you what my brain's favorite piece of evidence for what a loser I am is, because it's probably the same as yours right now. If we were wrong in our negative self-assessments, then these girls would have liked us back. Am I wrong in saying that's the one that really twists your heart when you think about it? It's a cold, tangible, external fact that they didn't choose us, and it's now marinating in the broth of many years of similar rejections, all of those equally real. No matter how much we love our family and friends, their biased positive reassurances to us are towered over by how large the hurt of these rejections are in our brains.

Whether what we had for these women were love, limerence, infatuation--no matter what meaning anyone wants to argue about the feelings we had for them, at the end of the day, we held (and for many of them, still hold) an extremely high regard for their opinions. The coworker I fell for is extremely admirable. She isn't perfect, but because of her extraordinary character and enthralling personality, the judgement from her came down hard on me. I wasn't good enough for her. But worse than the potency of that effect, I already agreed with her rejection long before I even met her. I have to wonder if ironically my belief that I'm not good enough is what sabotaged me, and maybe if I just believed in myself, I'd be with her right now.

Frankly, I don't know what to do with this either. Maybe it's different for you, but for me, I don't have her on a pedestal. If I wanted to use toxicity to cope over this, I could make a list of her flaws and burn them into my brain. I genuinely love and respect her, and that respect is built on the positive character traits I see in her. So when someone that trustworthy, disciplined, and virtuous wants nothing to do with me, I don't know how to not internalize that I'm implicitly untrustworthy, undisciplined, and without virtue.

I don't know what to do with this pain. Maybe the folks on here are right and really all we can do is distract ourselves with media and give it time. I just see a lot of (probably pop) psychology resources on the internet talking about processing emotions and how stuff like that won't help make it any better. I just don't know what else to try, man. I've tried the therapy. I've tried the medication. I've tried the exercise. I've tried the meditation. I've tried going on trips. I've tried eating and sleeping better. I've tried journaling. I've tried talking to friends and family. I'm religious, and even my faith has brought me no resolution despite constant prayer begging for delivery.

It's no wonder you and I have been driven to SI. It seems to us like it's our only escape from this pain. I want for it not to be, but as you know, hope is really hard to just dig out of the ground. People on here have talked some about picking yourself up, and there's a lot of merit in that. But some of us are just in an extraordinarily unlucky game of Chutes and Ladders and every time we've gotten close to a win, we hit that stupid long slide that takes us back to the beginning. And with rejection, that's a debuff to our confidence. It's hard not to carry that forward. I can tell you, like me, have carried a lot of that baggage forward. Just last night, my brain decided to review so many of the rejections and failures I've had in life. I don't really think this pain has made me stronger, but weaker. Especially for men, lowered confidence is a damning handicap in dating. Truly a snowball problem.

I sometimes question the usefulness of "pick yourself up" and "you have to be okay with being alone before being with someone else." I often wonder if it would have worked with just one of these women, I could finally have some tangible freaking proof that it's possible to love me. Because as of now, I only have proof that I'm lovable by familial instinct, friendship, or by God. But the deepest desire of my genes, what my brain has evolved to scream at me to obtain through many years of evolution, is to obtain the romantic love of a woman. Failure to do so can arguably amount to a cosmic judgement that my DNA is not worth passing on. That the awful, painful feeling I have inside that it would be better if I never existed is supported by my very composition.

So we have our genes screaming this at us on one side, and then we have a highly individualistic modern society screaming at us on the other that we need to bootstrap harder to be at peace with the unbearable isolation that our bad luck and choices have subjected us to. This is why I don't go all in on these platitudes. There has to be a happy medium. It's okay to want someone who is extremely important to you and have that be reciprocated. So many of the very people who tell us that shit have one themselves. So many of them would become blubbering babies if they lost their loved ones or faced the rejection we have.

So this is why we have the self hatred. We don't know what to do with this pain. I don't know what to do about the pain, but in regards to the self hatred, I wanted to discuss the concept of splitting. It's discussed in the context of borderline personality disorder, but I believe splitting is something that at least most people do to various degrees. Sorry if I'm explaining something you already know here, but splitting is when someone engages with a black-and-white fallacy of seeing something as completely bad or completely good, when in reality, most things are a mixture of bad and good. Sorry if I'm overstepping here, but it seems to me like you're splitting on yourself and perceiving yourself to be all bad. I know I'm doing so to myself. I have seen you describe yourself as pretty thoroughly bad in no uncertain terms, and unless I've missed it, I haven't seen you say anything genuinely positive about yourself.

Supposedly splitting is a defense mechanism. Apparently it's something we automatically do to help avoid feeling the full range of painful emotions that would come with engaging with the nuanced reality of the situation. For example, in the past when I was rejected by a girl, I would split on her negatively and think of her as all awful. My subconscious was attempting to create the opposite of the scenario I'm having now: If this girl is complete scum, then not only does her judgement of me mean less, but I'm not missing out on anything in the rejection. This allowed me to escape having to deal with the painful reality of the fact that I got rejected by a girl I would have really enjoyed being with, and she probably had some very real reasons for not being attracted to me.

I wonder if you used to do this too. I didn't just do it to girls who rejected me. I would do it to friends, acquaintances, teachers, family members. Eventually I learned how toxic it is to do to individuals. I think I learned how to transfer that pain and splitting tendency into 3 channels that I still split on to this day: the world as a whole, humanity as a whole, and myself. And more and more as I've seen how antisocial splitting on the world and humanity is, my splitting has become more and more focused on myself as the years pass. If I'm feeling so awful, something must be wrong, and something has to be blamed. It is like all of that pain and blame is eventually being absorbed into one target. The worst part of this is, it's reinforced by a lot of facts. No one is more responsible for my life than I am. Objectively, if we had to chose a single person to blame for my woes, I am the most appropriate.

How to stop splitting? I don't really know. I'm leaving the realm of what's written out there and stepping more into my own experience and theories, but I'm starting to think that splitting is entirely an emotional phenomenon. Take my feelings regarding my coworker for example. Discussion of splitting frequently focuses on negative splitting, but positive splitting can also have consequences. Despite intellectually perceiving and understanding plenty of flaws in this girl, as well as rationally believing that her judgement is far from perfect, the emotional side of my brain has implacably gilded her--I am completely incapable of feeling a negative emotion about her as a person or feeling averse to even the worst of her opinions.

So on the one hand, I have split on her positively and feel the intense pain of her absence from my life and what her rejection says about me. On the other hand, I have long ago split on myself, which comes with intense mental anguish and an encyclopedia of supporting negative data about myself. These two phenomenon support each other and feed into each other, acting as tentpoles to support my current inescapable self-hatred. Maybe some of this is the same for you. I know for me, healing won't be possible until I don't hate myself anymore.

My current gambit is to let time erode her place in my brain. Hopefully when the tentpole of my positive split on her falls on its own, the negative split on myself will be easier to handle. This has succeeded in the past, but it's looking like that's not going to happen as long as I still work with her. So I really need to prioritize getting a new job.

Sorry for how extremely long all of that got. I just really identified with your post. Hopefully I wrote something there that is useful to you, and selfishly I hope that writing it helped me as well.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

This thread stuck out to me because we have a lot of similarities. I too am a male in his 30s. Suffered a lot of rejection from women despite it being something I desperately want, likely also prone to limerence. Take a long time to get over rejection, and I take rejection hard. Way below average relationship experience for people our age. I have had similar self-hating and suicidal thoughts. Even have some hydroxyzine myself. And not least of all, I too was recently rejected by a coworker that I fell head-over-heels for and am trying desperately to emotionally survive the situation until I can gtfo.

Maybe this opinion is just bias because of how much I sympathize, but I feel like some of the responses here have erred on being too antagonistic with you. It's obvious you spend a great deal of your focus on self-recrimination, so as such, even if we hypothetically took for example a worst-case assumption that you're a total racist, this confrontational strategy would only cause you to double down in whatever that tendency is.

As it stands, I don't see any notable prejudice or discrimination in your words beyond what any average human has. You simply have a preference, and there's nothing morally wrong with that. I do think men are villainized more for having preferences, but honestly I don't think there's anything malicious in that. I think biologically, humans are driven to think what's correct is that females are selective and males are non-selective, as our survival for most of human history favored that.

But I'm getting distracted from the main thing I wanted to talk to you about, which is your hatred of yourself. I'm not going to directly attack it and tell you you shouldn't hate yourself, that you shouldn't say these things. I know at least a part of you knows you shouldn't. I know you've tried not saying these things. I know if I told you to stop talking about yourself like that, it will only make you do it harder. I know this because I'm the same way. If I tell someone I'm a loser and they tell me no, it's actually started to upset me a lot.

How can they lie to me like that? Clearly I'm a loser. I could almost win a debate with God Himself on the topic: I'm a stronger subject matter expert in what a piece of shit I am than anybody is a SME on anything. I have an impressively full bingo chart of ways I'm not good enough. Just the other day I was saying to a counselor a similar thing to what you've said in this thread: If you balanced all of the negative I've brought into this world against the positive, I have taken/hurt way more than I've given/helped. The counselor made a formidable reply regarding how that's not really something that could be measured. While I agree it's very subjective, you and I both know we can make damn good cases for why it's a substantial claim, even if not mathematically provable.

And in case you haven't already seen how similar our perspectives are on this, I'll tell you what my brain's favorite piece of evidence for what a loser I am is, because it's probably the same as yours right now. If we were wrong in our negative self-assessments, then these girls would have liked us back. Am I wrong in saying that's the one that really twists your heart when you think about it? It's a cold, tangible, external fact that they didn't choose us, and it's now marinating in the broth of many years of similar rejections, all of those equally real. No matter how much we love our family and friends, their biased positive reassurances to us are towered over by how large the hurt of these rejections are in our brains.

Whether what we had for these women were love, limerence, infatuation--no matter what meaning anyone wants to argue about the feelings we had for them, at the end of the day, we held (and for many of them, still hold) an extremely high regard for their opinions. The coworker I fell for is extremely admirable. She isn't perfect, but because of her extraordinary character and enthralling personality, the judgement from her came down hard on me. I wasn't good enough for her. But worse than the potency of that effect, I already agreed with her rejection long before I even met her. I have to wonder if ironically my belief that I'm not good enough is what sabotaged me, and maybe if I just believed in myself, I'd be with her right now.

Frankly, I don't know what to do with this either. Maybe it's different for you, but for me, I don't have her on a pedestal. If I wanted to use toxicity to cope over this, I could make a list of her flaws and burn them into my brain. I genuinely love and respect her, and that respect is built on the positive character traits I see in her. So when someone that trustworthy, disciplined, and virtuous wants nothing to do with me, I don't know how to not internalize that I'm implicitly untrustworthy, undisciplined, and without virtue.

I don't know what to do with this pain. Maybe the folks on here are right and really all we can do is distract ourselves with media and give it time. I just see a lot of (probably pop) psychology resources on the internet talking about processing emotions and how stuff like that won't help make it any better. I just don't know what else to try, man. I've tried the therapy. I've tried the medication. I've tried the exercise. I've tried the meditation. I've tried going on trips. I've tried eating and sleeping better. I've tried journaling. I've tried talking to friends and family. I'm religious, and even my faith has brought me no resolution despite constant prayer begging for delivery.

It's no wonder you and I have been driven to SI. It seems to us like it's our only escape from this pain. I want for it not to be, but as you know, hope is really hard to just dig out of the ground. People on here have talked some about picking yourself up, and there's a lot of merit in that. But some of us are just in an extraordinarily unlucky game of Chutes and Ladders and every time we've gotten close to a win, we hit that stupid long slide that takes us back to the beginning. And with rejection, that's a debuff to our confidence. It's hard not to carry that forward. I can tell you, like me, have carried a lot of that baggage forward. Just last night, my brain decided to review so many of the rejections and failures I've had in life. I don't really think this pain has made me stronger, but weaker. Especially for men, lowered confidence is a damning handicap in dating. Truly a snowball problem.

I sometimes question the usefulness of "pick yourself up" and "you have to be okay with being alone before being with someone else." I often wonder if it would have worked with just one of these women, I could finally have some tangible freaking proof that it's possible to love me. Because as of now, I only have proof that I'm lovable by familial instinct, friendship, or by God. But the deepest desire of my genes, what my brain has evolved to scream at me to obtain through many years of evolution, is to obtain the romantic love of a woman. Failure to do so can arguably amount to a cosmic judgement that my DNA is not worth passing on. That the awful, painful feeling I have inside that it would be better if I never existed is supported by my very composition.

So we have our genes screaming this at us on one side, and then we have a highly individualistic modern society screaming at us on the other that we need to bootstrap harder to be at peace with the unbearable isolation that our bad luck and choices have subjected us to. This is why I don't go all in on these platitudes. There has to be a happy medium. It's okay to want someone who is extremely important to you and have that be reciprocated. So many of the very people who tell us that shit have one themselves. So many of them would become blubbering babies if they lost their loved ones or faced the rejection we have.

So this is why we have the self hatred. We don't know what to do with this pain. I don't know what to do about the pain, but in regards to the self hatred, I wanted to discuss the concept of splitting. It's discussed in the context of borderline personality disorder, but I believe splitting is something that at least most people do to various degrees. Sorry if I'm explaining something you already know here, but splitting is when someone engages with a black-and-white fallacy of seeing something as completely bad or completely good, when in reality, most things are a mixture of bad and good. Sorry if I'm overstepping here, but it seems to me like you're splitting on yourself and perceiving yourself to be all bad. I know I'm doing so to myself. I have seen you describe yourself as pretty thoroughly bad in no uncertain terms, and unless I've missed it, I haven't seen you say anything genuinely positive about yourself.

Supposedly splitting is a defense mechanism. Apparently it's something we automatically do to help avoid feeling the full range of painful emotions that would come with engaging with the nuanced reality of the situation. For example, in the past when I was rejected by a girl, I would split on her negatively and think of her as all awful. My subconscious was attempting to create the opposite of the scenario I'm having now: If this girl is complete scum, then not only does her judgement of me mean less, but I'm not missing out on anything in the rejection. This allowed me to escape having to deal with the painful reality of the fact that I got rejected by a girl I would have really enjoyed being with, and she probably had some very real reasons for not being attracted to me.

I wonder if you used to do this too. I didn't just do it to girls who rejected me. I would do it to friends, acquaintances, teachers, family members. Eventually I learned how toxic it is to do to individuals. I think I learned how to transfer that pain and splitting tendency into 3 channels that I still split on to this day: the world as a whole, humanity as a whole, and myself. And more and more as I've seen how antisocial splitting on the world and humanity is, my splitting has become more and more focused on myself as the years pass. If I'm feeling so awful, something must be wrong, and something has to be blamed. It is like all of that pain and blame is eventually being absorbed into one target. The worst part of this is, it's reinforced by a lot of facts. No one is more responsible for my life than I am. Objectively, if we had to chose a single person to blame for my woes, I am the most appropriate.

How to stop splitting? I don't really know. I'm leaving the realm of what's written out there and stepping more into my own experience and theories, but I'm starting to think that splitting is entirely an emotional phenomenon. Take my feelings regarding my coworker for example. Discussion of splitting frequently focuses on negative splitting, but positive splitting can also have consequences. Despite intellectually perceiving and understanding plenty of flaws in this girl, as well as rationally believing that her judgement is far from perfect, the emotional side of my brain has implacably gilded her--I am completely incapable of feeling a negative emotion about her as a person or feeling averse to even the worst of her opinions.

So on the one hand, I have split on her positively and feel the intense pain of her absence from my life and what her rejection says about me. On the other hand, I have long ago split on myself, which comes with intense mental anguish and an encyclopedia of supporting negative data about myself. These two phenomenon support each other and feed into each other, acting as tentpoles to support my current inescapable self-hatred. Maybe some of this is the same for you. I know for me, healing won't be possible until I don't hate myself anymore.

My current gambit is to let time erode her place in my brain. Hopefully when the tentpole of my positive split on her falls on its own, the negative split on myself will be easier to handle. This has succeeded in the past, but it's looking like that's not going to happen as long as I still work with her. So I really need to prioritize getting a new job.

Sorry for how extremely long all of that got. I just really identified with your post. Hopefully I wrote something there that is useful to you, and selfishly I hope that writing it helped me as well.

All of your assumptions about me are correct, unfortunately. I don't know yet if your reply will help me but at least I'm honored that you've felt compelled to sign up and post here as your first post on this forum. Sorry about what's happening to you though.

At the end of the day all I need to stop hating on myself is to be proven wrong and so far that has yet to ever occur. Wanting this to happen sinks me deeper into irredeemability.

I think even if I were to get a new job there's nothing stopping me from running into the same issue especially if the new job is better than my current one. If it's worse then I'll also be miserable for that reason alone, it's a lose/lose.

I've never heard of splitting before so that was indeed new information to me. I suppose in many ways I also do it. I've said before that often times I feel like two separate people, both of whom are equally shitty and both of whom share great hatred for each other and themselves. I never know which one I am so I just continue to do things hoping it will screw over the other one. The ONLY times in recent years that I've come close to merging these two selves into a whole person that doesn't hate themself is a few years ago when I met someone online from here who was interested in me. She called it off because she probably didn't like how I don't have a place of my own but for the few days we were chatting I finally felt like I didn't hate myself anymore. It sucks that this is the only thing I know will help me because I've still done nothing to deserve it and I doubt I'm ever going to anytime soon.

I too just wish there was something more that could be done. Maybe in another couple decades AI and androids can successfully fill the void but honestly with how things are going I don't want to wait that long.

One good thing about the previous responses to this thread though were that some of them did get me to challenge some of my own preferences. I already had to do that once when I thought my current crush was into me since she already was outside my preferences. Now at least I think I can be at least a little more flexible although them signaling to me first would still have to be a must especially after this experience…

 

[WearyDragon]

All of your assumptions about me are correct, unfortunately. I don't know yet if your reply will help me but at least I'm honored that you've felt compelled to sign up and post here as your first post on this forum. Sorry about what's happening to you though.

At the end of the day all I need to stop hating on myself is to be proven wrong and so far that has yet to ever occur. Wanting this to happen sinks me deeper into irredeemability.

I think even if I were to get a new job there's nothing stopping me from running into the same issue especially if the new job is better than my current one. If it's worse then I'll also be miserable for that reason alone, it's a lose/lose.

I've never heard of splitting before so that was indeed new information to me. I suppose in many ways I also do it. I've said before that often times I feel like two separate people, both of whom are equally shitty and both of whom share great hatred for each other and themselves. I never know which one I am so I just continue to do things hoping it will screw over the other one. The ONLY times in recent years that I've come close to merging these two selves into a whole person that doesn't hate themself is a few years ago when I met someone online from here who was interested in me. She called it off because she probably didn't like how I don't have a place of my own but for the few days we were chatting I finally felt like I didn't hate myself anymore. It sucks that this is the only thing I know will help me because I've still done nothing to deserve it and I doubt I'm ever going to anytime soon.

I too just wish there was something more that could be done. Maybe in another couple decades AI and androids can successfully fill the void but honestly with how things are going I don't want to wait that long.

One good thing about the previous responses to this thread though were that some of them did get me to challenge some of my own preferences. I already had to do that once when I thought my current crush was into me since she already was outside my preferences. Now at least I think I can be at least a little more flexible although them signaling to me first would still have to be a must especially after this experience…

I disagree that finding someone to reciprocate your limerence is the only way you can stop hating yourself. Maybe that's true in some kind of way, but I know it would be possible for you to at least reduce how much you hate yourself on your own. One of the things that contribute to how much we don't like ourselves are the very real or reasonable list of facts we can list about ourselves to support our self-hate. If I can attack and take down even one of those items, then I know I will hate myself ever so slightly less, because my list of self-judgements will be slightly smaller. If I can work up enough fucks to work out once, then I can remove "haven't worked out in weeks" from my list for a while. I don't think this will solve the core of the problem. Like I said in my reply, I'm of the opinion "love yourself first" is a mostly ineffective cope for the luckier folks who either don't care about finding someone as much as us, or haven't faced the same amount of rejection we have. But if I can reduce how much I hate myself, I can reduce my pain and grow my confidence by a marginal amount. If I can do those things, I might be able to try faking it again and I'll be able to try obtaining that love again.

I avoid thinking of coworkers as potential dating options. This has served me well in my life and this recent event has fully proven to me how wise it has been to live by that. No matter how interesting or attractive I perceive them to be, I treat and perceive them as though they were just another one of the boomers at my workplace. This latest event only happened because she started flirting with me. I've been wanting to leave this job anyway and I was like "well, what are the odds I'll even like her that much". Really, it's probably not even that good of an idea to be close friends with your coworkers. Any time I see that, it creates all kinds of drama and problems at work. It's a shame because modern society has destroyed the third space, so I don't recommend that as a universal rule like I do the dating one.

So yeah, maybe consider leaving your job a little more if you can spin up the gumption to do job searches. You might even find that you find a better job than the one you have and it'll be a double win. The fear of finding a worse job is a real one, and it's one that's kept me at my current job as well, but my job is pretty lousy and I'm getting to the point where the suffering of still being around this girl all the time and being unable to move on is making it unbearable enough for me to want to take a worse job. Of course, you gotta figure out how to min/max all of that for yourself. I would just say be careful that your limerence isn't convincing you to stay at this job just to continue to be around this girl. If things truly will never pan out between you two and healing for you requires you to not be forced to see her all the time, then you have to consider the value of healing.

 

[AvaCutey]

If you want to move on as fast as possible, you have to physically move out of your town/city and find a new place to call home—a new town, city, or even country. Don't announce your move, just go. Cut your hair, find a new style, and make who you are now different and distinct from who you used to be. Psychologically, this forcefully starts a new chapter in your life. Fill this chapter with new experiences, do things you haven't done, the more unfamiliar, the stronger your new memories will be.

Dive into a completely new culture or language. The steeper the learning curve, the less mental space you'll have for old memories. Volunteer for high-intensity experiences like disaster relief or wildlife conservation - they'll reframe your perspective rapidly. Push your physical limits. Run a marathon, climb a mountain, or learn a challenging sport. The endorphin rush and sense of accomplishment will rewire your brain.

But just realize that none of this will be easy, or healthy mentally. Running from problems doesn't resolve them - they often resurface later, and now that you buried them, you won't, know why you feel that way. There's always a trade-off for everything in life.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

I disagree that finding someone to reciprocate your limerence is the only way you can stop hating yourself. Maybe that's true in some kind of way, but I know it would be possible for you to at least reduce how much you hate yourself on your own. One of the things that contribute to how much we don't like ourselves are the very real or reasonable list of facts we can list about ourselves to support our self-hate. If I can attack and take down even one of those items, then I know I will hate myself ever so slightly less, because my list of self-judgements will be slightly smaller. If I can work up enough fucks to work out once, then I can remove "haven't worked out in weeks" from my list for a while. I don't think this will solve the core of the problem. Like I said in my reply, I'm of the opinion "love yourself first" is a mostly ineffective cope for the luckier folks who either don't care about finding someone as much as us, or haven't faced the same amount of rejection we have. But if I can reduce how much I hate myself, I can reduce my pain and grow my confidence by a marginal amount. If I can do those things, I might be able to try faking it again and I'll be able to try obtaining that love again.

I avoid thinking of coworkers as potential dating options. This has served me well in my life and this recent event has fully proven to me how wise it has been to live by that. No matter how interesting or attractive I perceive them to be, I treat and perceive them as though they were just another one of the boomers at my workplace. This latest event only happened because she started flirting with me. I've been wanting to leave this job anyway and I was like "well, what are the odds I'll even like her that much". Really, it's probably not even that good of an idea to be close friends with your coworkers. Any time I see that, it creates all kinds of drama and problems at work. It's a shame because modern society has destroyed the third space, so I don't recommend that as a universal rule like I do the dating one.

So yeah, maybe consider leaving your job a little more if you can spin up the gumption to do job searches. You might even find that you find a better job than the one you have and it'll be a double win. The fear of finding a worse job is a real one, and it's one that's kept me at my current job as well, but my job is pretty lousy and I'm getting to the point where the suffering of still being around this girl all the time and being unable to move on is making it unbearable enough for me to want to take a worse job. Of course, you gotta figure out how to min/max all of that for yourself. I would just say be careful that your limerence isn't convincing you to stay at this job just to continue to be around this girl. If things truly will never pan out between you two and healing for you requires you to not be forced to see her all the time, then you have to consider the value of healing.

Yeah, whenever I do try to hate myself less it ends with me doing things to spoil myself that also end up sabotaging myself long term. Unfortunately I can't get over how little I care about myself. After all, why should I be forced to forgive the one person who's caused me the most pain and suffering? Why should I be made to feel sympathy for my greatest abuser just because he also happens to be me?

Logically it doesn't make much sense, but it's still something I haven't been able to get through. Only when I've thought I was going to come close to having a relationship did I ever feel that "hey maybe me and myself, the two of us, should at least shake hands and begrudgingly get along just for this person". Unfortunately when things fall through it's back to total chaos and warfare. We're like the Middle East, except all it would take to end all the violence would be something we don't deserve.

If you want to move on as fast as possible, you have to physically move out of your town/city and find a new place to call home—a new town, city, or even country. Don't announce your move, just go. Cut your hair, find a new style, and make who you are now different and distinct from who you used to be. Psychologically, this forcefully starts a new chapter in your life. Fill this chapter with new experiences, do things you haven't done, the more unfamiliar, the stronger your new memories will be.

Dive into a completely new culture or language. The steeper the learning curve, the less mental space you'll have for old memories. Volunteer for high-intensity experiences like disaster relief or wildlife conservation - they'll reframe your perspective rapidly. Push your physical limits. Run a marathon, climb a mountain, or learn a challenging sport. The endorphin rush and sense of accomplishment will rewire your brain.

But just realize that none of this will be easy, or healthy mentally. Running from problems doesn't resolve them - they often resurface later, and now that you buried them, you won't, know why you feel that way. There's always a trade-off for everything in life.

Honestly I would love to do this but I just can't. I don't make nearly enough money to afford starting a new life and my mom and sisters depend on me, especially my sister who is severely autistic. My physical limits are very low. I'm not one for exercise since I personally believe it's equivalent to made up horoscope nonsense since nobody I've seen ever actually commits to it or they have to use steroids to fake it.