Story FuneralCry

[Suicidebydeath]

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/thre...-actually-gets-it-and-me-is-funeralcry.91226/

Thank you so much.

Thank you as well. This is nice to see especially after what happened on the forum recently. I always try to understand what others are going through and of course I can relate to all the posts about how horrible this life is. I wish you the best.

I also always appreciate Funeralcry's comments and theards.

I always love seeing Funeralcry's comments and it means a lot when they discuss on the forum. Though we haven't talked much, I look up to them, honestly.

I've seen them get a lot of hate and it just reaffirms my distrust in people. Where do we get support if not here?

I nominate FuneralCry. She's been here for a very long time, is about as active as anyone could be, and has a lot of empathy. The current Mods should recruit her. She'd be a fabulous Mod, IMO.

Trash has been taken out.

@FuneralCry your thread is no longer hijacked by garbage. Vent away!

Profile comment: "I'm sorry for being mean to you FuneralCry.
Thank you for being there for everyone. You make sure that nobody's post are ignored and that everyone is noticed. Thank you."

@FuneralCry For their philosophical threads and in depth responses.

FC: Your feelings of wishing to be gone from this world are understandable. I find it so dreadful the thought of still being here for another year, existing certainly is very awful. But I hope that when the time is right for you to leave, you find the freedom that you wish for.

Thanks FuneralCry, I hope you can find the peaceful method too.

Every single one of the ten posts you've made since mid-September is essentially a taunt as to why FuneralCry is still alive - basically saying "the same thing over and over again" - the very thing you accuse her of doing. At least FuneralCry's posts are thoughtful, and have some substance, whereas your posts are devoid of both those attributes.

You're not really contributing are you, you're just here to troll FuneralCry ...​

FC: There is a resources section and a search function, so people can search for any information they need. I hope that you find relief from your suffering in whatever you decide to do. I'm sorry for whatever brought you to this point.

Thanks @FuneralCry

Why did I start this thread with a bunch of quotes about FuneralCry? This is just a sample of what I could find in the first 4 pages of search if I typed in FuneralCry into the search bar, and removed instances of bullying ~ that I don't want to repeat here since FC might read this thread and doesn't need to be retraumatized by those specifics.

The way that a certain subset of people, not going to say how many, talk about and perceive FC is very differently to how many others in the community feel about her and her posts. This is the same user that has been bullied practically for months, and among other things they call her bot, npc, divisive, controversial, that her 16000 posts are basically all the same, etc.

Since I am not the most eloquent or persuasive writer, I suffer from PTSD and many other things. I felt like it would be better to let other people speak, using their own words(sorry for the quotes of everyone), and show the factual past. Then people can decide whether or not the bullying of FC is fair and whether the things people say about her are true or untrue. I intend to show that it's essentially lies & slander and to prove my point I will spend some of my time going through the past and posting the positives about FC. Whether this will be helpful or not, I do not know. I do not intend to stir up more drama, I want to put an end to it once and for all. I am not asking for punishments, I am asking for people to rethink their behaviour and just maybe listen to the moderation team and leave FC alone. I do not think she deserves the treatments or statements she receives, I think this is most unfair.

So for my end, I will spend some time to highlight the positives about FC. I will leave it in the hands of @RainAndSadness if she wishes to bring forward examples of lowkey & highkey attacks on FC, perhaps in another thread. This is meant to be positive. If the moderators decide this is unhelpful and or this thread gets horribly derailed and think its best to lock it, then I am ok with that. I just can't sit back while this whole situation unfolds and do nothing.

I said that when my life gets more sorted I will do what I can to help others. Currently I am away from and NC with my abusive family, I have my own self-contained flat, I am relatively safe and not in any particular danger. I do not care its a high crime area thats the absolute least of my IRL problems. So for as I am concerned I am safe and alright and can start improving my own life with less stress. I do not want to see other people end up in a situation where I was, with everyone putting everything on top of them and leaving them exhausted and bereft. It's a nightmare I don't want to see anyone else suffer.

I do wish there was a way to break this up into separate posts, because this is going to be a bit of a tl;dr if someone doesn't reply. Unfortunately there is no way to do that, the site will automatically append everything I write into the same post as long as nobody else replies. This isn't an invitation to reply, although anyone can. However I won't be able to respond without it interrupting my flow. I promise to engage with people if its in fair-minded and good nature. For now I just wish this to be a positive thread.

Anyway please bear with the tl;dr and skim or don't read as necessary.

As you can see, in the above quotes I have already found more people that benefitted from interactions with FC than the number of people that have been harassing her over the past few months, and that is just in samples the search bar gave me within 4 pages. You can imagine that the search bar is likely to cap or my endurance to run out far earlier than I will find all of the members that FC has made to feel better or supported. I will do my best however working from the current time as far as I can go. So we have results from 4 pages from other members, now I will go through some of FC's own postings -without her permission for now but I don't think she would mind. I will show that she does not post mostly divisive/controversial posts and that she is not npc/botlike and she does tailor her responses, does not copy and paste.

On that anyway, I do not see the problem if someone would write either terse or c&p responses anyway. This is something I do myself, because I simply often lack the energy and my brain will fog out, but I still want to send support. I just do the best I can. FuneralCry is always on top of her responses. The only short replies are understandable and kind, such as "Thank you for being kind.".
Vent: everyone should have the right to die and to have access to peaceful methods.

Of course everyone should. I view it as being absolutely horrific how we exist in a world where people continue to selfishly and unfairly force people here yet they are denied a straightforward way to finally end this unnecessary existence. After all, death is simply the most normal and expected thing ever so there could never be anything wrong with someone choosing to leave, and all that continuing to exist is, is just delaying the inevitable anyway.

It really would be the most ideal and compassionate thing to allow people the option of a peaceful exit where they can solve all their problems and never have to suffer again, it's so wrong to make it so people have no choice but to resort to risky methods, in fact it's incredibly disgusting. Suicide should always be viewed as the human right that it is.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/do-you-ever-feel-like-a-coward.107681/

After all, suicide can certainly be very difficult so it doesn't exactly mean that you are cowardly feeling like you are unable to go through with it. Of course if methods like hanging were easier I would be long gone at this point, that method scares me because of the risks involved. I really envy and admire the courage of those who have managed to succeed with it though.

But I do understand that it really can be so awful and tiring feeling so trapped in this world, it really shouldn't be so difficult for us to finally free ourselves from this hellish world, all those who wish to leave should be able to exit in a straightforward and peaceful way. Anyway, I hope that you find the freedom that you wish for.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/going-to-try-tonight.107678/

That sounds like a really horrible situation to be in, so I hope that you find the freedom that you wish for.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/its-getting-too-difficult.107615/

It really sounds like you have suffered a lot and it's understandable wishing to be free from it all. It's awful how other people can just create more harm and cause others to suffer more, I certainly do think that humans are responsible for so much of the torment that sadly exists in this world. But anyway I think that those who have the option of SN by their side are fortunate, it definitely sounds preferable to some of the more risky methods, the thought of ctb failing really is so terrifying to me. I wish you the best.

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/fake-empathy-sympathy.107674/

It's really true that you cannot trust people, so many people in this world just create more suffering and make this world a more hellish place. It certainly makes the thought of death sound even more appealing when I hear of how many people act in such an awful way.

edit:^I accidentally posted the same quote twice, this has been amended.

That did not take long at all. These are just 5 of FC's recent replies to threads. I don't know what other people see, but I see an empathetic and supportive person who understands how suicidal people feel. I do not see someone who deserves to be bullied & harassed for months on end for being a "bot" "npc" "divisive" "controversial" and many other things I don't wish to reprint because they're too offensive.

I could carry on, FC has literally thousands of different supportive comments. She made these while extremely stressed out and feeling the site was unsafe to post on. If you go back in her history there are only more comments that she makes like this. So I feel I have made my point already with just these 5 which are all recent (1st page of her #latest-activity, you can check for yourself).

In no way is this deifying FC or anything else that her denouncers would like to claim, as they have previously. This is all hard, cold facts, posts taken straight from the site itself. Is it fair that FC gets bullied for month, that someone literally said she's being given special treatment, being told she is a bot/npc, 16K divisive posts etc? All these are lies made about her. I hope I've shown otherwise because if not I can devote more of my time on this subject, this literally did not take much digging for me to do this at all.

@AreWeWinning Why the angry react? Is it something I did or because FC is still being bullied, as it has been for months now? x

 

[Lone_Traveler90]

I agree with you. This person (FC) seems to actually take a time to read posts and respond to them. In my opinion that's showing a compassion to posters problems.
I do not see any way that person (FC) would benefit in responding to so many posts, I think it's because she/he truly cares about this community.
After all, aren't we all here to look for a support in our darkest moments because we can't get it anywhere else?

 

[Suicidebydeath]

I agree with you. This person (FC) seems to actually take a time to read posts and respond to them. In my opinion that's showing a compassion to posters problems.
I do not see any way that person (FC) would benefit in responding to so many posts, I think it's because she/he truly cares about this community.
After all, aren't we all here to look for a support in our darkest moments because we can't get it anywhere else?

Thank you, and you are absolutely correct. This is a forum for support for people in their darkest moments, people that to be blunt, are feeling suicidal. FC provides constant support and can empathise with people that feel that way. It's almost as if her denouncers forget what this forum is. FC can resonate with a lot of people in their darkest times, and the comments she makes on other people's posts seem supportive enough that it would make people feel a little bit better, that someone understands. It's difficult to find that understanding outside of this forum.

I am thinking now that I should make a separate thread part II, and continue with all of FC's supportive posts. It will basically be a resource, not of any particular interest to anyone, but to serve as a counter to any argument that I have cherry picked FC's posts. She has over 16K, so it would take me a while, but I'm prepared to do it to backup what I say.

 

[Gaga786]

Thank you so much for doing this.In real life, I am gaslighted and often invalidated-a scenario in which most of us have faced. However, while venting on here, its the opposite and I feel like my points are valid at times. I feel like I have found my own people here. FC has been nothing but kind to me, as she has to everyone else, and has validated all of my statements. Her compassion resonates with me because some of our beliefs are homogenous. I don't feel alienated anymore.

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

Even if I don't always agree with what funeralcry has to say in terms of philosophy or disagreements with other people (and no one is ever going to be in 100% agreement with someone else, let's be real) I have always appreciated the kind responses she has left on my posts and the empathy she has displayed towards me, especially when I have spoken about my abuse history here. Even when others didn't respond to my vents, she always did, and that is something I am very grateful for. It definitely made me feel less alone when I needed it most.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

FC has been nothing but kind to me, as she has to everyone else, and has validated all of my statements. Her compassion resonates with me because some of our beliefs are homogenous. I don't feel alienated anymore.

This is the impression I get from her replies as well. I just put myself in the shoes of the OP and I can tell that FC has made that person feel validated. FC also often replies to my own vents, while I make very few OPs/vents myself, I'm more of a commenter, and sometimes is the only person to reply at all. Simply because when I make a vent OP I'm usually beyond the pale of being stressed out, at rock bottom in fog brain land, and FC is the only person who can still find a way to empathise or at least make an attempt. She's always supportive, to the point of being reliably so.

Even if I don't always agree with what funeralcry has to say in terms of philosophy or disagreements with other people (and no one is ever going to be in 100% agreement with someone else, let's be real) I have always appreciated the kind responses she has left on my posts and the empathy she has displayed towards me, especially when I have spoken about my abuse history here. Even when others didn't respond to my vents, she always did, and that is something I am very grateful for. It definitely made me feel less alone when I needed it most.

Same for me. I try to be positive, but I can understand that it's impossible for some people. I think even some of the people I loved, several that have passed away now, felt that way and there was nothing I could do to change that. I've met and spoken to people and darkness is their friend, and they don't have a way out. I think its understandable anyway, that we can be both suicidal ourselves and not want the people we like to leave, or wish them to find happiness instead. There's a strange duality about it.

So we can wish happiness on others, but also understand that it can be impossible.

 

[AloneInCollege]

As far as I'm considered, she's one of the most kind and considerate people on this site.

 

[ImsooDone1N]

Someone was Bullying FC in the chat a few days ago. It was late, I was really stoned and fixing to get high (but not quite High yet) and I just went off on this one user who said something negative about FC. I was in a sour mood, so it could have been anyone, and I would have still snapped, but thinking back, I was glad I let that user know its not okay to make fun of others, or to try to get a laugh at their expense. I really value FC, I enjoy and relate to her posts and tho I would never say "Im glad xx is a member here", I would say I am grateful for their contributions to the forum.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

As far as I'm considered, she's one of the most kind and considerate people on this site.

I agree.

Someone was Bullying FC in the chat a few days ago. It was late, I was really stoned and fixing to get high (but not quite High yet) and I just went off on this one user who said something negative about FC. I was in a sour mood, so it could have been anyone, and I would have still snapped, but thinking back, I was glad I let that user know its not okay to make fun of others, or to try to get a laugh at their expense. I really value FC, I enjoy and relate to her posts and tho I would never say "Im glad xx is a member here", I would say I am grateful for their contributions to the forum.

Thank you for standing up for her while she presumably wasn't around as well. I for one cannot stand bullying, I've been bullied by my family, at school, for most of my life. I've been attacked & harassed for standing up for and defending friends from other people. That latter is one thing I absolutely do no regret, I would do it again 1000 times even if it always had the same result in me being isolated. There's no place for it in this world. People shouldn't talk behind each other's back too, but that's another story. Thank you for standing up for another person xx

 

[Forever Sleep]

I agree- I think FuneralCry is one of the most compassionate people on here. I feel so moved by her responses to people- no matter their situation. She has an enormous amount of empathy despite obviously suffering greatly herself.

I do have to say that my point of view doesn't always align with hers. That's to be expected- we are all individuals here. We all come from different backgrounds. I, personally have never felt any harshness towards me despite expressing my difference of opinion. (Which I feel we should all have the right to do- with respect of course.)

I do understand why FC posts the way she does. For her- it is the absolute, obvious truth that life is utterly meaningless and dreadful and there's no point in caring what our suicide's will do to our families because- death is inevitable and we'll be dead- so- we won't be here to know about the aftermath.

Still- I hope you can also appreciate that these aren't opinions EVERYONE is going to hold. It's ok if they are presented as personal opinions but when they are presented as facts (where everyone who doesn't agree is delusional) honestly- on a public forum- you ARE going to get disagreement.

For some people who question FC, the replied intended insults of: 'pro-life' or 'get lost' aren't great in my opinion. I'm not saying they weren't provoked- I don't honestly know. I get the impression some of these feuds go way back. I don't know who started it and who is retaliating- I just wish it would stop.

Like I say- we come from VERY different backgrounds here. Just because someone once enjoyed their life once, or that they even see life itself as not totally evil- it doesn't make their pain NOW any less valid or deep. I know we're bound to get differences of opinion here and ideally- these really ought to be kept as civil discussions. I also think FC may only be retaliating to posts that may have been initially insulting. (Like I say- I've never experienced any trouble despite holding some different views.)

Still- honestly speaking- to tell ANYONE on a suicide forum to 'get lost' isn't good in my opinion... She may BELIEVE they are trolls because they seem to express a different approach to suicide and life. Still- we are an isolated group of people as it is. This is one of the only places we can actually express how we feel.

I sometimes DO get the impression that there is a desire to 'gatekeep' this section of the forum for only the most 'genuinely' depressive posts. You can see this from my post yesterday:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/thre...ave-been-born-in-the-first-place-poll.107643/

People who said they would in fact choose to be born to begin with (if that choice were possible with hindsight) were more or less apologising! Describing their vote as: 'A fly in the ointment', an 'unpopular opinion' or 'skewing the vote'. Why? Is it obligatory to hate life itelf to be on this forum?

I'm not saying that FC has created this environment by any means. It's just that there does seem to be an intolerance towards people who express any kind of positivity towards life- plus- happen to strongly disagree with the Nihilistic viewpoint.

For me- I believe ideation can affect ANYONE from any walk of life. I therefore feel it's important that a forum such as this is welcoming to all points of view. From what I've seen, I beieve warnings have been sent in all directions from @RainAndSadness - so, hopefully, things will quieten down.

I want to end saying that I despise bullying. There is NO excuse for people to be rude to one another here. We are suffering enough. We are adults too- we ought to be able to express differences of opinion without it degrading to name calling. I REALLY hope things just calm down.

I agree- I think FuneralCry is a great benefit to this forum. I just think it would be good if we could ALL learn to get along better. Some viewpoints around here aren't going to change. I just wish we could ALL learn to be more tolerant of one another.

 

[AreWeWinning]

@AreWeWinning Why the angry react? Is it something I did or because FC is still being bullied, as it has been for months now? x

Basically, that's my protest against your post. It's because you are protecting her. I'm in the camp of those who don't like her posts.

It's true that her posts are thoughtful and compassionate. This feels comforting and flattering for many people, which is evidenced by the reactions she receives.

The problem is, in my opinion, that she does not offer a solution to either herself or the people she interacts with. To me, it seems like she is just stuck in this loop of endless suffering. She does not even try to take steps towards a possible solution in either direction. This is bad for her and for the people around her. It is also the definition of an 'echo chamber'.

Maybe I'm just too pragmatic. It's not an easy topic. You can consider 'being compassionate' a good thing if it saves lives. If the goal is to save lives, and if what FuneralCry does gives people solace, then there is no harm, right? But then I ask: Is this really the life you want to live? (It's a rhetorical question, and if we are pro-choice, then any answer is valid. My answer is "no".)

It is also true that our own reflection in others shows us who we are. The things we don't like in others may be the very things we have in ourselves too or the things we are most afraid of. Maybe FuneralCry's comments annoy people because they see FuneralCry's qualities in themselves too. Maybe they are just so afraid of being stuck in this helpless state of mind themselves, and the 'bullying' is just a reflection of their own fears. Maybe it's true for me too. On the other hand, those who are brave enough to get on with their plans just ignore her. Or those who are strong enough to get on the path of recovery.

As for myself, I just put her on my ignore list some time ago. That's the easiest solution.

 

[Lone_Traveler90]

Basically, that's my protest against your post. It's because you are protecting her. I'm in the camp of those who don't like her posts.

It's true that her posts are thoughtful and compassionate. This feels comforting and flattering for many people, which is evidenced by the reactions she receives.

The problem is, in my opinion, that she does not offer a solution to either herself or the people she interacts with. To me, it seems like she is just stuck in this loop of endless suffering. She does not even try to take steps towards a possible solution in either direction. This is bad for her and for the people around her. It is also the definition of an 'echo chamber'.

Maybe I'm just too pragmatic. It's not an easy topic. You can consider 'being compassionate' a good thing if it saves lives. If the goal is to save lives, and if what FuneralCry does gives people solace, then there is no harm, right? But then I ask: Is this really the life you want to live? (It's a rhetorical question, and if we are pro-choice, then any answer is valid. My answer is "no".)

It is also true that our own reflection in others shows us who we are. The things we don't like in others may be the very things we have in ourselves too or the things we are most afraid of. Maybe FuneralCry's comments annoy people because they see FuneralCry's qualities in themselves too. Maybe they are just so afraid of being stuck in this helpless state of mind themselves, and the 'bullying' is just a reflection of their own fears. Maybe it's true for me too. On the other hand, those who are brave enough to get on with their plans just ignore her. Or those who are strong enough to get on the path of recovery.

As for myself, I just put her on my ignore list some time ago. That's the easiest solution.

I understand your logic, but I think you miss overall purpose of this website.

Maybe I am wrong, but the primary purpose here is to be heard and get some comfort. Neither one of us can offer a solution to anybodys problems. You can't fix somebodys life or lessen their suffering. Sure, you can offer a word of advise to get mental help ( I think everybody knows that thats available so they dont need reasurance for that) or you can offer advice how to ctb. While having possible option to exit this world might be comforting, probably even for even most people, the truth is many people dont immediately ctb after coming to this website. Many acquire the method and then still wait for the right time. In this time they still seak a comforts of this forum cause your suffering wont magicly go away just because you know you have N in your drawer.

I understand that her posts can come of as dark and hopeless but sometimes simply being heard and knowing that there is a person who actually read your thoughts might be comforting.

I hope you understand I am not trying to attack you here in any way, just having a healthy argument and of course if you feel like putting her on ignore list it's totally fine, that's your absolute right.

I hope you have a good day :)

 

[LaVieEnRose]

While I understand why she's arrived at the positions she holds I still wish she could grasp the gaps in her reasoning about things. She's a bright person so I confess it surprises me that she doesn't seem able to despite consistent pushback from many directions.

 

[FrozenMango]

I am out of the loop here but I think FC is a nice person. SS allows members to block other members for a reason. It is better to use the ignore button than argue with other members

 

[Suicidebydeath]

Basically, that's my protest against your post. It's because you are protecting her. I'm in the camp of those who don't like her posts.

I'm very anti-bullying, this is why. I would "protect" you or any other user on this site the same way if I saw the same thing happening. I don't know about "protect", really all I'm doing is posting facts, I'm posting quotes of what other people have said about FC in the past and some of FC own posts. The subjective opinion in this thread so far has been in support of FuneralCry and her kindnesses.

The problem is, in my opinion, that she does not offer a solution to either herself or the people she interacts with. To me, it seems like she is just stuck in this loop of endless suffering. She does not even try to take steps towards a possible solution in either direction. This is bad for her and for the people around her. It is also the definition of an 'echo chamber'.

Sometimes, people don't want a solution, they just want someone to listen to them and empathise. I'm going to stereotype here but bear with me, men like to provide solutions, women like to listen. Sometimes people don't want advice, what they want is empathy. Solutions can feel like the opposite and come across as patronizing and demeaning. For the second part, it sounds too much like telling FC to end it, and I'm not okay with that at all. As for recovery, you have to realise, recovery is very hard for some people. It's why this site exists at all, if we all recovered then nobody would ever have to commit suicide. So I'm sorry for "this is bad for her and the people around her", I think that's wrong for all the reasons above.

The second thing I want to say about this is, I found it ironic, because we're stuck in an endless loop of suffering of watching people bully FC too. They also live in an 'echo chamber' because they won't pay attention to any of the posts here, any more than they listen to the moderation team. They will only listen to people that agree with them. It's kind of disgusting for me and I shall probably fall out with a few more people over this issue before this is all said and done. The close-mindedness is not really tolerable for me.

It is also true that our own reflection in others shows us who we are. The things we don't like in others may be the very things we have in ourselves too or the things we are most afraid of. Maybe FuneralCry's comments annoy people because they see FuneralCry's qualities in themselves too. Maybe they are just so afraid of being stuck in this helpless state of mind themselves, and the 'bullying' is just a reflection of their own fears. Maybe it's true for me too. On the other hand, those who are brave enough to get on with their plans just ignore her. Or those who are strong enough to get on the path of recovery.

As for myself, I just put her on my ignore list some time ago. That's the easiest solution.

So your problem with FC is you think that because she's still here, and that she might be "saving people", that upsets you. That's a really unique take and contrary to some of her other detractors, I think. I can totally relate to you being frustrated that it's hard to escape this life but I don't see how that is FC's fault. Maybe I misunderstand something you wrote, but it does seem like when you wrote that to me that you are upset with her because she's still here on this site. At this point I would like to point out there are many members of the site that are older on the site and IRL than FC but they aren't despised purely for seniority here. Remember that FC is really a very young person. There are many people on this site that are double and triple her age.

As for the last thing, I think that is the wisest thing anyone can say. If you dislike her posts, just put her on your ignore list. So I applaud that. I know that everyone is different so while I don't understand the animosity for FC even after you've explained it to me, I'm not going to give you grief for it.

edit:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/funeralcry.107709/post-1845998

I've just read(skimmed) @Lone_Traveler90's response to your post and he said basically what I was thinking but in a nicer and more concise way. So if my reply incites you, its not intentional it's just my posting style and its likely I just meant to say the same as L_T90. I will read their response to you in full now.

"Maybe I am wrong, but the primary purpose here is to be heard and get some comfort. Neither one of us can offer a solution to anybodys problems. You can't fix somebodys life or lessen their suffering." - Yes this. Good post. When I was talking about people not wanting a solution, he says it right. This site just isn't about option 1 and option 2, its for support too. It's also true, we can't provide the solution to everyone's problems. Believe me, I've tried to help people out of their problems and it doesn't go well for either of us. Just doing lots of little things is all you can really do. There are some exceptions to this, but they're rare. If I could fix everyone's problems right now with the money I've saved up, believe me I would do it.

 

[suisuiforum]

There are some sentiments from FC that I agree with, and others that I don't, but disagreement is normal as long as people don't become overly hostile and aggressive. The purpose of this platform was to provide a place for free speech regarding topics like suicide and mental health in general within reason, basically supporting dialogue that doesn't devolve into attacks on other users. Personally I think it's fine to generally criticize certain viewpoints as long as everyone remains civil, but it might be worthwhile to keep in mind that some people don't appreciate that on posts specifically marked as "venting," where they may just want support. I really don't think there was any issue with what she has posted in the past in terms of attacking others (and saying that people are "delusional for enjoying life" isn't a specific attack on anyone that warranted the backlash that those posts received). As some people have mentioned in this thread before, people could also just choose not to engage or use the ignore function on this site.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

I'm not saying that FC has created this environment by any means. It's just that there does seem to be an intolerance towards people who express any kind of positivity towards life- plus- happen to strongly disagree with the Nihilistic viewpoint.

For me- I believe ideation can affect ANYONE from any walk of life. I therefore feel it's important that a forum such as this is welcoming to all points of view. From what I've seen, I beieve warnings have been sent in all directions from @RainAndSadness - so, hopefully, things will quieten down.

I want to end saying that I despise bullying. There is NO excuse for people to be rude to one another here. We are suffering enough. We are adults too- we ought to be able to express differences of opinion without it degrading to name calling. I REALLY hope things just calm down.

I agree- I think FuneralCry is a great benefit to this forum. I just think it would be good if we could ALL learn to get along better. Some viewpoints around here aren't going to change. I just wish we could ALL learn to be more tolerant of one another.

Hi, sorry I don't have a response for everything in your post. I do agree with this last section.
"It's just that there does seem to be an intolerance towards people who express any kind of positivity towards life- plus- happen to strongly disagree with the Nihilistic viewpoint." - Yes this does happen and as you rightly pointed out, this can happen with any user on the forum, not just one particular user. I see this as a consequence of being on a forum where the main issue discussed is suicide. I am aware of how some people can react negatively to positivity, and this is very understandable when you think about how most people IRL respond to people talking about suicide.

I think a positivity check is a good tell of the sensitivity that is a requirement not to upset a good portion of the forum. If people don't understand that, then they simply don't have the understanding, sensitivity or empathy required, it would not be the fault of the people getting upset at being positivity-barraged. I learned that early on here and almost fell out with someone because I was just a little bit too positive/inquisitive, and it came across as invalidating when I absolutely did intend to invalidate anyone. It's sad if other people cannot learn the same thing and end up alienating other users.

I too despise bullying. I wish in your post you had highlighted the out-of-order things that other people have posted(not focus on FC), but it is what it is. In that sense, and I'm sure you didn't intend it, but the post came across as one-sided. I did notice that you said you think it was in response to other insulting posts which is fair and I'm guessing that the reason you omitted other people's posts is you don't want to bullied too. I'm sure you can say the same for mine, and unfortunately people love to jump and try to tear an argument apart sometimes if you show any sign of "weakness" such as total unbias, which is why I'm extremely guarded when posting while also trying to be completely fair.

"I just think it would be good if we could ALL learn to get along better. Some viewpoints around here aren't going to change. I just wish we could ALL learn to be more tolerant of one another." - This, it would be more harmonious. People should use the ignore button more if they dislike certain posts. Then if for some reason someone on here is irritating you but they aren't breaking any actual rules or just bending them, at least you do not have to see their posts. I can imagine all kinds of people will think I'm talking about them on this last point but I can assure that its very unlikely those actually read this since it's nothing to do with FC.

I too wish we could just all LEARN to get along. Emphasis on learn rather than all.

 

[justwanasleep]

Whenever a thread has no replies she's always there to support whoever needs it. Like or hate her she's always there trying to be supportive. She's like part of the furniture in a good way. Just my 2 pence.

 

[WorthlessTrash]

Basically, that's my protest against your post. It's because you are protecting her. I'm in the camp of those who don't like her posts.

It's true that her posts are thoughtful and compassionate. This feels comforting and flattering for many people, which is evidenced by the reactions she receives.

The problem is, in my opinion, that she does not offer a solution to either herself or the people she interacts with. To me, it seems like she is just stuck in this loop of endless suffering. She does not even try to take steps towards a possible solution in either direction. This is bad for her and for the people around her. It is also the definition of an 'echo chamber'.

Maybe I'm just too pragmatic. It's not an easy topic. You can consider 'being compassionate' a good thing if it saves lives. If the goal is to save lives, and if what FuneralCry does gives people solace, then there is no harm, right? But then I ask: Is this really the life you want to live? (It's a rhetorical question, and if we are pro-choice, then any answer is valid. My answer is "no".)

It is also true that our own reflection in others shows us who we are. The things we don't like in others may be the very things we have in ourselves too or the things we are most afraid of. Maybe FuneralCry's comments annoy people because they see FuneralCry's qualities in themselves too. Maybe they are just so afraid of being stuck in this helpless state of mind themselves, and the 'bullying' is just a reflection of their own fears. Maybe it's true for me too. On the other hand, those who are brave enough to get on with their plans just ignore her. Or those who are strong enough to get on the path of recovery.

As for myself, I just put her on my ignore list some time ago. That's the easiest solution.

She has every right to express herself just as you or I do. If by solutions you mean to fix or treat the underlying problems we have, this section, the suicide discussion, is not intended for solutions to be offered. Most people here are waiting in limbo or are readying to CTB. The more appropriate section on this board to seek "solutions" is the recovery section.

Also, while she does speak in absolutes, that is just how she projects her feelings.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

While I understand why she's arrived at the positions she holds I still wish she could grasp the gaps in her reasoning about things. She's a bright person so I confess it surprises me that she doesn't seem able to despite consistent pushback from many directions.

She's HFA. I don't know if that is why, but I am not seeing the same thing, or anything that is too out of the ordinary. Many people aren't able to separate logic and their own thinking from internal biases. My own score on the logic scale of IQ is high, without posting the actual score as that looks like bragging, so that might be why there is a disparity that seems commonplace and frustrating to me. And tbh, "intelligent" people not being able to grasp gaps in their reasoning is not a phenomenon I would attribute to just one person. It's a frustrating phenomenon that I would associate with many people online. Don't even get me started on Flat Earthers. They're just the bottom of the barrel too, I think it's a very common phenomenon online.

There are some sentiments from FC that I agree with, and others that I don't, but disagreement is normal as long as people don't become overly hostile and aggressive. The purpose of this platform was to provide a place for free speech regarding topics like suicide and mental health in general within reason, basically supporting dialogue that doesn't devolve into attacks on other users. Personally I think it's fine to generally criticize certain viewpoints as long as everyone remains civil, but it might be worthwhile to keep in mind that some people don't appreciate that on posts specifically marked as "venting," where they may just want support. I really don't think there was any issue with what she has posted in the past in terms of attacking others (and saying that people are "delusional for enjoying life" isn't a specific attack on anyone that warranted the backlash that those posts received). As some people have mentioned in this thread before, people could also just choose not to engage or use the ignore function on this site.

I 100% agree with you on all points and you made a good, fair, unbiased post without taking a clear side. This kind of discussion I applaud since it seems true neutral, so I'll respond by letting my guard down a little in kind.

Imo, the criticisms haven't been civil, which has devolved into some kind of persistent flame & slander war, albeit one-sided. FC does not really partake in the flame war, except when it happens on her own vent posts. Which are "sacred ground", for everyone imo. The same way "goodbye" threads should be treated with respect. It does not mean someone can make a "vent" thread and then attack other members, or post racist, transphobic or sexist remarks. It just means that feelings & thoughts should be respected and treated as valid. I think the issue has been inflated because of an ongoing feud. I'm not too keen on the "delusional for enjoying life" comment personally but I've seen worse from other people and the other side and like you said its not a specific attack, which is what bullying is. It does not seem like a rule breaking comment with or without context. All I have to do is spend five seconds thinking about it and I realise this is just what someone who has hit rock bottom says.

So many people are quick to criticise, so many people are quick to ask Why? and then they instantly shut their brains off before anyone can give a response. So many people are quick to make suggestions about what other people should be doing in their life, without knowing anything about the other person or what their life is like or what other plausible reasons & actions the other person has already undertook. The world would be a better place if instead of criticising people thought for an extra five seconds to wonder why things are a certain way.

This was posted during the bullying afaik, all of it was. People should be using the ignore function if they are seeing posts that upset them for someone that is strictly not breaking the rules.

 

[ge0rge]

@Chinaski

 

[FuneralCry]

Thank you OP and others on here who are kind but I just think the fact is that nowhere is free from the cruelty of people, this will never be a 'safe space' for suicidal people and that is the reality, and people shouldn't expect any different. I guess that suicidal people will always be treat badly everywhere in this world, but I personally don't care too much at this point. People's opinions mean nothing to me and there's nothing wrong with anything that I've posted.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

@Chinaski

Welease the kwaken.

Lol, it was going so well. I had received some DMs/convos from people thanking for making this thread too. They did not feel like writing in the actual thread. I'll do some invocations too and then I might disappear to catch up on IRL stuff for a while. I'd stick around longer but if I do I'll start getting shit in my IRL for "doing nothing all day".

@RainAndSadness
@Dot
@bluem00n

That should prevent things from getting completely out of hand since I'm unlikely to respond in a thread if I start to feel uncomfortable.
I guess I should preface with that any interaction would also be breaking a contract(not to mention moderator ruling) that I find beneficial. I prefer if that moderator ruling is upheld no matter how old it is (I think it's over a year old), so its not as if I can respond anyway. [bold italics for emphasis]
~ I don't know if the mods or anyone else remembers but I do, and I've stuck to it faithfully so far ~.

Thank you OP and others on here who are kind but I just think the fact is that nowhere is free from the cruelty of people, this will never be a 'safe space' for suicidal people and that is the reality, and people shouldn't expect any different. I guess that suicidal people will always be treat badly everywhere in this world, but I personally don't care too much at this point. People's opinions mean nothing to me and there's nothing wrong with anything that I've posted.

You are welcome FC and I promise you that imho Rain and the moderation team are doing everything possible to make this a safe space for everyone. It's just impossible to please everyone. The world is never free from cruelty of people, even today I spoke to someone about a related issue IRL and they listened to me. It's hard for me to trust because I have PTSD but its possible. You are right suicidal people will be treated badly everywhere too, that is one of the reasons this forum exists, if we are treated well here, maybe others can learn from example.

I hope you have a good week FC.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I did notice that you said you think it was in response to other insulting posts which is fair and I'm guessing that the reason you omitted other people's posts is you don't want to bullied too.

Thanks- a fair response... I haven't included them because I don't know them and I don't how far back this went... I don't know who 'started' it as it were. I can't be bothered to find out either. I'm not trying to take sides here. I'm just commenting on what I've observed- the good and the bad.

With the whole drama with @freedompass (who was eventually banned), I tried to suggest a lot of what you are saying- that certain strongly held views are unlikely to change- so better to ignore and walk away. Still- it was their firmly held view that not challenging certain views would lead to the forum becoming very much what it is accused of- an echo chamber- where no points of view straying off the Nihilistic rhetoric are welcome.

I agree- overly positive posts or platitudes piss most of us off in this section. Still- for people to feel apologetic- or- not part of 'the club' because they at one point were 'happy' and they may even understand how other people CAN be happy seems to be excluding people who don't fit the specific type of suicidal that seems to be prefered here.

Again- I'm not blaming any individual for this. I'm just saying- ideation can affect someone who is actually more pro-life in sentiment. There are people here who WANT to live desperately but just can't get over whatever is crippling them. Those people should feel welcome here surely also? They ought to be able to disagree with certain things (respectfully of course) without being termed a 'pro-lifer' and told to 'get lost'. These people are suffering too. I'm not convinced they're all just disagreeing to taunt.

Still- I DO think it is likely how they post as to the response they get. Like I say- my views are fairly Nihilistic for me but not for the rest of the human race. Yet, I haven't gotten caught up in all this. I try really hard to be respectful though. As yet, pretty much everyone has been respectful back I'm pleased to say. That's why I love this community.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

Again- I'm not blaming any individual for this. I'm just saying- ideation can affect someone who is actually more pro-life in sentiment. There are people here who WANT to live desperately but just can't get over whatever is crippling them. Those people should feel welcome here surely also? They ought to be able to disagree with certain things (respectfully of course) without being termed a 'pro-lifer' and told to 'get lost'. These people are suffering too. I'm not convinced they're all just disagreeing to taunt.

They should, this feels like a bit of a strawman to me, because I don't see FC going into the Recovery section or similar posts just to attack other people's viewpoints, I don't think she does anything like to make anyone feel unwelcome. *edit and thinks for five seconds* If you meant that positive threads in general receive some opposition, then I agree, that's unfortunate. I wish I had the answer for that. I don't think it's a complete cop-out answer to say that opposition to positivity in a suicide forum is to be expected.

I do see what you are saying, they might want to come in and disagree with a post she made in another thread. In reality, when people do these things online it tends to start arguments, its difficult for it to remain or even begin respectful. How do you remain respectful while basically invalidating another person's feelings?

I think it's a common courtesy online that if someone sees somebody else's opinion that differs, to just scroll on by. This works for e.g. the Steam Forums. Posting a contrasting view there quickly devolves into a flame war, and it doesn't happen often. I try to avoid that myself, with the possible exception if I see something offensive, like racism, then I might make a contrasting post, and as you would expect, it's constructive exactly 0% of the time.

As for whether or not its taunting. I've seen sometimes online where people will disagree with someone just for the sake of disagreement, if they don't get on. As for FC, I lost track of the number of people taunting her as to why she hasn't ctb yet, among other things. That's not okay at all. That's a bad reflection. I suspect we just didn't see the same posts or saw them differently. To me, it doesn't matter too much who "started" it either, I just look at current behaviours. It's too easy for someone to try to provoke someone into saying something wrong, anyway.

 

[Lone_Traveler90]

They should, this feels like a bit of a strawman to me, because I don't see FC going into the Recovery section or similar posts just to attack other people's viewpoints, I don't think she does anything like to make anyone feel unwelcome. I do see what you are saying, they might want to come in and disagree with a post she made in another thread. In reality, when people do these things online it tends to start arguments, its difficult for it to remain or even begin respectful. How do you remain respectful while basically invalidating another person's feelings?

I think it's a common courtesy online that if someone sees somebody else's opinion that differs, to just scroll on by. This works for e.g. the Steam Forums. Posting a contrasting view there quickly devolves into a flame war, and it doesn't happen often. I try to avoid that myself, with the possible exception if I see something offensive, like racism, then I might make a contrasting post, and as you would expect, it's constructive exactly 0% of the time.

As for whether or not its taunting. I've seen sometimes online where people will disagree with someone just for the sake of disagreement, if they don't get on. As for FC, I lost track of the number of people taunting her as to why she hasn't ctb yet, among other things. That's not okay at all. That's a bad reflection. I suspect we just didn't see the same posts or saw them differently. To me, it doesn't matter too much who "started" it either, I just look at current behaviours. It's too easy for someone to try to provoke someone into saying something wrong, anyway.

I don't know the extend of how much FC was bullied but if what you say it's true, that is absolutely horrible. I know that in normal world or forums people argue about smallest, least important bullshit just for the sake of it. I hate it with passion and I immediately cross people out of my life if they argue or make a big a deal of some small problems.

I expected that people who join this forum have enough courtesy and compassion to not bully or belittle others because they know the struggle. I guess there are monsters everywhere you go.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

I don't know the extend of how much FC was bullied but if what you say it's true, that is absolutely horrible. I know that in normal world or forums people argue about smallest, least important bullshit just for the sake of it. I hate it with passion and I immediately cross people out of my life if they argue or make a big a deal of some small problems.

I expected that people who join this forum have enough courtesy and compassion to not bully or belittle others because they know the struggle. I guess there are monsters everywhere you go.

Thanks. Bullying is always horrible. I've exhausted myself, I'm out for a bit to destress elsewhere. Sorry in advance if I don't engage with more posts.

 

[Lone_Traveler90]

Thanks. Bullying is always horrible. I've exhausted myself, I'm out for a bit to destress elsewhere. Sorry in advance if I don't engage with more posts.

Don't ever apologize. You did a fantastic work today and I want to thank you for that. I hope you can relax for the rest of your day, all the best.

 

[Forever Sleep]

They should, this feels like a bit of a strawman to me, because I don't see FC going into the Recovery section or similar posts just to attack other people's viewpoints, I don't think she does anything like to make anyone feel unwelcome. *edit and thinks for five seconds* If you meant that positive threads in general receive some opposition, then I agree, that's unfortunate. I wish I had the answer for that. I don't think it's a complete cop-out answer to say that opposition to positivity in a suicide forum is to be expected.

I do see what you are saying, they might want to come in and disagree with a post she made in another thread. In reality, when people do these things online it tends to start arguments, its difficult for it to remain or even begin respectful. How do you remain respectful while basically invalidating another person's feelings?

I think it's a common courtesy online that if someone sees somebody else's opinion that differs, to just scroll on by. This works for e.g. the Steam Forums. Posting a contrasting view there quickly devolves into a flame war, and it doesn't happen often. I try to avoid that myself, with the possible exception if I see something offensive, like racism, then I might make a contrasting post, and as you would expect, it's constructive exactly 0% of the time.

As for whether or not its taunting. I've seen sometimes online where people will disagree with someone just for the sake of disagreement, if they don't get on. As for FC, I lost track of the number of people taunting her as to why she hasn't ctb yet, among other things. That's not okay at all. That's a bad reflection. I suspect we just didn't see the same posts or saw them differently. To me, it doesn't matter too much who "started" it either, I just look at current behaviours. It's too easy for someone to try to provoke someone into saying something wrong, anyway.

Honestly- like I say- I don't know how far back this went... This was the main thread where I became aware of all this conflict:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/thre...et-worse-as-time-goes-on.105062/#post-1809449

@freedompass did say- rather bluntly and in a sarcastic way- granted- that they didn't agree with this black and white thinking being passed off as fact. They also happened to mention they were 'happier' than they have ever been... and see the reaction...

There is mention of 'group-think' here (echo chamber) and that there does seem to be pressure to go along with certain ideas and individuals here. @freedompass is also questioned over and over as to why they are even here if they are so 'happy'. Perhaps it's a fair point but ideation is complex. Someone laughing today might slit their throat tomorrow. How do you qualify who has the right to be on here? Do we really ALL have to follow a certain type of suicidal?

That said- you can see I posted a long and rambling comment also disagreeing with some of the ideas and didn't get any kick back.

It's a forum- as I understand, that means we ought to be able to express ourselves reasonably freely. This is the 'Suicide Discussion' section- discussion can mean varying opinions surely? Obviously- we shouldn't be insulting one another. Still- we shouldn't have to ALL agree on everything? (That's the definition of a cult isn't it?)

However- I have come to realise that some people use the forum to rant. They're not looking for a discussion. Seeing as FC doesn't usually respond to my posts- I assume that she doesn't want to discuss. Totally fine- obviously. I try really hard to leave her posts alone now- or, I try to temper my arguments if I strongly disagree.

I do actually agree with you- that sometimes it's better if you just ignore a thread- rather than write something snide. Maybe you'd argue @freedompass was disrespectful- it all blew up out of proportion from that thread to be honest and things got crazy.

Still- we are ALL likely quite headstrong. The problem is that setting out opinions as facts and calling everyone who disagrees delussional IS controversial- EVEN on a suicide forum. People don't enjoy being called delussional! We don't ALL think exactly the same way- even if we are all suicidal.

I do happen to agree with you that FuneralCry doesn't usually make people feel unwelcome here. Quite the opposite in fact. I also don't condone any type of bullying towards anyone on here. There's no excuses for that.

 

[LastFlowers]

The problem is, in my opinion, that she does not offer a solution to either herself or the people she interacts with. To me, it seems like she is just stuck in this loop of endless suffering. She does not even try to take steps towards a possible solution in either direction. This is bad for her and for the people around her. It is also the definition of an 'echo chamber'.

Offer a solution? Are you saying that it's FC's duty, our duty, to come up with a viable solution to everyone's issues here?

A lot of us are stuck in a loop of endless suffering, that's why we are here.
Is that not why you're here?

"Take steps toward a possible solution in either direction"…what are the two directions?

Life? Death?

Are you saying you have a problem with FC sticking around?
You would prefer that they either "get busy living or get busy dying"…is that what you're saying?
(Because I don't see how it reads any other way.)
What you don't seem to understand, is that the former may be impossible for them and the latter, on your part..to expect..is pretty despicable.
That's not your call to make, not your date to set.

It's bad for FC and the people around them, to stick around, to be stuck between a rock and hard place?
Well of course it's bad for FC, but they didn't exactly choose their lot in life, now did they?
And you can speak for yourself as far as their way of being negatively affecting you, as I have reached the opposite conclusion.

Don't even get me started on the "Echo chamber" buzzword, haven't we driven that phrase into the mud already?
I'm going to have to start quoting my own damn self at this rate.
Then it will be a real echo chamber, with the amount of times I'm having to repeat myself.

(Think about this: People who go unheard, unacknowledged and lack validation often become broken records.
Same with people who are TIRED.
It does not mean FC's voice should be labeled as an "echo chamber" in order to dismiss it further.)

Maybe I'm just too pragmatic. It's not an easy topic. You can consider 'being compassionate' a good thing if it saves lives. If the goal is to save lives, and if what FuneralCry does gives people solace, then there is no harm, right? But then I ask: Is this really the life you want to live? (It's a rhetorical question, and if we are pro-choice, then any answer is valid. My answer is "no".)

Too "pragmatic"?
No. I don't think your opinion has anything to do with a heightened sense of pragmatism.

Why can we only consider being compassionate a good thing if it "saves lives"?
Why would you ever want to gatekeep compassion? Unless it was being directed at an undeserving party.
If compassion is only permissible under the expectation that it "saves a life" (by your definition), then it's probably not compassion to begin with..it's probably a hidden agenda, and a selfish one at that.

My own suicide is inevitable and my misery and the reasons why are unrelenting…half my time existing in this hell has been spent BEGGING for compassion (or understanding), so it means the world to someone in my position or similar to receive it.
We do not need to stop our plans to ctb in order for compassion to be useful or appreciated.

I don't agree with the premise you're setting up in the first place, so I'm not sure how to answer your rhetorical question that you don't want answered.

So I'll ask a couple more questions of my own..
What do you mean by "is this really the life you want to live?"…please define what type of life you're referring to.
FC's life?
A life of inescapable in-between and suffering that a lot of us here endure?

It is also true that our own reflection in others shows us who we are. The things we don't like in others may be the very things we have in ourselves too or the things we are most afraid of. Maybe FuneralCry's comments annoy people because they see FuneralCry's qualities in themselves too. Maybe they are just so afraid of being stuck in this helpless state of mind themselves, and the 'bullying' is just a reflection of their own fears. Maybe it's true for me too. On the other hand, those who are brave enough to get on with their plans just ignore her. Or those who are strong enough to get on the path of recovery.

True for who?
Just for FC?
I don't think you actually believe it's true for yourself.
Not here at least.
What's the point of having self awareness if you're not going to utilize it to address the unnecessary flak given to FC?

By "our own reflection in others", do you mean the way others perceive us (which is usually a problem and half the reason a good amount of people end up suicidal in the first place) or are you saying that what we see in others shows us who we are?

I think it's just plain silly to believe that everything we hate or dislike in others, must be because we also possess those traits ourselves, when it could just as easily be due to the fact that we do not possess those traits and never wish to.
Not every enemy is a twin cloaked in a different skin.
Could there be some truth to that notion at times? Yes.
But to state it as a given is absurd.


Not sure what you're suggesting by 'bullying'.
It is bullying. I've witnessed it with my own eyes, and unfortunately I know bullying when I see it.
This isn't some mindfuckery reflection of FC's own self that they're perceiving in other people. Nor is it excusable due to some "I hate you because I hate me" state of mind on the part of the bullies.


So you're saying those of us who don't ignore FC aren't "brave enough to get on with our plans"?
What does FC have to do with anyone's plans to ctb to begin with?
That's besides the point.

And "strong enough to get on the path of recovery"….oooh. No.
"Strength" has little to do with who ends up able to continue going on and who does not…or whose problems are solvable/livable and whose are not.