Fucking wonderful: "David Suzuki says the fight against climate change is lost"

[Rounded Agony]

First: you're a climate change denier, do yourself and everyone else a favour and just fuck off preemptively. This isn't for you.
For the rest: read the whole thing here, or if that link doesn't work, try here.

Here's a lil' taste to whet your appetite:

"I've never said this before to the media, but it's too late. I say that because I go by science and Johan Rockström, the Swedish scientist who heads the Potsdam Institute, has defined nine planetary boundaries ... As long as humans, like any other animal, live within those nine constraints, we can do it forever, and that includes the amount of carbon in the atmosphere, the pH of the oceans, the amount of available fresh water, the nitrogen cycle, etc.

There are nine planetary boundaries and we've only dealt with one of them — the ozone layer — and we think we've saved ourselves from that threat. But we passed the seventh boundary this year, and we're in the extreme danger zone. Rockström says we have five years to get out of the danger zone.

If we pass one boundary, we should be shitting our pants. We've passed seven!

And, if you look at those boundaries, like the amount of carbon in the atmosphere, we've had 28 COP meetings on climate change and we haven't been able to cap emissions.

We're on our way to more than a three-degree temperature rise by the end of this century, and scientists agree we shouldn't rise above one and half degrees."

Neat example further in of the Finnish government mailing its citizens telling them to get ready for extreme weather events to get worse and more frequent, and to start planning in their communities how they're gonna survive the imminent series of shitstorms.

Sadly most of us live not in Finland, but instead in bullshit corporatocracies run by people concerned only with making as much money as possible with their fingers in their goddamn ears all the while, happy to let their citizens die if the CEOs & politicians can ride a rocket to Mars or whateverthefuck to escape what's coming (Finland is surely also shit in its own ways; I don't claim to know a damn thing other than this single example of relative rationality).

 

[Szarur-abi]

I get the climate change doomerism, it absolutely sucks but its not like we arent doing anything with it. We actually do a lot, much more than predicted in fact, and the rate of installing renewables increases expentionally year by year while wind and water energy gets cheaper year by year thus incetivising people to build it more and more despite lobbying of oil companies in the last decades. It still depresses me a lot how faster change could be if it werent enormous lobbying of oil companies. Even the biggest pollutant like China is the BIGGEST investor in clean energy currently and arent building any new coal plants, plus they aggresively push EVs etc.

Every major economy also have some form of emission trading which incestive companies to invest in clean energy and lower emissions. Europe, China, India and many other countries have their version of such system which doesnt get a lot of news headline but those are facts. USA had such system but i think Trump abolished IRA thus abonding ETS.

So in conclusion, rates of clean energy instalation increases every year.

But climate is complex science and im no at any means expert in it so for all i know we may be alright or be doomed who tf knows.

This channel made a pretty good vid addresing this topic



Also i think that what Suzuki says about economic incestives not being a tool for fighting climate change is kinda baffling. I mean, if not it then what? Change the entire economic system? I mean sure that would be great but its not realistic. Working in existing boundaries works pretty alright, emposing regulations, introducing harsher penalting for polluting and making clean energy cheaper is what works currently. And fighting with oil companies (i cant stress enought how much i hate them but it would be another essay)

also the most polluting country in europe, Poland had its first month where renewables surprassed the energy from fossil fuels and it was first time when it falled below 50% but it didnt got any headlines even locally cause talking about positives doesnt catch peoples attentions as well
In near term im afraid about certain parts of earths being uninhabitable thus causing mass migrations and thus causing unreast in already uneasy word. Like, in short term we cant stop negative trends that are already happening... And yea, long term we may be fine, just mayyyybe. Also climate change already happened, to what degree we will increase avg temps is another matter.

I may be dead and not find out if we make it out relatively fine or not

 

[Faulende Fleisch]

I don't have much to add to Szarur-abi's reply. But climate change can be "reversed". The issue is that we won't be the ones to experience it. It's a slow process. We are fucked and can only ensure the comfort of the next few generations. Just like always; humanity doing its best is not goodbut it's good enough for the gradual improvement of the world. It may not be good enough for you or me. But thats how it always worked.

 

[RadiantNumber]

Humanity at least will pay for it's crimes

 

[quietwoods]

Unfortunately concerning deniers, the majority of this forum appears to be so. Latest poll that was taken showed ~60% of people didn't believe in it or didn't care about it. Including people that identified as liberal lol.

Yay

 

[sweetreliefpls]

First: you're a climate change denier, do yourself and everyone else a favour and just fuck off preemptively. This isn't for you.
For the rest: read the whole thing here, or if that link doesn't work, try here.

Here's a lil' taste to whet your appetite:



Neat example further in of the Finnish government mailing its citizens telling them to get ready for extreme weather events to get worse and more frequent, and to start planning in their communities how they're gonna survive the imminent series of shitstorms.

Sadly most of us live not in Finland, but instead in bullshit corporatocracies run by people concerned only with making as much money as possible with their fingers in their goddamn ears all the while, happy to let their citizens die if the CEOs & politicians can ride a rocket to Mars or whateverthefuck to escape what's coming (Finland is surely also shit in its own ways; I don't claim to know a damn thing other than this single example of relative rationality).

Yeah imo humanity is fucked tbh. The earth will survive as it's a self- regulating organism so will find a new balance, but that will mean extreme weather, extreme temperatures and weather events, including extreme cold and rain/flooding as well as heat and drought. Overall the new normal will be much more hostile to the thriving of human life we've had recently. The COP system hasn't done much at all to slow fossil fuels despite years of discussions. Petrol capitalism is king.

Just today I was reading that the melting glaciers and ice will mean much more volcanic activity…and more carbon released…

A lot of these broken planetary boundaries lead to self perpetuating cycles and in fact scientists don't yet understand how they all relate and interplay with each other. So "reversing climate change" isn't at all obvious now because there are many new processes and feedback loops in play, some of which are not yet fully understood: (removed links as with them this post was modded)

Don't CTB because of this. Things are mostly bearable for now, just worsening.
But I admit for me it does kinda add to existing reasons that CTB feels possible. As the future is getting harder.

 

[brokeandbroken]

First: you're a climate change denier, do yourself and everyone else a favour and just fuck off preemptively. This isn't for you.
For the rest: read the whole thing here, or if that link doesn't work, try here.

Here's a lil' taste to whet your appetite:



Neat example further in of the Finnish government mailing its citizens telling them to get ready for extreme weather events to get worse and more frequent, and to start planning in their communities how they're gonna survive the imminent series of shitstorms.

Sadly most of us live not in Finland, but instead in bullshit corporatocracies run by people concerned only with making as much money as possible with their fingers in their goddamn ears all the while, happy to let their citizens die if the CEOs & politicians can ride a rocket to Mars or whateverthefuck to escape what's coming (Finland is surely also shit in its own ways; I don't claim to know a damn thing other than this single example of relative rationality).

I think is climate change relies on ignoring the amount of hypocrisy surrounding it.

1) China contributes ~30% of climate gain change per year. Paris accords basically sent China a bigass check and said alright now change. And China said thank you and we've got the money now do something about us not doing anything about it. The CCP absolutely doesn't give a fuck. They want to exist currently in as a best as possible life as possible. If that means over fishing to the point of killing off the oceans, engaging in X harmful practice, or just producing the worst type of energy even if it kills the planet they absolutely will. They genuinely don't care. I'm not even sure their climate attitude is even in the top 10 worst things they do. Got to think human experimentation and organ harvesting are up there.
2) All these celebrities and figures who lecture people on it. Well they are the worst polluters. How do you know you see them. If they actually believed in it to the point they were saying. They'd turn amish. They wouldn't use the energy grid. They go back to the stone age. Instead they talk about it for political purposes so their favorite representative can get elected and well that's it. It's exploiting you for their political purposes. How many of those who were invited to bezos wedding didn't get the message because they decided to not engage in the energy grid for climate change purposes? How many declined flying to Italy because of climate change any? Hell Greta Thunberg one of the biggest climate change enthusiasts seems to find her way around the world. Pretty sure she isn't getting there in a horse and buggy. When's the last interview you saw from one of these celebrity hypocrites who was like here is my house I created it using just my hands. It doesn't have water, heat, electricity, I would use solar panels but they require creation from the energy grid. My medicine is this wood log here it doesn't really work but it's all I got. I need an antibiotic but damnit that requires the energy grid. If any of these politicians celebrities actually believed in it you would never see them.
3) What's the expectation from the populace? Are we going to get rid of TVs, electricity, AC, heat, cars, medicine, and everything that is inherent in modern society? That's a pretty tough sell to convince people and existential threat exists and to prevent it you need to go back to the stone age.
4) If you are reasonable you'll realize the way to combat climate change isn't writing big checks hoping governments and people change or shoving it down people's throats. It's innovation. The message really should be to the greatest minds of this generation if it is that big of threat like we did for things in the past this is the problem now go solve it. You solve it you'll be really really really rich. The question isn't can we change that's never going to happen it's can we out innovate it.

 

[idk3]

This topic is so politicized like everything else, I don't even know who to believe.

I heard some expert recently talking about how it's normal for earth's climate to fluctuate with or without humans, and the best we can do is slow it down a bit.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2024/09/19/earth-temperature-global-warming-planet/

 

[Rounded Agony]

Yeah imo humanity is fucked tbh. The earth will survive as it's a self- regulating organism so will find a new balance, but that will mean extreme weather, extreme temperatures and weather events, including extreme cold and rain/flooding as well as heat and drought. Overall the new normal will be much more hostile to the thriving of human life we've had recently. The COP system hasn't done much at all to slow fossil fuels despite years of discussions. Petrol capitalism is king.

Just today I was reading that the melting glaciers and ice will mean much more volcanic activity…and more carbon released…

A lot of these broken planetary boundaries lead to self perpetuating cycles and in fact scientists don't yet understand how they all relate and interplay with each other. So "reversing climate change" isn't at all obvious now because there are many new processes and feedback loops in play, some of which are not yet fully understood: (removed links as with them this post was modded)

Don't CTB because of this. Things are mostly bearable for now, just worsening.
But I admit for me it does kinda add to existing reasons that CTB feels possible. As the future is getting harder.

the only lengthy reply that actually gets it. thanks. sadly this is just one of the many things pushing me to the brink, ha

Also i think that what Suzuki says about economic incestives not being a tool for fighting climate change is kinda baffling. I mean, if not it then what? Change the entire economic system? I mean sure that would be great but its not realistic. Working in existing boundaries works pretty alright, emposing regulations, introducing harsher penalting for polluting and making clean energy cheaper is what works currently. And fighting with oil companies (i cant stress enought how much i hate them but it would be another essay)

the whole point is that working within the system is NOT working, has not been working - otherwise we would not be getting progressively more fucked.

I think is climate change relies on ignoring the amount of hypocrisy surrounding it.

1) China contributes ~30% of climate gain change per year. Paris accords basically sent China a bigass check and said alright now change. And China said thank you and we've got the money now do something about us not doing anything about it. The CCP absolutely doesn't give a fuck. They want to exist currently in as a best as possible life as possible. If that means over fishing to the point of killing off the oceans, engaging in X harmful practice, or just producing the worst type of energy even if it kills the planet they absolutely will. They genuinely don't care. I'm not even sure their climate attitude is even in the top 10 worst things they do. Got to think human experimentation and organ harvesting are up there.
2) All these celebrities and figures who lecture people on it. Well they are the worst polluters. How do you know you see them. If they actually believed in it to the point they were saying. They'd turn amish. They wouldn't use the energy grid. They go back to the stone age. Instead they talk about it for political purposes so their favorite representative can get elected and well that's it. It's exploiting you for their political purposes. How many of those who were invited to bezos wedding didn't get the message because they decided to not engage in the energy grid for climate change purposes? How many declined flying to Italy because of climate change any? Hell Greta Thunberg one of the biggest climate change enthusiasts seems to find her way around the world. Pretty sure she isn't getting there in a horse and buggy. When's the last interview you saw from one of these celebrity hypocrites who was like here is my house I created it using just my hands. It doesn't have water, heat, electricity, I would use solar panels but they require creation from the energy grid. My medicine is this wood log here it doesn't really work but it's all I got. I need an antibiotic but damnit that requires the energy grid. If any of these politicians celebrities actually believed in it you would never see them.
3) What's the expectation from the populace? Are we going to get rid of TVs, electricity, AC, heat, cars, medicine, and everything that is inherent in modern society? That's a pretty tough sell to convince people and existential threat exists and to prevent it you need to go back to the stone age.
4) If you are reasonable you'll realize the way to combat climate change isn't writing big checks hoping governments and people change or shoving it down people's throats. It's innovation. The message really should be to the greatest minds of this generation if it is that big of threat like we did for things in the past this is the problem now go solve it. You solve it you'll be really really really rich. The question isn't can we change that's never going to happen it's can we out innovate it.

the sheer lack of grasping the subtleties is astounding, but it really seems like you didn't actually read the article. start there, especially the bits about infinite growth being unsustainable. then read some more.

This topic is so politicized like everything else, I don't even know who to believe.

I heard some expert recently talking about how it's normal for earth's climate to fluctuate, and the best we can do is slow it down a bit.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2024/09/19/earth-temperature-global-warming-planet/

the earth's temperature does fluctuate regardless of human activity but there is an insurmountable level of undeniable evidence that the speed and rate of heating is due to human activity.
plus i would absolutely not put stock in an article advocating for a "moderate" response to climate change published by a media outlet owned by fucking Jeff Bezos.

 

[fallingtopieces]

Capitalism has brought us to absurd levels of inequality and destroyed the planet.
Uh, don't forget the massive amounts of energy AI consumes.

 

[brokeandbroken]

the sheer lack of grasping the subtleties is astounding, but it really seems like you didn't actually read the article. start there, especially the bits about infinite growth being unsustainable. then read some more.

Honestly I will admit I did skim it pretty heavily especially the political part. So I did go through and not skim it this time. I did read. Then I read about Suzuki because I've generally never heard of him.

"If we pass one boundary, we should be shitting our pants. We've passed seven!"

You know he has *four* properties. His mansion in 2013 was evaluated at over *8* million, another over 1 million, another over 1 million, his other is joint ownership with Kootenay Oil Distributors. That's right dude hates climate change so much he literally got into bed with an oil distribution company. "The global economy is far too big, it's got to shrink, and it's got to be distributed more equitably around the world". So is he going to give one of those properties to me or..? Is he simply a grifter. "It should be illegal for Christ's sake. It's got nothing to do with money, and everything to do with how big their dick is. We should have awards and whenever someone achieves $100 million, which is already obscene, we give them a bronze statue of a dick, and when you get $1 billion, we could give them an even bigger dick." So does he have a little dick statute then? Sounds salty he isn't there yet. " it was clear the Americans were behind the Russians and, as a Canadian down there, all I had to say was I liked science and they threw money at us." The lack of awareness on what the USSR was doing in the 1960s is alarming. Also just stop there is no way in hell he was invited to Bezo's wedding. If he would've been this dude would've showed up with bells on. He would've drooled at the opportunity. Dude talks about the earth being overcrowded. Yet he has *five* kids. 3 more than replacement. Good to know he can shit his pants in four different homes.

My first sentence was " (omitted the word what) I think is climate change relies on ignoring the amount of hypocrisy surrounding it." How in the hell do you not look at this dude and not see a giant flaming blinking climate killing hypocrite. "All these celebrities and figures who lecture people on it. Well they are the worst polluters. How do you know you see them. If they actually believed in it to the point they were saying. They'd turn amish. " Still true. " Instead they talk about it for political purposes so their favorite representative can get elected and well that's it. It's exploiting you for their political purposes. " The first half to 2/3rds of the article was purely political. It wasn't the world is going to end OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG. It was you know how great communism was? Those stupid Americans just threw money at me. " What's the expectation from the populace? Are we going to get rid of TVs, electricity, AC, heat, cars, medicine, and everything that is inherent in modern society? That's a pretty tough sell to convince people and existential threat exists and to prevent it you need to go back to the stone age." This is actually the best question. Because yeah this who is being told this information and having climate change laid on the feet at. So tell me me and you? You going no energy grid? Should I expect no response because you went no energy grid? Or are you willing to have a few more tornadoes and hurricanes, if you can watch squid games with the a/c blasting in your car while downing a bottle of Motrin.

"we've left out the foundation of our existence, which is nature, clean air, pure water, rich soil, food, and sunlight" Which of these is the oil distribution company he is literally in bed with helping with?

You know what's over his ability to sell people books on the topic. His dream of getting his fifth home and getting in bed with....honestly to be as ridiculous as possible I'd say fossil fuel industry but he already did that. So I'll just say Bezos because I think that dude wants to be in bed with him so bad it's unbelievable. And I mean that in the gayest possible way. I think he loves him some Bezos.