Help Fentanyl nembutal and what's in between

[Aap]

Excellent data. Ignore the unknown length to unconsciousness and roughly calculate 90%+ are unconscious in less than 10 minutes. Important to remember time to death is usually less than 90 minutes but could be much longer. (Again ignoring the unknown lengths, you are looking at 90-95% in less than 90 minutes.) The complications are extremely low, and in this data set, no one awoke, which is very consistent with what has been stated. I'd look at some of the numbers maybe on the flip side and tend to ignore, probably to my detriment, extreme outliers.

great post. (Yours not mine).

 

[enjolras]

My attention is for YomYom (and for my own culture). Facing the extreme circumstances (5-10%), what to think of adding Dilantin ? Would there be a risk of discomfort ? That's like the one million dollar question (or maybe I'm making it up)

Edit : digging deeper into this serie of stats to build confidence

https://www.doh.wa.gov/Portals/1/Documents/Pubs/422-109-DeathWithDignityAct2010.pdf

this previous year (2010 vs 2013), almost exclusively Seconal was used. Times to unconsciousness and death were shorter than with Pentobarbital principally

 

[attribute-level-kale]

Know the majority of fentanyl dealers are 1) the feds 2) CIs working in cooperation with the feds 3) under surveillance from by the Postal Inspector / Customs / DEA after the package hits the port of entry. The best case scenario might be being scammed.

They include so much fentanyl so it becomes a felony with intent to distribute. They will prosecute a person trying to commit suicide.

I am not saying do not do it, I am saying be prepared to actually need to hang yourself.

 

[Aap]

I completely understand the concern. In fact, when I go it will be using SN as a backup/secondary method. No one can tell you with 100% confidence the answer to your question. If you can get Dilantin and not amitriptyline, I would suggest the following, and I'll explain the reasons why:

(I'm assuming you do indeed have reglan and take it before SN): Take SN, wait 15-20 minutes, and then take Dilantin (powder mixed with 50ml water/as little as possible). Why wait 20 minutes? 1. If you do pass out from SN before, you will either peacefully expire or awake hours later with likely, based on what has been reported, with no long term damage and can try again. 2. You have the greatest chance of passing out before the Dilantin neurologic symptoms or cardiotoxicity become distressing.

I'll just put a few other notes out summarizing a potential misconception or two I see here (may or may not apply to anyone). the first deals with the onset of action. I've seen people talking about the onset of action of various drugs, specifically, I've seen people talk about benzos and make a statement close to "it takes about 60 minutes to go to sleep after a Valium therefore I know when to take it to time it in combination with ____."

keep in mind, normally one would not be asleep in 5 minutes from taking a therapeutic dose of N, it works so rapidly in the cases described above because it is a massive, massive OD. Likewise, think about an IM injection of say morphine. Normally, standard guidance would say the onset of full effects would be in 30-60 minutes.

now take big game tranquilization (almost always done with extremely high doses of extremely potent opioids like etorphine or carfentil). Very often you will see an animal unconscious in minutes. Why the difference in time? Again it is due to the fact that it is a massive dosage. This why I react somewhat cautiously to timing questions. Normal onset times aren't going to app,y in most cases. Without going in to absorption or dissolution kinetics, let's say you normally absorb 1% a minute of a drug. 1% of a standard dose is much, much less than 1% of 100x the therapeutic dosage. This is why I caution anyone assuming when something will "kick in" when taken under a period of extreme anxiety and in massive doses.

Another item is taking large quantities of anything. If this is done, it cannot be in pill form. The reason is that In The stomach many pills can bind together in a big mass called a beazor. If this happens, then all bets are off regarding absorption and stomach emptying. Everything must be in a solution or suspension before consumption.

 

[enjolras]

Acknowledged ! Thx

Additional info on Dilantin gathered :
- bitter, soapy taste, donno about the intensity
- reduced effect if coupled with alcohol (donno when for sure, chronic or also standalone use)
I thought about mixing it as a separate with the alcohol chaser, to take 3-4 minutes after N, to postpone its action a little, now not so sure
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7273603/ not sure to understand the meaning entirely

 

[Aap]

this is only referring to increased clearance (leaves your body faster/has a lower blood concentration (AUC)) due to ethanol induced liver enzymes in chronic Alcoholics. Basically, the some of the cytochrome p450 enzymes in your liver used to convert ethanol to ethanal (acetaldehyde) also metabolize the Dilantin

Unless you are a chronic alcoholic with withdrawal seizures, I would not take anything away from this study. Likewise, given how fast N works, there is no reason to take them separately.

 

[eve2004]

If a persons weight were an issue, I believe books written on the subject of self deliverance would have mentioned it.

What about the other end of the spectrum? 100lb female?

 

[Aap]

Are you asking about lowering the dose or if there is some "downside" for a smaller individual to take a standard dose?

 

[Yomyom]

I accidentally saw now that article

5. enytoin, sodium valproate, valproic acid: The effect of barbiturates on the metabolism of phenytoin appears to be variable. Some investigators report an accelerating effect, while others report no effect. Because the effect of barbiturates on the metabolism of phenytoin is not predictable, phenytoin and barbiturate blood levels should be monitored more frequently if these drugs are given concurrently. Sodium valproate and valproic acid appear to decrease barbiturate metabolism; therefore, barbiturate blood levels should be monitored and appropriate dosage adjustments made as indicated.

Nembutal® Sodium Solution CII(pentobarbital sodium injection, USP)

 

[Aap]

This is of no consequence in an OD. Certain medications inhibit or induce liver enzymes. The note refers to individuals taking phenytoin long term for seizure management at a predetermined dose/blood level. Receiving N, especially multiple doses, could alter the blood level. It has zero to do with taking N and Dilantin in the context of ctb, just to clarify.

 

[Darksektori]

Please I need your help!

This is not a goodbye (not yet)

After couple of hard days, I sat thinking about my options now.

My weight is around 125-130 kilograms.
And I will have max 12 hours (I guess maybe more but I don't want To provoke luck)

I have couple of options and please let me know which one you find more peaceful and fast

Here is a list of the drugs I will get and what I already got
- nembutal (23 grams)
- fentanyl patches (10 patches 100 mcg per hour)
- diazepam (around 500 mg)
- bondormin (10 pills,)
- Tramadol (300 mg 10 pills slow release)
- meto (10 pills of 10 mg)


1) nembutal 23 grams purity 67% (15.4 grams clean)

The problem- it might not be enough because of my weight or it will take too much time

2) order more 10 grams of the nembutal-
It will be 33 grams (clean 22.11)

The problem- I'm afraid to vomit from that amount


3) order fentanyl powder and use with couple of grams of the nembutal instead of benzo.

I don't know how much powder I should take so I'll order 4 grams so I could also test it

The problem- I don't think someone ever tried this, and I don't know how this combination reacts


4) 23 grams nembutal plus 10 fentanyl patches that I already have

The patches is 100 mcg per hour

The problem- I don't think someone ever tried this, and I don't know how this combination reacts


5) 10 fentanyl patches plus 500 mg diazepam
Already have all this drugs

The problem- takes too much time to die


6) I can buy almost any medical opioids and benzo

So if you know something that stronger (doubt that) tell me


I think right now about options number 3 and number 4, I think it's the easiest way for me, but I'm really want to know what you think about those plans

Any comment will be welcome.
View attachment 32832

Tramadol, ughh I hate that stuff,

 

[Yomyom]

To sum up this discussion (from what I succeed to understand...)

1) there is no proof that Dilantin can actually help to make N more Reliable, there is a lot of drugs for Euthanasia for animals that containing N with Dilantin, but the Dilantin is starting to act in the body after the death of the animal (and if I understood correct This arrangement can only work by injection)-

The high levels of barbiturate in the drug anesthetize the pet first. They become anesthetized the same as you or I would in order to have surgery. They become completely unconscious and cannot feel, see, hear, or experience anything.
The phenytoin kicks in after the pet is anesthetized in order to try to minimize any twitching or movement the pet may experience AFTER they're anesthetized. This is done primarily for the benefit of the owner. The pet is not feeling anything long before the anesthetic overdose kicks in, but if they twitch or move, it can be upsetting to the owner. Phenytoin helps prevent that.
It is NOT painful when used in this combination.

2) there is no enough info about combination of N with F or other opioids, sad but not so bad

3) the most important thing- 15 grams N is enough for a peaceful death.

Thank you everyone for helping to understand those points.