Discussion Express your thoughts on non-suicidal people.

[BroodingBleu]

I commonly bounce back and fourth from blaming people that don't experience these issues as ignorant or careless, but then ponder after the fact and make the understanding that the average person just doesn't have the knowledge or understanding from the perspective of the other side.

From discussing with the people I'm in contact with at work on a regular basis, I like to pick their brains and understand how and why they tick. I speak with both "normal" people and those with ideations and get obviously vastly different answers.

I suppose my question for this thread is, do you blame individuals for their lack of understanding of such pressing issues such as mental health, or do you blame society/ the world we live in as the culprit for a lack of education?

Obviously everyone has their own perceptions and opinions, and thats entirely okay. I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt and blame lack of education for the reason. Of course, even with education, the lack of personal experience means these individuals can never truly sympathize with the issue either.

 

[CTB Fella]

I commonly bounce back and fourth from blaming people that don't experience these issues as ignorant or careless, but then ponder after the fact and make the understanding that the average person just doesn't have the knowledge or understanding from the perspective of the other side.

From discussing with the people I'm in contact with at work on a regular basis, I like to pick their brains and understand how and why they tick. I speak with both "normal" people and those with ideations and get obviously vastly different answers.

I suppose my question for this thread is, do you blame individuals for their lack of understanding of such pressing issues such as mental health, or do you blame society/ the world we live in as the culprit for a lack of education?

Obviously everyone has their own perceptions and opinions, and thats entirely okay. I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt and blame lack of education for the reason. Of course, even with education, the lack of personal experience means these individuals can never truly sympathize with the issue either.

Fortunate.

Lucky.

One of the chosen ones.

Get them and their happiness the fuck away from me.

/discussion

 

[Unsure and Useless]

Of course, whenever I'm in a bad mood, I envy those people for being so fortunate that they don't have to live life not constantly doubting their self worth or being paranoid about people making fun of them behind their back. I wish they had to live at least a day in my situation so that they can shut up with their meaningless platitudes and actually understand.

Afterwards, I realize that they don't understand because they simply are unable to or don't have the time/energy to understand. How can an average person easily empathize with someone who's been hurt by life, and other people, many times over?

I think the blame is on society. Suicide has always been portrayed as this evil, selfish act that only cowards/weaklings do rather the desperate attempt of vulnerable and hurt people to end the ongoing cycle of pain. Can we really blame these people for wanting the suffering to end? If someone has a cut, they try to minimize the pain or get rid of the source entirely; the same concept could be applied to life.

 

[LunaXCBN]

I interact with them on a daily basis, they don't bother me.
But they do bother when they think they can just tell me to "not do it". That bothers me. A lot.

They have yet to grasp that I will be gone before they will.

 

[alivefornow]

One must understand. The amount of pain a successful suicide inflicts on people left behind in immeasurable. I wouldn't want any of my friends or relatives catching the bus, but I wish they understood I have no desire or drive to keep trying anymore. No interest in the future or daily shit I gotta deal with.

 

[SamTam33]

One must understand. The amount of pain a successful suicide inflicts on people left behind in immeasurable. I wouldn't want any of my friends or relatives catching the bus, but I wish they understood I have no desire or drive to keep trying anymore. No interest in the future or daily shit I gotta deal with.

Is it any more immeasurable than the pain of the one who committed suicide? Whose immeasurable pain should take precedence?

If they're not personally suicidal, then I have doubts about the weight of their pain. If it's not bad enough for them to want to abandon it - how bad is it truly.

If you still want to wake up each day and deal with said pain - is it really that unbearable?

Those are things I wonder about.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I tend to avoid people as much as possible but when I do come in to contact with 'normies', I suppose puzzlement would be the best description of what I feel. I obviously notice a profound difference between the way we think- so I start wondering: Were they born like that? Do they MAKE themselves act positive, are they just delluded- or, is it all just an act?

I once talked to someone who said they could NEVER imagine considering suicide. I just thought it best to say nothing. I tend to only open up to people when I get the impression they feel the same way- or- can at least relate to it.

I don't really blame individuals for holding certain views. We all have the right to think and feel the way we do. I don't like it when my perceptions and experiences are belittled- why should they? That said- I love debating stuff if they want to.

I don't think it's generally individuals who get to decide on major policies eg. assisted suicide anyway. I suspect- if there was more of a shift towards legalising it- people maybe would start talking about it more and perhaps change their opinions. As it is- I wouldn't expect anyone to support me in my decision to CTB- so- I simply don't talk to them about it.

 

[nowaru]

Most people are just others that are trying to get along with life the same way I am. I don't hate them because they are happy or more fortunate than me, the same way I don't think it's right to hate others based off of their race or gender. Some people are simply more suited to live in this world than others, and that's ok. We are all just people trying to live one day after another in our own different ways.

 

[TapeMachine]

I'm not sure how I feel about it..I haven't been awake for long, so my brain isn't fully functioning yet, but:

Sometimes I wish I could be blissfully ignorant of everything going on around me (which is how I perceive the unafflicted people in the world: blissfully ignorant), but the reality is that I'm hyper-aware of life's atrocities and cannot shut my mind's eye to them.

I'm not envious of "normal" people though. I'd have to sacrifice my empathy in order to navigate the world the way they do; but without empathy, I wouldn't be the same person, and I like who I am just fine.. But also, sometimes I'd give fucking anything not to feel so much some days.

I don't know if I properly expressed myself here. I need to wake up a little more.

 

[leeloosnow]

as with most things i think there's a bit of each side to blame. society sure puts most ppl at a disadvantage when it comes to compassion and progressive thinking, then the individual perpetuates it either by lack of ability or effort. the first time i saw the term NPC on here i misunderstood it for the commonly used gaming term 'non player character' LOL which isn't that far off base

 

[stilhavinightmares]

Jealous.

 

[GreenTree]

Lucky bastards

 

[OutOfTheVoid]

i generally focus on blaming systems and society/culture, rather than individuals. i dont have much of an opinion of non-suicidal ppl really. i wouldnt go to them to talk about my suicidal tendencies, and i have some distrust toward them due to the risk of intervention. but thats abt it. i dont even envy them bc i wouldnt necessarily prefer to be non-suicidal myself, tho i do wish living was as easy for me as it seems to be for them

 

[violetchiwawa]

I'm really happy for them and I wish I was like them too. Not having mental health issues is a blessing and I want to celebrate the fact that many people want to see tomorrow.

 

[stermc]

I guess some people are "happy" because they are ignorant, but there are a lot of people who have consciousness of the "horror" of life and world and are still happy. They are lucky.

 

[mushroomhive]

envy but not in a resentful way, im happy theyre happy

Is it any more immeasurable than the pain of the one who committed suicide? Whose immeasurable pain should take precedence?

If they're not personally suicidal, then I have doubts about the weight of their pain. If it's not bad enough for them to want to abandon it - how bad is it truly.

If you still want to wake up each day and deal with said pain - is it really that unbearable?

Those are things I wonder about.

i think the pain of grieving a close one who's died is pretty fuckinf bad, yeah. i don't think it's cool to discredit that.

 

[Finn_tasia]

If I were to lay blame anywhere it would be on larger systems/institutions/society's attitudes.

I'm glad life isn't terrible for everyone and that some enjoy the ride. But I do keep a little distance because I absolutely hate the 'it gets better' brigade who've no idea how chronic/severe illness even works.

 

[SamTam33]

i think the pain of grieving a close one who's died is pretty fuckinf bad, yeah. i don't think it's cool to discredit that.

The pain of being suicidal and wanting to die is pretty fucking bad too. Is it not?

The non-suicidal discredit our pain all the time.

It's almost like a sport, they do it so much. Have you seen the thread about overused phrases?

With that said, my post wasn't about "discrediting" pain.

I can acknowledge that the pain of losing a loved one exists. But everything has levels.

And if we're talking about "immeasurable pain," I'm going to assume the pain of person who jumped off a building or blew their head open was worse.

The other one appears content to wake up everyday and say prayers instead.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

I think 99% of humans believe that life is good, that non-existence is bad, having children is good, and that suffering is acceptable.

I vehemently disagree with all these beliefs.

The NPC's do suffer but they don't suffer as much as the suicidal people including me. I mean who hasn't had a heartbreak , intense pain from disease or injury, grief from a loved one passing, or temporary light depression? I think almost all humans suffer even daily . I mean who likes to every day get up and shower , dress , wash clothes , brush teeth, eat 3 times a day, go to bathroom , declutter, take out the trash, wash dishes, clean house, fix problems , fix broken things, groceries, drive to work in traffic , work 8 hours , stress, problems, people cutting off in traffic, problems with other humans , stress of getting fired , worrry , conflicts,relationship problems , unmet needs etc . I think most humans have to deal with all this garbage every day. I don't see a reason to deal with even one thing for example taking out the trash much less the extreme pain and suffering possible in life.

For what reason do they put up with this and the diseases , pain possible ? I think the ever deeper honesty book is right.

The NPc's do suffer . It's inevitable however they are brainwashed to believe that suffering is acceptable . I agree with all of this in the book which is free to download.

The Ever Deeper Honesty book says that 99% of humans are brainwashed to believe a lot of lies. Some of those are that life is good , Death is bad, non-existence is bad ,that having kids is good and that suffering is acceptable because it's part of life.

 

[FuneralCry]

I believe that for someone to be not suicidal they must be blinded by their privileges and/or delusions, I mean they have to be to want to exist in this hellish world with all of the risks associated with existing. I don't understand how anyone cannot be suicidal as wishing to die is all that I know but I do very much dislike these people when they force their life valuing beliefs onto others and use it as an excuse to invalidate the wish to die and dismiss the cruel reality of this existence.

Pro suffering people just make this world a worse place, and all those people who refuse to accept suicide as being a rational solution should be ashamed. The worst ones to me are the ones who go out of their way to interfere with people's suicide plans and try to force others to exist. I do believe that the problem lies in the society that insists that life must be prolonged rather than being a personal choice and this view is shown by the inaccessibility of suicide methods and the fact that suicide is unfairly so stigmatised. I do believe that it would certainly be different if something happened to all these non suicidal people to make them wish to die.

 

[bijou]

If they're not personally suicidal, then I have doubts about the weight of their pain. If it's not bad enough for them to want to abandon it - how bad is it truly.

i am someone who is suicidal and lost a friend to suicide. i can confirm it is a horrible kind of grief, it's quite shocking and traumatic and i was very much forever changed by the experience. i am more suicidal now because of that event.

after their passing i had a trauma-induced psychotic episode (yes that can happen, it's most common after traumatic death), i thought demons were talking in my brain and sending people to kidnap me. i got a tattoo in my psychosis to ward off curses and entities from "infiltrating my mind"

it was a brief event and i have had a full remission in my delusional thinking, but my waking life was literally terrifying for a long while (think ari astar levels of horrifying).

i often wake up and feel insurmountable rage when i am reminded they are gone (not at them, at a world that betrayed us).

 

[SamTam33]

i am someone who is suicidal and lost a friend to suicide. i can confirm it is a horrible kind of grief, it's quite shocking and traumatic and i was very much forever changed by the experience. i am more suicidal now because of that event.

after their passing i had a trauma-induced psychotic episode (yes that can happen, it's most common after traumatic death), i thought demons were talking in my brain and sending people to kidnap me. i got a tattoo in my psychosis to ward off curses and entities from "infiltrating my mind"

it was a brief event and i have had a full remission in my delusional thinking, but my waking life was literally terrifying for a long while (think ari astar levels of horrifying).

i often wake up and feel insurmountable rage when i am reminded they are gone (not at them, at a world that betrayed us).

Oh wow. And the psychosis/demons/voices only occurred as a result of your friend's suicide?

If it's a common occurrence, that can be added to the list of suicide scare tactics/prevention methods.

 

[mushroomhive]

The pain of being suicidal and wanting to die is pretty fucking bad too. Is it not?

The non-suicidal discredit our pain all the time.

It's almost like a sport, they do it so much. Have you seen the thread about overused phrases?

With that said, my post wasn't about "discrediting" pain.

I can acknowledge that the pain of losing a loved one exists. But everything has levels.

And if we're talking about "immeasurable pain," I'm going to assume the pain of person who jumped off a building or blew their head open was worse.

The other one appears content to wake up everyday and say prayers instead.

have you ever lost someone extremely close to you before? because this reads like you havnt. this is not a competition. lots of pain is immeasurable. suicidal peoples pain is immeasurable and so is the pain of a mother who lost her child. this doesn't mean you have to stay alive for them, but grief is a serious thing. i'm kind of disturbed by how much you're downplaying it

 

[bijou]

Oh wow. And the psychosis/demons/voices only occurred as a result of your friend's suicide?

If it's a common occurrence, that can be added to the list of suicide scare tactics/prevention methods.

i had to be hospitalized, i was told by the psychiatrist it was fairly common, but i'm not actually sure of the reality of that, just going off of what i was told, maybe she said that just to make me feel better. i am skeptical because i was the only one out of my friends to experience it. it is a very real thing though, and more common for those with an existing severe mental illness. i have an existing severe mental illness so makes sense it happened to me, lol.

i don't think it should, or will, be used as a scare tactic, "normie people" don't necessarily know about it because it's not common knowledge and unlikely to impact them. they may not respond to grief as severely as others, especially because those who are at risk for this are most likely already suffering from some form of hopelessness. i personally am not trying to scare people with that response, i just want to be candid with my experience. i'm mostly trying to say already suicidal people will respond differently to this kind of trauma, as i did.

and if it is used as a scare tactic, it'll be in an incredibly phony way by people who probably do not know what it actually feels like.

it just mega sucks because now i am at risk for relapse if i experience another intensely traumatic event, i'd rather be gone than go through that again.

 

[booplesnoot34]

It just boggles my mind that non-suicidal people exist like how??? How could somebody not want to die all the time?

 

[SamTam33]

have you ever lost someone extremely close to you before? because this reads like you havnt. this is not a competition. lots of pain is immeasurable. suicidal peoples pain is immeasurable and so is the pain of a mother who lost her child. this doesn't mean you have to stay alive for them, but grief is a serious thing. i'm kind of disturbed by how much you're downplaying it

Stay disturbed. That's none of my concern.

But yes, I absolutely have lost people close to me. Who among us will live our entire lives and not know anyone who's died?

But death is not the worst thing that could happen. Being alive and yearning to be dead is worse.

 

[SamTam33]

...i was told by the psychiatrist it was fairly common, but i'm not actually sure of the reality of that.. i am skeptical because i was the only one out of my friends to experience it. it is a very real thing though, and more common for those with an existing severe mental illness... i'd rather be gone than go through that again.

This is my entire point: that when something is traumatic enough, you'd rather die than continue to experience it.

 

[bijou]

This is my entire point: that when something is traumatic enough, you'd rather die than continue to experience it.

while my experience was extreme, if you aren't suicidal already you can still very much become so after losing a loved one to it. ptsd can develop at any age. just because they don't attempt doesn't mean they don't feel unbearable trauma and ideation.

i attempted before my friend's ctb. i was just already vulnerable to extremes

 

[SamTam33]

while my experience was extreme, if you aren't suicidal already you can still very much become so after losing a loved one to it. ptsd can develop at any age. just because they don't attempt doesn't mean they don't feel unbearable trauma and ideation.

Of course they can still feel trauma. But I don't believe it's at the levels experienced by the person who committed suicide.

Chances are, they didn't identify with anything the person shared prior to them dying.

These are the same people who use those empty phrases and suggestions from the other thread.

These are the same people who'll report you to the cops and downplay your symptoms.

But when you die, suddenly their pain is unbearable and immeasurable.

The actions of the person who committed suicide speak louder than the words of those left behind.

Not to mention that if you truly loved someone and they were in pain, you should find comfort in them being free of that pain.

Any trauma experienced by those left behind is primarily rooted in what they lost. They aren't focused on what the suicidal person gained.

 

[hellispink]

Most people are fine with being slaves of a system. Most people have evil intentions in life. Most people are selfish and that is all they need to continue living. People who can't understand life is not enjoyful for everyone, I see them as selfish who just see their own shoes and noses.