Does this forum have an Aleksandr Dugin? (evil mastermind)

[noname223]

I wanted to post two threads the first about my head exploding and then the thread about Dugin. But I might merge them I don't have much resources to cope with the pain.

So my personal current state: I have a very strong headache just took a painpill. College triggers the shit out of me. Sunday I reached my limit. I was extremely exhausted and could not cope with it any longer. Then monday happened and because I had fucking interactions with a very attractive woman I developed a very strong love delusion. Now the shame game has started. I will ignore her for now. I have not approached her in a brave manner. Gladly. I feel embarrassed though realistically basically nothing happened. And I am torturing myself over it. But due to the fact I crossed my limits monday I have now manic symptoms. Yesterday I tried to sleep without addictive medication which was a mistake. The whole thing is pretty complex but my headache shows I am way beyond my limit and holidays are several weeks ahead. I have soon to send a paper to a lecturer and I am panicking already. It stressed me so fucking hard. Yeah my life is a shit hole. But this forum gives me support and helps me to cope.

So after my rant. I try not to discuss politics too explicitly in this sub-forum. But this is a thought I had so fucking often when reading about this forum in the media. To make it clear I am very anti-Russia in the Ukraine war. I am clearly on the side of Ukraine. But this Dugin comparison does not leave my head.

Probably a lot of people on here don't know who Alexandr Dugin is. He is a Russian philosopher who is portrayed by the media as the evil mastermind behind Vladimir Putin. They say he is the puppet player behind the Russian fascist nation. He is extremely right-wing and a nationalist. The thing is he is probably a huge asshole, morally corrupt as fuck and might even support a genocide. That being said the way the media portrays him is ridiculous. Many experts say the media bullshits about the influence of him. The media completely makes that up because it is a story that sells well. He probably does not have any real influence on Putin. The media just pretends that to get more money by this interesting and fascinating story. It is made up in many parts.

And this fact reminds me of this forum. However there are differences as I said this guy probably is actually evil in contrast to this forum. But the way the media spins a certain narrative to gain more money is the same. The sensationalistic way of reporting feels always completely the same for me when I read about either him or this forum. I always have to think about it.

A question connected to that. Does this forum actually have a philosophy? I think most people would rather agree on antinatalism in contrast to promortalism. I am certainly not supporting promortalism. I think this forum does not have a very coherent philosophy because the members are too divere. There are some pillars though. The culture and atmosphere is fluid and changes when members appear/disappear. Could one say there is one member who is the main philosopher? I would say no. The closest would be the people who determine the rules but this usually is not a job for a philsopher (?). I think statistically some philosophies and philsophers are more popular than others. But it would be very hard to agree on one I assume.

I had this idea for a thread pretty long in my mind but I always postponed it because it might be too controversial. But this evening I am in the mood for it.

What do you think?

 

[Abandoned Character]

It seems you answered your own question. I do not see any indication that this forum has a single individual it takes philosophical inspiration from, secretly or publicly.

 

[Aergia]

A question connected to that. Does this forum actually have a philosophy? I think most people would rather agree on antinatalism in contrast to promortalism.

How many suicidal people here are anti-natalists?

Anti-natalism poll

sanctioned-suicide.net

Are you a promortalist?

Promortalism is the philosophical belief that for any sentient being, it is always better to cease to exist. Edit: I think considering how SS has been portrayed as a pro-death site by outsiders, it would be good to have actual data on the philosophies the members here hold.

sanctioned-suicide.net

I think you're correct. Though of course a larger sample size for the polls would be better.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I think from an outsider and pro-life perspective- these people always seem to zero in on the most sensationalist and pro-mortalist posts. No wonder- they see the forum as the devil incarnate- so- of course they're going to focus on the most extreme examples- especially surrounding minors. Any post that suggests suicide and especially assisted suicide is a good option for minors with no restrictions is a gift to them. It's that issue in particular that gets parents going and I imagine that it's parents that are the most afraid of a forum like this. Not to say people shouldn't be allowed to express themselves but I'd say it's that issue that gets people the most riled up.

If I'm honest- I would get so triggered if I read those articles/saw those videos- so- I try to avoid them. Do they try to portray it as having an evil mastermind behind it then? Of course- I've come across the incel angle- rubbish of course because- they no longer run the site. I believe FuneralCry is probably quoted a lot and some people seem to have some hair brained idea that she relishes in encouraging others to die whilst remaining alive. I think I've seen that. I don't think that's true at all. I do get the impression she would personally prefer it if everyone was pro-mortalist- because she is triggered by anything positive but- I don't think she wants or is trying to be a cult leader! She just wants a space she feels comfortable in.

Personally speaking- I agree with you. I think actually only a minority of people here are promortalist. Most are pro-choice for others- even if they are promortalist for themselves. Even the most promortalist ones don't encourage people to die who aren't sure. The furthest they go is to pick up on the negative things in their post and agree with how shit existence is.

With regards to anti-natilism though. Yes- there is a strong undercurrent of that here. Kind of unpleasant for parents I'm sure. Still- in a poll I ran ages ago, 80% of members wished they'd never been born, so it's no real wonder so many of us are anti-birth.

Personally, I think it's important that this forum neither actually becomes promortalist or- is seen to become it. I think it's important for people who want to discuss suicide in general to have a safe space to do it. I think it's important that multiple views are voiced and listened to. We better come to our own conclusions I believe by reading multiple opinions by others. I certainly wouldn't want to be part of some kind of cult where one person's beliefs reigned supreme. I love that this place is full of independent and deep thinkers who- for the main part will take the time to listen to one another. We may not agree with one another but most of the time, people are respectful of others views.

I'm sorry about your struggles at uni. I've been through the most ridiculous periods of limerance lasting years. (Obsessive crushes on people.) I know how much it messes with your head.

 

[real person]

name a single useful philosophical idea dugin has produced. he hasn't

 

[Mistiie]

I would argue that whilst SaSu strives to host individuals with varying beliefs, the underlying philosophy here is "anti-natalism". There's been a survey or two asked on here about whether or not people are anti-natalists and a smidge above half answered yes, so I'd say that's the majority belief.

However, it's worth mentioning that I've noticed that most 'anti-natalists' here have quite diluted versions of anti-natalism as a whole. Anti-natalists in practice tend to believe in procreation being entirely immoral (as in, you give birth to a baby, and you're causing near-immeasurable pain sort of thing), which I haven't seen the majority of people express here, or at least not in such an extreme manner. The same can be said for most other aspects and key ideas of anti-natalism, save for life causing suffering (is that really a surprise?) which kind of just echoes depression and a bleak outlook on life rather than anti-natalism - I think these two things get conflated far more than they should.

I would wager a pretty decent sum of money that the majority of people here aren't actually anti-natalist. A lot of the 'anti-natalist' views that spread here are, as mentioned above, diluted, but also a consequence of their own misery. The people here tend not to genuinely believe in life being guaranteed suffering, or that procreation is a sin, or that the sacrifice of the unhappy to fuel the happy is unfair. They "believe" in it solely because they're miserable. It's a philosophy picked up and dropped between times of great suffering in individuals. Anti-natalism, be it this site's diet variant or the real deal, is almost hilariously ridiculous to me as a concept and should be mocked relentlessly for being an incredibly self-centric view on life, and I think that this sentiment carries over to those who end up recovering a bit. Give those people a good upbringing and a relatively torture-free life and they probably wouldn't even have the faintest clue of what "natalism" means, let alone the concept of birth being negative. People here seem to opt for that philosophy only because they have suffered, not because everything does. It's almost like a confirmation bias; they have suffered, which proves anti-natalism to them as a worthwhile philosophy, whilst simultaneously ignoring all the good in their lives and everyone else's, either because they're too depressed to appreciate it or are blatantly ignorant.

In short, yeah, most people here are 'anti-natalists', but they don't really pick up the true spirit of the philosophy and additionally only pick it up because they're feeling rough. Drag them out of that suffering and their viewpoint changes, more often than not; this leads me to believe that only a fraction of the site wholeheartedly believes in anti-natalism when they're not suffering or when they're distracted from their thoughts.

(And a quick edit as I post this: It seems as though those beliefs also coincide with a whole lot of narcissism and other self-centric views; many people also seem to want to have a 'reset' of the world where no one is born, as seen in a poll the other day, even if it means the happy no longer have that opportunity to be, if only because it saves the few sad ones from being sad. I feel as though this is more indicative of this site harbouring hatred towards humanity in general because they're jealous of others and the success they find, rather than because they actually believe in anti-natalist ideology/life inherently being suffering, given that they acknowledged that people can be perfectly happy as is. It's just the closest thing that can describe such malice without saying it out loud.)

 

[Brew]

In short, yeah, most people here are 'anti-natalists', but they don't really pick up the true spirit of the philosophy and additionally only pick it up because they're feeling rough. Drag them out of that suffering and their viewpoint changes, more often than not; this leads me to believe that only a fraction of the site wholeheartedly believes in anti-natalism when they're not suffering or when they're distracted from their thoughts.

This is such a fun thought to have, right? It works so many other things that I've seen over time, specially what relates to Nietzsche and the idea that self-hatred could also mean a huge ego, which sounds ironic until you think about it a bit more.
Seems you're versed on philosophical ideas and specific psychological experiments, I'm interested in what else you might know or where you think I could check out more about this or generally any other unrelated ideas.

(And a quick edit as I post this: It seems as though those beliefs also coincide with a whole lot of narcissism and other self-centric views; many people also seem to want to have a 'reset' of the world where no one is born, as seen in a poll the other day, even if it means the happy no longer have that opportunity to be, if only because it saves the few sad ones from being sad. I feel as though this is more indicative of this site harbouring hatred towards humanity in general because they're jealous of others and the success they find, rather than because they actually believe in anti-natalist ideology/life inherently being suffering, given that they acknowledged that people can be perfectly happy as is. It's just the closest thing that can describe such malice without saying it out loud.)

Well now, as you already considered the true complexity of the anti-natalist belief, it's not because happiness can exist, not only for just a few but for moments in everyone's lives too, even as we have all the possible means and tech for every living thing on this planet to be happy [debatable], there is just too much horrible things happening to too many people at once, and most of us able to even come near to grasp the weight of this thought are prone to be affected by the Bystander Effect, just by being better off by a very thin comparative difference.
This is the third idea I forgot to mention, about a very fading memory of a philosophy/quote in what I can only assume is existentialist, that when put on a scale, being dead is infinitely better than being alive, and not have been born at all is infinitely better than dying.