Does anyone else think suicide/SI is a natural reaction to living in this capitalist dystopia?

[JGT]

Can anyone explain why the other day I was struggling to lift a box into my car and 2 people came over to help me straight away. However, if I was struggling for money/ looked homeless they would never help me?

 

[EmbraceOfTheVoid]

I don't know for sure it can be completely pinned down to Capitalism, although it's definitely not much better than any other political system. What I think it might boil down to is the fact many of the existing political systems are all poorly thought out by their very nature. We weren't meant to live like machines, period. Be it Capitalist/Communist. We are social animals who would be much better off imo if we would have just stayed as hunters/gatherers in some kind of modernized way, or maybe even not in a modernized way. If we all went extinct because we didn't have Hospitals, and modern healthcare for example, we would still feel a sense of universal engagement and belonging.

What maybe happens in modern times is that there are certain types of personalities that are suited for living in political system A,B,C and the rest all live in some kind of isolationalist nightmare where they're stigmatized, or worse, jailed/tortured/killed for not being a good fit. I'm aware hunting/gathering societies had immense suffering at times, and I may be completely wrong. To me though, it seems that a human hunting/gathering society would always have a universal sense of belonging, and much more social engagement for all members of such a society. In modern times it would bring immense suffering anyway, much more, because we've fucked the environment into the ground, and reached into the collective consciousness of every human way of life in every corner of the globe. How many people are still NPC'ing it when things are getting so obviously worse? Business as usual, it'll all burn down eventually though.

I remember watching a documentary 10 years ago of this professor visiting a tribe in South America and he tried to explain to them the concepts of money and homelessness in the outside world but they couldn't understand. One of the men exclaimed: "How does he not have a home? Bring him here and I will build him one."

You generally won't find something like that in modern society because most people in our culture are extremely greedy and only care about buying their next iPhone or whatever meaningless status symbol. I don't think a hunter/gatherer setting would work at this point either and the very nature of existence is evil to me; it rewards those who trample on others the most.

 

[meles_inoris]

Suicide? Yes. Survival Instinct? No. SI is your body's last ditch effort to preserve itself to keep on living. It's completely biological, much like how agonal breathing is the body's way of trying to get oxygen to the brain, or how some women's bodies will calcify a dead child still in the womb to protect the mother's body (real shit, look it up). The human body is fucking metal.

I thought SI stood for suicidal ideation, my bad

 

[Aeathelina]

I see it more as an reaction to a society that cares very little in the way of a person's feelings and dreams. And with every news flash (USA) we also see how disposable to the world as a whole we are. Happiness has become an option now.

 

[Walilamdzi]

Yes, I think so.

 

[Imgonnadie]

Absolutely. I've seen this sentiment repeated so much on online forums and definitely feel it myself. I'm pretty sure the most primitive societies don't have suicide rates like "developed" nations. If you look up suicide stats the most developed nations have some of the highest rates.

 

[EmbraceOfTheVoid]

Absolutely. I've seen this sentiment repeated so much on online forums and definitely feel it myself. I'm pretty sure the most primitive societies don't have suicide rates like "developed" nations. If you look up suicide stats the most developed nations have some of the highest rates.

The people in underdeveloped nations die from things like disease and hunger before suicide even becomes a option; lower suicide rates does not mean their culture is healthier.

 

[Imgonnadie]

No, Capitalism is by far the best economic system for providing good living standards. Open a world map and mark all the countries which are capitalistic USA,Europe(except for healthcare),Saudi Arabia,South Korea,Japan al these countries have a much better standard of living than socialist or communist countries like Cuba,Vietnam,Bangladesh,Soviet Union(former). GDP , life expectancy, poverty rates are all better for capitalist countries.
The best example in today's times is China, after it's open door policy in 1970's and privatization of many sectors ( all capitalist policies), the country is going to emerge as an economic superpower in the near future. China's poverty rate fell from 88 percent in 1981 to 0.7 percent in 2015, as measured by the percentage of people living on the equivalent of US$1.90 or less per day in 2011 purchasing price parity terms.
Suicide is caused by a number of causes. It is difficult to pin it down to just "capitalism". Infact for the reasons stated above, an average suicidal person will be much better off, living in a capitalist country then any other economic system.

turns out if you take capitalism and add common sense shit like guaranteeing housing, jobs, healthcare, education like scandinavian countries and much of western europe it greatly increases quality of life. yet they still have relatively high suicide rates

 

[xXSarac3nSlay3rXx]

Yes. I think suicide will become a more appealing option as society deteriorates further.

 

[ceelo]

>these morons thinking capitalism is a "system" like communism

Communism is a political system, capitalism is a description of transaction.

 

[Wisdom3_1-9]

The people in underdeveloped nations die from things like disease and hunger before suicide even becomes a option; lower suicide rates does not mean their culture is healthier.

I suppose this relates to Maslow's hierarchy in a way. If our needs are not met we die. If needs on the bottom of the pyramid are not met, the forces of nature will take us, but higher up on the pyramid, we take our own lives.

 

[lostangel]

I'm not sure with SI. But I remember seeing a quote it goes something like ''suicide isn't the problem, the problem is a much deeper societal issue '' or it's something close to that. But I do agree with suicide is a natural reaction to living in a dystopian capitalist.

If you think about it we go to school til 18 and college for 4 years and work for the rest of our lives until (something close to that) we die or that is what the majority do. I think this wage slave, type of living isn't the best for our mental health. I believe this is why illnesses like depression have become so common.

 

[ebt88]

If you look up suicide stats the most developed nations have some of the highest rates.

Not true at all

Suicide Rate by Country 2024

worldpopulationreview.com

Given suicidal population is a very small percent of the population I don't think this theory is true. Anyway this society is way to much easier to live at than the natural hunter-gatherer, if you don't think so then try it.

 

[epic]

I'm not sure with SI. But I remember seeing a quote it goes something like ''suicide isn't the problem, the problem is a much deeper societal issue '' or it's something close to that. But I do agree with suicide is a natural reaction to living in a dystopian capitalist.

If you think about it we go to school til 18 and college for 4 years and work for the rest of our lives until (something close to that) we die or that is what the majority do. I think this wage slave, type of living isn't the best for our mental health. I believe this is why illnesses like depression have become so common.

40 hours work week should be pretty manageable for an average person between 18 and 60 years of age. tbh .

 

[xXSarac3nSlay3rXx]

>these morons thinking capitalism is a "system" like communism

Communism is a political system, capitalism is a description of transaction.

Spare us your semantics. . .

 

[ceelo]

Spare us your semantics. . .

it's not semantics, they are literally completely different things, jesus christ why do people insist on discussing things they know nothing about?

 

[Wisdom3_1-9]

>these morons thinking capitalism is a "system" like communism

Communism is a political system, capitalism is a description of transaction.

???

 

[ceelo]

???
View attachment 40131

nice source but thats corporatism, not surprised by google though... go a bit further mate, capitalism is an economic system and description of transaction its nothing to do with political systems thus it is paired with democracy no? communism however is an all inclusive system of political and economic union.

 

[Wisdom3_1-9]

New Oxford English Dictionary. I was just surprised by your post because I'd never heard of capitalism described as "not a system" before. I buy the argument that it is an economic system rather than a political one, but I do think the US in particular has adopted capitalism as a political ideology, as a means of combating competing communist and socialist ideals of rival nations.

 

[ceelo]

New Oxford English Dictionary. I was just surprised by your post because I'd never heard of capitalism described as "not a system" before. I buy the argument that it is an economic system rather than a political one, but I do think the US in particular has adopted capitalism as a political ideology, as a means of combating competing communist and socialist ideals of rival nations.

No capitalism is the system of economics the usa uses and perpetuates, it's actual political system is a constitutional republic that engages in democracy on the state level. You could say it's expansive as you say tendency to install capitalism is politically motivated but then i'd have to refer to the fact this is again corporatism, usa hasnt had proper capitalism for many many years.

 

[Fedrea]

Question

No

 

[Madiem]

for me the human condition in itself is the reason for my plans.
life will never be the better option no matter what advanced technology might do to help reduce the overall negatives of being alive creating needs just to meet them isn't rational so im going to ctb and wish the rest catch on sooner or later.

 

[Cutepoison]

Yes. I think suicide is justified given this shit world

 

[rhiino]

Yes, living in this capitalist dystopia makes people suffer and it creates the desire for suicide.

It gets stated in this thread that capitalism creates a higher standard of living, an easier life and other stuff that is seen as beneficial by society. In fact, in my opinion everything that counts is how happy the people are. Being happy, no matter under what circumstances, is what makes a life worth living. People in capitalist first world countries are not happier. The standard of living here only creates further desires and makes you unhappy.
Additionally the standard of living of capitalist countries is often gained at the expense of people in other countries like China. They are slaves for the standard of living for half of the world and anything but happy there.

Native tribes live without any political system and close to nature. They are happy, they live a good life. Capitalism and also technology has brought us nothing but suffering.

 

[Wisdom3_1-9]

Native tribes live without any political system and close to nature. They are happy, they live a good life. Capitalism and also technology has brought us nothing but suffering.

You make a very good point about indigenous peoples with "primitive" economic and social systems still finding happiness. Advancements in technology and economics have made our lifespans longer and possibly more fulfilling, thought they are more wrought with complications.

Here are the top 20 and bottom 20 countries from this year's World Happiness Report. The top nations are all developed nations that have struck some balance between capitalist and socialist economics. The bottom are typically (though not ubiquitously) countries with limited resources. Of course, the version of "happiness" that the index measures may very well be rooted in more Western ideals.

 

[ceelo]

Prob is that happiness scale is based on materialism and gdp, the happiest ppl on earth are monks who have nought but practice being happy in metta meditation, something to take note of i guess.

 

[xXSarac3nSlay3rXx]

it's not semantics, they are literally completely different things, jesus christ why do people insist on discussing things they know nothing about?

Your distinction is entirely semantic: I think it's fair to say that capitalism and communism are both systems. You're a pretentious prick who knows no more than anyone else does. . .

 

[ceelo]

Your distinction is entirely semantic: I think it's fair to say that capitalism and communism are both systems. You're a pretentious prick who knows no more than anyone else does. . .

Your insecurities are showing. Communism is an all engulfing political and economic model, capitalism is a financial system of transaction that is paired with a political system, typical democracy. You probably think the usa is a democracy to? it isnt its a constitutional republic, know the difference? probably not.

 

[xXSarac3nSlay3rXx]

Your insecurities are showing. Communism is an all engulfing political and economic model, capitalism is a financial system of transaction that is paired with a political system, typical democracy. You probably think the usa is a democracy to? it isnt its a constitutional republic, know the difference? probably not.

Goddamn. Why do you keep going on about this dumb shit? I know the US is a constitutional republic, but it is in name only. The US is a corporate oligarchy in practice. Maybe I didn't use the right words just there, but you get the damn point. At least I can write a coherent fucking sentence. While I do know the difference between a democracy and a republic, you don't know the difference between "to" and "too." I can nitpick just as well. . .

 

[ceelo]

The US is a corporate oligarchy in practice.

yes thus is not capitalism but corporatism, you're getting there.... slowly.