Do you think what is said in goodbye threads is considered ‘encouraging suicide’?

[Circles]

So given what's been said about this site, one common argument talked about from numerous of people on Twitter, Reddit and in the article is that people on here are encouraging the members who are about to ctb. Now in all of my 3 years on the site I personally have never seen any obvious encouraging in any goodbye threads, but I can see how people outside this forum could see and misinterpret what is said. Like when members say 'Good luck' 'See you on the other side' and other examples, etc.

Plus another point they make is that there's no one trying to dissuade the members who are going to ctb from killing themselves. Now that's partly true only because not all goodbye threads get someone trying to dissuade the member who's about to ctb. There's been plenty of goodbye threads with people trying to dissuade and talk with the members but sadly not all. Yes we should support and respect everyone's right to die, but I just don't know how if anything could fix this. Make people aware of what you say but even then. People outside this forum is painting a big ugly picture about this place encouraging others when that's far from the truth but the truth doesn't matter to them.

Also while I'm at it another point they bring up is how people are live blogging their suicide to other members and I know this may be an unpopular opinion of mine at the moment but I feel there should be rules against live blogging. I don't know what can be said to defend this besides how lonely people are during their suicide attempt but most normal people won't understand that. Another thing about this is that since the live blogging occurs outside this forum we do not know what is said to these members and if anyone says anything 'encouraging'.

 

[Pluto]

All of us are born completely innocent. Many stages need to be passed before a person finds themselves making a goodbye thread.

The sin of the opponents of this site is refusing to take into account the events that happened prior to a person ultimately taking their own life. When all the failed attempts at recovery, failures of the medical system, ignored cries for help, slow descent over years, escalating desperation, etc. is properly accounted for, then it should be clear that comforting and embracing people in their dying hour is the only compassionate option left.

None of this would be happening if the world were a less shitty place, but nobody wants to talk about that. And by quoting the situation out of context, it makes it look like we are nonchalant in the face of our own friends dying before us.

 

[Insomniac]

I feel there should be rules against live blogging.

more importantly, ban people who propose suicide methods that are harmful to others like "playing in traffic" or "homemade bomb" type of posters.

 

[Suicidebydeath]

It's a moral grey area for me. I can understand the sentiment of reply posts in goodbye threads and hesitation to dissuade. If someone posts "there's still time to change your mind" and they continue to ctb then I just hope it's what they really wanted and they found peace.

SI and ctb difficulty is so high that I don't want to interfere but I feel relieved for those posts asking for certainty.

We're all here because we feel suicidal. I agree with above poster, they should maybe look closer at the reasons why we're here instead of being critical of our relief when one of us passes away.

Most of that article was full of bullshit and thats been covered. Now that I had more time to think about it, I thought the character assassination of the site owners was especially low. They had to try to paint some "big bad" but that was f'd up.

 

[deflationary]

By my standards, I've never once seen anyone encourage someone to commit suicide here. What these people call encouragement just seems like lack of discouragement to me. And I think that's totally fine. It's not my place to discourage someone unless they show signs that they want to be discouraged.

 

[Chinaski]

I tend to avoid goodbye threads tbqh - l very rarely post in them because I've seen too many which were not genuine, but one thing which needs canning is definitely the liveblog/research theme. People popping up to say IF YOU'RE STILL ALIVE CAN YOU TELL ME HOW LONG IT TOOK BEFORE U TURNED BLUE is gross even to me, so it's definitely not going to impress an outsider looking in - l do think there needs to be more maturity regarding what's often being discussed, when you consider how much emphasis this forum places on Safe Haven Empathy Hugs Emoji Uwu there are some members who will treat an individual's passing with a callous frivolity, and this is very uncomfortable imo.

 

[Insomniac]

but I can see how people outside this forum could see and misinterpret what is said. Like when members say 'Good luck' 'See you on the other side' and other examples, etc

these morons are only believing what they want to believe. this forum has accommodated them a lot already by creating recovering section and enforcing moderation (people can't even name sources to find products anymore, or provide links. and when someone ask for help with a method, there is a LOT less assistance than before. People on here mainly complain about their lives or make jokes. edit: also minors have been banned following complaints.).

It's been proposed many times to ban goodbye threads but it's still a bad idea. Goodbye threads must remain. Prolifers haven't showed any sign of gratefulness for all the changes made here. Even in the article they only talk about it in a negative light (ex: "the site says people who want to join only for the recovery section will most likely be denied" -a bitch journalist).

I say, no more compromising. People here used to be very polite and showed a lot of empaty for these complaining parents and relatives, but since they kept name calling us over and over again, and lying endlessly, I have lost all sympathy and respect for them and their grief. They can fuck off with and even choke in their pain.

 

[Chinaski]

I have lost all sympathy and respect for them and their grief. They can fuck off with and even choke in their pain.

This is absolutely immature and unhelpful to this site, frankly.

 

[StarryStarry]

I don't believe that. I can only speak for myself. When it will be my time (soon), I hope to post here to let you all know I'm leaving. Why? Because you all are the only ones who give a shit. This site has been a life saver for me. To speak openly about how I feel, how much pain I'm in and not be criticized or ridiculed or told that I have so much to live for or take a walk, exercise, get out more. What a bunch of horse shit! You all understand me. I can never than you enough.

 

[_Minsk]

tbh i really don't mind being encouraged, after all its me who decides in the end if this makes any sense..still, i understand why we might need these rules

 

[Insomniac]

This is absolutely immature

and yet still mild compared to how I feel towards them.

 

[Chinaski]

yet still mild compared to how I feel towards them.

Fair enough, just sometimes there is greater benefit in maintaining a dignified silence than there is in kicking off imo.

 

[Kennish]

Not really. I think this site gives people a way to vent and go CTB calmer and with people who understands them. That's why we're here.

 

[Insomniac]

Fair enough, just sometimes there is greater benefit in maintaining a dignified silence than there is in kicking off imo.

taking the high road used to work indeed.
edit: but it has never worked for this website.

 

[Kennish]

I think people that are against this site never experienced deep depression or other severe deseases

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

I can see how extremely ignorant people might see it that way. Even though I'm also extremely ignorant I at least realize that simple goodbyes aren't supposed to be directly encouraging anyone to do it. Many good bye messages even give people permission to opt out if they feel like they're not ready.

If anyone here ACTUALLY feels like they want/need to be encouraged to commit suicide, then this is a pretty difficult place for that. Why bother going through with the long process of signing up for this small website when anyone can head over to 4chan/Twitter/Reddit/Facebook and simply say anything controversial enough in a public group/page/thread. I promise you that doing so in the right spaces will net you hundreds if not thousands of messages demanding that you kill yourself.

 

[YourNeighbor]

Some comments do encourage goodbye OPs to go through with suicide (the "you-can-do-its" and the "you'll-be-at-peace-soons"), some don't (comments reminding OPs that it's not too late to reconsider), and most seem to be a meaningless version of SaSu virtue signaling (the "I hope you find peace soons").

 

[demuic]

Definitely not.

Mainstream society sees anyone who's not mindlessly repeating "NOOOOO DON"T KILL YOURSELF YOU HAVE SO MUCH TO LIVE FOR" when anyone expresses the mildest suicidal intent to be "encouraging."

No one is really going to be "encouraged" to kill themselves solely from replies from anonymous strangers on here anyway, not unless they had other serious problems that lead them to be in such a fragile state of mind. As @Dr Iron Arc said people are probably more like to be driven to suicide from social media than this site.

 

[Circles]

these morons are only believing what they want to believe. this forum has accommodated them a lot already by creating recovering section and enforcing moderation (people can't even name sources to find products anymore, or provide links. and when someone ask for help with a method, there is a LOT less assistance than before. People on here mainly complain about their lives or make jokes).

It's been proposed many times to ban goodbye threads but it's still a bad idea. Goodbye threads must remain. Prolifers haven't showed any sign of gratefulness for all the changes made here. Even in the article they only talk about it in a negative light (ex: "the site says people who want to join only for the recovery section will most likely be denied" -a bitch journalist).

I say, no more compromising. People here used to be very polite and showed a lot of empaty for these complaining parents and relatives, but since they kept name calling us over and over again, and lying endlessly, I have lost all sympathy and respect for them and their grief. They can fuck off with and even choke in their pain.

I didn't say anything about banning goodbye threads, I brought up what's said in goodbye threads and how it can be misinterpreted. The one thing I feel, and this is just my own opinion, but atleast live blogging should be banned.

And sure I agree with how you're feeling but we have to think about the bigger picture here. SS is in the spotlight now and anything that makes it look bad will be used against it. Hell even the partners page would make every normal person outside this forum think we're crazy. The Wild West of how things were are gone and we need to evolve if we want this site to survive. And before you argue with me I'm not bashing I'm just stating that given the situation we should atleast consider looking at the complaints about this site and working more to change things. Agree to disagree.

 

[demuic]

I didn't say anything about banning goodbye threads, I brought up what's said in goodbye threads and how it can be misinterpreted. The one thing I feel, and this is just my own opinion, but atleast live blogging should be banned.

And sure I agree with how you're feeling but we have to think about the bigger picture here. SS is in the spotlight now and anything that makes it look bad will be used against it. Hell even the partners page would make every normal person outside this forum think we're crazy. The Wild West of how things were are gone and we need to evolve if we want this site to survive. And before you argue with me I'm not bashing I'm just stating that given the situation we should atleast consider looking at the complaints about this site and working more to change things. Agree to disagree.

I really don't think so. These people will never be satisfied. They want all mentions of methods and the like removed. It's a case of giving an inch and taking a mile. This forum's existence is already enough for normal people to consider us crazy. We don't have to act according to their sensibilities.

This will pass as the other times SS has been in the spotlight has passed. Sucidal people are usually at the bottom of anyone's concerns.

There are far more illegal things on the internet, not even the dark web, that still have proper hosting and such, so I don't think SS is at any risk.

 

[Circles]

I really don't think so. These people will never be satisfied. They want all mentions of methods and the like removed. It's a case of giving an inch and taking a mile. This forum's existence is already enough for normal people to consider us crazy. We don't have to act according to their sensibilities.

This will pass as the other times SS has been in the spotlight has passed. Sucidal people are usually at the bottom of anyone's concerns.

There are far more illegal things on the internet, not even the dark web, that still have proper hosting and such, so I don't think SS is at any risk.

I agree but for fucks sake this time it's different. The mods were doxxed and anything bad or considered bad could lead them with legal trouble maybe. And the people who are after them and the site are the mothers of the members who died and there's nothing worse than a grieving Karen with nothing to lose. We need to protect the mods somehow and all I'm saying is that maybe just maybe we should change some things that seem questionable. This is a witch hunt and they're looking for scapegoats to blame after all. And the only reason I agree with you is that I know even if we change the things I'm talking about it won't change much but maybe it can help make this site last longer.

 

[FuneralCry]

No, it is supporting the right to die and respecting other peoples personal decisions about their lives. We all have the right to exit this world at a time of our own choosing after all.

 

[Chinaski]

I didn't say anything about banning goodbye threads, I brought up what's said in goodbye threads and how it can be misinterpreted. The one thing I feel, and this is just my own opinion, but atleast live blogging should be banned.

And sure I agree with how you're feeling but we have to think about the bigger picture here. SS is in the spotlight now and anything that makes it look bad will be used against it. Hell even the partners page would make every normal person outside this forum think we're crazy. The Wild West of how things were are gone and we need to evolve if we want this site to survive. And before you argue with me I'm not bashing I'm just stating that given the situation we should atleast consider looking at the complaints about this site and working more to change things. Agree to disagree.

Fwiw l fully agree with this - if someone is to liveblog a suicide, whether real or fake, anyone contributing to such a thread can be seen as *not intervening*, now this is fine, this is a pro-choice forum, but it does leave us open to difficult questions to answer. There are people I've confided in who are sympathetic re my suicidal ideation and do not seek to dissuade, however l would not ctb *in their house* because of the difficult questions they will face afterwards.

Regarding the partners thread, it's a nauseating creep-fest and l personally think it should have been canned a very very long time ago, but that's just my opinion.

 

[RainAndSadness]

No. It's a naturral desire to wish people peace and comfort in their last moments. I do not believe this is encouragement in a legal or moral sense. If a person voluntarily decides to end their life, which cruel person would want them to fail and possibly end up disabled permanently? The answer is obvious. Only people who disrespect the autonomy and decision of another human could hope for the worst possible outcome. So when people wish them luck, it's about their desire to find relief. Anything else is a horrible misinterpretation of that scenario.

 

[catdaddy2601]

I wouldn't say it's encouraging suicide, more about supporting our fellow SS members to finally be at peace. We're all here for a common reason, people who don't have suicidal thoughts or the trauma that we have will never understand what we have gone through, or had to go through our whole lives. We have all come to the conclusion that things will never get better, it's a cold cold world and actually, those who find the strength to cross the bridge and defeat their survival instincts are hero's because they give us hope that one day we will be strong enough to do the same.

 

[Chinaski]

No. It's a naturral desire to wish people peace and comfort in their last moments. I do not believe this is encouragement in a legal or moral sense. If a person voluntarily decides to end their life, which cruel person would want them to fail and possibly end up disabled permanently? The answer is obvious. Only people who disrespect the autonomy and decision of another human could hope for the worst possible outcome. So when people wish them luck, it's about their desire to find relief. Anything else is a horrible misinterpretation of that scenario.

This is accurate enough but there's a huge difference between a goodbye thread and a liveblogging, some goodbye threads have come across like lab experiments with the nature of some of the responses, I've made this point elsewhere but not all comments in these threads are appropriate or respectful imo, in fact quite a lot of them are very much the opposite, and it wouldn't do us any harm if the site used the description provided in the quoted post as the enforced standard, and removed any posts that fell foul imo.

 

[Crazy4u]

Noone encourages suicide here. Safe Travels, I hope you find peace, ....etc is not encouragement.

 

[wanttogetonthebus]

I think the only thing that is encouraged here is freedom of choice when it comes to whether or not a rational individual decides that their life is worth living.

 

[PDAnnie2610]

Fwiw l fully agree with this - if someone is to liveblog a suicide, whether real or fake, anyone contributing to such a thread can be seen as *not intervening*, now this is fine, this is a pro-choice forum, but it does leave us open to difficult questions to answer. There are people I've confided in who are sympathetic re my suicidal ideation and do not seek to dissuade, however l would not ctb *in their house* because of the difficult questions they will face afterwards.

Regarding the partners thread, it's a nauseating creep-fest and l personally think it should have been canned a very very long time ago, but that's just my opinion.

For some of us, doing it alone is hard. I'm not speaking for myself but being lonely going off is difficult.

 

[wanttogetonthebus]

For some of us, doing it alone is hard. I'm not speaking for myself but being lonely going off is difficult.

100% agreed. I'm like that too, but it's likely I'll still have to unfortunately do it all by myself because I'd need someone who I can 100% trust, wouldn't sell me out, and would stick with the plan.