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DontTouchMeImFamous

DontTouchMeImFamous

Student
Jul 18, 2024
120
It was hard for me to find these information because this chapter had been removed from later versions of PPH for reasons I'm unaware of. If you know why, please share them in the comments below. Thanks to Z-Lib, I was able to download this old version, and I'd like to share it with you. If you can, please consider donating to Z-Library or Anna's Archive to help keep free access to knowledge available for everyone.

For mods: If you find this useful, please consider adding it to the megathread or the Suicide Resource Compilation so everyone can easily access it.

These pages (88–95) make up the entirety of Chapter 7.


7

Cyanide
The death of Spaniard Ramon Sampedro in 1998 and the subsequent award-winning film The Sea Inside has focused attention on the use of cyanide as an effective means by which a seriously ill person can put an end to their suffering.

Sampedro, a quadriplegic since a diving accident at age 26, ended his life by drinking a glass of water in which soluble potassium cyanide had been dissolved. He died quickly, and peacefully. Many people who have seen The Sea Inside have asked why these cyanide salts are not more frequently used by those who are seriously ill to provide a peaceful death. In this chapter we explain some of the difficulties involved in using cyanide and provide some answers. It is not unreasonable to expect that the use of cyanide will increase in the future, and it may yet become an acceptable form of the 'Peaceful Pill'.


Some background to cyanide

In 1814, the carbon-nitrogen (CN) 'radical' common to a number of chemical substances was isolated and given the name 'cyanogen' by the French chemist Joseph Gay Lussac. The subsequent name 'the blue generator' referred to the place of the CN radical in a number of chemicals that were used as blue dyes; the Prussian Blue of blueprints (iron ferro cyanide) is perhaps the best known. In many of these compounds, the CN radical is so tightly bound that the substances are relatively non-toxic.

With the discovery of substances where the CN radical was not so tightly bound - the gas hydrogen cyanide, hydrocyanic acid, and simple salts like potassium and sodium cyanide - it
was soon realised that cyanide was extremely toxic to animal cells. By destroying the mitochondria, an essential element within each cell, the CN radical caused rapid cellular death.

In 1921, cyanide gas (hydrogen cyanide, HCN) was proposed as a humane method of execution and led to the passage of the 'Humane Death Bill' in Nevada. The gas was first used to execute Gee Jon in 1924. Since that time nearly 1000 people have died in the execution gas chambers in the US. All chambers used the same method to produce cyanide gas. Pellets of sodium cyanide were dropped into sulphuric acid to release the gas which then enveloped the prisoner.

Hydrogen cyanide is a volatile liquid and can be stabilised and absorbed onto a substrate. In this form (Zyclon B), it was used by the Nazi's during the Holocaust. Originally developed as an insecticide, the pellets were kept in sealed containers and released as HCN gas when the pellets came into contact with air.

Today, cyanide compounds are widely used in industry. Vast quantities of the cyanide salts are produced for use in the gold mining, metallurgy, electroplating and photographic industries. Their toxicity is well known and despite the large quantities used, they remain heavily restricted and difficult to obtain.

Can Cyanide provide a peaceful and reliable death?

Those watching the cinematographic depiction of Sampedro's death would have cause to believe that a death resulting from the ingestion of cyanide salts is peaceful. Unfortunately, not all reports of cyanide deaths support this view. Indeed, there is considerable variation in accounts. While reliability is not an issue, the question most raised relates to the method's 'peacefulness.' Just how peaceful is it to die with cyanide?

Most accounts of death from cyanide poisoning come from witnesses to gas chamber executions where the (unwilling) prisoner inhaled HCN. One study undertaken at San Quentin prison showed that, on average, consciousness was lost within one to three minutes, with death occurring after nine minutes. These deaths were often peaceful with the prisoner falling quickly asleep. On some occasions, however, a violent (and presumably painful) death was observed. This method of execution was largely abandoned in the US in 1994 when the American Civil Liberties Union took a successful action against the California Department of Corrections. In their action, the ACLU argued successfully that the gas chamber violated the US Constitution's ban against cruel and unusual punishment, because it inflicted needless pain and suffering.

Eyewitness accounts of seriously ill people drinking dissolved cyanide salt are also mixed. In his book Final Exit, Derek Humphrey describes deaths that are quick and painless. But he also documents one disturbing account that refers to a death that was 'miserable and violent, marked by frequent tetanic convulsions while awake' (Humphry, D. (1996) Final Exit. New York, Dell, p. 30.).

Toxicology texts of death by cyanide commonly refer to a rapid collapse and loss of consciousness if a large enough dose is absorbed. In his book Suicide and Attempted Suicide: Methods and Consequences, Geo Stone makes the observation that while cyanide might be commonly used by suicidal chemists, it is rarely by physicians. He concludes that this may be due to their different levels of access to poisons (Stone, 1999).

In 1995 when the guidelines for the Northern Territory Rights of the Terminally 111 Act (ROTI) were being developed the use of cyanide was not considered; better drugs (the barbiturates) were available. Nor is cyanide used in Oregon or Holland where euthanasia legislation is now in place. In Final Exit Humphrey summarises his thoughts on the use of cyanide, 'I believe that the balance of evidence about using cyanide indicates that it is best not used' (Humphry, D. (1996) Final Exit. New York, Dell, p. 30.).

Cyanide Revisited

For a substance or drug to be useful as a Peaceful Pill two main criteria must be met. It must be, Reliable, and it must be Peaceful. Applying the Exit RP test to a salt like sodium cyanide gives some encouragement.

Reliability is high, few people will ever survive the ingestion of a sufficiently high dose of sodium cyanide. For a dose of lgm of sodium cyanide, R=10.

There is also a correlation between the size of the dose and the speed of death and this minimises the chance of any adverse symptoms developing.

In terms of Peacefulness, the mixed accounts make this a difficult characteristic to assess. Clearly the size of the dose matters, if one is to minimise symptoms. Preparation is also important. The toxic effect is produced when stomach acid acts on the salt producing HCN which is then absorbed by the gut into the blood stream. This process is facilitated by dissolving the salt in cold water and drinking on an empty stomach where the gastric acid content is high.

An alternative is to place the cyanide salt into a treated gelatin capsule. Taking a 500mg capsule with an acidic drink (lemon juice, vinegar) creates the optimum conditions in the stomach. The delay can also usefully be employed to induce sleep with the addition of a strong soporific (sleeping tablet).

Taken in this manner the likelihood of a peaceful cyanide death is increased significantly. (P= 5)

Looking at the Minor Criteria

Availability (2/5) - Soluble cyanide salts are generally hard to obtain unless one has a contact in the industries where these substances are used. These salts are heavily regulated and restricted. They can however be manufactured (with care) from readily available ingredients, using unsophisticated facilities and equipment. Care must be employed in the manufacture, and the substance produced should be assayed to ensure the desired result.

Preparation (5/5) - Cyanide salts are consumed as a drink or in a gelatin capsule. Some clinicians will note the pink colour and a possible smell of bitter almonds but this can often be missed, especially in cases where there is underlying serious illness.

Undetectability (3/5) - at autopsy the substance will be detected.

Speed (5/5) - optimal administration will cause a very quick death.

Safety (3/5) - there is little risk to others, although the glass should be washed. Note - if vomiting occurs, the gastric contents may give off dangerous HCN.

Storage (5/5). With proper storage, the sodium and potassium soluble cyanide salts have an almost indefinite shelf life.

Exit RP Score for Sodium Cyanide 38 (76%)


Exit RP Test
Criteria
Score
Reliability
10/10
Peacefulness
5/10
Availability
2/5
Preparation
5/5
Undetectability
3/5
Speed
5/5
Safety
3/5
Storage
5/5
Total
38 (76%)


The Manufacture of Sodium Cyanide
(Notes courtesy Bert Tucker)


Sodium cyanide can be manufactured in a number of ways. Two relatively simple methods are described in the scientific literature. The first involves the use of the readily available dye, Prussian Blue (Iron III Ferro cyanide). A second uses the common swimming pool chlorine stabiliser, cyanuric acid.
In the first process the Prussian Blue is first converted to sodium ferrocyanide. This is done by allowing it to react with caustic soda in water. Iron oxide is precipitated and sodium ferro cyanide obtained. This sodium ferrocyanide (Yellow Prussate of Soda) is then converted to sodium cyanide by allowing it to react with concentrated
sulphuric acid.


Fig7.1: Forge reduces sodium cyanate with carbon
Fig7.1: Forge reduces sodium cyanate with carbon

The very toxic HCN produced is passed into caustic soda to form the desired salt. There is considerable information available on this process but it was abandoned after initial experiments, considering it too dangerous for the inexperienced home chemist - some of whom may be readers of this book.

A more suitable method of safe, small-scale home manufacture of sodium cyanide involves the two stage conversion of the common swimming pool chemical cyanuric acid.

The first step is carried out by heating powdered cyanuric acid with sodium carbonate. Sodium carbonate is obtained directly as washing soda (or by converting sodium bicarbonate, baking soda). In the second stage, the sodium cyanate produced is reduced to sodium cyanide by heating it with powdered charcoal in a covered crucible (Fig 7.1).

It is important that this stage is undertaken outside. In this process, carbon monoxide is given off. The resultant glassy mass is cooled, crushed and filtered with water to remove the soluble sodium cyanide from the remaining insoluble carbon (Fig 7.2). Careful drying produces solid sodium cyanide powder.

As with all home manufacture there is a need for great care in carrying out this process. Contaminated items need to be disposed of carefully after traces of cyanide are removed. This is best achieved using chlorine bleach to oxidise any unwanted cyanide and to prevent it contaminating the equipment. The product also needs to be tested by analytic means to determine its concentration and purity. Quantitative tests are available and Exit offers such a service for supporters. Further information that details the manufacturing process can be found in most university and public libraries.
The Peaceful Pill Handbook Philip Nitschke Fiona Stewart Z Library Page 8
 
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DontTouchMeImFamous

DontTouchMeImFamous

Student
Jul 18, 2024
120
You really planning on doing this?
I can't find any better alternative that wouldn't render me vegetable if it failed. But I might totally change my mind if I found a better method.

I like cyanide because it's fast enough that it wouldn't allow my SI to take control and I like the fact that once you swallow it, it's already too late to change your mind or seek help. Also, there's no chance for survival.

I would trade pain for reliability but it's not like that I don't prefer a peaceful death.

What about you, would you try it?
 
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DarkShadows

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Dec 21, 2023
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I saw quite a disturbing video of a man making horrible gasping sounds after ingesting cyanide. There's a risk to other people with cyanide. Medical examiners could potentially die if they cut someone open who has ingested cyanide because it can turn into a gas in the stomach. I assume there's also a risk if someone was to give mouth to mouth.
 
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Droso

Born, survive, reproduce, die.
Dec 23, 2024
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I saw quite a disturbing video of a man making horrible gasping sounds after ingesting cyanide. There's a risk to other people with cyanide. Medical examiners could potentially die if they cut someone open who has ingested cyanide because it can turn into a gas in the stomach. I assume there's also a risk if someone was to give mouth to mouth.
That's interesting, learn something new everyday!

I suppose in terms of harm reduction of others, one could state in a note what method they used so medical examiners are prepared and cautious. I plan on using SN, and I don't think any harm can come from that preforming an autopsy/cpr, but I am going to state what method I used. Make it easier for everyone who has to deal with my body and leave no room for assumptions.
 
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DontTouchMeImFamous

Student
Jul 18, 2024
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I saw quite a disturbing video of a man making horrible gasping sounds after ingesting cyanide.
Yea I tend not to think about these things or take them into account in order not to hesitate. As long as it's fast and reliable.

There's a risk to other people with cyanide. Medical examiners could potentially die if they cut someone open who has ingested cyanide because it can turn into a gas in the stomach. I assume there's also a risk if someone was to give mouth to mouth.
Jeez... The hell am I supposed to do now... 🤦‍♀️

I think I should dissappear so that my body can't be found until it's rotten and unidentifiable. It's ideal cuz I don't want to be buried anyways and I don't want my family to know that I killed myself cuz that would be too hard for them. But where the hell am I supposed to go?

I guess I should just jump from beachy head, then... What a riddle...
Like you mentioned, I'm for something more seemingly peaceful.


I've read it's a pretty painful way to go, and I'm a wuss when it comes to pain.
I see what you mean. For me personally, since I was a kid, I learned to not think about the thing that I fear untill it happens. That made it easier for me to deal with intimidating stuff.

So, in this case, I would buy the equipments and make the recipe without thinking of what I will use them for. Then I will just swallow the stuff then I will have to deal with the pain later after. But it should be mere seconds, so hopefully I won't suffer that much.
 
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DarkShadows

Member
Dec 21, 2023
60
That's interesting, learn something new everyday!

I suppose in terms of harm reduction of others, one could state in a note what method they used so medical examiners are prepared and cautious. I plan on using SN, and I don't think any harm can come from that preforming an autopsy/cpr, but I am going to state what method I used. Make it easier for everyone who has to deal with my body and leave no room for assumptions.
Yeah. Definitely with cyanide there should be a warning given.

SN isn't as dangerous. People that have died from nitrite poisoning pose no risk to others and people receiving emergency care too.
 
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Praestat_Mori

Mori praestat, quam haec pati!
May 21, 2023
12,616
I like cyanide because it's fast enough that it wouldn't allow my SI to take control and I like the fact that once you swallow it, it's already too late to change your mind or seek help. Also, there's no chance for survival.
I saw quite a disturbing video of a man making horrible gasping sounds after ingesting cyanide. There's a risk to other people with cyanide. Medical examiners could potentially die if they cut someone open who has ingested cyanide because it can turn into a gas in the stomach. I assume there's also a risk if someone was to give mouth to mouth.
needs much fewer preparations like fasting and additional meds to increase the chances of success. Furthermore, it's been a proven method since the end of WWII - it's very effective though might be painful for a few minutes. The advantages are clear: If there's no antidote given within a very short time after ingestion it's lethal and only 1g will do the job more than well and quickly.

There should be warning signs if cyanide was used to CTB.

It's a method that I would consider for myself and that I always have considered - simply bc it doesn't need much and it is LETHAL almost immediately.
 
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DontTouchMeImFamous

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Jul 18, 2024
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it's been a proven method since the end of WWII - it's very effective though might be painful for a few minutes.

Actually that Hitler is the one who inspired me to use it lol. And I've been looking on how to get it ever since.

But it was know to be the infamous Suicide Pill from well before the WWII. Lenin wanted to use it when he got ill. Also the Serbian militant who tried to assassinate the Austrian crown prince before WWI and failed used it.
 

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