Discussion Curious - spectrum of views amongst the pro-choice population here

[myopybyproxy]

I assume that most of those who have an account here are pro-choice regarding personal euthanasia, suicide, or catching the bus, as people say here. What about other topics - abortion, guns, education, military draft, euthanasia (for others), medical procedures (anything from prescription medicines to surgeries), vaccines, covid mandates (intentionally including this as a separate category to vaccines and medical procedures), procedures to change gender (surgery, hormones), mental health'care', the ability of children to make decisions, illicit drug use, criminal 'justice', self harm etc? Feel free to chime in on any topic not mentioned as well.

Curious to see if the pro-choice belief stops at the right to die, or if it does not, its nuance amongst the topics above.

Kindly refrain from making personal attacks on members based on any beliefs they may share in this thread.

Edited to add topics as I think of them.

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

One of the main reasons I find myself planning ctb is due to the lack of bodily autonomy in this world when it comes to medical decisions. The world is continously veering towards utter dystopia, with some researchers actively pursuing implants that can release psychotropic drugs when certain thoughts are detected in a patient's brain. How long until black mirror esque invasive technology becomes commonplace in everyday clinical practice?

Throughout my life, I have been repeatedly traumatized by the medical industry. Of course, I am always told I am the problem in this equation, no fault lies with the staff who perpetuated this discomfort and fear. From day one, we are told professionals and experts know better than us, and we should keep our mouths shut and follow their word as the holy gospel.

One quickly must come to terms with the fact that there are no gods in the realm of humans, we are all just apes stumbling around this rock attempting to get our needs met. There is no being on this planet who posesses all the answers, yet people will always hold authority figures to the standards of divine dieties.

Throughout life, we are often told that professional figures in positions of authority will always have the answers to our problems. It's why people continue to parrot the same hotline numbers and trite interventions that are useless for a significant chunk of us- they have to believe that these resources are truly helpful means of attack for everyone, to soothe their own fears that problems without solutions do exist in this world.

This deep seated terror has created a culture of safetyism, where an individual has little say in what is done to his body. The layman is assumed to be an idiot, who cannot possess any knowledge about his own experiences or health without the consult of a paid professional to validate his thoughts.

His existence practically belongs to the state, and the medical conglomerate, for there is basically no way to obtain substances and procedures- or deny them, for that matter- without accessing them through regulated and government controlled channels. It doesn't matter if you're in searing, dehabilitating pain. If lisenced physicians decide that the liability imposed on them by the predicament trumps your quality of life, you have no way to obtain anything to ease your misery.

This fact has always made me feel trapped, as I suffer from chronic, incurable illnesses. I had put myself through many painful and humiliating appointments and tests, quite a few of which were against my will, only to have to figure out myself that I had a chronic condition with no cure or treatment. Doctors were absolutely no help. In the years that I've been ill, I have received no tangible assistance whatsoever, and despite me knowing more than these buffoons about my own condition (CFS/Me) I have no freedom to pursue potential therapeutics because they are locked behind prescriptions.

I have ptsd from nonconsentual "exams" and the constant threat of sectioning looming over my head if I toe the line and vocalise my desire to ctb to anyone. A person does not ever forgot police barging into their room in the night, especially when the person is a frightened young child whose only crime was telling a friend online how they felt hopeless due to living with abusive family members.

Such circumstances would be seen as abhorrent if they were perpetuated by anyone other than our "healthcare heroes." I have nightmares from seeing what happened to loved ones in mental health facilities, many people I know never regain their sense of self after being locked up in those modern day asylums. One of my family members became abusive, violent, and caustic after her stint in a ward, and she remained unhinged until her death. Yet, this is seen as a helpful medical intervention instead of a human rights violation.

There is little freedom in life, a truth that I find incredibly suffocating. Knowing I don't have control of my body and doctors could do whatever they want to me again terrifies me. However, I am seen as mentally ill for despising this. Even when something is clearly harmful and damaging, others will chastise the victim and claim it is for their own good, as if all this boils down to an exact science.

My dream, before I became chronically ill, was to be a scientist. Despite being crippled in various ways, I have always tried to remain in education. However, it has become crystal clear that you have 0 freedom or choice in what you study, or what sort of scientific inquiry you want to pursue as a career. Whatever the pharmaceutical companies and donors throw money at will be your lab's specialism. Good luck ever getting to research something that doesn't lead to a profitable, patentable substance getting produced as part of the contract.

Science and medicine are deeply corrupt nowadays, due to the influence of the wealthy. What they say is what goes. You will have to constantly claw your way to the top and continually compete with the world's most savy, up and coming scholars for a chance to earn poverty wages by answering questions posed by CEOs and aristocrats. There is rarely an opportunity to study a topic because it is novel or interesting. You must publish or perish. This is why so much data out there is blatantly fabricated and lacks integrity, scientists are under intense pressure to make "positive progress".

Knowing that there are so few choices in life and that most things we do will always be controlled has always been an unfortunate corner-store of my desire for death, and why I find it so important to have honest discussions about the right to die and bodily autonomy.

 

[Pluto]

That's a range of volatile topics there. In all cases, sensible discourse involves nuance, with both extremes of politics being wise to ignore despite the 'entertaining' nature of fanatics.

Eg. illicit drugs. I have seen men turned into monsters via crystal meth (known as 'ice' in Australia) and I could never support a free-for-all approach to drug availability. However, given that alcohol is considered totally, OK, yet marijuana is significantly less harmful, why is the latter banned? And of more personal interest, psychedelics can have therapeutic benefits and can also enable profound insights into the cosmos - though perhaps this might be undesirable to a government that wants us to shut up and look busy and pay taxes.

 

[GenesAndEnvironment]

My opinions change by the hour so this doesn't mean anything, but I have nothing better to do...

I assume that most of those who have an account here are pro-choice regarding personal euthanasia, suicide, or catching the bus, as people say here. What about other topics - abortion, guns, education, military draft, euthanasia (for others), medical procedures (anything from prescription medicines to surgeries), vaccines, covid mandates (intentionally including this as a separate category to vaccines and medical procedures), procedures to change gender (surgery, hormones), mental health'care', the ability of children to make decisions, illicit drug use, criminal 'justice', self harm etc? Feel free to chime in on any topic not mentioned as well.

Suicide: pro-choice.
Euthanasia: pro-choice, also erring on the side of death in case the patient can't communicate.
Abortion: pro-abortion (not pro-choice).
Guns: yes.
Education: allowed.
Military: more nukes, less invasions/rape/waterboarding.
Medical procedures: allowed.
Vaccines: not mandatory.
Covid mandates: not based.
Gender change: allowed.
"Mental healthcare": not based.
Children: pro child supremacy.
Drug use: allowed but not based.
Criminal justice: either rehabilitation or humane execution.
Self harm: not based.
Serial monogamy: am not allow.

 

[motel rooms]

Don't have time for this today, getting ready to have myself a merry little XXXmas.
I disagree with everything they do in the States, China & Iran & agree with everything the Dutch do because of @Silenos, his golden locks & the fact that attempting to speak his language helps me fill my mouth with phlegm, which is extremely useful for certain activities.

 

[Julgran]

All I have to say is this. The most paranoid among us will get the hint.

 

[little helpers]

I assume that most of those who have an account here are pro-choice regarding personal euthanasia, suicide, or catching the bus, as people say here. What about other topics - abortion, guns, education, military draft, euthanasia (for others), medical procedures (anything from prescription medicines to surgeries), vaccines, covid mandates (intentionally including this as a separate category to vaccines and medical procedures), procedures to change gender (surgery, hormones), mental health'care', the ability of children to make decisions, illicit drug use, criminal 'justice', self harm etc? Feel free to chime in on any topic not mentioned as well.

Curious to see if the pro-choice belief stops at the right to die, or if it does not, its nuance amongst the topics above.

Kindly refrain from making personal attacks on members based on any beliefs they may share in this thread.

Edited to add topics as I think of them.

abortion: living women mean more, way more, than a bunch of cells not yet having a self-concept. and like, abortions are already emotionally painful. if someone wants to do this it must be becuz the other way round is worse. like people commit suicide becuz living is worse off.

guns: I'm kinda torn between Black Panthers and gun control. like, once BIPOC people are armed, right wing shouts gun control. smh. and I've learnt too much from life why prohibitions don't work. you can't kill an intention. but in the very least, police should not carry guns. not that policing should exist anyways. there's not all that much violent crimes, so if po-po really needs to stop some super violent situation (where, honestly, *deescalation* works better than threats), they can throw their baton from 10 feet away. lol. I promise this'll significantly lower incidences of direct, physical police violence. gunshot, you just pull the trigger. hurling batons all day? that's too much effort.

military draft: okay, do you listen to SOAD or Testament?
"utilizing drugs to pay for secret wars around the world, drugs are now your global policy, now you police the world".
"and what about the CIA? what the fuck is their real job anyway?"
"why don't the president fight the war? why do they always send the poor?"
they've put it better than I could. and you know, much of the poor are also Black and brown people.

medical procedures: too much ableism in every part of medicine and not enough informed consent. also, gotta need more methadone, suboxone, naloxone access. needle exchanges, hep C testing. we are still largely under-served.
first time reading Rx info on my bupe and it said something like "do not give this to dope addicts". I got a million question marks flying around my head and crashing into one another. this is a medication that can ease withdrawals and/or treat opiate addiction. now don't give this to opiate addicts??? who am I??! who needs this stuff if they aren't an addict??! (suboxone, aka. bupe, makes you throw up like shit if you're opiate-naive.) if anyone's still selling their methadone on the streets it means we're underserved by clinics. or becuz clinics force you to be sober instead of allowing your own management.

vaccines: if you ain't getting your kids vaccinated you're anti-kids. nuff said. ('cept there are circumstances of predictable allergies and other conditions interfering with vaccination. in this case only herd immunity will protect these people. measles are getting worse each year and polio is coming back… how many more iron lungs are we gonna need?)
and be warned of your "freedom" cuz now I know you watch fox news and I'm leaking it. /s

trans medical care: I need it. period. but I get paranoid knowing therapist sessions can feel like fucking exams. like you gotta need to "prove" your gender to them. well, if doc can prove their gender to me I'd just use the same words back to them. 'cept they can't. no one could.

anyways I prolly already said too much. but I'm morbidly curious about another thing. what's everyone racialized as here? a lot of these forums can be 99% White and that's sadly just excluded everyone else from these spaces.

Such circumstances would be seen as abhorrent if they were perpetuated by anyone other than our "healthcare heroes." I have nightmares from seeing what happened to loved ones in mental health facilities, many people I know never regain their sense of self after being locked up in those modern day asylums. One of my family members became abusive, violent, and caustic after her stint in a ward, and she remained unhinged until her death. Yet, this is seen as a helpful medical intervention instead of a human rights violation.

or being thrown into the "the hole". sectioning simply needs to stop. it's one of the worst ways they abuse someone. doesn't de-escalate anything. person gets more frustratedly violent cuz it's non-communicative. they ain't heard nothing from me kicking at bare walls yet, so, must kick harder.

and I got fully convinced about this shit being traumatizing after I discovered we had a new alter right after that experience. that's enough for a testimony.

 

[Callie Arcale]

Curious to see if the pro-choice belief stops at the right to die, or if it does not, its nuance amongst the topics above.

Here's a surprising point of view: we're not here to satisfy your curiosity.

I'm so tired of people creating an account just to poll the policitis of SS, or inquire into our opinions about controversial topics…

Can't you all find something else to do with your time and energy?!

 

[myopybyproxy]

Here's a surprising point of view: we're not here to satisfy your curiosity.

I'm so tired of people creating an account just to poll the policitis of SS, or inquire into our opinions about controversial topics…

Can't you all find something else to do with your time and energy?!

I try to find and participate in a group where I have perhaps a minute chance of belonging - and this is the reaction I get. I have nowhere else to turn. Thank you for this - I needed another reason to want to die - must not actually want it since I've stuck around this long already, eh? You create the catch-22 wherein users with low post count and new account open dates are seen as lesser in the hierarchy. Yet then with a high post count they're taken as a joke for joining a forum with suicide in its name and being obviously still alive.

Thank you for showing me your true colours and insufferable tendency to make assumptions about people you don't know. It is evident you've not read a single post of mine.

My opinions change by the hour so this doesn't mean anything, but I have nothing better to do...

Suicide: pro-choice.
Euthanasia: pro-choice, also erring on the side of death in case the patient can't communicate.
Abortion: pro-abortion (not pro-choice).
Guns: yes.
Education: allowed.
Military: more nukes, less invasions/rape/waterboarding.
Medical procedures: allowed.
Vaccines: not mandatory.
Covid mandates: not based.
Gender change: allowed.
"Mental healthcare": not based.
Children: pro child supremacy.
Drug use: allowed but not based.
Criminal justice: either rehabilitation or humane execution.
Self harm: not based.
Serial monogamy: am not allow.

Thank you for your response. What exactly do you mean by based?

 

[rationalis]

I try to find and participate in a group where I have perhaps a minute chance of belonging - and this is the reaction I get. I have nowhere else to turn. Thank you for this - I needed another reason to want to die - must not actually want it since I've stuck around this long already, eh? You create the catch-22 wherein users with low post count and new account open dates are seen as lesser in the hierarchy. Yet then with a high post count they're taken as a joke for joining a forum with suicide in its name and being obviously still alive.

You caught on quickly. When perusing the site before it went private, people seemed very supportive of everyone.

I am pro choice as to euthanasia, a planned death is a good death, but have no plan to die soon.

 

[justsayin]

I try to find and participate in a group where I have perhaps a minute chance of belonging - and this is the reaction I get. I have nowhere else to turn. Thank you for this - I needed another reason to want to die - must not actually want it since I've stuck around this long already, eh? You create the catch-22 wherein users with low post count and new account open dates are seen as lesser in the hierarchy. Yet then with a high post count they're taken as a joke for joining a forum with suicide in its name and being obviously still alive.

Thank you for showing me your true colours and insufferable tendency to make assumptions about people you don't know. It is evident you've not read a single post of mine.

This thread looks similar to another one made by a new memeber:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/what-are-the-politics-of-this-site-poll.80060/

Old members have reasons to be wary of everyone that registered after NYT article. Forum members do not form a homogenous group, and there is no hierarchy (except for the mods/admin). This is just a public forum that has become less public because of the attacks.

 

[myopybyproxy]

This thread looks similar to another one made by a new memeber:

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/what-are-the-politics-of-this-site-poll.80060/

Old members have reasons to be wary of everyone that registered after NYT article. Forum members do not form a homogenous group, and there is no hierarchy (except for the mods/admin). This is just a public forum that has become less public because of the attacks.

Not really - note that I did not use any labels to describe political orientation nor did I request that responses label themselves thusly. My thread also has no poll. I wanted a discussion - I plan to answer my own post when I have the time and mental focus.

I know we are not all the same - hence the thread. You can say there is no hierarchy all you want, but I've noticed in every forum or online platform those with the highest post counts - and therefore most recognised username - are given more credence. My bad for registering at an inconvenient time. People need support now more than ever.

 

[justsayin]

Not really - note that I did not use any labels to describe political orientation nor did I request that responses label themselves thusly. My thread also has no poll. I wanted a discussion - I plan to answer my own post when I have the time and mental focus.

I know we are not all the same - hence the thread. You can say there is no hierarchy all you want, but I've noticed in every forum or online platform those with the highest post counts - and therefore most recognised username - are given more credence. My bad for registering at an inconvenient time. People need support now more than ever.

Some members percieved it as similar, and their reactions were similar.

There are cliques on this forum, just like everywhere else, but they are not hierarchy. High post count does not mean credibility, because it is easily acquired by shitposting.

 

[rationalis]

Why is it presumed wrong if a newcomer wants to know what people here think anyway? Just ignore the thread or leave a comment that you think it is intrusive or whatever the problem.

I would appreciate an Ignore function for threads. I think everyone should post what they want, but it is annoying to repeatedly see some threads.

The Ignore feature for people works.

 

[9BBN]

Pro-choice ≠ libertarian. It's about autonomy, but it has checks and balances. I'm pro-choice about suicide but for example I don't support a "free-for-all" approach to guns, and I don't support the repealing of vaccine mandates. I wouldn't be pro-choice about a suicide of a captain of a ship if it meant the other sailors would drown.

 

[Julgran]

I try to find and participate in a group where I have perhaps a minute chance of belonging - and this is the reaction I get. I have nowhere else to turn. Thank you for this - I needed another reason to want to die - must not actually want it since I've stuck around this long already, eh? You create the catch-22 wherein users with low post count and new account open dates are seen as lesser in the hierarchy. Yet then with a high post count they're taken as a joke for joining a forum with suicide in its name and being obviously still alive.

Thank you for showing me your true colours and insufferable tendency to make assumptions about people you don't know. It is evident you've not read a single post of mine.

Thank you for your response. What exactly do you mean by based?

Why is it presumed wrong if a newcomer wants to know what people here think anyway? Just ignore the thread or leave a comment that you think it is intrusive or whatever the problem.

I would appreciate an Ignore function for threads. I think everyone should post what they want, but it is annoying to repeatedly see some threads.

The Ignore feature for people works.

The media usually compiles different statistics when they make a hit piece on any given sub group of society - very similar to your initial questions. That's probably where the suspicion comes from

For example: if we all answer all your questions, and you turn out to be a journalist, we might see an article later on that represents the community in a very careless fashion - such as "Most suicidal people tend to lean to the left (or right) of the political spectrum", and so forth, and "normal" people who then read said article will be none the wiser, because they will swallow it whole.

 

[rationalis]

The media usually compiles different statistics when they make a hit piece on any given sub group of society - very similar to your initial questions. That's probably where the suspicion comes from

For example: if we all answer all your questions, and you turn out to be a journalist, we might see an article later on that represents the community in a very careless fashion - such as "Most suicidal people tend to lean to the left (or right) of the political spectrum", and so fort, and "normal" people who the read said article will be none the wiser, because they will swallow it whole.

I think the "people" asking these questions are in fact lizard people. And nobody cares.

 

[demuic]

Why is it presumed wrong if a newcomer wants to know what people here think anyway? Just ignore the thread or leave a comment that you think it is intrusive or whatever the problem.

I would appreciate an Ignore function for threads. I think everyone should post what they want, but it is annoying to repeatedly see some threads.

The Ignore feature for people works.

There used to be an ignore function for threads, it disappeared for some reason. I don't know if it will come back. I hope it does.

 

[little helpers]

Not really - note that I did not use any labels to describe political orientation nor did I request that responses label themselves thusly. My thread also has no poll. I wanted a discussion - I plan to answer my own post when I have the time and mental focus.

I know we are not all the same - hence the thread. You can say there is no hierarchy all you want, but I've noticed in every forum or online platform those with the highest post counts - and therefore most recognised username - are given more credence. My bad for registering at an inconvenient time. People need support now more than ever.

it just sucks cuz like, you being a lil kid and your parent(s), guardian(s), whatever you call them, be like "hey kiddo, it'll not be nice to talk about politics when you grow up cuz people 'fight' about it". okay and definitely not at the dinner table when their politicking means more, I know. especially if you're afab. dunno 'bout kids today but being afab very likely have meant being "gentle" and "caring" at one point when you grew up. replace those two words with "they'd be more angry when I get angry" and "servitude" and now you get a perfect understanding that you can't speak of. as a kid *and* as a girl/"girl".

"no politics". interesting. when we're practically living through politics everyday, since we been children. when it's nice to talk about suicide politics but anything else is "too political". and we want a "homogeneous community", away from *whose* infiltration? I'm too non-homogeneous already. kick me out. I'm not White enough. maybe one day we would want a "straight cis male" section away from the "queer and trans folx seems generally alright with disagreeing and we really welcome *anyone* here who don't like the section above". now I actually kinda like this idea. idk.

we don't want to see either outsiders or our own selves tear this place apart. I get it. but political orientations are simply the answers we've found so far as to what's been running our lives and whether or not it benefits us.
and when some people's benefiting off the eternal suffering of others, this second group will simply have to fight and shout. did we all forget about survival instincts? I don't understand how.

and first group yells even louder back cuz: "becomes more angry when you're angry". even when all you did is state your position. angers them nonetheless.
power dynamics.

if this is not someone's favorite thread to see, I'd have to say that closing it and leaving no trace is the best way they can avoid blowing it up more. thread won't be peaceful cuz it can't be, won't be. and we ain't doing political campaigns right here anyways. it's just to learn something.

"it'll not be nice." yeah. cuz life is not nice. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[LingeringUnreal]

I don't think there's anything to gain by asking people to list things they're for or against in general, just seems like it's meant to make people squabble. Denying that this is political is also very weird cuz it clearly is lol

 

[myopybyproxy]

I don't think there's anything to gain by asking people to list things they're for or against in general, just seems like it's meant to make people squabble. Denying that this is political is also very weird cuz it clearly is lol

i did not deny its nature, rather the inclusion of labels by political party. and its not just listing for or against - the point is to hear other points of view and have a discussion. which obviously no one here seems to want.

I think the "people" asking these questions are in fact lizard people. And nobody cares.

yeah im a fucking lizard. and this site is 'support' my arse.

The media usually compiles different statistics when they make a hit piece on any given sub group of society - very similar to your initial questions. That's probably where the suspicion comes from

For example: if we all answer all your questions, and you turn out to be a journalist, we might see an article later on that represents the community in a very careless fashion - such as "Most suicidal people tend to lean to the left (or right) of the political spectrum", and so forth, and "normal" people who then read said article will be none the wiser, because they will swallow it whole.

idk what i can do to change your mind. im one of you.

im so tired of having to prove myself only to be shunned regardless. theres no place i belong and this just confirms that.

 

[Cant go back]

Yes pro choice on all things. Makes no sense to me at least why that would change depending on the topic.

 

[Julgran]

Kindly refrain from making personal attacks on members based on any beliefs they may share in this thread.

i did not deny its nature, rather the inclusion of labels by political party. and its not just listing for or against - the point is to hear other points of view and have a discussion. which obviously no one here seems to want.

These two sentences don't necessarily contradict each other, but any discussion may result in attacks towards other members.

i did not deny its nature, rather the inclusion of labels by political party. and its not just listing for or against - the point is to hear other points of view and have a discussion. which obviously no one here seems to want.

I don't think there's anything to gain by asking people to list things they're for or against in general, just seems like it's meant to make people squabble. Denying that this is political is also very weird cuz it clearly is lol

As @LingeringUnreal says, I have a hard time seeing the point for members here to list their beliefs. We all have our problems and reasons for being here - what can we do with all this information?

im so tired of having to prove myself only to be shunned regardless. theres no place i belong and this just confirms that.

You don't have to prove anything, because no one here can prove anything. Do note, however, that other sub groups in society have been infiltrated by psychologists, journalists and similar professions, so there's no point in believing in that someone is not an infiltrator either. We are only here to share and comment on each other's stories, and find methods that apply to our circumstances.

 

[little helpers]

Yes pro choice on all things. Makes no sense to me at least why that would change depending on the topic.

Idk but like, this has to be one of my favorites here. your comment. I really like the other comments too cuz they're reasons and narratives. but all for and against, all reasons, goes to one thing - autonomy.

'cept one thing. it's not a choice when it's not an *informed* decision. and there's no space for self-determination when others clearly *are* in political domination. lil neonates can't make informed decisions on vaccinations. and way too many parents are not very well-informed.

I don't think people are *really* to blame when they heard rumors and now suddenly believe vaxx is poison. people can't decide what's good from bad when information itself is riddled with political maneuvers and oppressive interest.

so I don't know. it'd be nice if you wanna talk more 'bout it.

I don't think there's anything to gain by asking people to list things they're for or against in general, just seems like it's meant to make people squabble. Denying that this is political is also very weird cuz it clearly is lol

I agree with every word you said. actually. yeah. but I don't think it's weird to simply *wanna* talk about politics somewhere. this is not a music forum, right, but people like it when we got a thread to share music. same thing with politics. it's not a poll. and polling here means nothing anyways. I understand where OP is coming from, a lot, cuz I don't have all that many people to talk to these days, and I'm on suicide watch (welp. help.). it's just to talk 'bout something. communication. discuss something you like. and everyone has a right to do that where everyone also has a right to walk away if it doesn't interest/benefit them.

like I said in another comment, it's just to learn something.

but this thread has already, practically, turned into one where people discuss whether or not we should discuss politics here. and *that*, is VERY political in nature. smh.

 

[seaweaves]

It's almost a canned response from me at this point, but wanted to remind us of the simple fact that language around pro-choice and pro-life is often overgeneral and slippery at best.

Simple example: you can think life is always best for eg religious or philosophical reasons, but still think choice and autonomy overrules that. Or, you can think that individual choice matters most, but that this doesn't entail a positive legal or medical claim to support from other people in acting on those choices. Or you could lean into choice, but be concerned about the conflict between individual rights and public harms, such as thinking that keeping suicide supporting behaviours criminalized or certain means restricted is a practical way of reducing wrongful deaths or malicious actions etc, viewing unjust laws as a needed safeguard in an imperfect world, while still believing individual suicides are not themselves wrong.

None of these are my specific views, to be clear, but meant to show the labels we choose on either side is more often a kind of moral shorthand for a wide variety of views that can conflict with each other.

And this is one reason I don't think it is an empty question to ask how far a "pro-choice" attitude reaches for people, like what's asked in this thread, but also why I think it isn't necessarily helpful either: most big questions never fall to just yes or no, or pro or con, and doing so tends to ignore and obscure some important distinctions, and makes productive debate or discussion that much harder.

You asked for a spectrum of views, so hopefully this reads as part of that spectrum enough :p

 

[Cant go back]

so I don't know. it'd be nice if you wanna talk more 'bout it.

I'd love too

 

[OrcWitch]

I'm basically a generic SJW outside of my pro choice for suicide stance. I mostly avoid politics here

 

[lostundead]

I'm basically a generic SJW outside of my pro choice for suicide stance. I mostly avoid politics here

SJWs are becoming self-aware!?--Scary times we live in.

 

[little helpers]

I'm basically a generic SJW outside of my pro choice for suicide stance. I mostly avoid politics here

except SJWs are all different to each other. imagine this, an SJW SJWing another SJW? alright I was playing into the negative connotation of that, one that people put on me cuz I used to be preachy sometimes. my approach has shifted since I realized campaigning and preaching are not the same. going back to the topic, there can be a general message that we all agree on, but once we get to the why's and how's it becomes infinitely intricate. and like, are you a racist feminist SJW or an anti-racist sexist SJW? no one knows. that's why I think SJW is basically a null label.

SJWs are becoming self-aware!?--Scary times we live in.

your avatar shows you're a good "student". /s