Discussion Are parents inherently evil throughout?

[Deleted member 8579]

something i really agree with. maybe you might want to give it a read

This cat-person's writing style is terribly convoluted; I really don't know what he's on about.

 

[CynicalHopelessness]

This cat-person's writing style is terribly convoluted; I really don't know what he's on about.

Being a 10% catgirl I feel very meow-meow about it.

 

[FuneralCry]

I do wish I was never born. The fact that we exist in the first place is the cause of all of our problems. There is no limit as to how much we can suffer in this life. Non existence means no suffering.Even the best lives have suffering in them, so I would always conclude it is better to never be born in the first place. However, many parents seem to think they are doing a good thing by bringing a child into the world, it is almost as if they are blind to the true nature of existence, which is suffering, so I would not see parents as being evil exactly.

 

[Alwaysbadtime]

Parents are selfish. It's unfortunate to see that many do okay and are thankful for their existences. Parents have no idea if their kid will become miserable and suicidal...

 

[ncmxm]

Well, my parents are the reason I'm here. Sentenced to life. This fact infuriates me.

Same, I'm not grateful to my parents for bringing me here, I fucking hate them for it and the fact that they brought me here makes me furious

 

[TriggerHappy]

it's funny bc it basically is directly killing someone. no one would ever die if they were never born. no matter who or what in a persons life causes them suffering or death, the parents are always at fault bc they voluntarily brought the person into this shithole hell world knowing the risks.

....and the realities of life.
Addiction/ cancer /schizophrenia run rife in my family tree :: i so don't want kids, i fear my own fucked up genetics.
Unemployment, hunger, abuse, pandemics.... aargh.
When I was a kid all I wanted was love, sex, dancefloors and loud music, not masks and lockdowns.
The teen ctb rate is climing :: isolation, alienation, loneliness, self-harm, addiction...
I teach em and most of their folks are fucking up royally :: its a fractured mess.

 

[SleepDealer]

Mm yes, a troll post on my final day, a fitting reminder of why I'm leaving.

 

[LastLoveLetter]

I am opposed to procreation as I feel it is unethical for numerous reasons. However, I do not believe that all parents are inherently evil. Many of us see life through the lens of severe suffering, systemic disadvantage, debilitating disease and so much more. We see the worst this world has to offer and the unrelenting ruthlessness that can befall anyone.

Most parents do not realise the unlimited potential for pain that existence can bring. Those who have led successful lives hope to be able to provide a good life for their offspring. With rose-tinted glasses that have not been tainted, they perhaps feel joy at the thought of bringing another human being into existence, like planting a seed in the earth and watching it grow.
Those who have not may hope that they can give their children a better life, that they can erase the errors of their own parents or undo their misfortunes.

However, I do feel it is often an act of ignorance and selfishness. Consider the primary motivations for having children: Simply wanting a child, the mammalian instinct to have sex and spread their genes, liking children, carrying on the family name, societal expectations, creating an extension of yourself that will live on and there are many more motives I have probably omitted. A commonality the majority share is that they revolve around the parents' wishes.

Little to no consideration is given to how their child(ren) will feel, what they may want in future, what is best for them (or they will project their perspectives onto their unborn progeny). And really, that ought to be the most vital factor of all.

Society will preach that there is no greater gift than life and that being a parent is the ultimate sacrifice an individual can make.

Surely an act of true altruism would be to adopt, rather than reproduce in this already overpopulated world? There are millions of orphans in precarious positions: Those who have been abandoned and abused. Those whose entire families have died. Those suffering in poverty, slave labour and human trafficking. Those passed around the social "care" system. Those living in countries impacted by conflict and danger and destitution.

Many of these innocent lives are left to rot in favour of biological offspring. I have yet to hear a rational, sensible argument for why procreation is so superior to adoption, considering the staggering number of orphaned and unwanted children there are in this world.

Too many people decide to have kids even if they're evidently ill-equipped to care for a child and unable to provide stability and quality of life. They lack the foresight and insight to consider the many ways in which life can doom one to unbearable suffering. And it is the child who pays the price for their imprudence.

 

[Worndown]

Being a parent is a lot if work and not everyone is good at it. It is really not fair to blame them for your birth. They can be held accountable for being terrible at it.

Unfortunately not all parents can cope with illness or a desire to ctb. Most humans have a difficult time with that.

Having said this, I hope those suffering with parent induced issues can find a way to look beyond that and find a way to have a better life of their own.

 

[Mthom2]

Parents, including me back years ago, have children out of ignorance. Most of us procreate at a rather young age, before having experienced much of life's hardships and while still in a state of optimism about life. We are pressured by society, expected to build family units. It has become "human nature" to breed.

At this point in my life, I am of the opinion that it all needs to stop. I gave birth to two children, who I could not love more. I raised them without help from a father, and my entire life revolved around them. As a matter of fact, I have never been so lost and hurt as I have been since they grew up and moved out to live their own lives. After having lived all these years and suffered through a very difficult life, I've realized my own mistakes in bringing two humans into this world who will experience lives full of suffering. My poor daughter has already been suffering immensely throughout her childhood, and into adulthood, with a painful chronic condition. My son suffers in other ways. I feel responsible because I gave birth to them in ignorance. With every fiber of my being, I regret having them. My stupidity and selfishness resulted in multiplying suffering.

It is a very hard thing to live with. In my state of suicidality, I've been forced to also understand that they could end up where I am. What kind of person am I to have committed such a thoughtless act? How could I have done that to two people who I love so much that it hurts? What does that say about me?

We procreate without wisdom or real consideration for reality. Optimism and hope for a utopian life play huge roles in why we breed. The pleasure of sex, really? What a selfish excuse for such a horrible crime. Or, what should be a crime! We are barbarians.

 

[Jumping_realms]

Any with lax gun laws.

 

[KayKay]

I asked my son this question. He said "well your not Mom". That's good enough for me. For now.

But maybe he'll change his mind with the anger and hurt that comes when I CTB. Because that may indeed be an evil "act". Leaving that legacy to my kids.

I'm not sure I believe in concepts I belief in concepts like good and evil "people". Acts and behaviour can be judgement her way. People? People are just flawed strangling humans mostly sound the best they can.

My parents weren't evil. They both just had mental health issues. As a kid, I used to hate them for giving me life. Now is just feel compassion for their suffering. I understand. They did the best they could. Like we all try to

 

[UselessMF]

Yes. All parents are terrible sadly. They foster suffering. They create suffering. They create death.

They are worse than pedophiles.

SS is a place thats supposed to accept and not judge anybody, but everytime the parents and child subject comes around.... well not so sure about the pro choice sanctuary.

For me a pedophile is worst than any other criminal, come on !?!

 

[Helplessturtle79]

I do think that right now it's fairly unethical to have kids if you're going to adopt, but if you say my mom is evil ill fight you. She's the reason I've put off ctb for so long.

 

[Dear Agony]

So you're saying that child rapists don't have control of what they're doing

Lets face it, a lot of women get babies just to force the man to pay for it the rest of its life

Lets face it, a lot of women get babies just to force the man to pay for it the rest of its life

Yes, it's my opinion. You can't decide what I believe is the ultimate truth.

"A lot of women get babies just to force the man to pay for it for the rest of its life". Well that's not news in this forum, men victimizing themselves and saying they're more oppressed than women. Well poor babies.
But I'll play your game: It's much more common for men to simply abandon their child or have little to no contact with them, than the situation you are describing right here. See on this forum, for example. How many people here do you think have "daddy issues" and why. I'm not saying women are saints. They can be as bad or even worse than men, especially when it comes to parenting. But society created this illusion that all mothers are meant to give birth and have a special relationship with their children, take care of them at all times while their husbands work to sustain the house. If you are born female, you are expected to do this and will be judged if you don't. Period. There are circumstances that leads people to have children. Having children alone does not make you a bad person.

 

[eternalmelancholy]

My parents weren't evil. They both just had mental health issues. As a kid, I used to hate them for giving me life. Now is just feel compassion for their suffering. I understand. They did the best they could. Like we all try to

That is not good enough. Kids are not disposable toys. They are living, breathing human beings with their own thoughts and feelings who will grow up into jaded, miserable adults. "I tried my best" is the go to excuse for abusive and negligent parents everywhere.

 

[whywere]

I was never ever wanted, I was a male child instead of a female child and neither "parent" wanted the social stigma of adoption so till I was 18 and got kicked out , life was a living hell for being a punching bag, verbal abuse that never ended and unlike my older brother and younger sister, I never got presents or money like for my birthday. In fact, when my birthday would roll around for the year no one would mention anything or do anything.

I disliked my "parents" not only for being so darn mean but it helped mess me up into adulthood.

Some people should NEVER have offspring. I was used as a no payed farm worker and when I left at 18 I had zero money, so ya, my "parents" were darn mean.

Walter

 

[eternalmelancholy]

Some people should NEVER have offspring. I was used as a no payed farm worker and when I left at 18 I had zero money, so ya, my "parents" were darn mean.

Even the shittiest parents don't think they are bad people. These people have kids just to boss them around and feel powerful. Yet they get pissed if you are not grateful for a shitty life you never even asked for.

 

[Labean]

The most interesting thing is that your parents had parents too. And those parents had ... who do you think? That's right: parents too. And those parents also had ... PARENTS. There I can continue to enumerate until the very beginning. And you will not believe none of them ASKED TO APPEAR IN THIS WORLD! How beautiful this world is.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Parents are merely a consequence but not the root of this sort of evil. I've said it before and I'll say it again: DNA is the actual root of evil. It's those horrible little proteins that are so hung up on doing whatever they can to optimize their own survival and copy itself as much as possible. Think about it, even if we sterilized and exterminated the entire human population, suffering would still exist in some form.

Even if all humans were gone, a deer will still feel pain if its parents do a shitty job of raising it or leave it to die by dying themselves after getting their flesh and bones crushed by the jaws of some predator. The salmon spends its whole life aimlessly wandering the seas only to make a perilous climb up the rivers where bears are ready to eat them and even if they survive, all they do is lay eggs/jizz all over those eggs and then they die a slow painful death because of how exhausting it all was. I bet if those salmon were given a level of sentience, they'd still mostly make that choice because their dna is telling them that's what they need to do and no amount of posts on a suicide forum are going to convince them. Ffs Even plants feel pain if the sun doesn't shine on them right or some animal peed on them or because some other asshole weed is choking them and depriving them of soil nutrients.

Suffering comes from being alive, yes. But life itself is the one to fully blame because it poisons every species' mind by making them obsessed with continuing to virally spread their genes ergo, your parents. Even if you attempt to break the cycle by refusing to breed, you are merely playing right into DNA's hands by removing your influence from the gene pool anyway so either way we're all still fucked.

 

[drune11]

Anti-natalists are the worst. Not EVERYONE suffers as much as the people on this board, most people have a decent if not good life when all is said and done.

 

[apathetic.]

If people like us can have a brain enough to not have kids because it's such a simple fact that people suffer then why couldn't they realise it too? I have no empathy for people who have kids. They're literal trash

 

[eternalmelancholy]

Anti-natalists are the worst. Not EVERYONE suffers as much as the people on this board, most people have a decent if not good life when all is said and done.

No, people like you are the worst. I can't believe even on a suicide forum people defend bringing kids into this hell. None of us chose to be born and would have preferred non-existence to this torment. Most people do not have good lives. Either you are extremely naive or grew up with great privilege.

If people like us can have a brain enough to not have kids because it's such a simple fact that people suffer then why couldn't they realise it too? I have no empathy for people who have kids. They're literal trash

Unless these people are complete idiots they know. They don't care. Their selfish desires supersedes all logic and reasoning. They rather see their own children suffer in great agony than admit they made a mistake. They throw out excuses like "I tried my best" or "this is just how life is". Never underestimate people's ability to rationalize their actions.

 

[drune11]

No, people like you are the worst. I can't believe even on a suicide forum people defend bringing kids into this hell. None of us chose to be born and would have preferred non-existence to this torment. Most people do not have good lives. Either you are extremely naive or grew up with great privilege.



Unless these people are complete idiots they know. They don't care. Their selfish desires supersedes all logic and reasoning. They rather see their own children suffer in great agony than admit they made a mistake. They throw out excuses like "I tried my best" or "this is just how life is". Never underestimate people's ability to rationalize their actions.

Good is obviously subjective, but there's a reason most people you ever will encounter, even pass by everyday will not have a genuinely suicidal thought their entire life. I'll admit I had a decent upbringing compared to a lot of people, but it's not like parents can expect their children to turn out this poorly - it's an anomaly, not the norm.

Again, the vast majority of people will never look into CTB in any serious way, and thus, have at least a decent life that they can tolerate.

 

[eternalmelancholy]

Good is obviously subjective, but there's a reason most people you ever will encounter, even pass by everyday will not have a genuinely suicidal thought their entire life. I'll admit I had a decent upbringing compared to a lot of people, but it's not like parents can expect their children to turn out this poorly - it's an anomaly, not the norm.

Again, the vast majority of people will never look into CTB in any serious way, and thus, have at least a decent life that they can tolerate.

This is a load of bullshit. You don't know what people are thinking inside. No one knows I am depressed much less actively suicidal in real life. Over a million people kill themselves each year. 1 in 50 deaths is by suicide. We all know the vast majority of attempts end in failure. The true number of people who want to ctb but never do must be staggering.

Let me guess you are a parent yourself. Gambling with someone else's life and then saying "oopps I messed up" later is indefensible. If you had a good upbringing why are you trying to tone police those of us who have only known misery from birth? You don't speak on behalf of us.

 

[MyStateKilledMe]

I think parents have kids out of desire to have power over a weak, helpless being. Think about it: most of us report to a boss who tells us what to do every day, including some unreasonable requests. After all, there can only be so many Directors, VP's, or CEO's. But... by spreading our legs (women) or thrusting our hairy dicks (men), we filthy humans can attain limitless power over a helpless creature who's legally prohibited from getting away from us. And we can make its [sic] life as miserable as we want it to be, and be praised for it.

That's why most parents have kids: to gain power over another person. It's not much different than the Elite Hunting Club members in the movie "Hostel" paying tens of thousands of dollars to torture and kill someone. Nietzsche said that the whole human history is about power. Namely, about power shifting from one person to another. Heck, if kids had the freedom to run away or kill themselves at any age, even at 1 year old, no parents in the world would be willing to go through a pregnancy or the misery of having a baby.

 

[Circles]

Well there goes any rational discussion without emotions involved.

 

[drune11]

This is a load of bullshit. You don't know what people are thinking inside. No one knows I am depressed much less actively suicidal in real life. Over a million people kill themselves each year. 1 in 50 deaths is by suicide. We all know the vast majority of attempts end in failure. The true number of people who want to ctb but never do must be staggering.

Let me guess you are a parent yourself. Gambling with someone else's life and then saying "oopps I messed up" later is indefensible. If you had a good upbringing why are you trying to tone police those of us who have only known misery from birth? You don't speak on behalf of us.

First, no I'm not a parent. I wish, but I cannot get anyone to date me long-term. Second, where is the 1-50 stat coming from? A lot of "attempts" fail because a lot are women making gestures, not actually trying to go. I'm not being the tone police, but I'm bringing to light that anti-natalism is not a good position to have.

Also, I said my upbringing was decent, not good. My parents, who did "try their best" left me with a ton of anxieties. Still, it's impossible to predict your kid will one day be so fucked up because, again, the odds are staggeringly low. You obviously disagree, and I imagine you are venting because of some recent event or thought whirlwind about this so whatever

 

[eternalmelancholy]

That's why most parents have kids: to gain power over another person. It's not much different than the Elite Hunting Club members in the movie "Hostel" paying tens of thousands of dollars to torture and kill someone. Nietzsche said that the whole human history is about power. Namely, about power shifting from one person to another. Heck, if kids had the freedom to run away or kill themselves at any age, even 1 year old, no parents in the world would be willing to go through a pregnancy or the misery of having a baby.

My parents were religious nutjobs who loved to abuse me to feel powerful. They were legitimately out of their minds, believing in crazy conspiracy theories and rejecting modern science.

I didn't even realize how fucked up my upbringing was until later in life. To this day my parents still think they are good people. It just blows my mind.

 

[drune11]

I didn't even realize how fucked up my upbringing was until later in life. To this day my parents still think they are good people. It just blows my mind.

Same, it took talking to my mom's sister and seeing my friends interact with their parents to realize how neurotic my parents made me - genetically or environmentally.