Discussion A well balanced article on Kenneth Law, this website and the topic of suicide

[Againstthewind]

Sup Dawgs

I know there has been many articles in the past few years on Kenneth law, and this website, the topic of suicide as a whole in links to this website. The whirlwind of pro-choice, pro suicide (as others would call it) predatory accusations, angry grieving people, getting this website banned, running after people in Alabama. And just all the general stuff that we've all heard about regardless of what side of the fence that you're on.

But this article was brought to my attention and I read it in full it is kind of longish but I got to say personally I think it is one of the best articles that's been written on all of this stuff, as it is very well balanced argument (something journalism should technically be).
It blows the UK based articles out of the water, but that tends to be just full of biased because it's coming from very quick reactionary emotions.

It is a journalist based in Canada and most of them have been following the Kenneth law case. It uses stories of people who have used this forum who aren't the typical pawns that have been used in other journalist stories that you hear of all the time.

What I like about this is it addresses what we have all been talking about which is about you can point the finger at the website all you want but it is a more complex issue, such as mental health services absolutely failing at its job. To the various different issues that we all suffer from, from mental health to just a whole list of complex issues that cannot put people in a black or white box.

What I think is interesting, it includes a conversation with a person who refers themselves as 'Daniel' to keep that anonymity but they talk about, that this forum has helped them out more than anything, a sense of community. He does have various resources to take his own life but he keeps it hidden while he continues on with life because in a way it's a placebo for when things get tough. I'm glad they included that because that's some of the things that other stories don't include because that would defeat the whole problem of the big bad wolf. There are of course some inaccuracies such as this 'suicide kit' stuff but its been called that for years now. I also do not believe in taking the 'tools' away from people is going to stop suicide.

Do have a read. I do think it's pretty good as it puts in there, that I've said many times before, we're all just trying our best to do what we can to survive.

https://torontolife.com/deep-dives/kenneth-law-suicide-kits/

 

[TapeMachine]

Thanks so much for sharing the article here. I look forward to reading it later this evening

 

[Lulzacruel]

Rare canadian news media win

 

[refused]

Rare canadian news media win

Rare win for Canada in general -_______- (sorry, angry Canadian here).

 

[Blurry_Buildings]

Thanks for the article <3 o7

 

[DeepCD]

@Againstthewind ... Thanks for the Great Read!

BTW, if anyone has Salt Nicotine ...

... better get rid of it ASAP, before Authorities track all packages & take it from you!

 

[voyager]

Sounds interesting, gonna read it tomorrow, since it's getting a bit late, but Merchant of Death, huh. Guess they really can't help themselves even when making an objective piece.

 

[HighFlight]

Thank you for sharing <3

 

[Scythe]

Ah well, would've liked a bit more representation, but better than all I've seen out there. The let's do the bare fucking minimum to suicide prevention mindset is still there...I do apperciate the segment talking about the shit ass mental health systems. It's also really sad knowing they are spending 158million on a shitty helpline while the money could've been used for something else. Perhaps to help the homeless, they are often suicidal. The amount of money they are spending on 988 is just sad and pathetic.

 

[LonelyKitten]

I do agree it has a generally better and more varied opinion.
However, this part made me angry, because it perfectly exemplifies what is wrong with how people in general view suicide. (at least, one of the ways)

The WHO estimates that 90 per cent of people who die by suicide have a mental illness such as depression, schizophrenia or a substance use disorder, so the most effective way to prevent suicide is to treat those conditions through therapy, medication and other mental health supports. It's also helpful to address the factors that often underlie mental illnesses, such as poverty and homelessness.

No, that is not the most effective way.
It's not "also helpful" to "address the factors that often underlie [...]", that is THE most effective way.
Most people aren't just "ill" for no reason like catching a cold, it's completely rational to be in severe mental distress when you face overwhelming practical issues.

How this is not commonly understood is absolutely beyond me.
I'll never understand it.

 

[I Can't Say]

The bit about wellness checks completely failed to convey exactly what's involved, and how coercive it all is.

 

[jar-baby]

A thank you to "Daniel" for speaking with the reporter. I'm glad one publication out there decided it'd be a good idea to talk to a suicidal person when covering this issue.

 

[Kattt]

Every article, journal and source has some degree of bias. It might be as overt as Rupert Murdoch's gutter press or as nuanced as an individual reporter's semantics. Nobody is entirely without preconceptions.
I agree with your doubts as to whether taking away the tools will prevent suicides. I know for myself and for a great many others, having those "tools" to hand have actually become a source of comfort and have either prolonged lives or helped individuals move beyond suicidality.
I've made attempts in the psych ward and the apparent frequency of suicide in prison leads to the conclusion that as much as you try to take away the tools, determination will find a means.
Concerning the suicide of Nadia Kajouji, it was myself and a handful of other contributors from the A.S.H. newsgroup who gathered the evidence and demanded Melchert-Dinkel was prosecuted. The community refused to tolerate any encouragement... not exactly the way the picture is painted by the media.
One important function of the forum that is largely not mentioned is that of harm reduction. Undoubtedly the most comprehensive source of accurate information available, the "resources" thread is sure to be a primary cause of opponents complaints. Their principles are akin to the "abstainance only" approach to sex education or the "just say no!!" anti-drugs campaign.
Imagine how many impulsive attempts, doomed to fail and even resulting in disability, serious injuries, horrific suffering and even public endangerment, may have been avoided because of accurate information being made available. For many people here, there's few things as terrifying as the prospect of winding up physically and/or mentally incapacitated. It's a question the "victims" families won't be so quick to answer... with the fact that the deceased endured extensive pain and suffering acknowledged, would they prefer that they were able to learn the least painful and most reliable way to bring an end to that? Or would they rather they were forced to rely on their "best judgement" alone, unable to communicate, feed themselves, walk, move independently or find a semblance of happiness?
Not everything in life can be sunshine and rainbows. No amount of denial will make it any more palatable.

 

[wljourney]

A thank you to "Daniel" for speaking with the reporter. I'm glad one publication out there decided it'd be a good idea to talk to a suicidal person when covering this issue.

Yes!! Thank you!!!
A few other outlets did talk to users here from the forum as well but their reporting was sadly sensationalist and most comments about needing better access to mental health services were struck down by editors.

CityTV. Global. CTV.

If it's not clickbait they won't print it.
And that's not the journalists fault. That comes from the top.