Help A question about phenobarbital

[NikWild]

Who knows how long it will take me to pass out if I take 30 grams of phenobarbital orally?

 

[Deadinsidex]

I'm looking for an answer myself but considering the onset of action for phenobarbital is 5 minutes then passing out should be quick when u take a lethal dose

 

[Dayrain]

passing out should be quick

It is said that that passing out is not quick at all and therefore a long-acting benzo like Diazepam (500mg-1000mg) is highly recommended.

 

[Deadinsidex]

It is said that that passing out is not quick at all and therefore a long-acting benzo like Diazepam (500mg-1000mg) is highly recommended.

Why wouldn't it be quick though?! it's a medication that is taken to control seizures if you take it while you don't have any seizure problems it just puts you to sleep and sedates you i don't see how it could happen otherwise cuz with a lethal dose it most definitely should lead to coma but to ensure lethality one totally needs to add something else like some benzos personally I'm thinking to add butanediol for the guarantee

 

[Dayrain]

Why wouldn't it be quick though?! it's a medication that is taken to control seizures if you take it while you don't have any seizure problems it just puts you to sleep and sedates you i don't see how it could happen otherwise cuz with a lethal dose it most definitely should lead to coma but to ensure lethality one totally needs to add something else like some benzos personally I'm thinking to add butanediol for the guarantee

From my understanding it takes round about 30 minutes up to one hour to unconsciousness. It is said that could cause anxitey, which I don't understand too well. The benzos should calm you down, but have no effect on the lethality. Something like 30 grams would certainly lead to a very deep coma, but I don't know if it would increase lethality.

 

[NikWild]

Why wouldn't it be quick though?! it's a medication that is taken to control seizures if you take it while you don't have any seizure problems it just puts you to sleep and sedates you i don't see how it could happen otherwise cuz with a lethal dose it most definitely should lead to coma but to ensure lethality one totally needs to add something else like some benzos personally I'm thinking to add butanediol for the guarantee

and how much butanediol is needed?

 

[Deadinsidex]

and how much butanediol is needed?

60ml is more than enough as long as you don't vomit at all

From my understanding it takes round about 30 minutes up to one hour to unconsciousness. It is said that could cause anxitey, which I don't understand too well. The benzos should calm you down, but have no effect on the lethality. Something like 30 grams would certainly lead to a very deep coma, but I don't know if it would increase lethality.

Is 15g enough? (the lethal dose being 10g) and considering that your not taking it alone and by the way when you take another cns depressent it does have an effect on lethality

 

[Dayrain]

Is 15g enough?

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[Crazyturtle777]

I'm looking for an answer myself but considering the onset of action for phenobarbital is 5 minutes then passing out should be quick when u take a lethal dose

I don't think so. I've seen in wikipedia that plasma peak levels of phenobarbital are reached within 2 to 8 (!) hours when taken orally.. Even if 30 g is a heavy dose I think it won't knock you out before 30 minutes after ingestion. But if you don't vomit, I think phenobarbital is very reliable in ctb

 

[hito5]

Am very interested in this question too. I have access to:

9,5g of phenobarbital
5g of pure heroin
5g of China White (mix of heroin and fentanyl, as I understand it)
25g of Xanax
10ml of GLB
5 75microgram fentanyl patches

a sheet of Zofran, the anti-emetic

I was planning on crushing the phenobarbital with a mortar and pestle, mixing it in with some yoghurt or juice (grapefruit?), taking a large quantity of Xanax then the phenobarbital, then doing a big line (1 or 2g) of heroin or China White. I'm very opiate-naive so honestly the line alone could probably do me in, but I want to be certain. I also am humouring the possibility of adding in a fentanyl patch, inserted rectally, to really secure the plan.
I know the usual recommendation for phenobarbital is 20g, but with this mix do you think my 9,5 could be enough?

 

[Relic]

I was planning on crushing the phenobarbital with a mortar and pestle, mixing it in with some yoghurt or juice

Many (or most?) pharmaceutical companies make the pheno pills very filler heavy, specifically with overdoses in mind, so dissolving them is the only way.

the usual recommendation for phenobarbital is 20g

Various guides just keep upping the dose. The "usual" is 6 grams, and the method requires a long-acting benzo.

 

[hito5]

Many (or most?) pharmaceutical companies make the pheno pills very filler heavy, specifically with overdoses in mind, so dissolving them is the only way.


Various guides just keep upping the dose. The "usual" is 6 grams, and the method requires a long-acting benzo.

Ah thanks good to know. Would you recommend dissolving them in alcohol or in water/juice? And by long-acting benzo, you mean something more like Valium?

 

[Relic]

Ah thanks good to know. Would you recommend dissolving them in alcohol or in water/juice? And by long-acting benzo, you mean something more like Valium?

Dissolved in water. The sugar and enzymes in juices are only helpful in some cases and can complicate things. Alcohol is going to make keeping it all down much more difficult. And yes, the benzo is supposed to be 300mg of diazepam.

 

[NikWild]

Ah thanks good to know. Would you recommend dissolving them in alcohol or in water/juice? And by long-acting benzo, you mean something more like Valium?

Phenobarbital is practically insoluble in ordinary water.And it dissolves well in alcohol.Source: Chemical Reference

 

[Relic]

Phenobarbital is practically insoluble in ordinary water.And it dissolves well in alcohol.Source: Chemical Reference

That is not what "dissolve" means in this context. It will be suspended in water and separated from the filler, which is soluble in most cases.

 

[hito5]

C

That is not what "dissolve" means in this context. It will be suspended in water and separated from the filler, which is soluble in most cases.

Can you explain what you mean exactly? I want to be able to separate the phenobarb from the filler in water, and get rid of the filler? Thanks for the help

 

[Relic]

Can you explain what you mean exactly? I want to be able to separate the phenobarb from the filler in water, and get rid of the filler? Thanks for the help

This is what happens with the pills in water, the phenobarb gets separated from the filler. It is not meant to be filtered or anything like that, the resulting liquid is the intended form.

 

[hito5]

This is what happens with the pills in water, the phenobarb gets separated from the filler. It is not meant to be filtered or anything like that, the resulting liquid is the intended form.

Got it. That must be quite a lot of water then, to dissolve 95 pills in.

 

[NikWild]

Ах, спасибо, приятно знать. Вы бы порекомендовали растворить их в спирте или в воде/соке? И под бензом длительного действия вы имеете в виду что-то вроде валиума?

Got it. That must be quite a lot of water then, to dissolve 95 pills in.

By the way, not all tablets dissolve in water, some substances have a water-repellent effect.I tried to dissolve them yesterday, but it didn't work out.Try to split the pills with a knife, then put them on for a few hours so that the phenobrabital precipitates.I filtered it through a rag, but it is advisable to buy filter paper.

 

[hito5]

By the way, not all tablets dissolve in water, some substances have a water-repellent effect.I tried to dissolve them yesterday, but it didn't work out.Try to split the pills with a knife, then put them on for a few hours so that the phenobrabital precipitates.I filtered it through a rag, but it is advisable to buy filter paper.

ok I see, with the idea that the filler will stay in the filtered paper and the rest of the liquid will be pure phenobarbital?

 

[Relic]

Got it. That must be quite a lot of water then, to dissolve 95 pills in.

How big are the pills? More water can be always added, a good starting amount is 50ml.

By the way, not all tablets dissolve in water, some substances have a water-repellent effect.I tried to dissolve them yesterday, but it didn't work out.Try to split the pills with a knife, then put them on for a few hours so that the phenobrabital precipitates.I filtered it through a rag, but it is advisable to buy filter paper.

In a Magic Bullet type blender, it would take around a minute to get usable solution.

ok I see, with the idea that the filler will stay in the filtered paper and the rest of the liquid will be pure phenobarbital?

In case of filtering, the filtrate needs to be discarded, as it will contain very small amounts of pheno, depending on the filter material. Then new water would need to be added, which will be basically back to square one. To make things simple, everything should stay as it is, in the water.

 

[hito5]

How big are the pills? More water can be always added, a good starting amount is 50ml.


In a Magic Bullet type blender, it would take around a minute to get usable solution.


In case of filtering, the filtrate needs to be discarded, as it will contain very small amounts of pheno, depending on the filter material. Then new water would need to be added, which will be basically back to square one. To make things simple, everything should stay as it is, in the water.

Ok, so if I've got it right, the ideal process is to blend the pills in a blender then put the powder into 50ml of water?

 

[Relic]

Ok, so if I've got it right, the ideal process is to blend the pills in a blender then put the powder into 50ml of water?

Correct. Or if you have the blender type I mentioned, then the water and pills can, and should be blended together. If you have a coffee grinder or something similar, then grinding the pills into dust and mixing it with water works, too.

 

[NikWild]

How big are the pills? More water can be always added, a good starting amount is 50ml.


In a Magic Bullet type blender, it would take around a minute to get usable solution.


In case of filtering, the filtrate needs to be discarded, as it will contain very small amounts of pheno, depending on the filter material. Then new water would need to be added, which will be basically back to square one. To make things simple, everything should stay as it is, in the water.

And what kind of pills he's talking about.In my opinion, phenobarbital should just be a precipitate

 

[Justnotme]

I didn't understand a little...
if you overdose with phenobarbital, do you need to wash down the pills with alcohol ONLY?
That is, if I color 100 phenobarbital tablets into a glass, then fill them with water and immediately drink this solution, will phenobarbital have almost no effect on me?

 

[Relic]

And what kind of pills he's talking about.In my opinion, phenobarbital should just be a precipitate

Pheno will be suspended, everything else can be added to the solution, the benzos, and any opiates, if desired.

do you need to wash down the pills with alcohol ONLY?

Preferably, no alcohol.

will phenobarbital have almost no effect on me?

It will have an effect, just there is a possibility that it gets drawn out. It is a two component method, the phenobarb itself, and a long-acting benzo, like diazepam or flurazepam. Any opiates would potentiate this mix.

 

[NikWild]

How big are the pills? More water can be always added, a good starting amount is 50ml.


In a Magic Bullet type blender, it would take around a minute to get usable solution.


In case of filtering, the filtrate needs to be discarded, as it will contain very small amounts of pheno, depending on the filter material. Then new water would need to be added, which will be basically back to square one. To make things simple, everything should stay as it is, in the water.

Pheno will be suspended, everything else can be added to the solution, the benzos, and any opiates, if desired.


Preferably, no alcohol.


It will have an effect, just there is a possibility that it gets drawn out. It is a two component method, the phenobarb itself, and a long-acting benzo, like diazepam or flurazepam. Any opiates would potentiate this mix.

Won't alcohol increase sedation, or do you think it can lead to nausea?

 

[Relic]

Won't alcohol increase sedation, or do you think it can lead to nausea?

The risk of vomiting would increase considerably, and according to the literature, throwing up or hospitalization are the only times this method can fail.

 

[NikWild]

The risk of vomiting would increase considerably, and according to the literature, throwing up or hospitalization are the only times this method can fail.

Listen, are you interested in chemistry?Then can you tell me how best to separate phenobarbital from these pills?I just ground them into powder and threw them into cold water, and then collected the sediment.As I understand it, phenobarbital and starch were mainly left in the sediment.However, the effect of 200 mg of phenobarbital seemed weak to me (slight dizziness and drowsiness, and only after 2 hours I was able to fall asleep). The composition of the tablets: active ingredients: sodium metamizole (analgin) – 250.0 mg, phenobarbital – 20.0 mg, bendazole – 20.0 mg, papaverine hydrochloride – 20.0 mg. Auxiliary substances: potato starch – 51.84 mg, talc – 4.60 mg, stearic acid – 3.56 mg.
I am mostly interested in the separation of analgin, because I do not know how it works in large quantities.And he also weighs too much to be able to take 25 grams of phenobarbital with him.

 

[Relic]

Listen, are you interested in chemistry?

While interested, I'm quite far from being a chemist. I have difficulties concentrating, so I'll only read about what I'm interested in, most of the time.

how best to separate phenobarbital from these pills?

You would need to find a solvent that will only dissolve either the pheno, or only the other components. Metamizole is soluble in water, so as a first step you could dissolve the pills in water, then discard the water. You would also lose one gram of pheno for every liter of water, assuming that it's in a form of free acid. Phenobarbital sodium is freely soluble in water, and everything would end up in the filtrate.

I'm not sure why bendazole would be combined with a barbiturate, but it is not water soluble. The solubility info can be found here. But it is going to be a challenge, as phenobarbital is also soluble in these solvents.

Papaverine should not be a problem in this mix.

Fillers are generally also not a problem.

If these pills are meant to be a sleeping aid/sedative, then the inclusion of albendazole seems to be intentional to discourage possible abuse.