Discussion Your take on psychology/psychiatry?

[struggles_inc]

Fucking hate it.
1. I don't trust a random person more than myself
2. People are yet to study human brain so there's no real way to cure it now, only sucky solutions like shutting it off
3. I don't think trauma like rape (experienced) and death of close people (experienced 4x) is treatable
4. In some countries a psychiatric diagnosis takes a toll on one's career and future
5. Mental illnesses are stigmatised and many psychiatric professionals are biased, meaning it's extremely traumatic to find a good doc to begin with
6. A psychologist/psychotherapist won't say anything that I don't already know, for instance bottled up rage or attention seeking like duuuh, dude. No eye-opening experience for me

But maybe I'm just stupid. What do you guys think?
Sorry for bringing this up again. I just HATE that all the support I have from anyone in my life is "oh well you should visit a psychologist". WHY. WOULD. I.
Psychologists are basically emotional dumpsters. People throw you to them to avoid dealing with you ever.

 

[Spectre]

I completely agree. It feels like a scam made up by pharma companies to sell unproven drugs. They are all so arrogant and their little theories are so basic and unscientific.

 

[struggles_inc]

I completely agree. It feels like a scam made up my pharma companies to sell unproven drugs. They are all so arrogant and their little theories are so basic and unscientific.

Oh my gosh yes yes so true. And the effects of those drugs are precious. Like yeah why shouldn't I take this antidepressant pill that will make me go bald, puke and be depressed?

 

[DoubleUp8]

Fucking hate it.
1. I don't trust a random person more than myself
2. People are yet to study human brain so there's no real way to cure it now, only sucky solutions like shutting it off
3. I don't think trauma like rape (experienced) and death of close people (experienced 4x) is treatable
4. In some countries a psychiatric diagnosis takes a toll on one's career and future
5. Mental illnesses are stigmatised and many psychiatric professionals are biased, meaning it's extremely traumatic to find a good doc to begin with
6. A psychologist/psychotherapist won't say anything that I don't already know, for instance bottled up rage or attention seeking like duuuh, dude. No eye-opening experience for me

But maybe I'm just stupid. What do you guys think?
Sorry for bringing this up again. I just HATE that all the support I have from anyone in my life is "oh well you should visit a psychologist". WHY. WOULD. I.
Psychologists are basically emotional dumpsters. People throw you to them to avoid dealing with you ever.

Struggles u got it right. Most people here seem highly intelligent. I think things like depression anxiety and mental/emotional stuff more likely to happen to intelligent people. Brains more complex. Really stupid people don't seem to have these issues. Thus the saying "ignorance is bliss". Mental health in the United States is mostly completely fraudulent. Psychiatry has always been more bullshit than science. Not saying there is nothing valid. But the way it is practiced in the United States is mostly fraudulent and some of the big pharma psych drugs are absolutely dangerous and harmful and doctors prescribe willy nilly without knowing anything about them. It's mostly about giving people these horrible drugs that I believe make the person worse off in most cases

 

[Rhizomorph1]

I think a lot of people massively misunderstand the rolw of psychology. For example, people with traumatic brain injuries absolutely benefits from neuropsychologists who can help treat and rehabilitate them. There is no doubt in my mind about the benefit of psychology especially for these specific populations. So the question is really "are psychologists helpful for mood disorders/etc.?"

I think the statement "psychologists won't say anything I don't already know" defeats the point; it is over-medicalizing it by assuming that – like a doctor – a psychotherapist will tell you the problem and administer a treatment.

With things like emotional attachment – or even attachment disorders – what people need is not advice. Indeed, one of the golden rules of modern therapy training is to not give advice and help to motivate/empower clients to find their own solutions.

That is to say that what people benefit from is the intimacy, connection, and vulnerability; the psychological safety in being seen authentically by another person. It serves both our emotional safety and self esteem needs that are hardwired into us. It's not about "learning something new" but often about having what we already know be transparent in the face of another person to reach out nervous system that it is safe to be this way around others.

Re: your other points:

1. This lack of trust is precisely what therapy tries to target by creating psychological safety and building an alliance/relationship. It's okay if you don't trust it; therapists do everything they can according to science to create safety. If you don't feel safe this is not always their fault (unless you have a bad therapist, in which case I'm sorry).

2. I'm unsure what you mean. Neuroimaging is quite reliable and has cured certain illnesses.

3. If absolutely is treatable but the extend to which people can live comfortably afterwards will vary. Treatment =/= cure. Some people remit fully, some people learn ways to adjust that make living comfortable, and indeed there are a minority who I believe are unrecoverable; these people should try every available treatment first, however. If not, hhopefully MAID becomes more accessible.

4. These countries usually have a greater stigma towards mental health and shold seriously consider changing their cultural views. In my psychopathology class they talk at length about the prejudicial (e.g., stigma) vs. beneficial value (e.g., insurance and roadmap for how to treat/cope) of diagnosis. They're usually not given out without ample consideration. But we can't dismiss the benefits as we have mountains of evidence that for many people the benefits outweigh the prejudicial value.

5. This will also vary.

6. See above. This is a personal experience.

TL;DR: all your claims are true in some instances but they are biased towards unique and individual experiences. Per aggregate evidence, psychology does measurably greater benefit than harm. But as with anything in medicine, milage may vary.

I wouldn't discount psychiatric medicine or psychology just because there are a proportion of cases it is ineffective for. I myself am one of these outliers but that doesn't mean I will deny the benefits for everyone else who I have personally witnessed have their life given back to them.

 

[Nothing………………….]

I think a psychiatrist is only helpful if they actually know what they're doing, which is all too rare. The only real solution to many mental issues is a good psychiatrist, but good is the key word there, if you can't fins one then there's nothing you can do.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

I do not stan.

 

[struggles_inc]

I think a psychiatrist is only helpful if they actually know what they're doing, which is all too rare. The only real solution to many mental issues is a good psychiatrist, but good is the key word there, if you can't fins one then there's nothing you can do.

What makes them good though? Never seen a genuinely good one. Every time people share their experiences with a psychiatrist/psychotherapist/psychologist, it's always so basic and/or dumb I just can't

 

[Rhizomorph1]

I think things like depression anxiety and mental/emotional stuff more likely to happen to intelligent people.

I vehemently disagree. People with mental illness are massively stigmatized and face disproportionate barriers to education, enriched social lives conducive to social intelligence, childhoods surrounded by books, the arts, humanities, etc.

There are intelligent people who are depressed because of their deep awareness of philosophical problems (e.g., existentialism), sure. But this is certainly the exception rather than the rule.

Most intelligent people can comprehend existentialism but have enough meaningful interactions (social life, hobbies, etc.) and a well-regulated brain that existential meaninglessness doesn't really concern them.

Existentialism is mainly haunting for people living with chronic pain.

It sucks but we got the short end of the stick. And framing ourselves as more intelligent is probably just our inborn will to meaning; an egoic self-defense mechanism.

The people on this forum (myself included) almost objectively have lower IQs.

 

[Nothing………………….]

What makes them good though? Never seen a genuinely good one. Every time people share their experiences with a psychiatrist/psychotherapist/psychologist, it's always so basic and/or dumb I just can't

What makes them good is if they actually help you feel better. You don't have to look far to see countless stories of peoples lives being changed by a good psychiatrist. Also most of the time when people share their experiences it has to be dumbed down to an extent since usually you don't have all the time in the world to talk, and also they can't share their emotions directly, only verbally.

 

[struggles_inc]

I think a lot of people massively misunderstand the rolw of psychology. For example, people with traumatic brain injuries absolutely benefits from neuropsychologists who can help treat and rehabilitate them. There is no doubt in my mind about the benefit of psychology especially for these specific populations. So the question is really "are psychologists helpful for mood disorders/etc.?"

I think the statement "psychologists won't say anything I don't already know" defeats the point; it is over-medicalizing it by assuming that – like a doctor – a psychotherapist will tell you the problem and administer a treatment.

With things like emotional attachment – or even attachment disorders – what people need is not advice. Indeed, one of the golden rules of modern therapy training is to not give advice and help to motivate/empower clients to find their own solutions.

That is to say that what people benefit from is the intimacy, connection, and vulnerability; the psychological safety in being seen authentically by another person. It serves both our emotional safety and self esteem needs that are hardwired into us. It's not about "learning something new" but often about having what we already know be transparent in the face of another person to reach out nervous system that it is safe to be this way around others.

Re: your other points:

1. This lack of trust is precisely what therapy tries to target by creating psychological safety and building an alliance/relationship. It's okay if you don't trust it; therapists do everything they can according to science to create safety. If you don't feel safe this is not always their fault (unless you have a bad therapist, in which case I'm sorry).

2. I'm unsure what you mean. Neuroimaging is quite reliable and has cured certain illnesses.

3. If absolutely is treatable but the extend to which people can live comfortably afterwards will vary. Treatment =/= cure. Some people remit fully, some people learn ways to adjust that make living comfortable, and indeed there are a minority who I believe are unrecoverable; these people should try every available treatment first, however. If not, hhopefully MAID becomes more accessible.

4. These countries usually have a greater stigma towards mental health and shold seriously consider changing their cultural views. In my psychopathology class they talk at length about the prejudicial (e.g., stigma) vs. beneficial value (e.g., insurance and roadmap for how to treat/cope) of diagnosis. They're usually not given out without ample consideration. But we can't dismiss the benefits as we have mountains of evidence that for many people the benefits outweigh the prejudicial value.

5. This will also vary.

6. See above. This is a personal experience.

TL;DR: all your claims are true in some instances but they are biased towards unique and individual experiences. Per aggregate evidence, psychology does measurably greater benefit than harm. But as with anything in medicine, milage may vary.

I wouldn't discount psychiatric medicine or psychology just because there are a proportion of cases it is ineffective for. I myself am one of these outliers but that doesn't mean I will deny the benefits for everyone else who I have personally witnessed have their life given back to them.

Sorry for a messy response, I did not expect to receive so many messages. In my individual experience psychiatry did only harm (made my uncle a vegetable and my sister basically braindead) and psychology made 0 progress literally even to those who gave it a chance.

I mean YEAH maybe for some people it will work, go win the lottery right? But then why is it so general and so much recommended, if literally everything will vary from person to person.
Also why would I literally ever pay anyone to make friends, like what. That sounds… eh.
Anyways, please write your opinions, I really didn't expect the thread to blow up like… damn

 

[Codename_Joryu]

It sucks.
Therapy is only good if you really have some psychological issues like schizophrenia or bipolar disorder, but not when you have depression. Most people don't understand that depression isn't some mental illness that comes out of nowhere and tricks your brain into thinking your life is shit, depression is just a result of everything that went wrong with your life and there are no magic pills that will fix it. I remember trying therapy before in my life and it only made me more closed up and scared of seeking actual help, pills didn't work either. I wish more people understood that, but every fucking person is so ignorant that they believe the therapy is the ultimate cure for everything. It isn't, shut the fuck up.

 

[Abyssal]

Rhizomorph took the words right out of my mouth. If you want my opinion just read their first reply a second time.

I vehemently disagree. People with mental illness are massively stigmatized and face disproportionate barriers to education, enriched social lives conducive to social intelligence, childhoods surrounded by books, the arts, humanities, etc.

There are intelligent people who are depressed because of their deep awareness of philosophical problems (e.g., existentialism), sure. But this is certainly the exception rather than the rule.

Most intelligent people can comprehend existentialism but have enough meaningful interactions (social life, hobbies, etc.) and a well-regulated brain that existential meaninglessness doesn't really concern them.

Existentialism is mainly haunting for people living with chronic pain.

It sucks but we got the short end of the stick. And framing ourselves as more intelligent is probably just our inborn will to meaning; an egoic self-defense mechanism.

The people on this forum (myself included) almost objectively have lower IQs.

While I feel that I generally agree, measuring intelligence as IQ (I'm assuming that's what you are referring to? I am working off assumption so feel free to correct me) can be faulty and doesn't account for the multiple variables that make up a person. Not entirely sure where I'm going with this to be honest, but the difference types of people I have met on here leads me to believe that a large number of us can't really be placed into set categories all too well. That alongside how many different backgrounds there are here puts what we define as intelligence into question. I respect your input, but I can't help but feel you are working with a biased perspective. On the other hand, I am too haha.

 

[Anonymoususer1234]

I think it's useful sometimes but it's use is limited. The treatments we have right now don't work in a lot of cases. But psychiatry has played an important role in my life and is part of the reason I'm as stable as I am now. I think it really depends on your issues/mindset. There's a lot to critique but there's also a lot worth keeping.

 

[struggles_inc]

It sucks.
Therapy is only good if you really have some psychological issues like schizophrenia or bipolar disorder, but not when you have depression. Most people don't understand that depression isn't some mental illness that comes out of nowhere and tricks your brain into thinking your life is shit, depression is just a result of everything that went wrong with your life and there are no magic pills that will fix it. I remember trying therapy before in my life and it only made me more closed up and scared of seeking actual help, pills didn't work either. I wish more people understood that, but every fucking person is so ignorant that they believe the therapy is the ultimate cure for everything. It isn't, shut the fuck up.

That's what I forgot to mention actually, thanks for bringing it up. IDK how therapy will solve poverty or war in your country or anything seriously damaging that comes from the outside except from "reshaping how you see it" which is like… lol…

 

[Rhizomorph1]

Sorry for a messy response, I did not expect to receive so many messages. In my individual experience psychiatry did only harm (made my uncle a vegetable and my sister basically braindead) and psychology made 0 progress literally even to those who gave it a chance.

I mean YEAH maybe for some people it will work, go win the lottery right? But then why is it so general and so much recommended, if literally everything will vary from person to person.
Also why would I literally ever pay anyone to make friends, like what. That sounds… eh.
Anyways, please write your opinions, I really didn't expect the thread to blow up like… damn

I think a lottery would be the reverse. Statistically psychology works for most people. If therapy/behavioral interventions don't work then they try medication.

In severe cases they will try higher risk higher benefit drugs.

Is the risk worth it for these drugs (e.g., antipsychotics, etc)? Hard to say. They make life livable for some but they can have permanent side effects for others.

These are not conventional treatments, however.

Do you mind if I ask what your uncle was taking/what they did that made him a "vegetable"? What was his diagnosis?

 

[struggles_inc]

I think a lottery would be the reverse. Statistically psychology works for most people. If therapy/behavioral interventions don't work then they try medication.

In severe cases they will try higher risk higher benefit drugs.

Is the risk worth it for these drugs (e.g., antipsychotics, etc)? Hard to say. They make life livable for some but they can have permanent side effects for others.

These are not conventional treatments, however.

Do you mind if I ask what your uncle was taking/what they did that made him a "vegetable"? What was his diagnosis?

Not sure what he was taking. I know it had to be injected but nothing more unfortunately. The poor guy was schizophrenic.
My sister had other stuff. Alongside depression there's some personality disorder that makes you stay at home and NEVER leave. She told me how it's called but i forgor

 

[NotToBeRemembered]

I'd say they can be good if it's done the right way. Imo, they should always work together in tandem. Psychologist to help you build more healthier lifestyle, while psychiatrist to lessened your mental issues symptoms currently. Their methods - again, if it's done properly - should always refer to scientific research. While it sounds silly, because you might think psyche couldn't be studied in any way, it actually IS able to be studied in a scientific way. Because in the end, human are also animal which has universal behaviour patterns. It's not 100% accurate since human mind could literally develop into anything, but the basic principle is almost always same.

The real issue imo is about how capitalist it is now. Rather than focusing on helping people recover, they look like trying to suck your money dry instead. For example: they could easily tossed you around between a bunch of psychologists and psychiatrists because they had enough of your case; they don't care if you somehow stopped making appointments; they don't really try to understand you before planning your recovery programs which in most cases led into ineffective therapy methods. Basically just too many red flags in application.

I still encourage people to seek help before doing CTB tho, be it professionals or informal helpers, because there's still chance to fix your problems especially if you're under 30. CTB should always be the last resort, not something you want to do on a whim.

 

[struggles_inc]

Statistically psychology works for most people

Feels like we live in different worlds. And maybe we even do. Where I come from psychiatry is used mostly for political repression and psychology just… doesn't work, I guess

 

[Hotsackage]

I'm my own psychiatrist/therapist. But I do have one so they can give me pills

 

[struggles_inc]

I'm my own psychiatrist/therapist. But I do have one so they can give me pills

Do the pills work?

 

[DoubleUp8]

I vehemently disagree. People with mental illness are massively stigmatized and face disproportionate barriers to education, enriched social lives conducive to social intelligence, childhoods surrounded by books, the arts, humanities, etc.

There are intelligent people who are depressed because of their deep awareness of philosophical problems (e.g., existentialism), sure. But this is certainly the exception rather than the rule.

Most intelligent people can comprehend existentialism but have enough meaningful interactions (social life, hobbies, etc.) and a well-regulated brain that existential meaninglessness doesn't really concern them.

Existentialism is mainly haunting for people living with chronic pain.

It sucks but we got the short end of the stick. And framing ourselves as more intelligent is probably just our inborn will to meaning; an egoic self-defense mechanism.

The people on this forum (myself included) almost objectively have lower IQs.

I would be surprised if that's true. I'm in the chronic pain situation you described. It's just an observation of mine and my experience that less intelligent people don't seem to have these issues as much. No way to objectively prove 1 way or another. But I was saying after reading some of the posts on this site. A lot are very insightful and thoughtful and obviously not written by idiots. That comment was after reading initial post by struggles inc. about psychiatry. You don't agree that sounds like written by someone with above average intelligence? And maybe it's just after dealing with people in mental health industry who seem to me so close-minded and incapable of critical thinking I find the open-minded platform here refreshing with the variety of viewpoints. Other places seem to be in lockstep and they may as well be bots. But really? You think below average? I don't. I think the opposite. I've seen poorly written words misspelled posts here too so maybe I am wrong and just judging by the better ones.

 

[Hotsackage]

Vaguely, I still can't work lol or even socialise

 

[struggles_inc]

I would be surprised if that's true. I'm in the chronic pain situation you described. It's just an observation of mine and my experience that less intelligent people don't seem to have these issues as much. No way to objectively prove 1 way or another. But I was saying after reading some of the posts on this site. A lot are very insightful and thoughtful and obviously not written by idiots. That comment was after reading initial post by struggles inc. about psychiatry. You don't agree that sounds like written by someone with above average intelligence? And maybe it's just after dealing with people in mental health industry who seem to me so close-minded and incapable of critical thinking I find the open-minded platform here refreshing with the variety of viewpoints. Other places seem to be in lockstep and they may as well be bots. But really? You think below average? I don't. I think the opposite. I've seen poorly written words misspelled posts here too so maybe I am wrong and just judging by the better ones.

IMHO this has something to do with empathy levels more than smarts. I think empathic people are more prone to becoming depressed

Vaguely, I still can't work lol or even socialise

I'm so sorry friend

 

[DoubleUp8]

Not just here but in my life experience, really stupid people seem to be happy and content. Give the village idiot a ball and a stick and he's happy all day long. And all the people I have known who ctb were definitely above average intelligence.

 

[Codename_Joryu]

I know it has nothing to do with the conversation, but I just remembered one post about a guy that tried to go to therapy and during it he explained how he found his brother dead after he shot himself in the head. Therapist basically bursted into tears explaining how she lost her husband in a similar way and that she couldn't continue this conversation. And the guy was basically like "How the fuck is this bitch supposed to handle mentally ill people if she can't even handle a sob story like that?". Just goes to show how qualified these "therapists" are I guess.

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

I'm glad my psych clearly understands that the only purpose of his profession is to write me my Adderall scrip. 3 minute phone session with him for a refill every 3 months and that's it.

 

[struggles_inc]

I'm glad my psych clearly understands that the only purpose of his profession is to write me my Adderall scrip. 3 minute phone session with him for a refill every 3 months and that's it.

Damn, ruthless

 

[R_N]

Psych meds hurt me physically more than anything else. So you can guess what I think.

 

[meltdown]

Fucking hate it.
1. I don't trust a random person more than myself
2. People are yet to study human brain so there's no real way to cure it now, only sucky solutions like shutting it off
3. I don't think trauma like rape (experienced) and death of close people (experienced 4x) is treatable
4. In some countries a psychiatric diagnosis takes a toll on one's career and future
5. Mental illnesses are stigmatised and many psychiatric professionals are biased, meaning it's extremely traumatic to find a good doc to begin with
6. A psychologist/psychotherapist won't say anything that I don't already know, for instance bottled up rage or attention seeking like duuuh, dude. No eye-opening experience for me

But maybe I'm just stupid. What do you guys think?
Sorry for bringing this up again. I just HATE that all the support I have from anyone in my life is "oh well you should visit a psychologist". WHY. WOULD. I.
Psychologists are basically emotional dumpsters. People throw you to them to avoid dealing with you ever.

A reference to any sort of psychologist is a means of disposing of you. In other words, "not my problem".
Ironically, professionals do this too, and you will be informed of how you need "a higher standard of care" as you are referred up the ladder of therapists, psychologists, and psychiatrists.

They are salesman for pharmaceutical companies. I attended college with the intention of becoming some sort of therapist, psychiatrist, etc. I dropped out as the more I learned, the more disgusted I became. Ethical individuals are weeded out or neutered via red tape, guidelines, and professional bullying. The only good psychologist/therapist I've so much as observed quit from how much he hated the field. Psychology is not a science. Treating is as a science doesn't even help anyone. You cannot quantify pain, trauma, or joy.

Talk therapy can tremendously help people with various problems, but trust is required, which disqualifies any licensed therapist or mandated reporter immediately. Imagine having your life ruined because you offhandedly mention some dream you had.

Pretty much all of your points are accurate. There is almost nothing good to say about the field. You can get adderall from them I guess, that's pretty cool.
The only people in my life I was told to see a psych by were abusers.

omg Undertaker is my favorite black butler character!!